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Overwatch |OT9| There is no Cow Hero

DR2K

Banned
In my experience when playing if my team has a widow,hanzo,sombra it's usually a loss I can't think of many situations where I've thought "man we could really use a sombra"

When you need to pick support off and disable characters abilities.

No one does 2000 damage to a Rein shield in the time he can be hacked and made useless or can stop RoadHog from healing himself.

Sombra has a ton of utility. It's usually when 1 or 2 members on the team aren't able to pull their own weight and the non meta pick gets blamed. Babies get toxic, someone throws, etc...
 
In master right now, do I have to stay in master by the end of the season to get the master rewards or did they only change top 500?

Also played like a 30 minute match on a King's Row yesterday and won 8-7, it was crazy. Got potg as Reinhardt hammered down everyone on the pay load and ended up getting the team kill with my brother using aimbot while in OT. Very rewarding but stressful. Those are the games where I needed to take a break after.

Pretty sure it's season high
 

Nimby

Banned
Already mentioned that caveat! Not switching is another thing but an immediate "um that isn't a dive comp pick, switch plz" mentality is boring.

I want to Sombra more though, and have slowed on my Junkrat use. Aside from situation uses, I find Junkrat is okay if the team is bad, since people are seemingly incapable of breaking shields.

If 5 out of the 6 heroes went dive, you should too really. For example, Junkrat really doesn't synergize with that comp, he would be a sitting duck. Widow does, but is a glass cannon so to speak, she can pick off heroes in the middle of the chaos but will eventually just get smothered by a Winston/D.Va.

In my ranked games it's pretty much just free for all though, I don't trust anyone on a Winston, they usually jump in and feed non-stop. They probably don't even have any meta knowledge at all or have the coordination to run a dive comp properly. It all depends on your rank. I would say sometimes in Diamond, and Masters+.
 

ponpo

( ≖‿≖)
If 5 out of the 6 heroes went dive, you should too really. For example, Junkrat really doesn't synergize with that comp, he would be a sitting duck. Widow does, but is a glass cannon so to speak, she can pick off heroes in the middle of the chaos but will eventually just get smothered by a Winston/D.Va.

In my ranked games it's pretty much just free for all though, I don't trust anyone on a Winston, they usually jump in and feed non-stop. They probably don't even have any meta knowledge at all or have the coordination to run a dive comp properly. It all depends on your rank. I would say sometimes in Diamond, and Masters+.

Yeah I guess a lot of this discussion is based around what people are willing to and capable of doing.

I like when someone goes Winston since I'm usually Zenyatta anyway, but it's sad when you're facing a team you know a Winston would be a good pick against, but no one will go Zen or Zarya or whatever to support your switch so nope.
 
Not having a good day today. A formerly masters Mei trying to derank was on our team, of course we lost.

And can we please delete roadhog from the game? so anti-fun
 
9h straight, 22 comp games, that was a shit ton of fun for the most part. I think in the last games I was playing subconsciously, my brain couldn't process anything more. Guess that's the only way I can actually win playing tracer this season.

The randoms were nice at the end thankfully, that girl sounded like she was kinda tilted but I'm glad that she made the right decision.
Felt like I had success with pretty much any role I chose. That was nice.
 
When you need to pick support off and disable characters abilities.

No one does 2000 damage to a Rein shield in the time he can be hacked and made useless or can stop RoadHog from healing himself.

Sombra has a ton of utility. It's usually when 1 or 2 members on the team aren't able to pull their own weight and the non meta pick gets blamed. Babies get toxic, someone throws, etc...
What you explained requires communication and
coordination which your not gonna find allot of in solo queue.
I feel pretty comfortable dealing with a sombra with any class nothing against the character I just feel like I have to go try hard when one is on my team. It's also usually a relief when the enemy has one since her invis and teleport are pretty loud

Edit: and to be far I think she's good at point harassment teleporting in and out to distract the enemy team and good at picking off low health targets with her passive ability and I consider her the hard counter to orisa
 

ohkay

Member
I started seeing dive executed efficiently around ~3800. Nobody even tries it in Diamond.
I've noticed at lower ranks when people dive they kinda just go after random heroes and don't really target key targets like supports first.
In my low diamond games, people ask to go dive but it fails because there's a lack of coordination. Everyone will be attacking their own targets instead of focusing important targets. The rare game where it does work, the other team just gets deleted
 

MG310

Member
I feel like I should only play during the day.

Just a bunch of grouped up assholes blaming the people who don't mic for everything out there tongiht.
 
