BBQ_of_DOOM
Member
Some random previews mentioned it, but nothing concrete/reliable.
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Next-gen Racing Graphics Face-off | (Next-gen means current-gen)
- Thread starter Gestault
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Some random previews mentioned it, but nothing concrete/reliable.
I've played (and own) all of the games you mentioned other than PCars 2 (I have the original though). You seem to have no idea what you're talking about to be frank.
Forza Motorsport 1 had day racing and night racing, but never transitioned during a race.
Forza Motorsport 2 through 5 didn't even have night racing.
Forza Motorsport 6 brought night racing back, and added wet weather. There are no transitions however, you pick day or night, wet or dry at the start of the race, and whatever conditions you begin the race with are the same you end the race with.
All of these are static conditions.
Forza Motorsport 7 allows for races to begin and end at different times of day, and allows for rain to start and stop during a race. This is dynamic...
It doesn't allow the player to freely set the conditions, and it doesn't allow these conditions on all courses, but that doesn't prevent it being dynamic where it is used. This is a ridiculous point to be arguing against.
Ethomaz, did you mean to say Forza here? It's the first I'm hearing about a confirmed rain feature for GTS other than tyre material.
My eyebrows are going up on this. Any screenshots or professional write-ups?
So wrong lmao
ethomaz
Banned
I dont have pics here but when in Arcade Mode you have to choose a combo that the last two options was Dirt and Snow... in the middle has Rain too but Rain was combined with others options like Night, Afternoon, etc... these options were there but disabled to choose in Beta.
I'm going to remind you of what you said, which is a bit difficult to read, but I think you were saying that you set the weather at the start and it stays the same throughout (thought?!) the race.
ethomaz said:
So, now you're moving the goalposts. The weather will change during the race. You were wrong. You would have known that if you played the free demo.
I've been looking for videos of GTS weather. Have any been released?
So, a quick recap.
ethomaz:
- Doesn't actually know what the word "dynamic" means
- Doesn't know what was/wasn't in previous Forza games
- Considers rain to be factually in GTS despite no actual evidence of its presence yet 2 weeks from release
- Has extrapolated that if rain is in, then it'll of course change throughout the course of the race like FM7's
- Didn't seem to know Forza 7's actually changed during the race, but didn't let that stop him
ethomaz:
- Doesn't actually know what the word "dynamic" means
- Doesn't know what was/wasn't in previous Forza games
- Considers rain to be factually in GTS despite no actual evidence of its presence yet 2 weeks from release
- Has extrapolated that if rain is in, then it'll of course change throughout the course of the race like FM7's
- Didn't seem to know Forza 7's actually changed during the race, but didn't let that stop him
thelastword
Banned
A tear is a tear. I know what it means traditionally. My main point was not even about the tearing though, ok let's call it a split tree...It was about the foliage, textures and general lighting which had to take a step down to cater to weather whilst keeping 60fps. As I said, 60fps is great, but we're just seeing the cost with newer features added on top? 4k is great, but at what cost? especially if you want to compete with other titles on a visual level. I wonder if DF will do a "60fps or 4k at what cost" video on this title...I think they've done it for a few titles before....Anyway, carry on...
Did you even see textures and foilage on highest settings? Or are you looking at og Xbox one? Cause textures are extremely high res with a lot more grass on Xbox One X and pc highest settings
Head.spawn
Junior Member
More Pcars 2 photomode shots:
Full size shots: https://www.flickr.com/photos/15539352@N02/sets/72157687605088095
Downsampled like that, you could absolutely trick some people into thinking these are IRL shots. Beautiful.
ethomaz
Banned
- I know what Dynamic weather / ToD means.
- I know and played previous Forza and it has baked change of time when the race started with sun high and ended with sun falling.
- I saw Rain the GTS Beta menu... Dirt, Snow, etc... I was on the Beta in the first day already.
- Do you believe you will race the same tack for over a hour with the same weather/ToD? It is baked (predefined) but it will chance.
- Not just me but Eurogamer is saying the game changes weather/ToD not in a trully dynamic way... it probably is not simulating weather or passing time like a dynamic weather/ToD does... pCARs 2 or GT5/6 do that but not Forza 7.
