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It legit feels like we’re coming to the end of “Gaming” as it has existed the past 30+ years
- Thread starter jcorb
- Start date
amigastar
Member
Thats true, one example is Pithead Studios former known as Piranha Bytes. They call themselves an Indie Studio but their next game for sure wont be Meat Boy or Braid type game but rather AA Gaming.
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Hugare
Member
We are in August and the only AAA singleplayer game that I actually enjoyed this year was FF VII Rebirth. And I havent even finished it.
I bought an Android portable device (Odin 2) and have been revisiting "old" games on the go. Bioshock, Dishonored, Mirror's Edge, Dead Space trilogy, Assasins Creed II and etc.
And man, they dont make them like they used to. Thats not even counting games from the PS2/GC/Wii era that I'm also playing on the side, while my PS5 collects dust.
The industry is a mess right now. But life finds a way. The pendulum will swing the other side eventually.
I bought an Android portable device (Odin 2) and have been revisiting "old" games on the go. Bioshock, Dishonored, Mirror's Edge, Dead Space trilogy, Assasins Creed II and etc.
And man, they dont make them like they used to. Thats not even counting games from the PS2/GC/Wii era that I'm also playing on the side, while my PS5 collects dust.
The industry is a mess right now. But life finds a way. The pendulum will swing the other side eventually.
Nickolaidas
Member
Stopped reading right there.
diffusionx
Gold Member
Even if another good game never comes out, there's still thousands of good ones you haven't played. Things will be fine.
Toons
Member
Rocksteady - fell to gaas
Arkane - fell to gaas
Bungie - fell to gaas
Epic - fell to gaas
Bethesda - fell to gaas
Naighty dog - almost fell to gaas
Rockstar - trying to be gaas
Ubisoft - feels like gaas
Insomniac - fell to Marvel ip
Eidos - fell to Marvel ip
Firaxis - fell to Marvel ip
Bioware - fell to woke
Blizzard - fell to woke
Volition - fell to woke
Hmm it's almost as if op has a point
Not a single comment about whether the games have good gameplay, graphics, stories, anything... just gaas=bad game and woke = [insert personal grievance/nonsense] = bad game?
No, he doesn't have a point and this doesn't reinforce it. It completely ifnored the things that actually make games good, for starters
Nickolaidas
Member
Yeah, paying 120 bucks upfront to play what is basically unfinished beta versions of bland games which will be completed by the devs after 12-18 months (or maybe never) just proves how utterly spoiled and pessimistic those gamers have become. "Just eat the slop and sftu, you chuds!" Seriously, can't they appreciate the pinnacle of gaming that we have been witnessing for the last eight years?
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KuraiShidosha
Member
I agree wholeheartedly. I was born in 1987 and witnessed much of the Golden years of gaming. Nothing in the past 5+ years compares to what came before. This isn't just limited to games though, all media is coming to an end. Quality is down across the board, and too much of a change of culture and background of those behind new content has me feeling like an 80 year old man
None of this shit is good and I can't understand the people who are okay with it. Genuinely, it all sucks and is soulless. It's been a good run and I'm sure as fuck glad I got to enjoy the best years we had, but the ride is unquestionably over.
None of this shit is good and I can't understand the people who are okay with it. Genuinely, it all sucks and is soulless. It's been a good run and I'm sure as fuck glad I got to enjoy the best years we had, but the ride is unquestionably over.
ProtoByte
Weeb Underling
Don't you think this is entirely because there's not as much/nearly no new ground to break now compared to when you started gaming almost 40 years ago?
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
Starting your post with this is someshow shit. Listen…if you are trying to make a point about something, trying to justify what you are doing with your first line will lose readers’ respect every time. Truthfully, I didn’t even read past that. If you have to put a disclaimer on your thoughts in the first sentence, maybe you should think harder to yourself if it’s worth it, before you consider sharing your thoughts?? Idk, maybe I’m wrong
. But “I don’t want to be a negative Nancy”, but here I am being a negative Nancy, is just fucking weird to me.
