Regginator
Member
I'm not an American, but what is going to happen in November 2018? Surely not new elections, seeing as Trump has only been president for almost 2 years by that time instead of 4...
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|OT| French Presidential Elect 2017 - La France est toujours insoumise; Le Pen loses
- Thread starter Holden
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Some perspective
Chirac won 82% to 18% in 2002 against Jean-Marie LePen (Marine's Father).
That she did 34% shows the divide in France
I'm not sure "Les bonnets rouges" will be very happy with the result (but who knows), I have many friends in Rennes, I'll ask them next time I speak with them.
france 24 shows him at 65.78% of the vote right now.
Wasn't he also like a much worse candidate? He is like a mega racist while she is just a racist.
Holy Order Sol
Member
midterm elections
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Yes, but at the same time Chirac was a much worse candidate than Macron. Chirac is like France's Bush; to this day nobody has any idea how he won two consecutive elections.
I don't think she's less of a scumbag than her father tbh
Rats Off To Ya
Banned
Midterm elections, where most of our Congress is up for grabs. Trump will still be President (unless he's impeached), but losing the legislative branch would be a serious blow to his administration.
Alx
Member
Those are the officially counted ballots, but the larger cities arrive last and are very biased against FN. The numbers people consider as the real result are extrapolations based on knowledge of local behavior, until everything is counted.
It's documented that he never was in it to win unlike his daughter.
So that might explain some things...
Her strategy of cleaning the image of the party actually worked too (and not that shitty Melenchon argument that people that aren't him played into her hand).
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
But isn't the general perception of her as being less of a racist fuck than her dad?
Then again he had a very nice image in year 2k because he didn't do shit for 5 years.
If there's one thing French like, it's politicians who do nothing
Bonen no Max'd
Banned
Well, didn't he win the second one by running on "Vote for the crook, not the fascist"?
Chirac got lucky that his opponent in 2002 was a member of the le pen family.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Well, didn't he win the second one by running on "Vote for the crook, not the fascist"?
I mean, more or less.
My god, suddenly I understand what Fillon was trying to do!
Muffin1611
Banned
I look forward to the Bundestagswahl-Tweets.
harriet the spy
Member
As much as an awful president Chirac might have been, and in spite of whatever motivations for it, I'll remain eternally grateful to Chirac for his strong opposition to the war in Iraq. Though I assume that Jospin and even Le Pen would have done the same.
Nah. That's what she wants you to believe. She's just much better at building a cleaner image and compromising - on paper at least. In that sense, she's a much more conventional politician. Her father didn't care, he basically had no filter. He's very anti-PC. And he was a liability to her, which she was clever enough to recognize early on. That's why she kicked him out of the party.
But they're cut from the same cloth. If they weren't, she would have rejected the party from the get-go and created her own party. Which she is only doing now that she's failed with the FN. The move is right, but too late if you ask me.
Also, the polls weren't as accurate back in 2002, and Le Pen's first-round victory was such a shock to everyone that people instinctively pushed back. With MLP, the writing had been no the wall for ages. I shudder to say this, but people were already used to her making it to the second round. She was normalized.
toddhunter
Member
34% of the people who bothered to vote. If anything it shows more apathy then any great divide.
Now that could turn into a divide, but today is not that day.
Not everybody falls into the same political mold for sure. The younger generation in Rennes is certainly closer to Mélenchon than Macron.
Well, didn't he win the second one by running on "Vote for the crook, not the fascist"?
Yeah. The RPR Chirac's party at the time was crooked because of corruption scandals that plauged that political party . The same was true with the UMP and now the LR..
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
All politics is global, apparently.
Funny, considering how isolationist so many of these people are.
Regginator
Member
Oh, wow, didn't know the US had that. So there's a slimmer of hope after all, let's hope for the best then!
R_thanatos
Member
Well your "perspective" ignore the huge ballot of blank votes and the biggest ratio of people that didn't go to vote.
In fact her numbers are similar to her father , it's just that the context is different . The "front national" voter base hasn't expanded that much even if it did expand.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Not really. Many American are willfully--even proudly--ignorant. And short-sighted. And easily misled. And deeply stupid.
I say this as an American who wishes it wasn't this way. I love my country, but I don't really recognize it anymore. But maybe that's because I'm finally seeing it for what it's been for a very long time.
