People like to think they (as in western countries) are better than russia or other dictators.
These kind of news show that we are not one inch better than other war criminals.
More than 200 dead in suspected U.S. airstrike that hits civilians in Mosul
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People like to think they (as in western countries) are better than russia or other dictators.
These kind of news show that we are not one inch better than other war criminals.
SolarPowered
Member
Christ almighty and some people wonder why people hate or fear America.
TwiztidElf
Member
But, but, 3 people died in London. That's what's getting rammed down my throat by my mainstream media (real news).
Mr. Giggles
Member
200 hundred innocent people died, I want the alt-right cucks who lurk the forum who love saying that They're all for freedom and tolerance to come in and tell me how these people deserved this.
this shit was bad enough under Obama but I fear that it's only going to get much worse under Trump as he gets "tough" on ISIS and in the process pushes more people into their arms.
I can't imagine what I would feel if I had to bury family members killed in a strike like this. You can't blame people for hating us.
I can't imagine what I would feel if I had to bury family members killed in a strike like this. You can't blame people for hating us.
TrojanBlade
Member
Yeah I was thinking the same or the fact that there are no BIG LETTERED headlines all over the media when more people are killed in these countries compared to if just a few are injured in the west. How long will the western world let their governments go unaccounted for these heinous acts. I am all for killing the actual terrorists but I can't accept even one let alone 100s of innocents dying. Nope that's not collateral damage that's just plain murder.
Sunster
Member
they will just say we are naive and this is war or some bullshit like that. had this argument a million times with the likes of them
AdventureRacing
Member
Jesus that's a fucking tragedy. 200 people, it's hard to even picture. What's sad is that whilst this is an extreme case this type of event isn't even uncommon, this is just what people in countries like Iraq have had to get used to. It's disgusting, no ones held accountable and there aren't even any real apologies. Meanwhile when the west gets hit by a terrorist attack we say it's because they hate freedom and democracy. Shit like this only furthers the cause of terrorists and encourages more people to become one.
The whole situation is terrible and sad.
The whole situation is terrible and sad.
It's not just those types that justify this as being just the way it is
Kralamoonard
Member
Mr Giggles, this isn't even an 'alt-right' problem. Framing it like that is completely missing the point and counter intuitive to the core of the problem.
We have so called 'liberals/lefties', from politicians to people in various threads here on GAF, who don't say a thing or are silent or try and justify it by saying it's a 'necessary part of war.'
One of my closest friend in high school for example, who was as 'liberal' as they got, attempted to justify the Iraq war (even 10 years after it started) and is way pro-Israel playing the 'both sides are as bad as each other card'.
Even the Obama administration wasn't exactly a ray of sunshine in regards to hawkish foreign policy. You guys keep bringing up Trump but the double standards have been there long before the wotsit came into power. It's a sad state of affairs. As much as I hate trump to my guts, at least he's brutally honest (not a good thing but probably the only statement with an underlying truth) when it comes to how evil and disgusting the US have been in their foreign policy. He wasn't exactly framing it that way (and was doing so in defence of Russia with that stupid brain of his), but when he said 'we have a lot of killers' he wasn't lying.
Yep you have a point there. I missed out that point. Like Poster#1 said, US did it so it's fine.
We have so called 'liberals/lefties', from politicians to people in various threads here on GAF, who don't say a thing or are silent or try and justify it by saying it's a 'necessary part of war.'
One of my closest friend in high school for example, who was as 'liberal' as they got, attempted to justify the Iraq war (even 10 years after it started) and is way pro-Israel playing the 'both sides are as bad as each other card'.
Even the Obama administration wasn't exactly a ray of sunshine in regards to hawkish foreign policy. You guys keep bringing up Trump but the double standards have been there long before the wotsit came into power. It's a sad state of affairs. As much as I hate trump to my guts, at least he's brutally honest (not a good thing but probably the only statement with an underlying truth) when it comes to how evil and disgusting the US have been in their foreign policy. He wasn't exactly framing it that way (and was doing so in defence of Russia with that stupid brain of his), but when he said 'we have a lot of killers' he wasn't lying.
Yep you have a point there. I missed out that point. Like Poster#1 said, US did it so it's fine.
.
Shadow Puppetry
Member
Agree.
Yup, in the article:
Our goal has always been for zero civilian casualties, but the coalition will not abandon our commitment to our partners because of ISIS's brutal tactics terrorizing civilians, using human shields, and fighting from protected sites such as schools, hospitals and religious sites, Scrocca said in a statement, using an acronym for Islamic State.
They seem really committed to this goal, with these constant recklessly planned strikes.
Kralamoonard
Member
Ah the human shield card, being played from Gaza all the way to Syria as an excuse to lift the blame off the government's atrocities.
Sunster
Member
most advanced military in the world yet we use it just like Russia
Kain-Nosgoth
Member
that's plain old terrorism, i don't care about the goal behind it, and it's been going for years, even under obama with the drones strikes! And fucking trump will now try to do even worse or what?
Let's remind people that it happen almost every week too, it's just that here, it's a really big number of people killed so it's not easy to avoid it!
Let's remind people that it happen almost every week too, it's just that here, it's a really big number of people killed so it's not easy to avoid it!
Monochromaticx
Member
When can they sue the US?
There has been article after article how the trump administration plans on loosening the rules and plans on going forward with air strikes that have high risk of large civilian casualties. That is something obama didn't do.