Your opening line here is far shittier though, to be fair.
Hypereides
Gold Member
Yet. Give it time.
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
I think there's some truth here. The ballooning costs for games seem to mostly be about graphics, not ideas or gameplay.
Really, if people* did put more money into indie/smaller productions it could genuinely change the gaming landscape for the better.
*By people I meant customers
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Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
Flintlock, Dungeons of Hinterberg, Kunitsu-Gami, CYGNI all dropped just within the last 30 days. All new IP, all great AA games, all priced less than full price. And that's not even counting the numerous cheaper indies, and this is just 4 weeks.Capcom recently released new unique AA game.....but no AA games are gone for good /s
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
Shifty1897
Member
Play Japanese games, they're still making bangers over there.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
I dont buy that because graphics have stagnated this generation. This is the first gen in 35 years where there was no leap in visuals. Why? Publishers got greedy this gen, extending cross gen out far too long and now we're 4 years into it with very little progress to show.
People aren't ditching the ps4 ...i wonder why? Sony hasn't released a true next gen game even wtf is up with that? Maybe costs have skyrocketed because theyre trying to develop games for ps4, ps5 and a million PC configurations? Maybe mismanagement and DEI hiring is costing extra money too?
hyperbertha
Member
Yea it does look we're finally starting to move on to basic 3d from pixel art. It depends on how easier the tools get from here on. Maybe cascadeur can make a difference if it makes animation much faster.
hyperbertha
Member
Gaas - usually makes games shallow, repetitive, barebones and grindy
Woke - makes the stories vomit inducing.
These two things absolutely cause a decline in the industry. Let's not pretend otherwise.
Bonfires Down
Member
The type of games you are asking for are 3D action adventure/RPG games, preferably with high level production values. It's true that a lot of the studios producing those could not keep up as budgets got higher and higher and they were shut down. I have no doubt that as indie studios mature and expand their manpower, you will see more of these games. But it is inherently an expensive genre to produce, even with indie production values. You also run the risk of being compared to AAA games and people asking why they should play a game that's similar but looks worse.
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Punished Miku
Human Rights Subscription Service
We're supposedly getting Hyper Light Breaker this year.
We definitely are well into the era of 3D indies on par with PS3 / PS4 stuff. Their last game from 2021 is fantastic, Solar Ash.
This is western gaming, American indie team putting out stuff that looks like Gravity Rush.
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Nickolaidas
Member
Perhaps. But I find it really hard to believe that the industry was making new genres left and right in the 90s and basically covered everything.
Don't you think the more probably scenario is that games are so much expensive to make nowadays (AAA, anyway), to the point that a single title failing means the abolition of the dev team which made it, causing them to make games which are as safe and risk-averse as possible?
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
"
Nah, let me do you one better
"Gee, many of these big chain restraunts have low quality ingredients and food, and what they make just doesn't taste good at all. I guess all restraunts suck and we are in a terrible time for food!"
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BlackTron
Member
Even if things aren't completely doom and gloom, there are still many changes from the old gaming landscape that in aggregate make it less fun than in the past. It's not that gaming is dying -just changing, and we liked it better the old way. Some changes were inevitable, like diminishing returns. Others, not so much.
ProtoByte
Weeb Underling
Moore's Law of game design. In the 90s we transitioned from 2D to 3D. That alone would trigger the rapid creation of new genres. That type of quantum leap isn't happening again.
I do not. Because the other side, the supposedly innovative and creative "indie" scene where there's (again, supposedly) far less at risk is not producing new things either.
