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I wouldn't mind a massive seamless 3D Mushroom Kingdom open world game, but as long as it was comprised of a majority of old-school linear sections. You can still explore outside of those sections if you like, but the game is more or less designed with linearity as a prime focus.

IMHO, M64 was still pretty linear most of the time, but because the worlds were so small and disconnected, each individual world then felt as a whole not particularly linear. But if you connected up all the M64 worlds into one seamless open world, the linearity would show through a bit more.

 

[rpmurphy]

Well, I've already posted what I think they should do with Mario.
That being make it a huge seamless world like Just Cause 2.
It would be awesome and crazy.

Also, racing games are going to be cool on this thing. You can put the Speedometer and Gears and stuff on the touch screen (or in the case of Mario Kart, you put the items and you can use them by pressing the icon).

Mario Kart isn't really a button-heavy game so there's really no need for touch screen controls. Unless they add stick shift. lol

 

[Portugeezer]

Pretty good specs if true, not very expensive in the end, optimised games should look even better. I have a gaming rig already with a 5850 but of course wouldn't mind a Wii 2 with Nintendo's key franchises.

How many ps3s? or is it even possible to make that analogy with the Cell and whatnot?

4.99 x PS3.

Cell is pretty useless for gaming, mostly used to offset any GPU bottlenecks the PS3 has.

 

[Triton55]

I think Nuts and Bolts' environments have a pretty nice looking combination of cartoony aesthetics and powerful(ish) graphics. If Mario Stream had some open-ended worlds to freely hop around like that (a la Sunshine) alongside the tighter platforming challenges of Galaxy, then I'd be a happy camper.

 

[watershed]

I just feel we're missing out on some interesting speculation like "What could at least a generation and a half of technology upgrades do for improving Mario and Zelda games?" in favor of retreading debates we don't really have enough information on to analyze especially well.

Okay if this is the desired direction for this thread then I list my ideas.

Firstly in Zelda the game could now handle a bigger world, more towns, more npcs with more intelligent AI. I'm imagining a world like the ones seen in the fable games, where there are multiple towns/cities and AIs all have their routines. We could also see greater interaction between link and npcs though I wouldn't want it to get too far into sim territory. I think it would be cool if the size and scope of Zelda were upped to something like the world of FFXII for example. Lots of diverse environments, a good spread of dungeons, and lots of towns, but hopefully with more variety to the aesthetic of each town and npc.

One thing I hope Nintendo avoids though is the bigger is better philosophy. I seem to recall that much of the early hd era games were about the staggering number of enemies on screen or the huge but barren landscapes. I thought TP already had too many dungeons and drawn out gameplay so hopefully Nintendo remembers the value of a tight concise story/campaign when facing the open pastures of HD gaming.

 

[SneakyStephan]

Zelda in a seamless jc2 sized world please.

 

[Triton55]

One thing I hope Nintendo avoids though is the bigger is better philosophy. I seem to recall that much of the early hd era games were about the staggering number of enemies on screen or the huge but barren landscapes. I thought TP already had too many dungeons and drawn out gameplay so hopefully Nintendo remembers the value of a tight concise story/campaign when facing the open pastures of HD gaming.

Aonuma and co seem to have already learned from TP's kinda empty fields as they have indicated a desire to make SS's overworld more "dense."

 

[watershed]

Aonuma and co seem to have already learned from TP's kinda empty fields as they have indicated a desire to make SS's overworld more "dense."

Then hopefully SS will impress us all with a world that feels alive instead of a field of muddy textures and god awful trees.

 

[Poyunch]

Then hopefully SS will impress us all with a world that feels alive instead of a field of muddy textures and god awful trees.

But that sounds like Skyward Sword... /troll

 

[TekkenMaster]

Huge seamless worlds are the biggest thing for me.

Even though I love the Metroid Prime games, by MP3 the "series of rooms with doors" thing began to seem stupid to me and take me out of the immersion.

