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Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)

shandy706

Member
Ha, good one.

Truth is they got it right years ago. FH3 is just the current peak of it.

Unless you're trying to say this isn't getting it "right"?
w2PsAXL.png

I like car butts and I can not lie, you other brothers can't deny...

forzahorizon39_27_201c8s70.png


Super overcast day with some light sprinkles. Makes for some nice body shots.
 

Synth

Member
Hmm, Dumb and others have tons of off-road screenshots which make you sweat about your statement...

I'm not sure who the "others" are that you're referring to, but dumb basically doesn't do "screenshots". He has a fucking fantastic sense of photography in these games, but he's basically supplying a constant stream of bullshots that look nothing like the game does running in realtime. We've seen some direct comparisons as to what can happen to a Driveclub scene between realtime and photomode.. it really shouldn't be getting utilized the way it is for comparisons. In photomode I'd agree that Driveclub currently remains untouched (and will probably remain that way until the equally photogenic Gran Turismo turns up), but even if the game contains assets of this quality, they are not represented at anything close to that quality when playing the game. This is why so many people pick up Driveclub, and then remark "it looks nothing like all the images I was seeing", because everything appears muddy and undefined by comparison to the photomode shots, and indeed plenty of other games.

So I re-ask my question for the experts who would come by here :

What is preventing DC to go open world ?

I'm definitely not an "expert", but I've seen this pop up a few times, and I'm always surprised that people think making a game open-world would be as simple as "remove the restrictions". There are tons of things I can think of that an open world game would need to consider that a more linear one doesn't.

Firstly, both games utilize streaming, but in Driveclub's case the next place the player will move to is easily predicted, because they can only follow the track forwards, or backwards. This is even in effect in the photomode, where you're prevented from roaming far from the established course. If you had something more akin FH3's drone mode in Driveclub, this would be an easier claim to make. Sonic Generations also streams the level in as the player moves through it, and it's really really good at doing this at some ridiculous speeds... until the player employs some shortcut that causes them to move through the level off the beaten path, at which point the scenery around you disappears as the game scrambles to get what it needs I order to draw everything to the screen again.

Secondly, in both games aggressive LOD will reduce the quality of assets at a distance.. however, in Horizon's case you can usually approach all them and they will be rendered in full detail, including all those that surround it. So whereas you could create an area 3km from the track containing 1000 trees getting LOD'd into sprites in both, in an open world game you'll probably have to deal with those 1000 trees at close range should the player decide to drive there. In Driveclub, this wouldn't be an issue because you've locked the player to the track and so they can't actually get to them ever... let alone get passed them and look back at the track through the forest. Same goes for stuff like placing a huge mountain 5km from course. You just never have to worry about resolving any of it at a higher details, or having it approached from any angle. This obviously still applies to an open world game to some extent, but is basically limited to the outer circumference of the game's world, rather than a short distance from any given course.

Finally, and this one is less directly about open-world and more of a game design element in general, but pretty most areas in FH3 are also occupied by traffic, in addition to the human controlled players. 12 cars at any one time are all that will ever be present in a scene in Driveclub, whereas 12 player cars that can be comprised of any combination 350+ cars contained in the game, but also AI cars which can also be a different set of cars from any of the players.

There's quite a bit that would need to change in order for Driveclub to do what FH3 does, and vice-versa. There's a lot of talk here comparing the talent of each team, and what would happen if Evolution made a Driveclub 2, or if Playground games had 40% more processing power to work with, or if one switched to linear vs the other switching to open-world... and honestly I think there's too many variables to make sort of meaningful prediction in those regards. Even when talking stuff like FH3 being the second Playground games attempt on XB1, there's the fact that they had shipped FH1 in 2012, when Evolution was probably a year deep into Driveclub's development at that point. Driveclub also had an additional year of development added onto it, and the weather update still arrived months after launch. Had it realised at the PS4 launch like it was slated to, it would have been a game entirely without weather, and a DC2 may have been when were got the weather system it has now. The "what if" scenarios just aren't really worth it.
 
Ha, good one.

Truth is they got it right years ago. FH3 is just the current peak of it.

Unless you're trying to say this isn't getting it "right"?

Well it is off for that time of day. Everything looks far lighter than it would and looks very unnatural, hardest time of the day to capture though. However I'm assuming that is photomode not in game as it would be a very unusual option for PG to intentionally blow out highlights like that to capture darker tones.
 