Most of the stuff that gets made there is some variety of farming sim ripping off Animal Crossing or Stardew Valley (which was a ripoff of Harvest Moon), nostalgia-bait 2D platformers trying to recreate the vibe of 90s mascots, narrative adventure games aping 90s classics, action-adventure games aping 90s-2000s cult-hits at a somehow smaller scale and budget-artstyle, or smaller scale versions of more contemporary games with a budget-artstyle. Not accounting for the endless stream of roguelikes, puzzle games, and genuine walking simulators that hasn't stopped for more than 10 years.
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Nickolaidas
Member
Fair points. Perhaps it's a tech issue and they need more tools to make a new concept. Perhaps A.I. will be able to make player/game interactions like never before, creating new genres. Or some other technology.
I still think it's a matter of ideas, though. Sometimes the trendsetter is made by slightly altering an already established formula. Alone in the Dark was an adventure/puzzle game and with just a few alterations to the concept, Resident Evil created the Survival Horror genre. Demon's Souls basically took the hack and slash concept and added a stamina bar, as well as a death/punish system. So it's not so much that the tech was evolving, as much as a visionary having an idea which became really catchy and effective.
We just need more visionaries.
Also, there is a solid chance that a lot of indies have original ideas but get buried under a tonne of crap/mediocre/stale games and no one notices them. Or, they are patient zero and need a visionary to take their idea and expand on it to create a trendsetter.
buenoblue
Member
I think gaming has never been better . Between VR, steam deck, PS5 and PC I feel like I have never had so much choice. Plus I upgraded my TV to a 65 QD OLED and full Atmos sound system and playing games on PC at 120fps 4k is so good. Finally the fidelity of games is amazing
I've just got a racing sim setup last week as well and been having fun with that.
Yeah every game might not be to my exact taste but there is plenty out there for everyone.
. Between VR, steam deck, PS5 and PC I feel like I have never had so much choice. Plus I upgraded my TV to a 65 QD OLED and full Atmos sound system and playing games on PC at 120fps 4k is so good. Finally the fidelity of games is amazing I've just got a racing sim setup last week as well and been having fun with that.
Yeah every game might not be to my exact taste but there is plenty out there for everyone.
Guilty_AI
Member
I'd argue the last trendsetter was Factorio back in 2016 (with full release in 2020).
DUSK also kickstarted a huge wave of boomer shooters with modernized elements, but i'd argue that was more due to a growth in the DOOM/Quake modding community. I guess Prey also began a trend of re-imagining/modernization of immersive sims. I just don't consider either of these two much of trendsetters because they've been more about reviving old genres and remaking them with modern tech and game design knowledge. So Factorio it is.
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Bonfires Down
Member
I realize these types of games are generally not what people who make these threads are looking for, so I'm not trying to change anyone's mind. But I was interested to get an overview of what indie games have launched this year and been positively received by the gaming community. So here is a list of some of them. I didn't include early access games but there were some heavy hitters like Hades 2 and No Rest For The Wicked.
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Bonfires Down
Member
64bitmodels
Reverse groomer.
Stardew Valley is the one game you can properly think of ripping off that genre lol
I think you need to realize that compared to the AAA space.... that is creativity. None of the genres you have listed have been properly represented in AAA for 15-20 years. When's the last time Ubisoft published a 3D Platformer or Stealth game?
Have any of these big publishers ever even made an adventure game or a visual novel at all? An RTS? Rhythm game not trying to be exactly like dead and buried guitar hero?
You say you know the indie scene and don't think it's that innovative then cite ONE "ripoff" game that has basically surpassed it's predecessor in popularity and polish- WAY more people know about Stardew Valley than Harvest Moon. Such a ripoff amirite?
Indies will give you the genres that typically show up in AAA and then proceed to give you more stuff. It's way more diverse than AAA, and this is a fact.
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Mobilemofo
Member
"we evolve, but we don't, er, revolve". - Alan partridge
Ok let's get this out of the way first - that's not what 'AAA' ever stood for (and it certainly isn't what company PR ever used it for). It represented high-production values / blockbuster budgets (in large part, a reflection of industry's continued obsession with hollywood, but admittedly, it grew beyond that since term's inception).
