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Manga News/Discussion |OTX| Attack on Titles

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S

smurfx

get some go again
don't know if it's been said but jump is supposed to be on break but we usually get the chapter early. you should probably expect it around the 26th or the 27th.
 
G

Glass Rebel

Member
Among all the OP females, Nico Robin is the best right now

pocsdN4.png


look at dem thighs and dem hips
 
D

DryEyeRelief

Member
TacticalFox88 said:
The more I think about it, the more I'm POSITIVE, that the Stern Ritter aren't going to be the final antagonistic group.

Between Kenpachi, Renji, Rukia, Byakuya, AND Ichigo. They're likely strong enough to solo the rest of the Stern Ritter, save for, obviously, Juhabach.

Renji just curbstomped a Sternritter who shitstomped two vizard captains in their bankai mode, effortlessly. Imagine how strong Ichigo is right now.

Then you have the rest of the captains + Urahara + Yoruichi + Grimmjow + The Royal Guard themselves!

That's not even enough for everyone to get a one-on-one fight! Quincys as they are, heavily outgunned and outnumbered. They were revealed way too early and getting their shit stomped in. Which leads me to believe that Bach has something else going on, seeing as he's perfectly willing to kill his subordinates for failure.
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There are just too many characters
 
L

LonelyGreyWolf

Banned
Need more Dressrosa :X Also, there are lots of awesome new characters for the next One Piece game now. One Piece: Pirate Warriors 3 for Playstation 4 please.

Glass Rebel said:
I know many of you fap to the stuff you read but One Piece is a comic first and foremost
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Since literally every female in One Piece got three times bigger breasts since the time-skip I don't know what to think.
 
C

curlyfriski

Banned
I don't have a problem with the One Piece women specifically as much as the artstyle in general, which falls too often on the wrong side of the charmingly cartoonish/garishly ugly divide.
 
S

Supaidaman

Member
Jojolion 26

Yasuho sure can't catch a break. And more misteries are added to the mix with the new character. Araki is killing me with all those secrets :(
 
T

Tacitus_

Member
Gintoki313 said:
Berserk 64-140

It's time for my daily update on my Berserk reading.

Right now it seems Gutts will just be traveling, helping people out, exorcising demons, and trying to find Griffith and the other 4 gods. I'm so glad to see Puck back. He's like the only comic relief in the manga that gives some breathing room, between all the dark scenarios happening.
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I suppose it could be called helping people in some sense of the word.
 
G

Gintoki313

Banned
Wiseblade said:
Welcome to the "Griffith must die" club. But sleeping with the princess wasn't a part of his schemes, it was the act of a child who lost his favourite toy.
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Sorry about the spoiler tags. I'm reading this in huge chunks so I wasn't sure if it would be right to put a huge batch of the story without spoilers. Just in case someone else wanted to read.

If he didn't lose to Gutts I'm guessing he wouldn't have done that. Still, it's quite confusing. If he wanted to replace Gutts with the princess, I don't know what was going through his head. Either he wanted to become the ruler faster because Gutts humiliated him, or he wanted someone else in his life because Gutts was leaving.

Veelk said:
The fascinating thing about Griffith is that
you couldn't be more wrong about his feelings toward his army. He loved the Hawks. He cared for them very deeply. If he didn't, the sacrifice would not have happened, because it requires that you love the person you are sacrificing.

This person in the Berserk thread explains it better than I do.

Great thing about Berserk is that it has truly complex characters that grip you deeply.
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I forgot about that. Even though he cared about his army very much, it's still kinda heartless that he would do that to the female soldier and kill his whole army to become powerful. It still showed that if he has the decision to have his dream come true, or be with his army. He would choose his dream.

Which it seems so far that's the whole lesson in the manga. If a person had the choice would they choose there loved ones, or there dream. It seems so far that almost everyone is putting there dreams first.
 
T

Tacitus_

Member
Gintoki313 said:
Sorry about the spoiler tags. I'm reading this in huge chunks so I wasn't sure if it would be right to put a huge batch of the story without spoilers. Just in case someone else wanted to read.

