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[methos75]

You're too late, MGS4 was projected to sell 1.4 million copies and now they are all sold. Go hang out at eb games and heckle people buying used copies.

I don't get your point, I bought MGS4 day one myself and love it. Pointing out its flaws does not make you an hater, in fact I would argue that a true fan of the series would be more apt to point out its flaws and what could be better, because they unlike an casual fan, are more intent on seeing the series improve and grow.

 

[dermannmitdemcolt]

I can't wait until the fanboy/hype goggles come off with this game like it did with GTA 4 and Bioshock so we can actually have an intelligent discussion about the game, rather than get blindly attacked for saying maybe the game deserved a 9 instead of a 10. Jesus.

Don't think so. People realized that GTA4 was a complete failure, when they reached the 10h mark. At this point you did see everything the game had to offer, the story went downhill and the lack of content was undeniable. I don't know what's wrong with Bioshock, the game is fine as it is. And...MGS4 - most people here have beaten it. And think they've played something special. And rightfully so.

 

[2real4tv]

The only I say its a perfect 10 because other games were getting it non-deservingly and this game is definitely better than those games

 

[revolverjgw]

I never meant to imply that MGS4 should copy the HL/SS/BS philosophy, but rather take notes from it. Imagine how gripping those B&tB backstories would have been if they were interactive, or at least shown in some way or form?

I want forward thinking ways of telling stories. Granted, Bioshock more or less a refined copy of System Shock 2, but I feel the way of storytelling is more true to gaming than cutscenes, so I'm more inclined to forgive that. I still have problems with all my favorite games, but some are more jarring than others. I'm not a game designer, and I know nothing about what it takes to make a game, but I feel that the pieces to a truly gaming-native way of telling a story is out there. What bothers me is that Kojima didn't even try.

There's no ''truly gaming-native way of telling a story'' and never will be, so you can stop holding your breath now. There's not even a truly movie-native way of telling a story.

 

[Absinthe (Permed)]

People are welcome to criticize the game and I've even admitted that it is not perfect. But for someone to complain about the game not being like other games and criticizing it for being wholly Metal Gear---well, that's just silly. It's also silly to say that the game plays exactly like the first game. That's either borderline trolling or complete ignorance.

What is your favorite gun on the game?

 

[chubigans]

What bothers me is that Kojima didn't even try.

Or maybe because this is an established franchise that has it's own method of cutscenes and design? Imagine if the next Half-Life game has out-of-body cutscenes like these here. Do you really think there would be universal praise for the new method of storytelling?

No, because people expect the kind of cutscenes that Half-Life delivers. They've delivered it over the span of four games and lots of expansions (Half Life, Opposing Force, Blue Shift, HL2, Ep1, Ep2, and so on) and I'd imagine they'll continue it. Does that make them lazy?

MGS4 tries a LOT of new things in the franchise, risky in a finale to a twenty year franchise, and certainly ballsy since Kojima could have played it safe. To say he didn't try, or that he was lazy, is so incredibly WRONG.

 

[rollingstart]

How do I get past the (Act 2 Spoilers)

Spoiler

Gekkos in the Drebin escape sequence at the end of Act 2 if I'm going for a no-kill no-alert run? Is it okay to kill Gekkos?

Don't worry about it.

Spoiler

Gekko and other unmanned enemies are fine to kill and even earn you bonus DP.

 

[Guled]

wait, did some of you play the game. From the microwave room, to the final fight

Spoiler

also the bike chase and rex fight

this is the closest gaming has been to movies. The bar was raised

 

[CloudNL]

Does anyobody know where to find a high-res version of that MGS4 movie like poster? I thought it was posted before, but can't find it.

TIA!

 

[Solo]

It's also silly to say that the game plays exactly like the first game. That's either borderline trolling or complete ignorance.

I seem to recall PLAYING THE FIRST GAME in MGS4, if only for a brief while.

 

[lunlunqq]

People are welcome to criticize the game and I've even admitted that it is not perfect. But for someone to complain about the game not being like other games and criticizing it for being wholly Metal Gear---well, that's just silly. It's also silly to say that the game plays exactly like the first game. That's either borderline trolling or complete ignorance.

What is your favorite gun on the game?

i completely agree!

 

[methos75]

wait, did some of you play the game. From the microwave room, to the final fight

Spoiler

also the bike chase and rex fight

this is the closest gaming has been to movies. The bar was raised

That is the issue, some hate how movie like it is and hence the hate on Kojima and his cutscenes and rail sections like the Bike chase.

 

[Absinthe (Permed)]

I seem to recall PLAYING THE FIRST GAME in MGS4, if only for a brief while.

