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[Miburou]

Like I was saying earlier, this whole thing about PSP > DS because of speed makes no sense to me. PSP does not use touch screens or voice recognition gameplay. Why does it feel like the people who are actually concerned about gameplay here are in the minority? This is Gaming Age - you would figure that there would be tons of gameplay enthusiasts here.

When I first saw this news I thought "wow, that is really awesome for the consumer." Then I read everyone's response saying that somehow PSP >>> DS now. This just doesn't compute. Is graphical technology really that important to all of you? For a crowd that is so focused on stretching the boundaries of the modern game, it seems those excited about new gameplay styles are really in the minority. I find this really sad, to be honest .

The point is that some people aren't (yet) convinced that the DS's touchscreen will enhance gameplay.

 

[Mrbob]

The price point is astounding, but we're still talking about a device that is going to require you to buy a proprietary movie format to watch a movie, buy very expensive memory cards to listen to music, and only lasts for 5 hours (estimates are always higher than actual use but we'll give them the benefit of the doubt here). If people check their facts, no wonder it has to be so cheap; nobody would buy it.

Look at how well those Majesco GBA videos are selling. I never thought there would be a market for portable movie/tv show viewing but I guess those Majesco video sales have proved me wrong.

Anyway, I'm shocked at this pricepoint too. I'm guessing $199 US launch base price and $250 bundle price. I'll get that bundle version right away! New Level 5 PSP game? Sold!

Oh, and poor Europe. You know you guys are going to get raked over the coals and make up the difference from the money lost in NA and Japan on the PSP hardware. Enjoy paying the equivalent of 1000 US dollars for each of your PSP units.

 

[Guns N' Poops]

Well, that strategy worked for 'em on PS2!

Oh great, the big "I am a freaking blind nintenbot" outing starts, huh? What is next, the PS2 was bought in 90% of all cases for the DVD player function and 75% of PS2 users are software pirates? It's time to get your innovated ass from this thread, for sake.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Like I was saying earlier, this whole thing about PSP > DS because of speed makes no sense to me. PSP does not use touch screens or voice recognition gameplay. Why does it feel like the people who are actually concerned about gameplay here are in the minority? This is Gaming Age - you would figure that there would be tons of gameplay enthusiasts here.

It's quite simple. The gameplay style of the PSP has been proven to work. It's basically taking the PS2 and putting it into handheld form. The DS style of gameplay hasn't been proven yet, and until Nintendo proves that it definetly works then people will continue to prefer what they know works.

 

[drohne]

don't even try to spin it, nintendoods fans! the psp just did the same number on ds that the playstation did on saturn. sony's come up with forward thinking hardware at an aggressive price, and they've caught the competition flat-footed. nintendo doesn't even have time to revise their hardware as sega did. would anyone choose a $150 n64 over a $200 ps2? cute touchscreen or no, that's essentially the choice portable gamers will be making. the ds is over. it's been exposed for the lazy hack it is. i'm sure some of you people are privately questioning your preferences.

 

[JasoNsider]

The point is that some people aren't (yet) convinced that the DS's touchscreen will enhance gameplay.

That's because the touchscreen doesn't necessarily enhance anything. It's just completely different altogether in many cases. Sure, for a game like Advance Wars or something it would possibly enhance input, but for many games it's just completely different. That's why it really irks me to see people so callous towards brand new input devices and gameplay styles. Especially in the crowd that should be the most accepting. I find it really worrisome.

 

[human5892]

Oh great, the big "I am a freaking blind nintenbot" outing starts, huh? What is next, the PS2 was bought in 90% of all cases for the DVD player function and 75% of PS2 users are software pirates? It's time to get your innovated ass from this thread, for sake.

Hahaha.

If JackFrost is an Nbot, then I'm the King of Mars.

Spoiler

AND I'M NOT!!

 

[ge-man]

Like I was saying earlier, this whole thing about PSP > DS because of speed makes no sense to me. PSP does not use touch screens or voice recognition gameplay. Why does it feel like the people who are actually concerned about gameplay here are in the minority? This is Gaming Age - you would figure that there would be tons of gameplay enthusiasts here.

When I first saw this news I thought "wow, that is really awesome for the consumer." Then I read everyone's response saying that somehow PSP >>> DS now. This just doesn't compute. Is graphical technology really that important to all of you? For a crowd that is so focused on stretching the boundaries of the modern game, it seems those excited about new gameplay styles are really in the minority. I find this really sad, to be honest .