If he didn't lose to Gutts I'm guessing he wouldn't have done that. Still, it's quite confusing. If he wanted to replace Gutts with the princess, I don't know what was going through his head. Either he wanted to become the ruler faster because Gutts humiliated him, or he wanted someone else in his life because Gutts was leaving.



I forgot about that. Even though he cared about his army very much, it's still kinda heartless that he would do that to the female soldier and kill his whole army to become powerful. It still showed that if he has the decision to have his dream come true, or be with his army. He would choose his dream.

Which it seems so far that's the whole lesson in the manga. If a person had the choice would they choose there loved ones, or there dream. It seems so far that almost everyone is putting there dreams first.
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He fucked the princess because he was distraught over losing Gutts. Other people would've drank their minds out or something similar.

And Griffith is quite different from Femto. There will be a discussion that reveals this a bit further down the line.
 
W

Wiseblade

Member
Gintoki313 said:
Sorry about the spoiler tags. I'm reading this in huge chunks so I wasn't sure if it would be right to put a huge batch of the story without spoilers. Just in case someone else wanted to read.

If he didn't lose to Gutts I'm guessing he wouldn't have done that. Still, it's quite confusing. If he wanted to replace Gutts with the princess, I don't know what was going through his head. Either he wanted to become the ruler faster because Gutts humiliated him, or he wanted someone else in his life because Gutts was leaving.



I forgot about that. Even though he cared about his army very much, it's still kinda heartless that he would do that to the female soldier and kill his whole army to become powerful. It still showed that if he has the decision to have his dream come true, or be with his army. He would choose his dream.

Which it seems so far that's the whole lesson in the manga. If a person had the choice would they choose there loved ones, or there dream. It seems so far that almost everyone is putting there dreams first.
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You're giving the fool too much credit. There's nothing more to it than I said. Griffith lost control of Guts and slept with the princess to feel better about himself even though he knew being caught would be the end of him.

At that point, Griffith's eventual ascension to the throne was inevitable. The favour of the King, the love of the princess, the fear/control of the nobles and adoration of the commoners. Yet he chose to do the one thing that would ruin all that work. THEN, he had the GALL to make the ones most loyal and closest to him suffer for his mistakes and ambition.

In that night, Griffith revealed his nature as a selfish, spoilt child with a silver tongue and a dream too big to handle. AND WAS REWARDED FOR IT.

RETCON:

I don't buy into that "tragic character" crap. So he had enough conviction to sacrifice the Hawks for his dream, but not enough to stop himself throwing that dream in the first place?
 
V

Veelk

Banned
Gintoki313 said:
I forgot about that. Even though he cared about his army very much, it's still kinda heartless that he would do that to the female soldier and kill his whole army to become powerful. It still showed that if he has the decision to have his dream come true, or be with his army. He would choose his dream.

Which it seems so far that's the whole lesson in the manga. If a person had the choice would they choose there loved ones, or there dream. It seems so far that almost everyone is putting there dreams first.
Click to expand...

Tacitus_ said:
He fucked the princess because he was distraught over losing Gutts. Other people would've drank their minds out or something similar.

And Griffith is quite different from Femto. There will be a discussion that reveals this a bit further down the line.
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Wiseblade said:
You're giving the fool too much credit. There's nothing more to it than I said. Griffith lost control of Guts and slept with the princess to feel better about himself even though he knew being caught would be the end of him.

At that point, Griffith's eventual ascension to the throne was inevitable. The favour of the King, the love of the princess, the fear/control of the nobles and adoration of the commoners. Yet he chose to do the one thing that would ruin all that work. THEN, he had the GALL to make the ones most loyal and closest to him suffer for his mistakes and ambition.

In that night, Griffith revealed his nature as a selfish, spoilt child with a silver tongue and a dream too big to handle. AND WAS REWARDED FOR IT.
Click to expand...
You guys seem to be forgetting the whole bit where he was tortured over a year. Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending him, but Griffith in his right state of mind might have been tempted by the Godhand, but he'd have ultimately told them to go fuck themselves. Griffith resents how his humanity inhibits his ambition, but all that means is that he has that humanity, and he wouldn't have thrown the hawks over the barrel like that...except the Behelit activates in the moment of the most intense despair, where you are most pliable to them.