MGS4 is an evolved version of MGS1. They share core gameplay elements (sequels always do), but the game improves upon the framework seen in previous titles. The ability to play in first person, the camo, Drebin points, the ability to play aggressively rather than stealthily, etc. are all welcome.

 

[No_Style]

Just finished off my first BnB Corp:

Spoiler

Found Laughing Octopus incredibly creepy. The creepiest out of all the MGS bosses. The laughter coming from all sides. The sudden bursting into areas and slow methodical movement. What was creepier was her beauty form with all the sounds of her past flooding into the room as she crept closer and closer.

Loving it!

 

[methos75]

People are welcome to criticize the game and I've even admitted that it is not perfect. But for someone to complain about the game not being like other games and criticizing it for being wholly Metal Gear---well, that's just silly. It's also silly to say that the game plays exactly like the first game. That's either borderline trolling or complete ignorance.

What is your favorite gun on the game?

Its neither, its called the fucking truth, please enlighten me on what is so different about MGS$ from MGS and what big next gen changes we have seen in it from MGS3 please. Other wise as I stated before, shut up because you have no foot to stand on, I defended my point, so you do the same.

 

[Guled]

That is the issue, some hate how movie like it is and hence the hate on Kojima and his cutscenes and rail sections like the Bike chase.

The beauty of this game is that you don't do the same thing over and over again for 30 hours like gta. Each act is different and the gameplay feels refreshed. Why would you want one type of gameplay when you could have more?

 

[zam]

Don't worry about it.

Spoiler

Gekko and other unmanned enemies are fine to kill and even earn you bonus DP.

Ok thanks.

Also does anyone know where the (Act 2 spoilers)

Spoiler

Laughing Octopus statue shows up? I defeated her using non-lethal weapons (though I used lethal weapons on her beast form and then tranqed her human form) and now that I'm past the tracking sequence I just remembered that I didn't pick it up. Thinking of going back to my save just before beating her and beating her again and picking up the statue.

 

[Solo]

MGS4 is an evolved version of MGS1. They share core gameplay elements (sequels always do), but the game improves upon the framework seen in previous titles. The ability to play in first person, the camo, Drebin points, the ability to play aggressively rather than stealthily, etc. are all welcome.

You missed my point. I was a) joking, and b) referring to the start of

Spoiler

Act 4, in which you actually get to play an emulated version of MGS1.

 

[biggkidd32]

People are welcome to criticize the game and I've even admitted that it is not perfect. But for someone to complain about the game not being like other games and criticizing it for being wholly Metal Gear---well, that's just silly. It's also silly to say that the game plays exactly like the first game. That's either borderline trolling or complete ignorance.

What is your favorite gun on the game?

M-4 Custom fully decked out. Laser sights and scope. The weapon customizations are really well done. One my favorite new additions to the series.

 

[methos75]

MGS4 is an evolved version of MGS1. They share core gameplay elements (sequels always do), but the game improves upon the framework seen in previous titles. The ability to play in first person, the camo, Drebin points, the ability to play aggressively rather than stealthily, etc. are all welcome.

Yes but those are not extreme advancements and the core gameplay is unchanged, and even more painfully so compared to the last three games as an whole. Look I sam not saying that is bad because it is what MGS fans wanted, but issue is with saying that little things like this have advanced gameplay beyond other games, when its just an play on the other games gameplay. I call BS on that.

 

[Truant]

There's no ''truly gaming-native way of telling a story'' and never will be, so you can stop holding your breath now. There's not even a truly movie-native way of telling a story.

I disagree. While there are obvious, experimental exceptions, I think that film is a very obvious storytelling medium. In fact, so much that it's something you take for granted, and therefore accept it when it appears in other mediums, such as gaming.

You would think Kojima, proclaimed innovator, would look at this and try to adress it. Whenever I ask people about this game, they tell me how innovative and cinematic it is. Then I try to talk with them about cut-scenes, and every single time I get the whole 'This is just how MGS has always been' and I pass out from the oximoronity and wake up with amnesia and find myself as a videogame cliché as I try to unravel my dark past.

 

[lunlunqq]

Or maybe because this is an established franchise that has it's own method of cutscenes and design? Imagine if the next Half-Life game has out-of-body cutscenes like these here. Do you really think there would be universal praise for the new method of storytelling?

No, because people expect the kind of cutscenes that Half-Life delivers. They've delivered it over the span of four games and lots of expansions (Half Life, Opposing Force, Blue Shift, HL2, Ep1, Ep2, and so on) and I'd imagine they'll continue it. Does that make them lazy?