The love of gameplay died along time ago. Frankly, most of us our graphic whores whether we want to admit to it or not. That doesn't mean that the DS rough graphics aren't a valid complaint, however. I won't defend Nintendo there, but I'm glad that they have tried to expand the abilites of a portable and not just add more buttons and better graphics.

 

[Lord Error]

Just a few thoughts:

- This price is incredible. Sony may have fuckked their profits with it, but this price pretty much confirms that PSP will be a mass market hit, just like PS2 was. In time they will recoup costs as usual, and after all, I can't say I care all that much about it, the actual product is what matters to me.

- The packaging looks very nice, and so do headphones. I really like the styling of the XMB user interface, very classy. Hopefully we'll get some of the PS2-like animated 3D effect crazines in the user interface as well (while the machine boots, up, etc). It's all part of the charm.


- I'd LOVE to see that Boutrousint guy come in here now and quote his super 1337 Japanese developers contacts who laugh at PSP and know that it will be released mid next year in Japan. Surprised he didn't show up yet in this thread...

 

[SantaC]

Oh great, the big "I am a freaking blind nintenbot" outing starts, huh? What is next, the PS2 was bought in 90% of all cases for the DVD player function and 75% of PS2 users are software pirates? It's time to get your innovated ass from this thread, for sake.

damn junior troll.

 

[human5892]

would anyone choose a $150 n64 over a $200 ps2?

No.

Luckily that's not the issue at hand.

 

[Mrbob]

Well I wonder how truly portable the DS is.

The reason I say this is because of Metroid Prime Hunters. I've read some different previews on this game, and they all say the same thing:

Because of the control scheme it is better to play this game while having your NDS sit on the counter. Otherwise your hand is going to cramp up. So I question how condusive a portable unit the Nintendo DS will be if there are other games that have control schemes like this.

 

[drohne]

you're right - it's more like a $150 ps1 vs. a $200 ps2.

 

[Guns N' Poops]

damn junior troll.

Damn experienced Nintenbot troll. I've been a daily reader of this board for 3 years now, it's just I never had the wish to register myself until few months ago. Thus I shit on my tag, you big cool guy with the Member tag.

 

[Razoric]

Well I wonder how truly portable the DS is.

The reason I say this is because of Metroid Prime Hunters. I've read some different previews on this game, and they all say the same thing:

Because of the control scheme it is better to play this game while having your NDS sit on the counter. Otherwise your hand is going to cramp up. So I question how condusive a portable unit the Nintendo DS will be if there are other games that have control schemes like this.

Thats exactly what I was saying a few replies ago. You have Nintendo fanboys saying how NINTENDO IS INNOVATING GAMEPLAY!!1.... but if the innovation is crap then how is that helping anyone? Give me a control pad and buttons and keep the innovation in the games.

 

[Mrbob]

you're right - it's more like a $150 ps1 vs. a $200 ps2.

A PSone with 64 MEG carts.

 

[human5892]

Well I wonder how truly portable the DS is.

The reason I say this is because of Metroid Prime Hunters. I've read some different previews on this game, and they all say the same thing:

Because of the control scheme it is better to play this game while having your NDS sit on the counter. Otherwise your hand is going to cramp up. So I question how condusive a portable unit the Nintendo DS will be if there are other games that have control schemes like this.

Well, even if you do choose to play the game with the stylus control (there are other methods), most times when someone is playing a portable, they aren't standing up -- you'll always have at least a lap to rest the system on.

I agree that games with similar control schemes would be a problem if you do happen to be standing up, though.

 

[JasoNsider]

It's quite simple. The gameplay style of the PSP has been proven to work. It's basically taking the PS2 and putting it into handheld form. The DS style of gameplay hasn't been proven yet, and until Nintendo proves that it definetly works then people will continue to prefer what they know works.

Right, I think you nailed it on the money, and I have to thank you for at least being somewhat reasonable here with your response.

My point is that this hesitation from the users is what is actually causing the stagnation to begin with. It's the whole snowball effect. If people just keep going to see teen movies, they'll just keep making them. Perhaps even more of them too, if the sales go up.

If people aren't willing to accept something new, then we have a serious problem in this industry.

 

[SantaC]

Damn experienced Nintenbot troll. I've been a daily reader of this board for 3 years now, it's just I never had the wish to register myself until few months ago. Thus I shit on my tag, you big cool guy with the Member tag.

Yeah it's really cool of you to bash nintendo in basicly every reply.

 

[thorns]

I can't wait until MS unveils Xenon and blows all the handhelds away(and current consoles) and kills all this handheld hype.

There's sooo much you can do with 3 3.5+ghz cpus.

 

[ge-man]

Well I wonder how truly portable the DS is.