Guts is the one, along with Caska, that affects his humanity most deeply, and he decided he didn't want to follow his lead anymore. Then he beat him in a sword fight, where Griffith used to have superiority. He made the premature decision with Charlotte out of a need to realize his ambition, and it ended tragically. Then he lost all his physical capability, to the point where he could no longer even speak and was rendered a cripple in a world where strength rules everything. And you know what? An important scene is the one right before his suicide attempt. He imagined a life with Caska, and while it was not his dream, despite all that's happened to him, he would have been willing to accept that. A life with someone that loves him....and then he sees Guts and Caska in an intimate moment. You are looking at a man who has lost literally everything in his life, essentially all to Guts.

And even then he's not 100% on board with the sacrifice bit until Guts comes up, trying to save him. At this point, it wasn't even entirely about his dream. He just needed to get the upper hand somehow, he couldn't live his life as Gut's inferior in every imaginable way. That's not even how an egotist functions, people who feel completely disempowered in every way are similarly prone to despair. It is only then that he accepts it and becomes Femto. And it's important to note that becoming Femto isn't merely getting power. He abandoned his humanity, his capability for empathy. That cold, calculating image that he crafted for himself that was weighed down by his humanity and his doubts of whether it was worth the sacrifice of the hundreds he slaughtered as the commander of the hawks, Femto was that made into reality. Griffith would have very much regretted what he did afterwards. But Femto lacks all empathy *future berserk spoilers for Gintoki*
and even then he had to visit the Hawk's grave site to make sure he felt no guilt
.

I'm not saying Griffith was a good person. God, no. But what a compelling, complex character. As much as you may want to, you can't write him off as simply evil or a child, even though he does possess those characteristics strongly.
 
G

Gintoki313

Banned
Tacitus_ said:
He fucked the princess because he was distraught over losing Gutts. Other people would've drank their minds out or something similar.

And Griffith is quite different from Femto. There will be a discussion that reveals this a bit further down the line.
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Wiseblade said:
You're giving the fool too much credit. There's nothing more to it than I said. Griffith lost control of Guts and slept with the princess to feel better about himself even though he knew being caught would be the end of him.

At that point, Griffith's eventual ascension to the throne was inevitable. The favour of the King, the love of the princess, the fear/control of the nobles and adoration of the commoners. Yet he chose to do the one thing that would ruin all that work. THEN, he had the GALL to make the ones most loyal and closest to him suffer for his mistakes and ambition.

In that night, Griffith revealed his nature as a selfish, spoilt child with a silver tongue and a dream too big to handle. AND WAS REWARDED FOR IT.
Click to expand...

That does make more sense. I remember after the scene he did have that look of "what have I done" on his face. So he probably did do it just to make himself feel better or to get over losing Gutts. Either way Griffith is still a piece of crap. Before all the soldiers were sacrificed they showed him as a boy, and telling him to climb a mountain of corpses if he wants to reach his dream. Without hesitation he just agreed to making that commitment. While he was stunned when the old woman was explaining the situation to him, he still willfully took the chance.

I think Berserk is one of the first manga I've read that made me look into characters so much. As a reader that mostly only reads comedy mangas, going into a dark drama. It's quite the change on my analysis of different characters and scenarios.
 
V

Veelk

Banned
Gintoki313 said:
That does make more sense. I remember after the scene he did have that look of "what have I done" on his face. So he probably did do it just to make himself feel better or to get over losing Gutts. Either way Griffith is still a piece of crap. Before all the soldiers were sacrificed they showed him as a boy, and telling him to climb a mountain of corpses if he wants to reach his dream. Without hesitation he just agreed to making that commitment. While he was stunned when the old woman was explaining the situation to him, he still willfully took the chance.