MGS4 tries a LOT of new things in the franchise, risky in a finale to a twenty year franchise, and certainly ballsy since Kojima could have played it safe. To say he didn't try, or that he was lazy, is so incredibly WRONG.

well said. i think Kojima Production has added enough interesting new things into this game while conserving its true MGS core. It is an amazing achievement considering this is the last chapter where they have to tie up every loose end in the story of MGS series. Maybe next MGS game will be very different and I may happily accept it. But not this one. This is the perfect finale of an epic saga.

 

[Absinthe (Permed)]

Its neither, its called the fucking truth, please enlighten me on what is so different about MGS$ from MGS and what big next gen changes we have seen in it from MGS3 please. Other wise as I stated before, shut up because you have no foot to stand on, I defended my point, so you do the same.

I don't recall the other Metal Gear games having things like Drebin points. The other games were almost impossible to play aggressively as well. This game does not force you to play the game stealthily like the past games. Not to mention that this game boasts entirely more weapon variety. Then you have things like the stress meter, the ability to take photos, the active camo, the ability to play in first person, etc.

 

[hirokazu]

Ok thanks.

Also does anyone know where the (Act 2 spoilers)

Spoiler

La-Li-Lu-Le-Lo statue shows up? I defeated her using non-lethal weapons (though I used lethal weapons on her beast form and then tranqed her human form) and now that I'm past the tracking sequence I just remembered that I didn't pick it up. Thinking of going back to my save just before beating her and beating her again and picking up the statue.

Spoiler

Statue?

I don't have that either...

 

[rollingstart]

People are welcome to criticize the game and I've even admitted that it is not perfect. But for someone to complain about the game not being like other games and criticizing it for being wholly Metal Gear---well, that's just silly. It's also silly to say that the game plays exactly like the first game. That's either borderline trolling or complete ignorance.

I have said it before in this thread and just to make my stance clear, I feel like MGS4 is perfect and the best game ever made. I am fine with other people expressing their opinions and critcizing the game, but it does get annoying when someone disagreeing with others considers themself right saying that it should have been done this one way. The gaming medium is big enough to have stories told through gameplay like Portal, Bioshock and the Half-Life games at the same time to have games that strive to be cinematic like Metal Gear. There is no wrong way to do it. I sure as hell don't want MGS story telling/cutscenes in Bioshock, nor do I want it the other way around.

 

[Solo]

The other games were almost impossible to play aggressively as well.

True for MGS1 and 2, but in 3 you could play like freakin' Rambo.

 

[rSpooky]

Not even done yet.. I am in act 4 , but this game amazing. I am really wondering WTF is wrong with some people here, trying to put the game down on any point. It might not be your style of game but some of the comments here are ridiculous.

I do admit , this game is not for everyone and though,in fact I hope my friend didnt buy it yet, because I want to make sure he knows what he is getting into (he never played a MG game in his life)

I love the cut scenes,but there were times ( especially act 3,so far) where I was getting so angry , wanting to take control and smack some people around. Seeing the drama unfold I just really wanted to intervene,at times I was screaming at the TV :lol . Which just shows you that Hideo is a master in bringing out these emotions with his story telling.

The game is also full of easter eggs as a clear sign of fan service , that newcomers will just not notice or "get" which is a shame.

The game is a masterpiece that will surely get a place in gaming history , no matter how hard the haters try to put it down.

 

[Truant]

True for MGS1 and 2, but in 3 you could play like freakin' Rambo.

I turned Big Shell into a slaughterhouse on my second playthrough.

 

[BlueTsunami]

Just want to state that I finished Act III and I feel that the story isn't really meshing with me. The big moment didn't really elicite any surprise out of me. Also this game really doesn't have any notable enemies beside Liquid and Vamp. The Beauties feel like a throwback instead of a main component. The way MGS3 handled the various Boss personas was nearly perfect.

 

[Solo]

I turned Big Shell into a slaughterhouse on my second playthrough.

Well there you go. I guess stealth isnt really a requisite in ANY of these games, to be honest.

 

[Calcaneus]

Just beat Act 2. The gameplay sections were great, I already can't wait to tiker around with it during my next playthrough.

I also want to start MGO, but everytime I think of doing that stupid update, I just slip back into playing the main game. Anyone know if the update process is any better than the last one?

 

[firehawk12]

Just a quick question about Naomi:

Spoiler

I may have missed something with the USB key during the Act 3 mission briefing. I just assumed that was Liquid/Ocelot telling her to infiltrate Otacon's systems or some such, but she couldn't do it and that was the end of it. I don't think it comes back up again, but now I'm wondering if I missed something and that was a foreshadowing of the virus uploaded to GW.