I'm not sure who the "others" are that you're referring to, but dumb basically doesn't do "screenshots". He has a fucking fantastic sense of photography in these games, but he's basically supplying a constant stream of bullshots that look nothing like the game does running in realtime. We've seen some direct comparisons as to what can happen to a Driveclub scene between realtime and photomode.. it really shouldn't be getting utilized the way it is for comparisons. In photomode I'd agree that Driveclub currently remains untouched (and will probably remain that way until the equally photogenic Gran Turismo turns up), but even if the game contains assets of this quality, they are not represented at anything close to that quality when playing the game. This is why so many people pick up Driveclub, and then remark "it looks nothing like all the images I was seeing", because everything appears muddy and undefined by comparison to the photomode shots, and indeed plenty of other games.



I'm definitely not an "expert", but I've seen this pop up a few times, and I'm always surprised that people think making a game open-world would be as simple as "remove the restrictions". There are tons of things I can think of that an open world game would need to consider that a more linear one doesn't.

Firstly, both games utilize streaming, but in Driveclub's case the next place the player will move to is easily predicted, because they can only follow the track forwards, or backwards. This is even in effect in the photomode, where you're prevented from roaming far from the established course. If you had something more akin FH3's drone mode in Driveclub, this would be an easier claim to make. Sonic Generations also streams the level in as the player moves through it, and it's really really good at doing this at some ridiculous speeds... until the player employs some shortcut that causes them to move through the level off the beaten path, at which point the scenery around you disappears as the game scrambles to get what it needs I order to draw everything to the screen again.

Secondly, in both games aggressive LOD will reduce the quality of assets at a distance.. however, in Horizon's case you can usually approach all them and they will be rendered in full detail, including all those that surround it. So whereas you could create an area 3km from the track containing 1000 trees getting LOD'd into sprites in both, in an open world game you'll probably have to deal with those 1000 trees at close range should the player decide to drive there. In Driveclub, this wouldn't be an issue because you've locked the player to the track and so they can't actually get to them ever... let alone get passed them and look back at the track through the forest. Same goes for stuff like placing a huge mountain 5km from course. You just never have to worry about resolving any of it at a higher details, or having it approached from any angle. This obviously still applies to an open world game to some extent, but is basically limited to the outer circumference of the game's world, rather than a short distance from any given course.

Finally, and this one is less directly about open-world and more of a game design element in general, but pretty most areas in FH3 are also occupied by traffic, in addition to the human controlled players. 12 cars at any one time are all that will ever be present in a scene in Driveclub, whereas 12 player cars that can be comprised of any combination 350+ cars contained in the game, but also AI cars which can also be a different set of cars from any of the players.

There's quite a bit that would need to change in order for Driveclub to do what FH3 does, and vice-versa. There's a lot of talk here comparing the talent of each team, and what would happen if Evolution made a Driveclub 2, or if Playground games had 40% more processing power to work with, or if one switched to linear vs the other switching to open-world... and honestly I think there's too many variables to make sort of meaningful prediction in those regards. Even when talking stuff like FH3 being the second Playground games attempt on XB1, there's the fact that they had shipped FH1 in 2012, when Evolution was probably a year deep into Driveclub's development at that point. Driveclub also had an additional year of development added onto it, and the weather update still arrived months after launch. Had it realised at the PS4 launch like it was slated to, it would have been a game entirely without weather, and a DC2 may have been when were got the weather system it has now. The "what if" scenarios just aren't really worth it.

A few ppl on gaf = somany ppl now huh?
Care to point out what significantly changes in DC from photo mode to gameplay. Because the way you put, it's like photo mode and gameplay in DC are two different games.
 

Sebmugi

Member
2 small fresh gif ;)
Driveclub for me is often more impressive in motion than with the photo mode .. strongly ps4 pro for make 1080p video

161010081033172693.gif
161010081017342350.gif
 

dr guildo

Member
I'm not sure who the "others" are that you're referring to, but dumb basically doesn't do "screenshots". He has a fucking fantastic sense of photography in these games, but he's basically supplying a constant stream of bullshots that look nothing like the game does running in realtime. We've seen some direct comparisons as to what can happen to a Driveclub scene between realtime and photomode.. it really shouldn't be getting utilized the way it is for comparisons. In photomode I'd agree that Driveclub currently remains untouched (and will probably remain that way until the equally photogenic Gran Turismo turns up), but even if the game contains assets of this quality, they are not represented at anything close to that quality when playing the game. This is why so many people pick up Driveclub, and then remark "it looks nothing like all the images I was seeing", because everything appears muddy and undefined by comparison to the photomode shots, and indeed plenty of other games.