I think Berserk is one of the first manga I've read that made me look into characters so much. As a reader that mostly only reads comedy mangas, going into a dark drama. It's quite the change on my analysis of different characters and scenarios.
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That wasn't literally what happened. It was an illusion given by that one Godhand. The mountain of corpses was him trying to rationalize what he was doing. He didn't want to make the past sacrifices meaningless, so he had to accomplish his dream, otherwise their deaths would be for nothing. The Godhand was encouraging that mindset, again, to ply him into accepting the sacrifice. The point of that scene wasn't to show his inhumanity at how he sacrifices people, but his immense guilt from doing so, even as he does so. The woman, the godhand in disguise, wanted him to carry on. Again, Femto, the being Griffith always wanted to be, is more the one who truly feels nothing for the harm he causes for the sake of his dream.
 
W

Wiseblade

Member
Veelk said:
You guys seem to be forgetting the whole bit where he was tortured over a year. Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending him, but Griffith in his right state of mind might have been tempted by the Godhand, but he'd have ultimately told them to go fuck themselves. Griffith resents how his humanity inhibits his ambition, but all that means is that he has that humanity, and he wouldn't have thrown the hawks over the barrel like that...except the Behelit activates in the moment of the most intense despair, where you are most pliable to them.

Guts is the one, along with Caska, that affects his humanity most deeply, and he decided he didn't want to follow his lead anymore. Then he beat him in a sword fight, where Griffith used to have superiority. He made the premature decision with Charlotte out of a need to realize his ambition, and it ended tragically. Then he lost all his physical capability, to the point where he could no longer even speak and was rendered a cripple in a world where strength rules everything. And you know what? An important scene is the one right before his suicide attempt. He imagined a life with Caska, and while it was not his dream, despite all that's happened to him, he would have been willing to accept that. A life with someone that loves him....and then he sees Guts and Caska in an intimate moment. You are looking at a man who has lost literally everything in his life, essentially all to Guts.

And even then he's not 100% on board with the sacrifice bit until Guts comes up, trying to save him. At this point, it wasn't even entirely about his dream. He just needed to get the upper hand somehow, he couldn't live his life as Gut's inferior in every imaginable way. That's not even how an egotist functions, people who feel completely disempowered in every way are similarly prone to despair. It is only then that he accepts it and becomes Femto. And it's important to note that becoming Femto isn't merely getting power. He abandoned his humanity, his capability for empathy. That cold, calculating image that he crafted for himself that was weighed down by his humanity and his doubts of whether it was worth the sacrifice of the hundreds he slaughtered as the commander of the hawks, Femto was that made into reality. Griffith would have very much regretted what he did afterwards. But Femto lacks all empathy *future berserk spoilers for Gintoki*
and even then he had to visit the Hawk's grave site to make sure he felt no guilt
.

I'm not saying Griffith was a good person. God, no. But what a compelling, complex character. As much as you may want to, you can't write him off as simply evil or a child, even though he does possess those characteristics strongly.
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Tortured for his actions and his alone. Anyone with half a brain could tell that sleeping with Charlotte was a death sentence, the Hawks say as much when they hear the rumours. Griffith threw everything away because he suffered an inconsequential, embarrassing defeat. It's that simple.

Nobody made Griffith sneak into Charlotte's room. Nobody made him mouth off to the king. Griffith made his bed, then decided those closest to him were worth less than the dream he threw away in childish fit and forced them to lie in it. It doesn't matter if the Godhand persuaded him. When asked to choose between his companions and the throne, Griffith chose the throne. And for that choice, he needs to die.
 
V

Veelk

Banned
Wiseblade said:
Tortured for his actions and his alone. Anyone with half a brain could tell that sleeping with Charlotte was a death sentence, the Hawks say as much when they hear the rumours. Griffith threw everything away because he suffered an inconsequential, embarrassing defeat. It's that simple.