Unknown Soldier
Member
Jean-Marie was pretty much a Nazi. His daughter first kicked him out of the party he founded and then set about dramatically moderating the FN's image to make it more palatable to the French right instead of just the extreme fringe right.
And guess what, it's been a really successful venture thus far. Don't sleep on the FN because they will be strong in the parliamentary elections.
Bonen no Max'd
Banned
It turns out "I'm like that shitty president you all hated but grit your teeth and voted for last time" isn't the strongest electoral message.
fredrancour
Member
Congressional elections. The house of representatives is on 2 year cycles while the Senate is on 6 years cycles, split in 3 waves. If republicans lose the house the republican party loses its ability to pass laws.
EatinOlives
Member
Most importantly, impeachment would then be on the table.
TestOfTide
Banned
More popular than Hillary is a low fucking bar.
The GOP has been VERY good at turning Warren into their next "Hillary" (a woman that everyone in the GOP is unified in hating).
A better option would be someone that takes the GOP by surprise, as in before the GOP can paint a negative narrative around them. Obama did this VERY well.
Unknown Soldier
Member
The Democrats would need to grow a spine first.
Rats Off To Ya
Banned
plop's not wrong here, but there's been an encouraging trend in special elections since the inauguration, and Trump is a historically unpopular President. The opposition party usually gains power in a midterm election, and in a year and a half the opposition will be more riled up than its ever been in any of our lifetimes.
I choose to be optimistic about 2018. Possibly because optimism is all I have left at this point.
Franken 2020!
I'm Minnesotan.
Muffin1611
Banned
Lol @ LeaveEU
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/861307433829924866
What happened to will of the people and all that?
https://twitter.com/LeaveEUOfficial/status/861307433829924866
What happened to will of the people and all that?
Although if they keep the Senate the republicans can still pass treaties and appoint people.
Maybe someone should remind her that there wouldn't be a U.S without France.
People are much more sceptical of his strategies over here, owing to the fact that he made some questionable/unpopular decisions back when he was the Minister of the Economy, and that he used to be an investment banker.
If you ask me, his one strong point is his unequivocally pro-EU stance and what seems to be a sincerely positive outlook on the world. Let's hope it's not just fluff though. The rest is up in the air.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
Keep burning all the bridges for any future alt-reich slimeballs, deplorables.
I have seen worse reactions to marine le pen's landslide loss.
harriet the spy
Member
Why does she have bot in her name. Is it making fun of the accusation that many of the alt-right sphere is made of Russian bots?
No maybes, the bolded part is correct.
The Shadow
Member
Congrats France. I don't think I've ever been more happy for another country than I am right now.
The friends I know in Rennes seems to be happy with Macron... It's 85-15 in some places around Rennes. And I feel like "Bonnets rouges" is a small minority, not a mainstream movement.
She at least hide it better because she knows she needs to do it to have a real chance to win. At the end of the day, that may make her MORE dangerous.
Err... I can't see the link between Bush and Chirac, and I'm not sure at all he's a worse candidate. He tends to avoid acting so that it pleases as much people as possible, but I'm not sure he's that bad.
malboroking
Banned
This is why Republicans control the House and Senate. You need to vote in 2018!
Palette Swap
Member
Honestly, I wonder how much Wednesday's performance hurt that normalization.
She really came across as entirely unfit to govern, in the sense that their platform is really paper thin and when push comes to shove, she can't show any substance to save her life. It's beginning to show and their only growth will either be through more discontent or through an actual political project. The Euro fumbling of the last week was an embarrassment.
I think FN officials have been living in a bubble for years, where they can show up on tv and say outrageous things about a very narrow subset of issues, that means good ratings so the media lap it up, but they really wing it and start deflecting to other issues whenever they get out of their comfort zone. You can't build a comprehensive platform and run 15 ministries based on that.
People might dislike his policies, and disagree with them, but there's much more depth to Macron's worldview, as illustrated by these two Mediapart interviews. This doesn't mean he'll be great or anything, just that he clears the bar of having an actual project beyond a handful of hot button issues. It's a testament to the toxicity of our media cycle tbh.
Mind you, the shape of parliamentary elections makes it a completely different fight.
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