I still don't understand why Mercy becomes invincible when using her Ultimate. I can understand the people she's reviving being invincible for a short while, to help them get their bearings. But why should she?

Pharah has to be completely still when using her Ult. Why is she not invincible?

You lose all control of Junkrat for his Ult, why is he not invincible?

It makes no sense that Mercy can just fly into a crowd, pop her Ult, walk around unscathed for a few seconds and then fuck off again.
 
I still don't understand why Mercy becomes invincible when using her Ultimate. I can understand the people she's reviving being invincible for a short while, to help them get their bearings. But why should she?

Pharah has to be completely still when using her Ult. Why is she not invincible?

You lose all control of Junkrat for his Ult, why is he not invincible?

It makes no sense that Mercy can just fly into a crowd, pop her Ult, walk around unscathed for a few seconds and then fuck off again.

Mercy shouldnt be invincible while casting thats for sure shen can go kamizaki and be rewarded for such bold action and ran away unlike Lucio who can be still killed mid air and Anna can be stopped on her Nano boost animation too.
 
Mercy is vulnerable while she flies in 1v6, and they just fought without her if she hid.

Once I think we are winning, I always hunt for Mercy as hog.
 

Fugu

Member
I still don't understand why Mercy becomes invincible when using her Ultimate. I can understand the people she's reviving being invincible for a short while, to help them get their bearings. But why should she?

Pharah has to be completely still when using her Ult. Why is she not invincible?

You lose all control of Junkrat for his Ult, why is he not invincible?

It makes no sense that Mercy can just fly into a crowd, pop her Ult, walk around unscathed for a few seconds and then fuck off again.
The change was made because before, when she was basically guaranteed to die when she used her ult, you had to get a really big one for it to be worthwhile at all. I'll give you an example.

Fight starts 6v6.
Enemy Zarya gravs, tracer bombs, three people on your team die (let's say a tank, a healer, and a dps, for the sake of this example, although it doesn't really matter) at the cost of two ults.
You go in and res to bring the fight back to a 6v6. You traded one ult for two, sounds good; but your positioning is problematic.

There's a few things that can happen here depending on what point in the game you're in and how skilled/economical the teams are, but it ultimately boils down to one of three outcomes:

1. Mercy escapes, the enemy team uses no follow-up ults. This is great, but it's unlikely. When the enemy team has killed three and sees that Mercy is not one of them, they'll be gearing up for the inevitable res.
2. Mercy escapes, the enemy team uses follow-up ults. This is by far the most likely outcome in a game with decent players and usually when this happens the outlook isn't so good for the team that just used res unless the recently-ressed players are co-ordinated and preparede. The reason for this is two-fold, but it comes down to the fact that most teams post-res are positioned in a problematic way (such as in the aforementioned example where the three guys you ressed will basically be stacked on top of each other) and, while getting ressed, the other team has initiative. If your team is ahead on ult economy you can often turn these kinds of situations around, but that's far from a guarantee and sometimes there's just plain nothing you can do about it, like if you res into a high noon and your team has no barrier.
3. Mercy dies during the res. Now you've burned an ult but you're dead, so it's 6v5. What's worse is that, as in the previous outcome, your team's positioning is probably pretty bad. Now, sometimes this ends well for the team with Mercy on it, but usually it doesn't. In fact, even though you traded 1 ult for 2, by putting your team in an awkward position you're highly likely to charge enemy ults instead.

I deliberately picked a neutral case. Mercy's ult has always been good when it's, say, 3v4 and you can res two to easily tilt the fight in your favor without excessive ult usage, but because Mercy is such a high priority target res being good largely only in these situations wasn't quite good enough to make her a viable character.

The way it works now is that the third outcome I listed above is no longer possible and in the overwhelmingly likely second case Mercy has the opportunity to position herself somewhere better after ressing, ameliorating the fundamental disadvantage that the revived team will have in that regard. And honestly, while it's made res a lot better, she's still not exactly a powerhouse because it's still often possible for an opposing team to use res against her.

I started seeing dive executed efficiently around ~3800. Nobody even tries it in Diamond.
Can confirm, I had a very similar experience. I'm in the 39xx range these days and dive works here but even in low master people's conceptual understanding of the idea was very week.

My friends are mostly in the 1000-2000 range and they haven't a clue what to do with a dive comp.
 

Veelk

Banned
I still don't understand why Mercy becomes invincible when using her Ultimate. I can understand the people she's reviving being invincible for a short while, to help them get their bearings. But why should she?