Nobody made Griffith sneak into Charlotte's room. Nobody made him mouth off to the king. Griffith made his bed, then decided those closest to him were worth less than the dream he threw away in childish fit and forced them to lie in it. It doesn't matter if the Godhand persuaded him. When asked to choose between his companions and the throne, Griffith chose the throne. And for that choice, he needs to die.
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You act like you never did or said something you shouldn't have in a moment of anger or despair. This is the same thing as that on a much larger scale. Of course it was stupid, but it wasn't like his mindset was 'I am going to do this thing that is going to ruin my life, tee hee'. He was distraught and distraught people are not rational. I'm not saying it wasn't the wrong decision, but it's a completely empathizible one. This kind of thing is something literally everyone has done at some point: A mistake. Besides, if you think he deserved a year of torture and complete ruination of his body for having sex with a consenting woman and mouthing off to a guy who was going to torture him regardless of what he said then, I think you're morals are somewhat skewed. As for the sacrifice, again, not defending it as a moral decision by any stretch of the imagination, but it is the same thing that happens with Charlotte except on a MUCH more massive scale. If anyone had their life ruined to the extent that Griffith's was (whether his fault or not), whether it's you or me or anyone in this thread, at the height of their despair they would similarly do ANYTHING to change it without considering the moral ramifications of it. If there are people who wouldn't, they are saintly to the point of being borderline inhuman and certainly very small in number. What Griffith did is reprehensible, but all the moreso because we can see ourselves in him.

Besides, you act as if griffith sleeping with Charlotte was inevitably going to lead to his ruin. Had the maid not seen it, had she not reported it, had Charlotte maybe thought up some excuse that the blood was from her period or something, Griffith's fate might have been averted. But chance rules our lives as much as our will does, if not more.
 
G

Gintoki313

Banned
Veelk said:
That wasn't literally what happened. It was an illusion given by that one Godhand. The mountain of corpses was him trying to rationalize what he was doing. He didn't want to make the past sacrifices meaningless, so he had to accomplish his dream, otherwise their deaths would be for nothing. The Godhand was encouraging that mindset, again, to ply him into accepting the sacrifice. The point of that scene wasn't to show his inhumanity at how he sacrifices people, but his immense guilt from doing so, even as he does so. The woman, the godhand in disguise, wanted him to carry on. Again, Femto, the being Griffith always wanted to be, is more the one who truly feels nothing for the harm he causes for the sake of his dream.
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So what I get from this and your write up from before, is that Griffith isn't a full on bad guy. He was actually a good person up until the point where he realized Gutts was surpassing him in leadership, sword fighting, and taking his one chance of happiness away (or that life he saw with Casca). Once he realized that his life and dream were gone, was the moment he lost his mind and decided to choose to want power.

I guess that's one way to look at it, but doesn't that kinda make Gutts seem like the bad guy? All Gutts was doing throughout the story was mostly... well, living. He trained to get better, he showed Casca the attention Griffith couldn't, and he built a friendship with his fellow soldiers while Griffith was talking with nobles and the princess all the time. This kinda makes Griffith seem more jealous of what Gutts has accomplished, more then just his pursuit for his dream.
 
U

upandaway

Member
Assassination Classroom 50

:lol well that was incredibly silly. Now we have a mini-chairman in the student body, but I'm not sure why that's relevant at all. Oh well.
 
V

Veelk

Banned
Gintoki313 said:
So what I get from this and your write up from before, is that Griffith isn't a full on bad guy. He was actually a good person up until the point where he realized Gutts was surpassing him in leadership, sword fighting, and taking his one chance of happiness away (or that life he saw with Casca). Once he realized that his life and dream were gone, was the moment he lost his mind and decided to choose to want power.

I guess that's one way to look at it, but doesn't that kinda make Gutts seem like the bad guy? All Gutts was doing throughout the story was mostly... well, living. He trained to get better, he showed Casca the attention Griffith couldn't, and he built a friendship with his fellow soldiers while Griffith was talking with nobles and the princess all the time.
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I wouldn't call him a good person. He was still a mercenary that was killing people for selfish purpose. But he had humanity, is what I'm saying, and the struggle between his humanity and his ambition is what broke him and what makes him a compelling and complex character. You can't simply write him off as either wholly bad or good. He's more than that.