When they spread it has dynamic weather/ToD I had the impression it was dynamic like GT5/6... this is a big difference here.
Oh boy so much mis info
What FM game has TOD changing? Must have been kept aside with HL3 lol
Dynamic means changing
Weather changes in a race
TOD changes in a race
These elements are randomly selected by the game engine for every race
You set a percentage on the chances of rain and how much is ramdomly done
There is nothing static about it like you have in gts
Also LOL at your proof there's weather in gts
Gts is out in 2 weeks and not a single pic or video of weather. It's not looking good bud
NullPointer
Member
is GTS completely static?
Coulda sworn I read somewhere that it has some very limited transitions / TOD options.
I read that it does that but it basically puts you in a loading screen to load up the track to a brighter scene. Basically loading up a pre baked track
Doesn't happen in real time like FM7
Are there any timelapse videos of Forza 7 already?
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
The amount of motion blur is laughable insane and still we can easily see aliasing.
You either add an "insane amount" of motion blur to a 30 FPS game or you deal with a stuttering image. Ignore the obvious graphical differences. which one looks smoother to you?
This: https://youtu.be/8xm9StdHhzk?t=6m44s
or
This? https://youtu.be/wQ9tAIFw8WQ?t=1m46s
Or, the engine has a small set of fixed conditions to choose from. Like I said before Turn 10 never said it was completely dynamic because why wouldn't you if it is.
Furthermore, from reading through the Forza Motorsport 7 OT, it seems like the conditions only change when the player is moving. One would have thought a dynamic system would be completely independent to any other system because it would need to simulate conditions and display it regardless of other factors.
I found the post to highlight what I mean...
...which really confirms there is no dynamics at play. It does change but it's completely artificial.
How can a system be dynamic when it's tied to player activity (see details above) or doesn't simulate changing conditions?
Gran Turismo Sport seems to have a real-time system in place. If you look at shadows they have the same characteristics as open-world games, either softly dithered or softly jagged. It's like the engine changes the position of the sun based on the time you select from the menu, which seems to be a different system to Forza Motorsport 7.
You do need to consider track limits and run-off...but not trees in the background. Just don't worry about it. It's not important.
skyfinch
Member
Weather changes without player movement. That race must have been one of the first races where it can save rain to start after a certain time but I've sat during a race and seen it go from rain to sunshine without moving my car. Do you have the game?
Video of weather and lighting changing with player standing still
https://youtu.be/vdjLX1-CO9k
Beerman462
Member
I see the usual suspects are not only cherry picking evidence to prove points, but also cherry picking who and what they respond to so they can ignore counter points they can't argue against and when that fails they move the goal posts and invent new definitions for commonly used terms.
Like I said before all of these games look great, but all have flaws and make sacrifices to hit their targets. That's what making games is about though or we would all be playing VR sims that are indistinguishable from real life.
At least the thread is entertaining to read.
Like I said before all of these games look great, but all have flaws and make sacrifices to hit their targets. That's what making games is about though or we would all be playing VR sims that are indistinguishable from real life.
At least the thread is entertaining to read.
rodrigolfp
Haptic Gamepads 4 Life
MilkyJoe
Member
Does anyone at Turn 10 actually drive? What happens to the tail lights when you have your headlights on? What happens to the tail lights when you hit the brakes? Are they afraid of illumination? Ffs sort it out.
Here are two shots of mine.
Gosh dang FM7
Beerman462
Member
That skybox loops over the same animation rather quickly - and abruptly due to the timelapse. By 5:16 you have the same skybox as you had at 4:15 in this video.
I had presumed Forza had ToD changes like GT6 where you literally saw the stars change as the game simulated the rotation of the earth.
LukasTaves
Member
The video isn't even 2 minutes long XD
But what you are asking is not possible because they recorded the sky. It's not a composed skybox in realtime (they clearly use the skybox to light the scene though, so their lighting model has to be at least somewhat dynamic. Likely, using image based HDR/lighting)
Don't know what you're talking about. That video is 1min long and it looks sped up because it is. The video is played in fast motion which makes the sky move faster than normally like any other time lapse video
Yeah, my conclusion after wasting time reading his comment. Shitting a game that probably didnt even play on first place...but why?