I'm definitely not an "expert", but I've seen this pop up a few times, and I'm always surprised that people think making a game open-world would be as simple as "remove the restrictions". There are tons of things I can think of that an open world game would need to consider that a more linear one doesn't.

Firstly, both games utilize streaming, but in Driveclub's case the next place the player will move to is easily predicted, because they can only follow the track forwards, or backwards. This is even in effect in the photomode, where you're prevented from roaming far from the established course. If you had something more akin FH3's drone mode in Driveclub, this would be an easier claim to make. Sonic Generations also streams the level in as the player moves through it, and it's really really good at doing this at some ridiculous speeds... until the player employs some shortcut that causes them to move through the level off the beaten path, at which point the scenery around you disappears as the game scrambles to get what it needs I order to draw everything to the screen again.

Secondly, in both games aggressive LOD will reduce the quality of assets at a distance.. however, in Horizon's case you can usually approach all them and they will be rendered in full detail, including all those that surround it. So whereas you could create an area 3km from the track containing 1000 trees getting LOD'd into sprites in both, in an open world game you'll probably have to deal with those 1000 trees at close range should the player decide to drive there. In Driveclub, this wouldn't be an issue because you've locked the player to the track and so they can't actually get to them ever... let alone get passed them and look back at the track through the forest. Same goes for stuff like placing a huge mountain 5km from course. You just never have to worry about resolving any of it at a higher details, or having it approached from any angle. This obviously still applies to an open world game to some extent, but is basically limited to the outer circumference of the game's world, rather than a short distance from any given course.

Finally, and this one is less directly about open-world and more of a game design element in general, but pretty most areas in FH3 are also occupied by traffic, in addition to the human controlled players. 12 cars at any one time are all that will ever be present in a scene in Driveclub, whereas 12 player cars that can be comprised of any combination 350+ cars contained in the game, but also AI cars which can also be a different set of cars from any of the players.

There's quite a bit that would need to change in order for Driveclub to do what FH3 does, and vice-versa. There's a lot of talk here comparing the talent of each team, and what would happen if Evolution made a Driveclub 2, or if Playground games had 40% more processing power to work with, or if one switched to linear vs the other switching to open-world... and honestly I think there's too many variables to make sort of meaningful prediction in those regards. Even when talking stuff like FH3 being the second Playground games attempt on XB1, there's the fact that they had shipped FH1 in 2012, when Evolution was probably a year deep into Driveclub's development at that point. Driveclub also had an additional year of development added onto it, and the weather update still arrived months after launch. Had it realised at the PS4 launch like it was slated to, it would have been a game entirely without weather, and a DC2 may have been when were got the weather system it has now. The "what if" scenarios just aren't really worth it.

Pics are worth 1000 words :
All pics from GTplanet DC scenery thread : https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/driveclub-scenery.320510/

Streaming would do the rest to go open world IMO, as you told yourself, you are not an expert.
Evo are wizard when it comes to loading times, I think streaming have no secret for this studio too...

Wow, those DC pics make me think that DC is the most realist game in the world when it comes to graphics, this is clearly unbelievable !!
 
Well it is off for that time of day. Everything looks far lighter than it would and looks very unnatural, hardest time of the day to capture though. However I'm assuming that is photomode not in game as it would be a very unusual option for PG to intentionally blow out highlights like that to capture darker tones.

No, I did that myself, it is photo mode. The default exposure is 50 and is darker than that picture at that time of day so I increased it to boost the darks.


EDIT: Jesus fuck, put those in quotes please. That's a lot of scrolling.

A few ppl on gaf = somany ppl now huh?
Care to point out what significantly changes in DC from photo mode to gameplay. Because the way you put, it's like photo mode and gameplay in DC are two different games.

Gameplay has a lot of jaggies, photomode renders some intense AA. I believe car models are boosted slightly but not as strongly different as the change you'd see in Forza. Motion blur has exponentially more samples, and the DoF switches from the crappy gaussian kind to a proper bokeh kind since it has about 25 seconds to render a single frame.
 

