newtypepilot
Member
revenue doesn't mean anything.
Uber makes billions in revenue too but they have been bleeding money for years.
Uber makes billions in revenue too but they have been bleeding money for years.
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Phil Spencer - "We've put a lot of money into the market, over a billion dollars a year supporting third-party games coming into Game Pass"
- Thread starter Thick Thighs Save Lives
- Start date
- Business
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Sony's PS+ revamp and the tiers seems like it's a pretty direct response to it. They're also bringing their first party titles to the sub services in a year or so time now, something they would never have done a few years back. The only thing they're not doing is releasing day and date first party games.
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OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
I get it just fine. I have gamepass PC myself. That's the problem that some of you seem to be ignoring. You don't need the console. That's why nobody is buying them (among other reasons). So why continue to make them?
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Gameplay Gods Bless
Member
The CFO said Gamepass is a "high margin business" straight to investors, it's over.
pasterpl
Member
Approximation now is 25 million consoles sold, it is not world shattering but saying nobody is quite a hyperbole. Especially when console sold so much “without games” as Gaf keep telling me. MS will probably end this generation with 50-60 m sold, which again is millions more than nobody. And the number of 1st party games already confirmed and officially announced for the next 1-3 years is quite impressive.
Bumblebeetuna
Member
Pretty much, people talk like the Xbox is pulling Dreamcast numbers.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Didn't Sony say they were spending $500 million a year on first party develop?
There are multiple paths to profit. Why would everyone follow the exact same route?
Apple and Samsung don’t follow the same philosophy when it comes to mobile hardware margins, but both are profitable.
You might as well argue that Sony has to be losing money on PC ports since Nintendo hasn’t followed that exact path and brought their games to PC.
havoc00
Member
MS does not care about what you care about. Its not like this is the first rodeo. MS cannot be more clear about their direction and I really struggle to understand why it's so hard to understand. MS does not care about hurting console sales. They stopped caring about hurting console sales when they put day one all their first party games on PC.
MS has pretty much always from the get go that GP is their future. They have invested everything into it and all their moves have been towards making it successful. Yes, the Xbox console is a biproduct of that direction, but you can believe MS did not pay 69 billion dollars for Xbox consoles . They paid 69 billion dollars for GP and the future of their services within the gaming space.
MS will do whatever it takes to make GP a success. They will pour huge amounts of resources at the problem because gaming, not just console gaming but gaming in general is a huge market mobile etc and they want to be competitive in all areas but mostly they want GP to be the service of choice for all areas of gaming.
twilo99
Gold Member
Really bad for gamers and gaming in general tho
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Cheers Phil, good to know you are paying these devs well and the service is viable.
Keep making it better each year. 2023 line up was bonkers!
Keep making it better each year. 2023 line up was bonkers!
twilo99
Gold Member
Hi, do you happen to have a particular market cap at which you start to care about a given company? You clearly don't care about a trillion dollar one, but what happens bellow that threshold?
Negotiator101
Member
It's no one is buying the Xbox console nonsense
pasterpl
Member
never understood that argument that it is bad for gamers and gaming, lots of studios receive a hefty injection of money that sometimes is the only way that they can finish the game. Console gaming market is approx 250m users, so gampass with 25m subscribers is approx 10% of that. It is fully voluntary and at the end of the day thanks to this we are seeing more games developed by smaller studio, at the same time these are getting more exposure, saving on marketing spend.
twilo99
Gold Member
Yes, because it makes no sense.
Mr.ODST
Member
But in an ecosystem you dont NEED a certain device, do I need an iPad for apple music? Do I need a Mac for my Apple TV subscription?
I find it funny sony fanboys runing in everwhere on this forum to shit on MS and keep using “consoles sold” as a metric when it doesnt tell the full story
Bernardougf
Member
The fact that this guy cannot for the life of god shut the fuck up just shows how bad the sittuation must be for them .... the other companys just sells and occasionally drop an interview or sales report and move on.. this guy has to be talking 3 times a week to appear to have relevance and "swear" they are doing just fine .
Pathetic
Pathetic
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Killjoy-NL
Member
If they spend $1+B a year to get 3rd party games on GP and they already hit a ceiling at ~40M subs and their consoles sales are getting crushed by Playstation and Nintendo, that doesn't sound like a good thing.
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Clintizzle
Lord of Edge.
Bonjour, I don't have a particular threshold for when I start caring about companies, gaming or otherwise.
I wouldn't react any different if Sony went out of Business vs a 4 person Dev team. Both situation will make no material difference in my life.
Gavon West
Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
His whole post was ass to begin with. No title that comes to Gamepass is exclusive. You can still buy the game at your leisure on your preferred platform (provided it's available) and purchase at a discount on gamepass itself.
I found it entertaining that he shut up for some months because he didn't want to be putting his foot in his mouth during the ABK proceedings. Now that that's gone through he's doing interviews all over the place again. Don't think it has anything to do with being in a bad situation though.
Gavon West
Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
Oooh Weeee! Smh. Stop. Just stop talking right now.
Tell me you have NO CLUE what you're talking about without telling me you have NO CLUE what you're talking about. Damn...
Can’t be anywhere near as pathetic as people consistently complaining about an executive giving interviews, while at the same time demanding for more transparency in the industry.
You would certainly have a compelling point if the number of interviews given by gaming CEOs was directly correlated to console sales, subscriber counts or game development. But it’s not. And you certainly go out of your way to engage with these interviews.