We need a truly seamless Metroid with realistic "blockades" instead of the colored doors (unless the colored doors are inside buildings, spaceships, etc).

 

[Portugeezer]

We need a truly seamless Metroid with realistic "blockades" instead of the colored doors (unless the colored doors are inside buildings, spaceships, etc).

Why does it have to be realistic, or make sense? Fun is important, does SMG2 make sense? No but it's amazing.

 

[ReyVGM]

You people are expecting too much from Zelda. Nintendo will never turn Zelda into a Fallout/Final Fantasy 12/Xenoblade kind of game.

If anything, Zelda will be like Dragon Quest: A familiar and classic game at its root, except with a hook/gimmick on every game.

While it would be great if Zelda incorporated all of that stuff people keep mentioning, I'm not sure I really want it too. I mean, there aren't any other games like Zelda in production, and... do we really need another Fallout/Oblivion/Whatever clone?

 

[ZAK]

Huge seamless worlds are the biggest thing for me.

Even though I love the Metroid Prime games, by MP3 the "series of rooms with doors" thing began to seem stupid to me and take me out of the immersion.

We need a truly seamless Metroid with realistic "blockades" instead of the colored doors (unless the colored doors are inside buildings, spaceships, etc).

Are the doors really the problem? Metroid already (well, in my experience; I haven't played them all) has plenty of "realistic" blockades which are nonetheless just locks you need the keys to. Spinner-activated thing, missilable thing, grapple gap, whatever... It's all the same thing, really.

 

[From The Dust]

Why does it have to be realistic, or make sense? Fun is important, does SMG2 make sense? No but it's amazing.

it makes perfect sense!

 

[Necromanti]

Huge seamless worlds are the biggest thing for me.

Even though I love the Metroid Prime games, by MP3 the "series of rooms with doors" thing began to seem stupid to me and take me out of the immersion.

My main gripe with MP3 was the fact that every other door took like 5 minutes to load. Now that's an immersion killer. That really soured the experience for me.

 

[Lupin the Third]

Are the doors really the problem? Metroid already (well, in my experience; I haven't played them all) has plenty of "realistic" blockades which are nonetheless just locks you need the keys to. Spinner-activated thing, missilable thing, grapple gap, whatever... It's all the same thing, really.

Yeah, this is basically what I thought. That and classic Metroid had an awful lot of "rooms with doors" to boot.

I don't like Metroid very much, really.

Spoiler

I have yet to play Super Metroid, though.

 

[jeremy1456]

My main gripe with MP3 was the fact that every other door took like 5 minutes to load. Now that's an immersion killer. That really soured the experience for me.

Good job exaggerating.

 

[herzogzwei1989]

Honestly, a console with the power of the RV770 GPU would be able to create worlds that the Wii could never manage and that the 360/PS3 could only realize in sub-HD, sub-30fps rates. I hope to God that the RV770 is the GPU which Cafe's GPU is based.

 

[Nirolak]

Well, I've already posted what I think they should do with Mario.
That being make it a huge seamless world like Just Cause 2.
It would be awesome and crazy.

Also, racing games are going to be cool on this thing. You can put the Speedometer and Gears and stuff on the touch screen (or in the case of Mario Kart, you put the items and you can use them by pressing the icon).

I wouldn't mind a massive seamless 3D Mushroom Kingdom open world game, but as long as it was comprised of a majority of old-school linear sections. You can still explore outside of those sections if you like, but the game is more or less designed with linearity as a prime focus.

IMHO, M64 was still pretty linear most of the time, but because the worlds were so small and disconnected, each individual world then felt as a whole not particularly linear. But if you connected up all the M64 worlds into one seamless open world, the linearity would show through a bit more.

One other possibility here is to sort of make it like Dark Souls, where it is basically like a regular Mario world, but everything is stitched together to seem seamless and you can explore to find secret passages to new areas as well.

The central hub would essentially let you teleport to different save points at the end of what would normally be levels.