Gestault

Member
Dr guildo, on a serious note, some people are on mobile. If you feel compelled to dump that many images at once, please quote them so it's not unbearable to use this thread. For perspective, it's 30 presses of the Page Down button on normal desktop.
 

DD

Member
Pics are worth 1000 words

But you're actually proving his point. D:

I mean, the things in the distance are just some polygons with blurry textures, and some 2D sprites in some cases. You could stream things, the little details while moving there, but then you'd hit limitations like memory and budget.
 
No, I did that myself, it is photo mode. The default exposure is 50 and is darker than that picture at that time of day so I increased it to boost the darks.


EDIT: Jesus fuck, put those in quotes please. That's a lot of scrolling.



Gameplay has a lot of jaggies, photomode renders some intense AA. I believe car models are boosted slightly but not as strongly different as the change you'd see in Forza. Motion blur has exponentially more samples, and the DoF switches from the crappy gaussian kind to a proper bokeh kind since it has about 25 seconds to render a single frame.

Gameplay doesn't have a lot of jaggies. Evo has stated that the car models you see in the garrage are the same car models you drive on the track lol. Even then so those changes are enough to make it seem like Photo mode and gameplay is like comparing 2 different games?
 

DD

Member
The only assets changes I see in photomode in DC is in the grass. All the rest looks the same to me. But, yeah, infinite AA, AF, high quality DOF and motion blur can do wonders, tho.
 

shandy706

Member
(snip tons of shots).

Viewed on a phone and as thumbnails some of these are absolutely gorgeous.

Viewed at 1080p....some of these are nice lighting wise, but just awful texture/asset wise.

Low....low res textures all over the place. I sometimes wonder what people are looking at (or what they're viewing shots on)

What's with the lack of Forza gifs?

giphy.gif


I'd have made a ton by now normally, but I've had basically ZERO time to play since it came out :'(
 

Synth

Member
A few ppl on gaf = somany ppl now huh?
Care to point out what significantly changes in DC from photo mode to gameplay. Because the way you put, it's like photo mode and gameplay in DC are two different games.

Look, "so many" doesn't actually have a number. It's also not restricted to GAF. Don't worry so much about it... just pretend I said "some people" if that helps.

Pretty much everything related to the graphics is touched by the photomode to various extents (and this is hardly limited to Driveclub either). Car models are swapped out for the highest fidelity model, AF is increased to a decent standard, textures appear better (not just at an angle either... even dead on), reflections are far higher quality, shadows are better.. basically everything. I mean, why wouldn't they be? It has all the time in the world to render the image.. pretty much every graphical compromise made in every game is made to get the rendering time under the required amount to hit the desired framerate.

When you look at the individual technical aspects of Driveclub, it sits at the top of the genre in nearly all of them (in areas that aren't omitted entirely)... however the cost for this results in an overall image quality that for some people isn't very attractive. The photomode allows all of Driveclub's strongest aspects to shine (at an even higher level of quality), whilst also solving all of the image quality issues that drag it down in realtime. It's the best of both world's, but not what the game actually looks like.

And again, this applies to the photomode for most games, not just Driveclub. For simply showing nice pictures (in an OT or the screenshot thread - though that should probably actually be screenshots too) photomodes are great. They should not however be used to argue the graphics of one game against those of another, as those aren't the game's graphics.

Also, I never said it was like "comparing two different games". If you want a comparison along those lines though, it's like comparing a game to its next-gen remaster.

Pics are worth 1000 words :

Streaming would do the rest to go open world IMO, as you told yourself, you are not an expert.
Evo are wizard when it comes to loading times, I think streaming have no secret for this studio too...

No, in this case pics are not worth a thousands words. None of those pics address anything that I said.

And yes, I said I'm not an expert... but that doesn't mean nothing I stated doesn't make any logical sense. "Evo are wizards when it comes to loading times" is very likely a result of smart decisions made on what not to do. The point is that there are many things that Driveclub, as a closed-circuit racer can get away with that a true open-world game doesn't have the luxury of. Maybe Evo could in fact make an open-world game that looks exactly the same... but they haven't, so it's moot. But it's not just a case of removing the barriers.
 

dr guildo

Member
But you're actually proving his point. D:

I mean, the things in the distance are just some polygons with blurry textures, and some 2D sprites in some cases. You could stream things, the little details while moving there, but then you'd hit limitations like memory and budget.