The reason I say this is because of Metroid Prime Hunters. I've read some different previews on this game, and they all say the same thing:

Because of the control scheme it is better to play this game while having your NDS sit on the counter. Otherwise your hand is going to cramp up. So I question how condusive a portable unit the Nintendo DS will be if there are other games that have control schemes like this.

It's probably going to depend on the games. MPH is unique among what we have seen for the DS. I don't expect other developers push the touchscreen like that.

 

[human5892]

you're right - it's more like a $150 ps1 vs. a $200 ps2.

*puts on fortune teller hat*
Glib.

*opens envelope*
Drohne's attitude when it comes to DS vs. PSP!

 

[Guns N' Poops]

Yeah it's really cool of you to bash nintendo in basicly every reply.

Again: I don't have anything against Nintendo, I own all their core consoles (Virtual Boy excluded) and enjoy most of their games. I was often disappointed by them, though. If you see offensive bashing against Nintendo from my side, you have to be blind. Stop develop into the next efralope. It really brings me on a tree, when a fanboy starts using shitty clichés. (to Jack Frost)

 

[JasoNsider]

you're right - it's more like a $150 ps1 vs. a $200 ps2.

For those following our little conversation, this is exactly the kind of comment that worries me as a videogame design enthusiast. Notice that the DS is being lined up in terms of processing power and not gameplay features tied to input devices.

God damn it, what should have been happy news in this thread has actually made me worry even more about this industry. I'm not even sure who to point the finger at here. My initial reaction is that the gamers are at fault since they vote with their wallet, but maybe designers are at fault for not taking risks.

 

[Do The Mario]

OMG I don’t think anyone set up a popcorn stand!!!!!

 

[maskrider]

Right, I think you nailed it on the money, and I have to thank you for at least being somewhat reasonable here with your response.

My point is that this hesitation from the users is what is actually causing the stagnation to begin with. It's the whole snowball effect. If people just keep going to see teen movies, they'll just keep making them. Perhaps even more of them too, if the sales go up.

If people aren't willing to accept something new, then we have a serious problem in this industry.

But to accept something new, they have to prove that something new will work really well (and entertaining), certainly not exactly the case at this moment.

 

[Mashing]

PSP 19800 Yen
http://www.scei.co.jp/corporate/release/pdf/041027a.pdf

PSP + MS Duo + remote headphone = 24800 yen
http://www.scei.co.jp/corporate/release/pdf/041027b.pdf


The war begins!

Damn, color me suprised... Nintendo can bleed them dry though in losses if they want... it's GREAT for consumers, but I have reservations if it's good for their bottom line though.

 

[SantaC]

Again: I don't have anything against Nintendo, I own all their core consoles (Virtual Boy excluded) and enjoy most of their games. I was often disappointed by them, though. If you see offensive bashing against Nintendo from my side, you have to be blind. Stop develop into the next efralope. It really brings me on the paln, when a fanboy starts using shitty clichés. (to Jack Frost)

I also own all consoles, but spend most time on nintendo games. They are still great games, but some peopel seem to forget it.

 

[Lord Error]

I can't wait until MS unveils Xenon and blows all the handhelds away(and current consoles) and kills all this handheld hype.

Ohh, don't cry. Uncle MS will have it's 15 minutes of fame once Halo 2 comes out.

 

[JasoNsider]

But to accept something new, they have to prove that something new will work really well (and entertaining), certainly not exactly the case at this moment.

For me, I was probably more impressed with the DS Balloon Trip game at E3 than almost anything else at the show.

Maybe it's just because you guys haven't actually tried the DS yet, so it's unproven, but you can readily imagine playing a PS2 on the go. Damn, this is a depressing topic.

 

[Miburou]

For those following our little conversation, this is exactly the kind of comment that worries me as a videogame design enthusiast. Notice that the DS is being lined up in terms of processing power and not gameplay features tied to input devices.

God damn it, what should have been happy news in this thread has actually made me worry even more about this industry. I'm not even sure who to point the finger at here. My initial reaction is that the gamers are at fault since they vote with their wallet, but maybe designers are at fault for not taking risks.

No offense, but you're being a bit of a drama queen.

 

[Che]

I'm excited about the possiblities of it, i'm just not excited about any games that's been shown so far.

And you're excited about the PSP lineup?

 

[Mrbob]

Ohh, don't cry. Uncle MS will have it's 15 minutes of fame once Halo 2 comes out.

Hey now, I think Halo 2 will have a wee bit more than 15 minutes of fame.

For me, I was probably more impressed with the DS Balloon Trip game at E3 than almost anything else at the show.