Guts was, for a long time, opposite of Griffith. He drifted through life without a real goal other than to keep surviving. It was actually Griffith's own words that sparked his downfall. Guts overheard him saying that a friend is someone who is his equal, and to do that they need a dream like Griffth has, not just mindlessly following his. It was Griffith once again rationalizing, pretending he doesn't care about the Hawks. But when Guts heard it, he left to find his own dream, because he wanted to be Griffith's equal by Griffiths terms. Guts was obstensively trying to give Griffith a gift of friendship by leaving. But back to the point, by not having a dream of his own, Guts was a mercenary that didn't judge others, he didn't harm others except in self defense, he felt guilt over his actions and instead of ignoring it, he let that guilt inform his future actions to not make the same mistake.

Guts is only a 'bad guy' if you see it as good inherently good to have ambitions. Guts was just going through life trying to do right where he could, and his mercenary job was less because he wanted to do it and more because he didn't know anything else (which does not detract from the fact that he enjoys a good fight and is not empathetic to his enemies, but still). Guts was no saint, but no, I don't think he was that bad, especially considering the usual characters of people in Berserk.
 
Shouta

Shouta

Member
Read all of what's out for Nanatsu no Taizai <3 Nakaba Suzuki. He makes so many good series and all of them have fantastic characters and awesome action (in their respective genre).

Finished up what was out for The Arms Peddler. I really wish the author would start publishing it again. =(
 
W

Wiseblade

Member
Veelk said:
You act like you never did or said something you shouldn't have in a moment of anger or despair. This is the same thing as that on a much larger scale. Of course it was stupid, but it wasn't like his mindset was 'I am going to do this thing that is going to ruin my life, tee hee'. He was distraught and distraught people are not rational. I'm not saying it wasn't the wrong decision, but it's a completely empathizible one. This kind of thing is something literally everyone has done at some point: A mistake. Besides, if you think he deserved a year of torture and complete ruination of his body for having sex with a consenting woman and mouthing off to a guy who was going to torture him regardless of what he said then, I think you're morals are somewhat skewed. As for the sacrifice, again, not defending it as a moral decision by any stretch of the imagination, but it is the same thing that happens with Charlotte except on a MUCH more massive scale. If anyone had their life ruined to the extent that Griffith's was (whether his fault or not), whether it's you or me or anyone in this thread, at the height of their despair they would similarly do ANYTHING to change it without considering the moral ramifications of it. If there are people who wouldn't, they are saintly to the point of being borderline inhuman and certainly very small in number. What Griffith did is reprehensible, but all the moreso because we can see ourselves in him.

Besides, you act as if griffith sleeping with Charlotte was inevitably going to lead to his ruin. Had the maid not seen it, had she not reported it, had Charlotte maybe thought up some excuse that the blood was from her period or something, Griffith's fate might have been averted. But chance rules our lives as much as our will does, if not more.
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I've made mistakes in life, yes. But never have I acted to hinder my ambitions in a fit of anger. I at least have enough self control to do that much. And I've never benefitted from passing on the consequences of my mistakes to those I care about, or even those I don't. Would you sacrifice your friends and family for fame and fortune? I know I wouldn't.

Like I said, any idiot could see the risks involved with sneaking into the princess's chambers at night and choose not to. I don't care if he wasn't thinking straight, he should suffer the consequences of his actions rather than passing them onto others.
 
K

Kurita

Member
One Piece

Good. (I think I've never said the opposite about a One Piece chapter anyway)

Two weeks remaining until Haikyuu!!'s first volume in France. I just can't wait, haven't read a chapter since the announcement, I miss it so much. But I think I'll enjoy it more this way.
 
U

upandaway

Member
Assassination Classroom 63

5S98mbR.png


Seeing this from Matsui made me burst out laughing just now. Caught me off guard, haha.

He's so salty.

retcon: caught up, good stuff. the villains are kinda reminding me of neuro villains.
 