Keeping the policy of "if you can see it, you can reach it" would also be great here since if you saw a moon way off in the distance, you would know that you could eventually find some secret thing that would send you there.

 

[Lance Bone Path]

Well, if people are interested in this debate, then we might as well have it.

This is an interesting question, because there seem to be evolving preferences with this.

Let's take Japan for example, a country that plays games almost exclusively on handhelds, which have awful visuals compared to consoles.

Now, Sengoku Basara 3 was a game developed from the ground up for the Wii, and after Samurai Warriors 3 bombed, Capcom did a last minute port to the PS3.

In Japan, the Wii has almost twice the user base as the PS3, and it got an exclusive entry in the biggest third party core series in the nation, Monster Hunter, about a year before the game released, so we know that there is a fairly sizable audience of core gamers that own the platform.

Now, despite there being almost zero visual upgrades with the PS3 version of Sengoku Basara 3 outside of higher resolution and better image quality, and the series primary appealing to women according to Capcom, the PS3 version outsold the Wii version by more than 4 to 1. (358,135 versus 83,317)

Were I Nintendo, this would concern me greatly.

Core gamers who bought a wii with Monster Hunter Tri probably did not become wii fans. I know I didn't. Third-party, non-superbrand, wii-exclusive, core games are still probably pretty much on their own.

That's not to say that this trend will continue with the wii's successor since Nintendo has been saying that the next console is a kind of do-over.

Also, according to the posted article Sengoku Basara 3 players are 40% female, but the fans who go to the Capcom sponsored events are 90% female, so I'm not sure I would say that the series primarily appeals to women. The hardest of the hard core fans are women for sure, but are these event visitors a representative sample of the game's fans?

 

[herzogzwei1989]

One other possibility here is to sort of make it like Dark Souls, where it is basically like a regular Mario world, but everything is stitched together to seem seamless and you can explore to find secret passages to new areas as well.

The central hub would essentially let you teleport to different save points at the end of what would normally be levels.

Keeping the policy of "if you can see it, you can reach it" would also be great here since if you saw a moon way off in the distance, you would know that you could eventually find some secret thing that would send you there.

That would be awesome.

 

[Nirolak]

Core gamers who bought a wii with Monster Hunter Tri probably did not become wii fans. I know I didn't. Third-party, non-superbrand, wii-exclusive, core games are still probably pretty much on their own.

That's not to say that this trend will continue with the wii's successor since Nintendo has been saying that the next console is a kind of do-over.

Also, according to the posted article Sengoku Basara 3 players are 40% female, but the fans who go to the Capcom sponsored events are 90% female, so I'm not sure I would say that the series primarily appeals to women. The hardest of the hard core fans are women for sure, but are these event visitors a representative sample of the game's fans?

Right, it's true that it's not a literal majority, but for a core series this is a very high percentage, especially among evangelists.

I only listed it because Nintendo made a big deal of how their platforms tended to attract far more women than the other platforms, which is very true, and thus was something that could have potentially been reflected in the sales split, but didn't end up doing so.

That would be awesome.

I feel Mario games tend to do a great job showing off new features for Nintendo's consoles, so I'm quite curious to see what they do even if they don't go with an idea like this.

 

[Necromanti]

Good job exaggerating.

Touché, but when I have to wait for a door to open long enough that I notice it and manage to kill the foes that I wanted to avoid, then it took too long.

 

[Nirolak]

Huge seamless worlds are the biggest thing for me.

Even though I love the Metroid Prime games, by MP3 the "series of rooms with doors" thing began to seem stupid to me and take me out of the immersion.

We need a truly seamless Metroid with realistic "blockades" instead of the colored doors (unless the colored doors are inside buildings, spaceships, etc).

I think Arkham Asylum did a really nice job of having Metroid like progression while still making everything feel seamless, logical, and really fun.

Perhaps something more like that, but better fit to the Metroid universe.

While the game was 2D and you could only see a small part of the area at any given time, Super Metroid actually had some pretty huge locations, and recapturing that feel in 3D would be great.