So we're at a crossroads. You can either point out that it's getting worse and something needs to be done about it. Or you can pretend that both sides are the same and nothing will ever fucking happen. Frankly I'd be happy with going back to obamas status quo at least.
jellies_two
Member
What was getting not too widely reported, perhaps because it wasn't well sourced enough, is that Trump had sent out a memo saying that whatever the military were doing "in excess" of international laws in war, they should stop doing, and get as close to the low bar as they possibly could. And the person that leaked this information said it was the must effed up thing they'd ever seen. Judging by the civilian casualty counts it feels like this was the policy change.
Nationalism is cancerous.
Always has been, always will be.
How else can I be proud of the greatest country in the world?
Always has been, always will be.
How else can I be proud of the greatest country in the world?
theignoramus
Member
This is a bombshell news if true. But I'm tired of this trend of poorly sourced or highly speculative reporting on Trump catching wind simply because it confirms our worst fears or assumptions about the man. I need substantive proof.
jellies_two
Member
You can probably google some of this text or check who it came from and find out whether it pans out.
The context that this is not normal came from someone else.
edit: so removing hyperbole from what I first said, it isn't stated that he has issued instructions however if the attitude in the "gimme a plan" memo HAS been translated to what they're doing now [and why wouldn't it?], then it fits with the much higher civilian casualties this month.
Would not be surprising in the least. Under Obama, the Afghanistan hospital fuck-up was the big one, and now we have two in a week? Something's loosened up their standards.
Corronchilejano
Member
Killing civilians without repercussions is a US thing, not a Trump thing. Whoever still wonders why some people may hate you in the third world, it's because of shit like this.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
That was apparent after the Iraq war. We killed over 100k people in that country.
I H8 Memes
Member
Remember during the Iraq war when the military only dropped a bomb if it was estimated that it would only kill 27 civilians or less? Good times. Devils math tho.
Sunster
Member
idk about that. attitude would definitely be different. But the fact is, innocent civilians being killed in the middle east and Africa never get to even 10 pages. No matter who killed them.
water_wendi
Water is not wet!
Targeting family?
You Are Viewtiful
Member
Is this after his new drone strike guidelines came into effect? Not surprised at all. Republicans have very little regard for non-American lives, may as well not even be human.
Sunster
Member
they don't care about american lives either, but thats a different thread.
Obama is a damn war criminal too. The Nobel of Peace was a biggest joke of all time.
Americans still have the SAME image of warmongers since 1950 (Korea) tbh
Americans still have the SAME image of warmongers since 1950 (Korea) tbh
Davey Cakes
Member
This is horrible and sickening. Our leadership is making us look like careless warmongers.
water_wendi
Water is not wet!
What were we before? Careful warmongers?
Sunster
Member
we were great
jellies_two
Member
If the Feb/March figures continue (a different graph that includes March I can't re-find right now, is much worse) there is a qualitative difference with Trump on the levers. Russia used to be criticised for being indiscriminate and now the US can't do that.
1950-53 Korea
1961 Cuba - Bay of Pigs invasion
1961-1973 Vietnam
1961-1980s School of the Americas > fucking up Latin America as a whole
1965 Dominican Republic - US sends marines to quash a leftist uprising
1983 Grenada - US invade Grenada
1989 Panama - US invade Panama
1991 Gulf War
1994-1995 Bosnia
1999 Kosovo
2001-2014 Afghanistan
2003-2010 Iraq
2014-... Islamic State
"We are #1 USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!"
Lil'DigiOp
Member
And people gasp whenever I claim that were terrorist too.
Perspective.
These people know nothing about what goes on in the middle east, but the propaganda absolves us of any wrong doing.
Perspective.
These people know nothing about what goes on in the middle east, but the propaganda absolves us of any wrong doing.
Kralamoonard
Member
This just makes me think...how long do we even have to wait until people start opening their eyes? Like, what's the solution? Because it obviously hasn't started with this airstrike, nor will it end.
elrechazado
Banned
It's also going to be more relevant with Trump doing it than it was under Obama.
It's one of those things where as an individual event it may very well have happened under the Obama administration, but with Trump at the helm I expect more of these sorts of tragedies overall (like the raid he signed off on before). And an even less honest internal investigation (if such a thing is possible).
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
#trumpkillscivilians
Masterspeed
Member
I can't wait to see this plastered on every single news channel in both USA and UK, oh wait, I fucking won't.
TimeEffect
Member
Hm, didnt repubs shit on obama for this like last year?
We're already seeing it in this thread with the supporters.
Under Trump/Bush these were bad things.
Under messiah Obama? Lets just sweep it under the rug.
Adam_Vania
Banned
lol pointing fingers to pass the buck. the truth is, the American people don't care, so long as they can blame someone else. this post is that in action.
it's US policy. there is no anti-war party counterbalance. it has been this way ever since 9/11. at first it was W's fault. then it was Obama's fault. now it's Trump's fault. as long as we can blame somebody else we don't actually have to do anything about it.
we are where we are because of this. all the animosity against Islam was not created by Trump. it has been normalized through things like this happening for the past 16 years and people just not caring.
it is unfortunate and illogical, since these things will only create more terrorists. our children and grandchildren will be fighting the children and grandchildren of the people we killed in Iraq War 2050
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