W

Wiseblade

Member
One Piece

Good stuff. A chapter with focus that covered a lot, always nice to see from Oda. I can't wait for the fights I was promised next week.
 
V

Veelk

Banned
Wiseblade said:
I've made mistakes in life, yes. But never have I acted to hinder my ambitions in a fit of anger. I at least have enough self control to do that much. And I've never benefitted from passing on the consequences of my mistakes to those I care about, or even those I don't. Would you sacrifice your friends and family for fame and fortune? I know I wouldn't.

Like I said, any idiot could see the risks involved with sneaking into the princess's chambers at night and choose not to. I don't care if he wasn't thinking straight, he should suffer the consequences of his actions rather than passing them onto others.
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Really? You've been pushed to the brink of complete despair by the person you value most in the world rejecting you AND in turn felt that the only way to regain some sense of self efficacy was to promote the one, impossibly grand ambition you obsess about (obsess, not merely have), which ALSO coincides with a somewhat risky, but surefire way to realize said ambition if it succeeds opportunity AND you shrugged it off without the slightest temptation due to clear logical thinking? I'd like to hear that story then. The point of the comparison is not that you have done something similar and refrained from making a mistake like he did, but that you may have done something similar, but it was in far less proportion. Griffith's situation is fairly unique, not just by the things that have to coincide for it to happen, but also that the sheer audacity of his ambition and hidden guilt can't be matched by anything a real person can do nowadays, unless you've been working all your life to be president or something and have crushed hundreds of people to get there and you have massive suppressed guilt and empathy towards others. If you really think you have a situation that is analogues to his situation, then it's really a situation that is worth hearing about. Do tell, really.

Also, it's not about fame for him anymore. It used to be, when he was younger and just thought it'd be cool to be king. But present to the story happening, he's pushing for his dream not because he wants it for himself anymore (or atleast not entirely), but because he wants to make the sacrifices he made mean something. "Fame and fortune" aren't analogues here either. And you really don't understand what 'not thinking straight' means if you think 'any idiot could have seen the consequences of what would happen'. You don't think at all when you are that in that state of shock, you react automatically, and he did the only thing that could possibly make him feel better about losing control of someone so important to him that he thought he had control of.

Lastly, and this truly worries me, do you honestly think it's reasonable to demand someone to 'suffer the consequences' when those consequences are being mutilated and tortured and living a cripple because of a single night of weakness? Griffith didn't do anything wrong by having sex with charlotte. Well, he was using her, but she consented, so it's a relatively minor sin. But that's all he did. He had comfort sex with a consenting woman. And, as I explained in the previous post, it's really not as risky as you make it out to be. What were really maid would see it at that unfortunate time, report it, and there was even a way out if Charlotte had been a bit more quick witted and said it was her period. It wasn't THAT insane. And for this he deserves torture and mutilation? I mean, would you go to a paraplegic and tell him he deserves his disability because he was stupid enough not to properly check his parachute when skydiving? Really, what the fuck, man. What Griffith suffered through is something so inhumane, no one deserves it to happen to them, especially when it was done in a time where you weren't rational. What he did to heal himself is also wrong, obviously, but it's kind of sick that to tell a person they should just shut up and deal with things of that nature. What Griffith did was monsterous and of course the hawks didn't deserve it, but I might easily do the same in the height of despair. Not because I'm evil, but because being tortured and taken everything in life from me will leave me with nothing to live for, and here comes someone with offering to give me everything back and knows how to propose it in EXACTLY the right way? Even if by some miracle I have the moral fortitude to refuse, to say that it wouldn't be the greatest temptation of my life would be a lie. Because at that time, no one is thinking about whats moral or right or anything. Hypothetically, there may be some people who resist even in those circumstances, but they would be extremely rare. Yeah, what Griffith did was wrong, but when it's the choice between doing wrong and being miserable for the rest of your life, almost everyone will happily cut any ties to morality they have. Hell, there are people in worse parts of the world will shoot someone for the slightest convienence, like being in the way. To say that the choice is easy in circumstance's like griffiths is just disingenuous.
 
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