Any ideas?

 

[Mr. Spinnington]

okay, finished the game a few hours ago. as awesome as things were getting around act 3, the reveals at the end nullified everything i felt up to the last 2 acts. in that case, i have no feelings towards this game's story, i'm totally indifferent. and that's not a good thing

i can also see this game getting an honest 8/10, but no lower. the reason is that normally it wouldn't be such a big deal since game stories aren't usually of such importance, but hideo made the story such a huge part of the game that the actual gameplay (while fantastic) boils down to about 6 hours of playtime, out of an 15-20 hour game

even compared to the other mgs games, this one seems to have the shortest amount of play in it. so it's a legitimate reason to complain about the story so much if you don't like it, when a game is so focused on telling it to you. yeah there's mgo, but the core content of the disc is the story taking place throughout various cutscenes; and to me it felt like hideo was trying way too hard to please fans and make all the ends meet at the same time

he definitely could have used a little editing, and especially so near the end, but in the end i felt nothing for the characters in no way; some of them didn't belong, others had boring stories. maybe i shouldn't have finished mgs3 so close to this one's release, or perhaps it wouldn't have made a difference, but i stopped going OMG at the story about halfway through-- and i love this series

considering i won't play this for at least a year again i may sell it (anyone who wants mgs4 for $48 shipped let me know), but i'm glad i saw the series through to the end. it was kind of a neat thing to do

 

[Truant]

Well there you go. I guess stealth isnt really a requisite in ANY of these games, to be honest.

True, though the first person mode made it much easier to play it that way. MGS1 didn't have that on PS1.

 

[zam]

Spoiler

Statue?

I don't have that either...

You get statues for beating the BNBs using non-lethal weapons. Collect 5 statues (one for each BNB and one for beating the

Spoiler

FROG encounter with the Rat Patrol without killing anyone

. Collect all 5 and you get the Solar Gun.

Edit: Just noticed that in my previous post Laug-hing Octopus got changed to La-Li-Liu-Le-Lo. Wtf?

 

[Attack You]

Random thoughts:

I've always had a "problem" utilizing all of the techniques and items/weapons at my disposal in MGS games, and GotP underlines that. Didn't lay down any traps or customize any guns. Apparently, I forgot how to use Mk. II to scout ahead by Act 3. I had to take a crash course in CQC to deal the boss fight in the hangar. I completely forgot about holding people up until I started a second playthrough.

If I absolutely must nitpick, Acts 3 and 4 were the low points of the game. The beginning of Act 3 took me too long to "figure out." Act 4 was sparse on hide-and-seek. Both made up for their shortcomings in grand style by their close. Taken as a whole, the pacing of the game turned out pretty good. It may have dragged if all Acts were as heavy on the stealth as the first two. Although, you get to the beginning of Act 5, and it's jarring because you need your best stealth on tap after you've let the faucet run cold for a good chunk of the game.

But really, if I couldn't enjoy this game for what it is, I'd have to end my life, because I'm already dead inside. There's a powerful sense of payoff here for having followed this series since the original Metal Gear two decades ago. Regardless whether it's the "Game of the Forever" or not, I think KojiPro has done the franchise, its fans, and the medium justice in MGS4 -- perhaps with the assurance that they won't have to produce another epic like this again.

Now, get to work on ZoE3 already.

 

[sullytao]

Just got upto the first boss on Act 5 and dont think that I will be able to progress any further. Basically my PS3 controller works like a dream apart from the motion sensing which has stopped working altogether. So I come to a point where you have to move the controller to damage the boss. I'v tried every other large weapon I can think of but they sadly do nothing.

It's stuff like this that take the piss too no end. This sequence could have easily been done with using the analogue sticks but instead they had to tack on the motion sensing. The same problem has appeared in plenty of other ps3 games aswell.

My general feeling of the game upto that point is that its ok. There is some fun gameplay moments, but there's also a hell of alot of tedium. My most hated gameplay moment so far would have to be the following mini game thing in the third act. That bit lasted way too long and wasn't very challenging or interesting.

Other grievances I have with the game are the controls which are far from the worst around but still are not very user friendly. The environments allow for open strategies at times but then other times you will find that you are blocked by the stupidest of things. The install time in the game made me lol at one point. I'v gone through atleast 4 install screens in my playthough so far. This is the first PS3 game that I have played that uses install but surely others cant be this bad can they?

Finally the cutscenes. They are very well directed and if you liked the story in other MGS titles you will probably love them (presonally I found the story too ridiculous to get into but enjoyed the gameplay from the first 2 games) but even the most hardcore of fans must think that its gone too far in this game. There is without a doubt more cutscene time than there is game time. While story is a great asset to have in a video game surely the first priority should be the actual game itself.