You will have LOD more agressive, for sure. Do you think FH3 is not using LOD and streaming of datas ?
 

dr guildo

Member
Dr guildo, on a serious note, some people are on mobile. If you feel compelled to dump that many images at once, please quote them so it's not unbearable to use this thread. For perspective, it's 30 presses of the Page Down button on normal desktop.

Most of those shots are Jpegs, they weight nothing...
 

Gestault

Member
Viewed on a phone and as thumbnails some of these are absolutely gorgeous.

Viewed at 1080p....some of these are nice lighting wise, but just awful texture/asset wise.

Low....low res textures all over the place. I sometimes wonder what people are looking at (or what they're viewing shots on)

I had the same reaction. Even for carefully composed (and otherwise beautiful) vistas, you still see things like floating trees and some very low detail background segments like the capped mountain. Which isn't to say "this is unacceptable," but it's just a sign of how the attention to assets falls off the further from the track you get.

Like, I don't want to sound overly harsh, but Dr Guido, you legitimately seem to not be understanding what people are saying when they talk about asset and engineering differences for these kinds of games.

Most of those shots are Jpegs, they weight nothing...

It's not about the data usage; the space an image post like that takes up is excessive. It's why I mentioned the time it takes to scroll for mobile users, or the number of "page down" presses to get past your single post for desktop users. It's almost spamming. You can use quotes around your own images to minimize that if you think having that much is necessary for your point, and it cuts down that issue quite a bit.
 
giphy.gif


I'd have made a ton by now normally, but I've had basically ZERO time to play since it came out :'(

Thank you kindly :p I'd love to see some gameplay clips, PC if possible.

Side note, there's definitely some rough spots in DC, but that game just has a visual style that it nails, I think it's the lighting. Greater than the sum of it's parts for sure.
 

shandy706

Member
Thank you kindly :p I'd love to see some gameplay clips, PC if possible.

Side note, there's definitely some rough spots in DC, but that game just has a visual style that it nails, I think it's the lighting. Greater than the sum of it's parts for sure.

Gameplay and screenshots in FH3 on PC are basically identical (on my setup). You get a bit more AA passes and obviously you can alter DOF and other things in "photomode". I don't tend to alter anything but DOF.

3uMFPEw.gif
 

DD

Member
I made this DC video. :3

You will have LOD more agressive, for sure. Do you think FH3 is not using LOD and streaming of datas ?

Sure it is! :D
What I'm saying is that things wouldn't be as simple as removing the invisible walls and adding stuff that would come up via streaming. You could hit processing power limitations, or even if you don't, it would be insanely expensive to make a huge world with the same level of detail DC has. Another thing to add to the equations is the fact that the PS4 is more powerful than the Xbox One. To be honest, I think FH3 looks ace, but it might be too much to expect to expect it to look just like Driveclub because they follow very different philosophies, running in different specs. I think it's unfair to downplay the outstanding job the guys at Playground Games are doing.
 

Noobcraft

Member
Holy crap, Forza still have this problem with the tire marks?! D:
Yeah rewind mode doesn't erase the tire marks it draws so using it to make gifs like Sunhilegend did in that gif does that. It's definitely something they should address.
 

dr guildo

Member
But you're actually proving his point. D:

I mean, the things in the distance are just some polygons with blurry textures, and some 2D sprites in some cases. You could stream things, the little details while moving there, but then you'd hit limitations like memory and budget.

Do not forget, DC was targeting 60fps at some time, and it runs at a rocksteady 30fps, that means that the PS4 is not pushing all of its power in this game.
And it's because as you said : "the things in the distance just some polygons with blurry textures, and some 2D sprites in some cases."
...that open world is possible, via LOD and streaming. Can you go anywhere you want in FH3 ?
 
Look, "so many" doesn't actually have a number. It's also not restricted to GAF. Don't worry so much about it... just pretend I said "some people" if that helps.

Pretty much everything related to the graphics is touched by the photomode to various extents (and this is hardly limited to Driveclub either). Car models are swapped out for the highest fidelity model, AF is increased to a decent standard, textures appear better (not just at an angle either... even dead on), reflections are far higher quality, shadows are better.. basically everything. I mean, why wouldn't they be? It has all the time in the world to render the image.. pretty much every graphical compromise made in every game is made to get the rendering time under the required amount to hit the desired framerate.