 

[Buckethead]

If rumors are true about no HD beyond SD memory, I don't see much of a financial reason not ton justify 2GB RAM.

I can deal with the 4850 but 1 GB RAM is too little.

 

[Penguin]

I did an article looking back at the GameCube's reveal.

And it got me thinking, Nintendo needs to have F-Zero, Wave Race and 1080 up and out within the first year.

Just imagine the water physics of a new 12 player online Wave Race. And not just a mode in Wii Sports. Could even do various tracks around WuHu Island if they wanted to.

F-Zero speaks for itself, though I guess AMusement Visions is out of business.

 

[Buckethead]

I think Arkham Asylum did a really nice job of having Metroid like progression while still making everything feel seamless, logical, and really fun.

I don't know why backtracking has to stay a staple of the Metroid franchise.
Backtracking generally sucks: it's clear that you are going back to a certain area for a specific reason. It seems forced and like an enduring relic of old design.

Arkham City is more open world and thank God for that.

Make Metroid like Mass Effect. A nice balance.

 

[herzogzwei1989]

The GameCube reveal was pretty awesome:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCsCNYkPc6g

And I still think the real-time 60fps Zelda demo looks amazing to this day:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEF9Utdu-L0

 

[Buckethead]

The GameCube may have been awesome purple aside, but that logo is and always has been completely awful.

 

[JohnTinker]

Actually, I doubt any of those people know, yet.
They won't be setting up and rehearsing until the week before.

Sorry but as a video editor/producer I can guarantee you all of those people know (with the exception of the grunts setting up the floor).

They plan & map out the layout of the booths months in advance to account for wiring for sound, projectors, screens, tvs, etc. All of that equipment is rented out, and pieces like displays that are custom have to be built. All of those picture "manuals" that display how a game is played have to be designed in Photoshop, printed by companies contracted out, etc.

If a game trailer is using a song by a music artist whoever is making the video has to purchase rights to use the track, videos have to be edited down for time to take into account how long the presentations are, the individual presentations are rehearsed with videos in place, whoever is going to demo the game will have to play through for time, etc.

All of that to say that while the list we've seen posted with "Mario Cafe" and "Paper Zelda" is total garbage, there is most certainly a list of what is being shown/demoed/displayed at the show, and I would venture to say that the absolute definite titles already have their displays made but are sitting in a locked warehouse covered up. These convention support firms & print/edit houses take their jobs & clients seriously too.

 

[Jerk]

Yes, preferably to Kev as I have been getting a large PM influx lately.

Your damn fault for being so reasonable. Show us some of that ol' moderator instability/irrationality if you want to be left alone.

 

[AceBandage]

Sorry but as a video editor/producer I can guarantee you all of those people know (with the exception of the grunts setting up the floor).

They plan & map out the layout of the booths months in advance to account for wiring for sound, projectors, screens, tvs, etc. All of that equipment is rented out, and pieces like displays that are custom have to be built. All of those picture "manuals" that display how a game is played have to be designed in Photoshop, printed by companies contracted out, etc.

If a game trailer is using a song by a music artist whoever is making the video has to purchase rights to use the track, videos have to be edited down for time to take into account how long the presentations are, the individual presentations are rehearsed with videos in place, whoever is going to demo the game will have to play through for time, etc.

All of that to say that while the list we've seen posted with "Mario Cafe" and "Paper Zelda" is total garbage, there is most certainly a list of what is being shown/demoed/displayed at the show, and I would venture to say that the absolute definite titles already have their displays made but are sitting in a locked warehouse covered up. These convention support firms & print/edit houses take their jobs & clients seriously too.

These people need to get drunk and spill some stuff.

 

[caligula13]

i don't care how powerful this thing is. if nintendo now wants to force me back to a classic controler my answer is: get out!

 

[brochiller]

These people need to get drunk and spill some stuff.

Maybe leave a spec sheet behind at a bar or something...

 

[Somnid]

i don't care how powerful this thing is. if nintendo now wants to force me back to a classic controler my answer is: get out!