 

[methos75]

I don't recall the other Metal Gear games having things like Drebin points. The other games were almost impossible to play aggressively as well. This game does not force you to play the game stealthily like the past games. Not to mention that this game boasts entirely more weapon variety. Then you have things like the stress meter, the ability to take photos, the active camo, the ability to play in first person, etc.

The Derbin points are just a cash system, new to MGS maybe, but not a next gen advancement. You could play MGS3 in an aggressive manner if you wanted, god knows I did. Weapon variety while nice, does not scream to me gameplay advancement at all. The stree meter is the same as the stamina gauge in Snake Eater, you could go First Person in Snake Eater:Sub as well, and the Active Camo is just a play on the camo system in MGS3.

 

[Won]

Before I completely ignore this thread and wait for the inevitabe "Things you DON'T like about MGS4" (lawl) thread, I will add one complain:

WTF was with the cutscene weapon switching? I don't even know how often I had to go into the menu after a cutscene, because the game replaced the weapon I just used with the M4 or the stupid Operator.

 

[Absinthe (Permed)]

I think that this is the perfect game for fans of the series that wanted to see an evolved version of the past games and a satisfying conclusion. For people that wanted a wholly unique experience and wanted to see the gameplay completely changed or greatly tinkered with---well, they're probably disappointed with it.

 

[2real4tv]

I disagree. While there are obvious, experimental exceptions, I think that film is a very obvious storytelling medium. In fact, so much that it's something you take for granted, and therefore accept it when it appears in other mediums, such as gaming.

You would think Kojima, proclaimed innovator, would look at this and try to adress it. Whenever I ask people about this game, they tell me how innovative and cinematic it is. Then I try to talk with them about cut-scenes, and every single time I get the whole 'This is just how MGS has always been' and I pass out from the oximoronity and wake up with amnesia and find myself as a videogame cliché as I try to unravel my dark past.

But u act like its suppose to be a totally new experience, if that the case it would not be Metal Gear

 

[dagZ]

Can anyone help me? In Act 4,

Spoiler

you have to kill vamp, but he never dies? what do i do?

 

[zam]

Can anyone help me? In Act 4,

Spoiler

you have to kill vamp, but he never dies? what do i do?

Spoiler

CQC Grab with syringe equipped. Press /\

 

[Absinthe (Permed)]

I also think that despite not seeing proof, a lot of people are going to be eating crow when the NPD is released. It seems like that the game is selling incredibly well on top of all of the bundles being sold out as well.

 

[John_B]

I managed to obtain the Foxhound rank. It takes a load of patience, but it is very doable.

I will go for some of the other ranks now, then perhaps Big Boss next weekend. It will be extremely frustrating.

 

[rollingstart]

I also think that despite not seeing proof, a lot of people are going to be eating crow when the NPD is released. It seems like that the game is selling incredibly well on top of all of the bundles being sold out as well.

I am curious to see if it actually does sell or not. There is no marketing for this game at all.

 

[hirokazu]

You get statues for beating the BNBs using non-lethal weapons. Collect 5 statues (one for each BNB and one for beating the

Spoiler

FROG encounter with the La-Li-Lu-Le-Lo without killing anyone

. Collect all 5 and you get the Solar Gun.

Edit: Just noticed that in my previous post Laug-hing Octopus got changed to La-Li-Liu-Le-Lo. Wtf?

I'm near the end of Act 2, I did that for the first boss

Spoiler

because I read someone say here that you get a reward for defeating bosses with non-lethal weapons, and I actually did both the beast form and human form of Laughing Octopus that way. I assumed the extra face camo was the only reward. Where do I collect the statue?

Spoiler

I didn't know about statues, so I didn't do it for the FROGS encounter,

guess I'll have to do that on the second play-through.

 

[Absinthe (Permed)]

I am curious to see if it actually does sell or not. There is no marketing for this game at all.

Which is really, really fucking strange to me. You'd think that Sony would be pimping the hell out of this game.

I've seen a ton of games that is showing off Gran Turismo, Little Big Planet, and Metal Gear 4, but they need commercials solely dedicated to MGS4. I just haven't see many of those at all.

 

[biggkidd32]

I also think that despite not seeing proof, a lot of people are going to be eating crow when the NPD is released. It seems like that the game is selling incredibly well on top of all of the bundles being sold out as well.

People thought MGS4 was not going to sell well? *Mind boogles*

 

[Blablurn]

Finished the game for the third time now. still wow <3. it made several photos and collected all mp3's this time.

next on the list is the stealth camo.