You people will take ONE interview, break it up
Into multiple threads and post it here, then complain about it as if these are all separate interviews. Why?
One interview with WindowsCentral is ‘interviews all over the place’?
The man was in Brazil for an Xbox event and WindowsCentral approached him for an interview. Bizarre how that’s apparently a bad thing now.
Yeah, this isn’t true. He gave a lot of interviews, especially around their ‘E3’ showcase and afterwards. The ABK proceedings were in full swing then.
Bernardougf
Member
At least can we agree that a company that is fine and their flagship produtcs are fine dont have to tell this on interviews every few days .. right ?
And to be clear Im talking about xbox here as a branch of MS.. MS is more then fine and forever will be
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Yep. Explains why they aren't doing interviews every few days.
ZoukGalaxy
Member
That's the only thing they do "put a lot of money into XXX" and still are behind everyone on market.
Icymanipulator
Member
Phil talking about putting a billion into gamepass is exactly why he needs to go if MS wants to stand a chance in the console wars.
Sure they’ve brought that money, but that only brought games that were already going to be made anyway for the most part. Where are the new games? This entire generation and what… Star Field, Redfall and a couple Forza games is all they have to show for it.
They have barely contributed to gaming at all this generation in the form of NEW games. They are just consolidating other people’s games under their banner and calling it progress.
Sure they’ve brought that money, but that only brought games that were already going to be made anyway for the most part. Where are the new games? This entire generation and what… Star Field, Redfall and a couple Forza games is all they have to show for it.
They have barely contributed to gaming at all this generation in the form of NEW games. They are just consolidating other people’s games under their banner and calling it progress.
MacReady13
Member
So basically Sony are NOT following what Microsoft are doing. Eventually their games release on their sub service but not always within that years time frame. It’s a completely different way than what Microsoft is doing, and thank goodness for that.
ShaiKhulud1989
Gold Member
One day people learn that you can rake billions in revenue while still being in the deep red.
Until the, Phil will happily feed this mindless PR BS to his fangirls.
It was what, almost 2 years since the proper GP user numbers update?
Until the, Phil will happily feed this mindless PR BS to his fangirls.
It was what, almost 2 years since the proper GP user numbers update?
lyan
Member
To put into perspective from their chart at FY14 their subscription revenue is 1.4B, at that time there are about 10-11million Xbox Ones from a quick google.
With double the amount of Series consoles around plus online becoming more important we can prudently assume they would have generated 3B from Xbox Live anyway so 3.9B sounds pretty reasonable factoring Ultimate and PC, that said with at least over a billion increased cost the margin is undoubtedly lower than before.
cireza
Member
And of course you have a source to back this up. Or is simply wishful thinking from a fangirl ?
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ShaiKhulud1989
Gold Member
I am not the one hiding every meaningful metric, my dear.
You don't even need to do weird math.
Nadella straight up said in previous quarterly earnings (FYQ4 april-july) that Game Pass brought almost billion per quarter in revenue. Extrapolate that to whole year and you have almost 4 billions from Game Pass alone per year.
1 billion is invested into securing third-party content. 3 billions are left for other things.
Also, Stuart (Xbox CFO) said that Game Pass is high-margin business, so it's pretty clear that wet dreams of some people around here about "Game Pass is subsidzed by big daddy Microsoft" are just wrong.
Mr.ODST
Member
Fucking hell the amount of bullshit you post might aswell change your name to "Anti Xbox"
ShaiKhulud1989
Gold Member
All I’m asking is some trivial (for other vendors) numbers, not some moot revenue w/o any context. But sure, when Xbox stopped reporting even subscriptions numbers, it’s people who’s asking for measurable context are thr enemies.
lyan
Member
Might want to read twice.
FF:Enhanced_Reality
Member
Translation. We haven't really had much success because we made some seriously fucking poor decisions (i.e. the launch Xbox one) so we just thought we'd buy it instead. Please be impressed by the amount of dollar we have spent in the hopes you buy our console or subscribe to our service.
DForce
NaughtyDog Defense Force
Yes, 3 billion left in other things.
- Marketing.
- Third-party royalties
- First-party investments
Starfield was released day one on Game Pass. If they only made 150m in retail, then that amount needs to be recovered through Game Pass. It's going to be harder to recover that extra revenue in retail because most gamers who wanted to wait for a discount probably decided to get the game through Game Pass for just $9.99.
Next year you're probably going to see Hellblade 2 and Fable and that's why growth is going to be very important for Microsoft. If the retail sales are flat and growth becomes stagnant, it's going to be harder to recover the budget from these titles.
Yes, this is why Microsoft wanted growth by 2027
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
You should. If the trillion-dollar company stops making a profit, they will stop making the things you like.
If the margins are SOOOO high with Game Pass, then why is that MS is raising the price on the Xbox Series S and X consoles this year?
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Why did Nintendo need to release Tears of the Kingdom for $70 when Switch is the second highest selling gaming console of all time?
Hardware and content are different brackets of revenue.
pasterpl
Member
He lives free of charge in your head I see and triggger you much /s
yes, it is horrible when a company communicates regularly with their customers via various means. It is such a bad practice.
Edmund
is waiting for Starfield 7
You sound really proud as if you're getting a share.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
"we put billions in trying to devalue gaming in a race to the bottom, where only a trillion dollar company can absorb the losses and stand on top"
pasterpl
Member
Thank you for sharing your delusions /s
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
So that $70b was free, right? That sunk cost doesn't need a payback before turning profit?
Math is hard.