Somehow I don't think you'll have to worry about this.

 

[herzogzwei1989]

Man, just 3 more weeks til E3, cannot wait.

 

[Boney]

i don't have time to argue this

 

[caligula13]

Somehow I don't think you'll have to worry about this.

well, everyone is talking about a classic controler with a touch screen.

 

[herzogzwei1989]

Hopefully at E3 we will not only get a good idea of what Cafe games will be like graphically, but also be able to come close to nailing down what GPU it's based off of.

 

[Gamer @ Heart]

well, everyone is talking about a classic controler with a touch screen.

There where also rumors of an advanced wiimote as well when the flood gate opened, but thats boring so it wasnt really discussed or followed up on like everthing else.

 

[antonz]

Hopefully at E3 we will not only get a good idea of what Cafe games will be like graphically, but also be able to come close to nailing down what GPU it's based off of.

Unlikely get a good grip on the power from Nintendo developed things unless they have a few of their better teams doing stuff for awhile.

Multiplatform will probably look pretty similar to whats out there though Nintendo should do the graphics whore bit and point out they run better and look better.

 

[caligula13]

There where also rumors of an advanced wiimote as well when the flood gate opened, but thats boring so it wasnt really discussed or followed up on like everthing else.

i don't believe that Wii2 will have two controllers. so it's either wiimote or classic controller with touch screen

 

[TekkenMaster]

I think Arkham Asylum did a really nice job of having Metroid like progression while still making everything feel seamless, logical, and really fun.

Perhaps something more like that, but better fit to the Metroid universe.

While the game was 2D and you could only see a small part of the area at any given time, Super Metroid actually had some pretty huge locations, and recapturing that feel in 3D would be great.

Totally agree. Arkham Asylum really felt like HD Metroid in the Batman universe.

I loved AA's "overworld". The 3D Metroid games, imo, should try to make a seamless overworld with few if any "doors". The Prime games' outdoor locations felt way too video-gamey, like a series of shoeboxes with four sides and an open sky.

 

[watershed]

Maybe leave a spec sheet behind at a bar or something...

If Nintendo wants to put gamers and their competitors on notice that they are back in the graphics arms race (will not happen) then this would be the way to do it. A sly leak, no press release, no bragging like Sony and Microsoft do, just a little piece of paper left under a empty shot glass...

 

[Thunder Monkey]

i don't believe that Wii2 will have two controllers. so it's either wiimote or classic controller with touch screen

One will be the focus and the other compatible with select games. Like what they did with GCN controllers.

 

[herzogzwei1989]

Unlikely get a good grip on the power from Nintendo developed things unless they have a few of their better teams doing stuff for awhile.

Multiplatform will probably look pretty similar to whats out there though Nintendo should do the graphics whore bit and point out they run better and look better.

I think we'll see one or two internally developed games that shows what Cafe can really do.

Nintendo does needs to up the ante and show us that all games on Cafe look and run better than on 360/PS3.

 

[caligula13]

One will be the focus and the other compatible with select games. Like what they did with GCN controllers.

well, that's the thing i don't like. i personally don't want to go back to any form of a classic controller. i am happy that sony copied the wiimote and made move.

 

[SneakyStephan]

The GameCube reveal was pretty awesome:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCsCNYkPc6g

Holy shit.

I remember being blown away by rogue squadron and the waterski game back in the day, and thinking the luigi's mansion trailer looked really cool, but I never saw this reveal.

Best new console reveal ever, mad impressive stuff for the time.

Rogue squadron looked out of this world good. (still does in a way)

 

[shadyspace]

Holy shit.

I remember being blown away by rogue squadron and the waterski game back in the day, and thinking the luigi's mansion trailer looked really cool, but I never saw this reveal.

Best new console reveal ever, mad impressive stuff for the time.

Rogue squadron looked out of this world good. (still does in a way)

smh

 

[Buckethead]

Still pisses me off we haven't had a new Wave Race.