Which is also a reason the terminology only really becomes relevant when such productions started being made in mid 90ies (or became common place in the 00s when the term was actually coined).
Now sure - you can head-canonize this however you like - but in terms of production values - a 'big' game like Super Mario was not differentiated from an 'indie' production in anything other than marketing in the early 90ies. Yes of course there are objective quality differences - but that wasn't because one team had 100x the $ to spend - they were simply much better at spending roughly the same amount.
That is in stark contrast to R* spending 500M - 1B on their next game while the average indie competitor is quite literally working with 100x+ less. And this delta was just as pronounced in the 00s - a 10M$ AAA was relative to 100k$ budget productions on the other end of the scale. The absolute numbers grew - but the relative deltas were already there.
Which brings me to the point
Yes in 2001. ICO was built on that sub 1M budget - like many similar scoped games of the time. I didn't compare it to Dark Cloud by accident - both were new IPs backed by major publishers, both had a core team of about 5-10 people, and both made their money back at 100k sales, so they never needed to compete with 'AAA's of the time for mindshare.
Of course the modern equivalents have shifted a bit - but it's more of a spectrum now. We get things like Dave The Diver or TMNT Reshelled, but also original Senua or Plague's tale (which are real 'AAs' of the past decade) but I know that'll trigger a bunch of people.
Early 00s had multi-million sales ambitions for big IPs (with top end going towards 10M). AAs simply didn't aim for that, just like they don't aim for 10-100M range today. Doesn't mean it never happens though (see Helldivers 2).
cash_longfellow
Member
Touché my friend…touché.
AmuroChan
Member
I think maybe something else is going on in your life that’s causing this doom and gloom view you’re trying to project onto the gaming industry. If you have access to all the major gaming platforms, I don’t see how you can objectively say there are no great games being made these days. As for games journalism, they still exist. Perhaps just not in the legacy spaces that you used to go to years ago.
If you've been gaming for a long time it definitely starts to feel like you're not seeing anything really new. But I think some of that is just that's there's soo many games out there. It's impossible to experience all of them. I'm not sure there's really a solution other than just trial and error.
Toxic and lameStarting your post with this is some
cash_longfellow
Member
What is?
MatrixReloaded101
Member
Lol I’m not a fan of the main character but the game looks like it has potential.
Nickolaidas
Member
The main character is the least of this game's problems.
Yoda
Member
The aging gamers (probably most of this forum) aren't being replaced by younger gamers at the rate they used to. The economics of the AAA space most likely will break down within the next decade if something doesn't change (hard to imagine games being MORE monetized than they already are). I think the only thing that can keep it going (not fix mind you) is if genAI tools allow for smaller teams to make games with less capital. That'd allow the games we've come to expect to continue being profitable for a time. The harsh reality is that if the younger gen doesn't want to buy console games in the same volume the older gen did, than game companies are going to adapt to that change... by investing more in mobile.
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ProtoByte
Weeb Underling
Well, I don't think Demon’s Souls is a new genre, or that Miyazaki is a visionary.
I mean, the fact that you're equating Resident Evil (and I never played AITD, so I don't know how big the distinction is or whether RE actually made survival horror) creating a genre and adding a previously and long established mechanic being put into a previously and long established genre that usually wasn't there would suggest that there is a plateau on doing "new" things.
Why not Overwatch? PUBG/Fortnite? Breath of The Wild? Baldur's Gate
None of these are games I either like or think do new things, but they set trends or at least made a design splash in the proposed conversation of it.
Being a trendsetter and doing something new are not synonymous.
No, it isn't. It's just stuff that appeals to your biases, and you get to hide behind the word "creativity" because people think low budget/not currently main of mainstream is "creative". That word does not have a relative meaning.
Humdinger
Member
That part is fine with me. Gaming journalism has been a joke for a long time.