Maybe it's just because you guys haven't actually tried the DS yet, so it's unproven, but you can readily imagine playing a PS2 on the go. Damn, this is a depressing topic.

One question. Have you ever played a PC game before? Because that mouse functions just like a stylus, but better.

 

[Pfucata]

Here were my predictions last week

1) PSP version 1 - the one to grab because it's going to have a great screen

2) PSP version 2 - the first cost-saving move is made by putting in a cheaper screen + battery saving move

3) PSP version 3 - advances in chip technology allow more energy efficient CPU/GPU. Same screen as version 2.

4) PSP version 4 - advances in screen technology allow a great screen w/better battery life.

With a 19800y starting point, the drive to reach PSP v2 is going to be huge... I'm preordering mine.

Alan

 

[SolidSnakex]

And you're excited about the PSP lineup?

New Ridge Racer, MG, Persona, Princess Crown, FF7...Hmm yep.

 

[drohne]

things get really hairy for the ds when you consider its "gameplay features tied to input devices." developers are struggling mightily to make any relevant use of that touchscreen. all we're seeing are puzzle games, lightweight novelties, and utter abortions like prime hunters and ridge racer with its pretend steering wheel. a few of those games are appealling, but i wouldn't want a system entirely populated with them.

the trouble with ds is this: it was sent down from the top rather than organically developed. the hardware came before the software. yamauchi decided they needed a "third pillar," so the hardware engineers were instructed to build something with a touchscreen. it wasn't a case where certain game concepts really called for a touchscreen. and i think it's showing.

the ds is not by default "THE CHOICE FOR PEOPLE WHO CARE ABOUT GAMEPLAY." i doubt the merit of its innovations. it needs to prove itself. and i don't believe innovation in gaming is deeply tied to novel input devices anyway.

 

[Razoric]

And you're excited about the PSP lineup?

More or less excited about the potential PSP games. I fully expect Twisted Metal (woot), some sort of GTA, a 3d portable Mortal Kombat (drool), etc. Not to mention I can put some MP3s on this sucker, get a FM transmitter and I got my own little MP3 player for the car. Nice little product indeed.

 

[maskrider]

For me, I was probably more impressed with the DS Balloon Trip game at E3 than almost anything else at the show.

Maybe it's just because you guys haven't actually tried the DS yet, so it's unproven, but you can readily imagine playing a PS2 on the go. Damn, this is a depressing topic.

No, I don't feel exciting about playing PS2 games (or any games) on the go (since I don't play games on the go), the PSP appeals to me solely because it is the sexiest portable in the world. (The same reason I bought my Ocean Blue PS2 and it stayed inside its white box since I bought it, not being used until this few months)

I have the GBA, but that's for my kid.

There may be a few type of games that can take advantage of the touch screen, but certainly the types do not appeal to me yet (from what I've read).

 

[Miburou]

Solidsnakex: in the name of all that is holy, check your damn PM inbox!

 

[JasoNsider]

No offense, but you're being a bit of a drama queen.

Eh? I don't see how being concerned about the industry is a bad thing. First gamers let the dreamcast die, and now people are equating a DS to a PS1. I feel like I must be taking crazy pills, as it seems everyone else in the gaming public is now gauging fun based on graphical prowess. To me, that is fundamentally wrong. Hey, being able to afford a PSP is great! Sure it's sad that the competition is now a battle to see who can chop the most limbs off, but from the consumer's end it's great. But to then turn to the DS and refer to it as inferior hardware....that doesn't sit well with me.

Essentially I look at it as a sign of what's to come. If gamers are going to be this closed minded in the future then I'm not especially optimistic about what we can expect next generation and beyond.

 

[seismologist]

I'm starting to believe that the PSP really isn't competing with the DS.
I'm getting a DS no matter what. The new way to play games is what appeals to me.

My PSP purchase is competing with a potential PDA purchase. I might just get a PSP for multimedia depending on the capabilities (Divx and whatnot).
PSP game lineup doesn't impress me, though I'm sure I'd get a couple games if I buy one.

 

[human5892]

things get really hairy for the ds when you consider its "gameplay features tied to input devices." developers are struggling mightily to make any relevant use of that touchscreen. all we're seeing are puzzle games, lightweight novelties, and utter abortions like prime hunters and ridge racer with its pretend steering wheel. a few of those games are appealling, but i wouldn't want a system entirely populated with them.

the trouble with ds is this: it was sent down from the top rather than organically developed. the hardware came before the software. yamauchi decided they needed a "third pillar," so the hardware engineers were instructed to build something with a touchscreen. it wasn't a case where certain game concepts really called for a touchscreen. and i think it's showing.