Gran Turismo Sport | PS4 Pro, Replay/Gameplay
Lighting in GTS is superb, second to none. Hopefully they nail it with the online mode... who knows? maybe GTS can become the PUBG of console racing games.
eso76
Member
What he wrote is the time on the lap, not the video. Weird but there it is.
And yeah clouds loop after a while: those races starting in light rain, then downpour, then storm, always end in the same glowing sunset as that stage in the demo.
icecold1983
Member
Not close at all. Theres a reason people only post highly artistic shots of pcars games
rokkerkory
Member
I get some of these posts nitpicking the tiniest of things. Is any game perfect? Nope come on each game had to make a decision to dial back certain things and prioritize others.
GTS: lighting is best
F7: 4k60fps rock solid
DC: environments are amazing
GTS: lighting is best
F7: 4k60fps rock solid
DC: environments are amazing
NullPointer
Member
Yeah, the staged PCars2 shots aren't representative of gameplay, at least on the current consoles. The in-cockpit shots like you'll find in the console screenshots thread are better in those terms, and while the gameplay won't exactly match, those do communicate the feeling perfectly.
icecold1983
Member
not on pc either. since theres no way to add tons of filters and DOF blur to cover up the extremely poor looking tracks and awful environment materials/lighting/foliage while actually playing
l2ounD
Member
Does it ever go from rainy to sunny in the afternoon?
BBQ_of_DOOM
Member
That track/setting looks awesome.
TheAdmiester
Member
That little pink square area before you go into the tunnel, driving through that in overcast is one of the most realistic things I've ever seen in a game.
EDIT: Just took a shot in non-overcast just because I like it.
NullPointer
Member
You do get an in-game DOF when using the cockpit view with helmet. And you can configure the strength of all of those effects, including removing the helmet itself funny enough.
If you played the game you would see the lights illuminate on the ground.
That little pink square area before you go into the tunnel, driving through that in overcast is one of the most realistic things I've ever seen in a game.
EDIT: Just took a shot in non-overcast just because I like it.
Is that real life?
icecold1983
Member
in game dof doesnt at all produce the same effect of the artistic shots people post. the poor looking environments are always plainly noticeable, as is the huge amt of shimmer if you dont have a gpu capable of enormous pixel counts
The artistic decisions on how the dynamic ToD is used has little to do with it being dynamic or not. It would be somewhat ambiguous if it were a situation like Need for Speed 2015, where the ToD reflects the player's location in the world, as then you could argue that there is actually only one ToD that exists for any given location on the track, and so the lighting could have been predefined for it as such. This isn't the case for FM7 where owing to its lap based nature the different time and weather conditions would be applied across the entire track.. it'd be pretty awkward having a 50 lap race otherwise.
The system isn't tied to player behaviour inherently, as shown by the video Space_nut posted, which honestly should be considered conclusive and end the conversation entirely. If it were, then it wouldn't be able able to function in a multiplayer environment, unless each player was seeing a different localised ToD, out of sync with everyone else. In terms of using the player location to influence the ToD, this isn't really anything out of the ordinary. I believe both the Forza Horizon games and Driveclub do this at times during predefined events. There are races where you'll start out at night, and then progress to heavy raining part way through, before transitioning to sunrise to coincide with the last lap or so of the race. This will happen even for players of wildly differing skill levels, putting up completely different lap times. Tying the time of day to player actions in this case makes sense as it allows for some artist direction that you can guarantee each player sees.
JackAubrey
Member
In Forza 7's free race mode you can set a weather condition for the start, mid and end of the race. With probabilities for the latter two.
It's similar to Pcars2, though that game allows more slots.
There plenty of variety in what you can choose for those slots in Forza 7. Doesn't have to be rain, there are several fog options. And the rain can be a light summer shower, or even a full on thunderstorm with lightning.
You can even choose a thunderstorm without it raining on the track. So one can simulate a distant storm with one slot then have it arrive and rain with the next slot.
It's similar to Pcars2, though that game allows more slots.
There plenty of variety in what you can choose for those slots in Forza 7. Doesn't have to be rain, there are several fog options. And the rain can be a light summer shower, or even a full on thunderstorm with lightning.
You can even choose a thunderstorm without it raining on the track. So one can simulate a distant storm with one slot then have it arrive and rain with the next slot.
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