When you look at the individual technical aspects of Driveclub, it sits at the top of the genre in nearly all of them (in areas that aren't omitted entirely)... however the cost for this results in an overall image quality that for some people isn't very attractive. The photomode allows all of Driveclub's strongest aspects to shine (at an even higher level of quality), whilst also solving all of the image quality issues that drag it down in realtime. It's the best of both world's, but not what the game actually looks like.

And again, this applies to the photomode for most games, not just Driveclub. For simply showing nice pictures (in an OT or the screenshot thread - though that should probably actually be screenshots too) photomodes are great. They should not however be used to argue the graphics of one game against those of another, as those aren't the game's graphics.

Also, I never said it was like "comparing two different games". If you want a comparison along those lines though, it's like comparing a game to its next-gen remaster.



No, in this case pics are not worth a thousands words. None of those pics address anything that I said.

And yes, I said I'm not an expert... but that doesn't mean nothing I stated doesn't make any logical sense. "Evo are wizards when it comes to loading times" is very likely a result of smart decisions made on what not to do. The point is that there are many things that Driveclub, as a closed-circuit racer can get away with that a true open-world game doesn't have the luxury of. Maybe Evo could in fact make an open-world game that looks exactly the same... but they haven't, so it's moot. But it's not just a case of removing the barriers.
Maybe you are right but car models aren't swapped out. Evo have stated that the cars are the same as those in the garage.
 

Noobcraft

Member
I still have a special place in my heart for night-racing in FM6.
The lighting looks better at night than it does in day races in FM6 imo.

Maybe you are right but car models aren't swapped out. Evo have stated that the cars are the same as those in the garage.
If there are multiple cars on track, Driveclub swaps out car models in photomode. In 1 car time trials, the model is the same in gameplay and photomode.
https://youtu.be/pOG1lzbzjCg
 

ShapeGSX

Member
But you're actually proving his point. D:

I mean, the things in the distance are just some polygons with blurry textures, and some 2D sprites in some cases. You could stream things, the little details while moving there, but then you'd hit limitations like memory and budget.

Yeah, those images do little to convince me that they spent much time at all on areas far from the road in DC. Forests disappear abruptly in the distance (LOD?). The Mt Fuji looking mountain in the background looks like it has a PS2 texture wrapping it.
 

Gestault

Member
The lighting looks better at night than it does in day races in FM6 imo.

The early morning/dusk windows are my favorite in Horizon 3, and they do things with the atmospherics that give reeeally nice results with that side-lighting (part of why I love the options for blueprint events).
 

Synth

Member
And it's because as you said : "the things in the distance just some polygons with blurry textures, and some 2D sprites in some cases."
...that open world is possible, via LOD and streaming.

No, because not being able to go there eliminates much of the consideration for what you actually place there. You can make a densely packed forest off in the distance, safe in the knowledge that it'll never have to be rendered as a fully detail 3d scene, because you can never be "within" it.

I already talked about streaming which the Sonic Generations example. It's not just a magical cure all that allows your game to suddenly represent the entire planet easily. Actually speaking of planets... this would be a good time to also mention how "you can see things as far away as 260km" are pretty meaningless in isolation. Guess how far away you can see shit in Elite Dangerous?

Maybe you are right but car models aren't swapped out. Evo have stated that the cars are the same as those in the garage.

The car models likely are the same in some instances (such as time trial, when only one is present).. but they're not highest quality in all situations like they are in photomode. I believe this was already tested and proved at some point earlier in the thread actually. I may go look for the post.

EDIT: What Noobcraft's posted will suffice.
 

dr guildo

Member
Yeah, those images do little to convince me that they spent much time at all on areas far from the road in DC. Forests disappear abruptly in the distance (LOD?). The Mt Fuji looking mountain in the background looks like it has a PS2 texture wrapping it.

Because it is zoomed. Do the same with FH3, you will see the result, it's not even better as seen in previous pages. In fact, it's worst.
 

dr guildo

Member
No, because not being able to go there eliminates much of the consideration for what you actually place there. You can make a densely packed forest off in the distance, safe in the knowledge that it'll never have to be rendered as a fully detail 3d scene, because you can never be "within" it.

I already talked about streaming which the Sonic Generations example. It's not just a magical cure all that allows your game to suddenly represent the entire planet easily. Actually speaking of planets... this would be a good time to also mention how "you can see things as far away as 260km" are pretty meaningless in isolation. Guess how far away you can see shit in Elite Dangerous?