I more or less agree with this. I was very excited for the DS initially, but my enthusiasm has waned a bit after seeing the actual implementation of ideas -- or lack thereof -- for the system's features.

I think the potential is still there for the system to produce some genuinely excellent ideas that are good for more than just a lark at a trade show, but whether or not developers will live up to that potential is debatable at this point.

One touch screen would've been just as good, I think, especially for genres like sports (selecting/creating plays), puzzle (obvious reasons), RTS, etc. This is why I want a PSP DS -- the power of the PSP crossed with the innovative potential of the DS. As it stands now, I'm only moderately interested in each one.

 

[Goreomedy]

Have I mentioned in the last 5 minutes how much I think Nintendo sucks?

Great, aggresive move by Sony. Well played.

I'm in the camp that demands an immediate DS price drop from Nintendo. How can they justify $150 now, when they were ready for $99(leaked pre-release image)?

 

[Ramirez]

Yay?

I hate portables as it is,but if did want one I want something thats gonna offer me something different gameplay wise.

 

[Lord Error]

Just because I feel like real bastard today:

http://ga-forum.com/showthread.php?t=20582&page=1&pp=50&highlight=1337
Talking about the bundle price and games that have now been confirmed:

boutrosinit
Member
(Yesterday, 10:33 AM)

That list is absolute bollocks.

That's all I'm saying.

Also PSP will definitely *not* be out this year.

According to?

People who are actually working on the fucking thing

 

[Che]

Like I was saying earlier, this whole thing about PSP > DS because of speed makes no sense to me. PSP does not use touch screens or voice recognition gameplay. Why does it feel like the people who are actually concerned about gameplay here are in the minority? This is Gaming Age - you would figure that there would be tons of gameplay enthusiasts here.

When I first saw this news I thought "wow, that is really awesome for the consumer." Then I read everyone's response saying that somehow PSP >>> DS now. This just doesn't compute. Is graphical technology really that important to all of you? For a crowd that is so focused on stretching the boundaries of the modern game, it seems those excited about new gameplay styles are really in the minority. I find this really sad, to be honest .

Nah. Many just act surpised by the price it's not like everyone said that they're gonna buy it or that DS is doomed (well some said that but they're just stupid trolls). I for example plan to buy DS on launch (whenever it launches on Europe) since I love how innovative the portable is, but I also like the fact that Sony made things more competitive and I might buy the next PSP model (I surely won't buy the first bunch of faulty units) when I wasn't considering it, at all.
But I'll buy it (PSP) not for the graphics but for some games I'll be missing on my DS. I will never become a graphics whore. NEVER.

 

[Razoric]

Haha boutrosinit has always been a douche.

 

[drohne]

if you define open-mindedness as "willingness to swallow every morsel of horse-pucky nintendo tries to feed us," then my mind is closed. but i'm pretty sure my game collection is more diverse and eclectic than the game collections of most people here. i dig marginal, experimental games. and i still find the ds totally unappealing. sorry. i love the way nintendo fans scramble for the moral high ground when they've been materially routed. again.

 

[Mrbob]

Eh? I don't see how being concerned about the industry is a bad thing. First gamers let the dreamcast die, and now people are equating a DS to a PS1. I feel like I must be taking crazy pills, as it seems everyone else in the gaming public is now gauging fun based on graphical prowess. To me, that is fundamentally wrong. Hey, being able to afford a PSP is great! Sure it's sad that the competition is now a battle to see who can chop the most limbs off, but from the consumer's end it's great. But to then turn to the DS and refer to it as inferior hardware....that doesn't sit well with me.

Essentially I look at it as a sign of what's to come. If gamers are going to be this closed minded in the future then I'm not especially optimistic about what we can expect next generation and beyond.

The problem with this argument is the game you are backing it with is Balloon Trip. A game, while you like it, will be a novelty at best. Just like a ton of DS games that employ the stylus, it is a novelty.

Personally, I think giving a portable more horsepower can lead to a better gameplay experience than adding addtional components to try and work around and implement (Stylus). And what happend to that 2nd screen? That is becoming a novelty too. I like one widescreen over two 4:3 screens.

 

[BigGreenMat]

Well considering this incredibly low price and what the supposed manufacturing costs are, who wants to give a prediction on the losses SCEA will post in the 4th quarter ending in March year over year? I mean it should show up on their quarterly earnings report that their net loss should be far larger/net gain far smaller year over year. I personally suck at earnings predictions and don't know good sources, but I would love to hear this.