Pharah has to be completely still when using her Ult. Why is she not invincible?

You lose all control of Junkrat for his Ult, why is he not invincible?

It makes no sense that Mercy can just fly into a crowd, pop her Ult, walk around unscathed for a few seconds and then fuck off again.

Because she'd go back to being worthless otherwise. Pharah is not underpowered for still being able to die while using her ult.

I have no idea about Junkrat. I feel his Mayhem buff did a lot for him since now he now doesn't have to worry about dying to his own bullshit, but he still has what I consider the worst ult in the game. Edit: Any Junk mains want to tell me what they think of his place in the game right now?

But my point is, ultimately, while having a 'consistent' set of rules for all heroes to abide by would be nice, the real goal is here is balance. To that end, many heroes have unique abilities that aren't granted to others. Only Genji has his cooldown reset if he gets an elimination for no reason that I can tell, for example. Only Genji and Tracer and Lucio have a faster base speed than others. Only Soldier has an ability that has no cooldown. Why? Because the powers that be decided that those were breaks in the 'rules' of the game that helped keep those heroes competitive and fun.

You can disagree, I certainly disagree with a lot of changes Blizzard makes (*glares at Soldier 76*), but mercies were being slaughtered before. With the invincibility, they are a major priority on the battlefield and I feel the game is better for it, even if they can be really annoying sometimes.
 

Fugu

Member
If Pharah was invincible during her ultimate the game would just straight up break. The only thing that balances its ridiculous damage output is the fact that she is almost guaranteed to die while doing it.
 

LiK

Member
If Pharah was invincible during her ultimate the game would just straight up break. The only thing that balances its ridiculous damage output is the fact that she is almost guaranteed to die while doing it.

I would quit the game if that happened.
 

Fugu

Member
I would quit the game if that happened.
As a Pharah main I'd probably take the opportunity to claim my rightful(?) place at the top of the ladder.

Seriously guys, Mercy is invincible during her ult and she's still not even close to the best character in the game. The situations are not analogous.
 

LordofPwn

Member
My Lucio play is very dependent on how competent my teammates are, more so the tanks. If they do their jobs I can help everyone and cause distractions to help make things easier. I still need more practice using him on anything besides capture point maps.

Anyways, played one comp game tonight as I try to claw back to platinum. Was a total shit show. Numbani Attack, I went Lucio, we have a zen, reaper, Pharah, Winston, Roadhog. Enemy team has torb sym Zarya mcree mei and a mercy I think. Not a single team fight, just kept enemy team staggered and off the payload.
On defense we did, rein reaper torb mercy soldier and I went sym. Had my teleporter up halfway through the first fight. Really easy to hit people with the slow orb when you're all funneled into a hallway. I don't think they got a single percentage point. I didn't play nearly as good as I'm capable of and it was an easy win but it did not feel satisfying at all.
 

ponpo

( ≖‿≖)
I only started replaying the game last week since taking a month off, so I haven't had that many opportunities, but I have yet to win a game on Oasis. Like 0-12 maybe.

Why senpais. Why.
 

Cappa

Banned
Fucking exhausted at work today but well worth it. Had some of the best 5 and 6 stack games I've had with you guys in a long time and to end on a winstreak perfect.

We played better as 5-6 stack than 4 stack lol

Ruler is a jack of all trades with tanks. I dont think he had a bad game playing any of the tanks and he was our rein for most of them. Batmans Lucio was great lots of games. I still think pooh is an amazing mercy who needs to stop playing Ana lol. Nd switching from dps to support to rein anytime we needed a change was huge too. The random we picked up at the end was good mechanically but his game sense was pretty bad and some of the suggestions he made was head scratching but he listened to us and did well.

I went 11-4-2 with you guys and climbed 222 sr according to overbuff not bad for one night.
 
Fucking exhausted at work today but well worth it. Had some of the best 5 and 6 stack games I've had with you guys in a long time and to end on a winstreak perfect.

We played better as 5-6 stack than 4 stack lol

Ruler is a jack of all trades with tanks. I dont think he had a bad game playing any of the tanks and he was our rein for most of them. Batmans Lucio was great lots of games. I still think pooh is an amazing mercy who needs to stop playing Ana lol. Nd switching from dps to support to rein anytime we needed a change was huge too. The random we picked up at the end was good mechanically but his game sense was pretty bad and some of the suggestions he made was head scratching but he listened to us and did well.

I went 11-4-2 with you guys and climbed 222 sr according to overbuff not bad for one night.
It's the "drunk a watching Harbleu at 2am" part of my day. But I hope hope your up for something similar a little later.