For a gameplay purpose, you won't have to drive in a so densely packed forest, because it's impossible to make your way in.
So to make the game playable, the area will have to be more spaced out, ala FH3, so you make less demanding environnements concerning the number of assets.
 

ShapeGSX

Member
I mean, really anywhere ? Not semi open world...

For the most part, yes. There are a few places that you can't go. There are some areas with people. They can't be accessed at all with the cars. I believe that the mountain in the middle of the map is off limits. Although, I don't know that I've ever noticed the wall that surrounds it, if there is one. I haven't spent as much time in that area of the map as the rest.

Most of the water in the game is shallow enough to drive across with any vehicle. But there is a lake or two that will cause your car to respawn on the side if you dare go deep enough.

And the edges of the map have very natural borders like cliffs or boulders or ocean or water that keep you inside the game. Again, it's very organic and you never feel like you are being kept out of any area.

Everything else? Drive there. It's as open as GTA V.
 

ShapeGSX

Member
Because it is zoomed. Do the same with FH3, you will see the result, it's not even better as seen in previous pages. In fact, it's worst.

How would you know that it isn't just low a low resolution asset without actually going over to the mountain in DC? Can you drive over to the mountain?
 
After a lot of time spent on both titles (and previously stating that DC was the best looking) I have to say... DC does a more impressive job technically... but FH3 just looks more visually attractive. What a beautiful game.
 
The lighting looks better at night than it does in day races in FM6 imo.


If there are multiple cars on track, Driveclub swaps out car models in photomode. In 1 car time trials, the model is the same in gameplay and photomode.
https://youtu.be/pOG1lzbzjCg

No, because not being able to go there eliminates much of the consideration for what you actually place there. You can make a densely packed forest off in the distance, safe in the knowledge that it'll never have to be rendered as a fully detail 3d scene, because you can never be "within" it.

I already talked about streaming which the Sonic Generations example. It's not just a magical cure all that allows your game to suddenly represent the entire planet easily. Actually speaking of planets... this would be a good time to also mention how "you can see things as far away as 260km" are pretty meaningless in isolation. Guess how far away you can see shit in Elite Dangerous?



The car models likely are the same in some instances (such as time trial, when only one is present).. but they're not highest quality in all situations like they are in photomode. I believe this was already tested and proved at some point earlier in the thread actually. I may go look for the post.

EDIT: What Noobcraft's posted will suffice.


So this happens when racing with other cars. What about when you're alone in a time trial? Does it also model swap when you go into photo mode?
 

Synth

Member
I mean, really anywhere ? Not semi open world...

I'm not sure what you're asking here. By "semi open world" do you mean like the original Forza Horizon or game like Need for Speed / Burnout Paradise, where you can freeroam the roads, but not the areas between them? If so, then no, it's not like that.

For a gameplay purpose, you won't have to drive in a so densely packed forest, because it's impossible to make your way in.
So to make the game playable, the area will have to be more spaced out, ala FH3, so you make less demanding environnements concerning the number of assets.

Yea, but that's kinda the point. When you at a forest in FH3 from a distance, you are seeing the result of these things already being taken into account. You drive into a forest and can go between all the trees etc, and it'll render the all to a standard in line with everything else in the game. When you see something like that in Driveclub, the 3D epresentation will likely never be seen, ever (and so effectively, it doesn't actually exist).. and nothing says that the game would handle that scenario well if they decided to just let you go there.

So this happens when racing with other cars. What about when you're alone in a time trial? Does it also model swap when you go into photo mode?

No idea tbh. At the very least the time trial model will be of a higher quality than the one in standard use.

When you are alone on the track, there is no swapping as already explained in the past, tho.

That's not really the point though. Photomode will swap the models out to make the game look better in many cases. So when dumb does a comparison by taking a photomode shot of an AI car to show the details they exhibit, it's meaningless, because all that shows is Driveclub's photomode handles that better. Those cars don't look like that ingame, so what's the point of the comparison?
 

Gestault

Member
AkLmNPl.gif


I do think the in-game motion blur quality is particularly solid in Horizon 3. Normally when you have high-contrast blur scenes (like the cast shadows on the tarmac here) you can get banding because of the lower number of samples, but they use what looks like some of the same techniques from PGR4. Most games are better about this now, but you notice it right away if it's not up-to-snuff.

Also, ugly cars need the MOST love.

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