Maybe after you've had a nap after work.
 
If Pharah was invincible during her ultimate the game would just straight up break. The only thing that balances its ridiculous damage output is the fact that she is almost guaranteed to die while doing it.

I'm not saying she should be invincible, I was just giving an example of a character who is completely out in the open, fresh for picking, when Ulting.

My comment came after being in a game on Ilios where we wiped out three of their heroes on the point, for some reason my team decides to all wander off so I'm there on my lonesome as Lucio, I see their Mercy coming in from the left, I shoot her, I get her energy right down until there's a smidgen left, she Ults, becomes invincible and walks back from where she came, all the time I'm firing and NOTHING. It's utter nonsense. At least have her stand still when Ulting if she must be invincible, there should be enough time for her team to rally around her and make sure she's safe.
 
Fucking exhausted at work today but well worth it.

LMAO

Yeah those were great games.

We had to ditch the random after 3 losses in a row in koth. Being a kamikaze lucio and dying immediately in a lot of team fights isn't exactly ideal, especially when we had batman that was having amazing games as him.
 

LiK

Member
LMAO

Yeah those were great games.

We had to ditch the random after 3 losses in a row in koth. Being a kamikaze lucio and dying immediately in a lot of team fights isn't exactly ideal, especially when we had batman that was having amazing games as him.

Did you miss my DPS
 
I was 5 points out of diamond last season and tried 2 placement matches last night thinking maybe i'd place and get into diamond but my god they may have been the worst teams Ive ever seen.... lost both games.

Why must you do this to me Overwatch....
 
Did you miss my DPS

Having people playing S76 is always good :)

We had an awful soldier in lijiang that basically ignored the pharah during all game, frequently rushing to his death without waiting for us. The funny thing is that he had gold damage with a really low number of kills (gold was 23, so he was at that too or lower), their team had a Hog and Winston, I immediately knew what he was shooting at lol.

But I don't want to just be a Mercy.

Why? Mercy is hot.

jk it's perfectly understandable.
 
with S4 ending this month. are they still planning a 1 year anniversary or was that wishful thinking? also i'm dreading S5 placement. i've deranked and lost lots of points this season.
 
But I don't want to just be a Mercy.
Your Zen is pretty nutty dude, if you ever wanna branch out of support you can let us know too. From what I could see with ana your sleeps are really nice but you need to be more active on mic about them and when/who is getting the nano. Sometimes I would get nano without ultimate while reloading or when approaching point and then have nothing to do with it.
I'm glad the games seem to be going better though, GAF plays a lot better off tilt.
 

Chance

Member
As a Pharah main I'd probably take the opportunity to claim my rightful(?) place at the top of the ladder.

Seriously guys, Mercy is invincible during her ult and she's still not even close to the best character in the game. The situations are not analogous.

Definitely not. Most of all because a Mercy can't pick and choose the position and moment to ult at the best of times. Her mobility and ability to position are reliant on teammates and corpses, and the moment is entirely dictated by whether or not dead allies are on the field.

She's pretty boxed in to begin with, and using rez before the buff was nearly always a death sentence. The buff was necessary.

I'm not saying Pharah has it easy, but when Mercy ults she's not dishing out 600 damage, either.
 
Definitely not. Most of all because a Mercy can't pick and choose the position and moment to ult at the best of times. Her mobility and ability to position are reliant on teammates and corpses, and the moment is entirely dictated by whether or not dead allies are on the field.

She's pretty boxed in to begin with, and using rez before the buff was nearly always a death sentence. The buff was necessary.

I'm not saying Pharah has it easy, but when Mercy ults she's not dishing out 600 damage, either.

That's actually a very, very, good point.

Dunno why I didn't think of that. Too early in the morning is my excuse.
 

Greddleok

Member
Is Mercy a viable healer now?

I can't get on with any of the others. I'm awful as Lucio, Ana I miss too many shots and with Zenyatta I can't heal hard enough to keep everyone alive.
 
I'm glad the games seem to be going better though, GAF plays a lot better off tilt.

Does not compute, I was on the team.

Then I'll just hear how you guys want me to go back to Mercy because the team can't win without rezzes.

I love me some good rez but we also did well with Lucio/Zen in the past. Batman/Cappa/Ruler/me play both, Biscuit plays Zen, Owzers does not play Symmetra and I'm probably forgetting someone, but you can take a break from support if you feel like to, you're the one that instalocks it.
 
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