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PoliGAF 2013 |OT2| Worth 77% of OT1
- Thread starter The Librarian
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I read what you said. I disagree that Obama is actually planning to use it as an absolute last resort.
You even have Pelosi vocal in her opposition to Obama's idea that the treasury/constitutional option is a bad idea. I would think she'd be in on the loop if Obama had seriously considered it and thus she wouldn't have voiced her disapproval, rather say nothing about it.
Just because I disagree with you doesn't mean I didn't read your post... I take Lew and Obama at their word when they say there is no other option in their view but the Congressional one.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Agreed. However if this were to happen and Obama did this...would the next step be impeachment in the House.
Still, I'm not worried about us even reaching that point. People are freaking out over Boehner's comments but it's clear he's bluffing. Maybe his comments are what it'll take for the market to begin speaking earlier than expected, and I'd imagine he knows that.
Dude, I don't know. Assume this is true and they are really holding out until the 16th (50/50 chance I'd say). If you think about it that is a good strategy. It is so cut-throat that depending on what happens, at the brink of the default GOPers could make even more demands and simply not give Obama enough time to put the onus back Boehner and have no choice but to pass their wet dream agenda, default or risk getting impeached.
Absolutely they want to impeach him. You know they are talking about it. They have to be.
I don't think Boehner gives a damn. He knows he's down in the dumps either way and is at ideological war with the President as well as Reid, siding with the Tea Party caucus. He must feel driven to do this. If he didn't he'd have put a clean CR on the floor by now because he knows despite his rhetoric the votes are most likely there. This fight? It's ALL HE HAS LEFT.
I don't even think he cares about what the Teabagger caucus does to him anymore, because no matter how this ends Boehner will go down as one of the worst Congressional leaders in American history. He knows this, he has to by now.
Hold on to your butts.
We can, but getting an official recalled is a lengthy process.
RustyNails
Member
I think you give Boehner too much credit.
PhoenixDark
Banned
dude...he has said, on two separate occasions, that he will not allow a default to occur.
Markets aren't the only way Wall Street will end this. You guys don't think Boehner will be getting calls from donors and CEOs by the end of next week? If we default it'll literally be due to him not scheduling a simple yes/no vote. I'm sorry but there's no way that happens.
Another question: what did you guys expect him to say on ABC today? Just yesterday most of us seemed to agree republicans were in the last stage of denial, and would soon fold. Now some are getting concerned...I don't get it. To believe we default is to believe one of the most corporate establishment Speakers in modern history will refuse to allow a vote. It's not going to happen.
Boehner's backers have created a monster. They might not be able to control his idiocy any more. That is what people are afraid of.
One second I hate Boehner, the next I feel bad for him.
Either way I would NOT want his job, holy shit.
Okay this makes me feel like he may indeed be bluffing but everything is just up in the air right now, so it is hard to tell.
But on the other hand, the GOP Congressmen willing to vote for clean funding are getting threatened too. So this may not be a lack of regard for the US economy but the vast majority of the non-tea party House GOP having no spine whatsoever and caving in to the demands of less than 40 or so individuals.
someone hold meh this is scary
Doc Holliday
SPOILER: Columbus finds America
Fuck Boehner and McConnell..They let this shit get out of control in the first place. They placated to the tea party early and often now they have to deal with this shit.
StopMakingSense
Member
So you think you have absolutely nothing to worry about after reading what Boehner said today? Nothing?
One second I hate Boehner, the next I feel bad for him.
Either way I would NOT want his job, holy shit.
Okay this makes me feel like he may indeed be bluffing but everything is just up in the air right now, so it is hard to tell.
But on the other hand, the GOP Congressmen willing to vote for clean funding are getting threatened too. So this may not be a lack of regard for the US economy but the vast majority of the non-tea party House GOP having no spine whatsoever and caving in to the demands of less than 40 or so individuals.
someone hold meh this is scary
It sounds like the Tea Party is threatening to primary everyone who votes for a clean CR. Boehner may be a wimp with no spine, but I do not envy his position right now. He really needs to find a way to break the Tea Party, if it's even possible.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
He put himself in this position, and he is hurting the country in order to attempt to help save his speakership. Fuck him. He is being completely selfish.
Oh I blame him completely on this, but at the same time I'd hate to be in his position. It sounds like his entire caucus is being held hostage by the Tea Party.
Nothing. It's posturing. They have the votes because they have the democrats. You don't come on a news station and say, well yea we can end this today easily but we still want concessions from the democrats.
The GOP had already fucked the chicken with this, they are getting the blame from everyone but their base, if you are already in the shitter whats the difference of another week?
Avon Barksdale
Member
Obama isn't getting impeached. It would be a bigger waste of time then Clinton's impeachment.
I wouldn't be surprised if the GOP proper tries to shift blame from themselves to the Tea Party in a build up to passing a clean CR. It would help them purge that poison from their party.
They'll still try. Just for show. Just like with Clinton.
I highly doubt the GOP cares about its image at this point. Their base is firmly with them. Their base hates Obama and wants nothing more to see him fail, and will then blame the default squarely on Obama, just like they did with the shutdown.
All you have to do is read Fox News comments to figure that out.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...r-says-ending-fiscal-problems-in-obama-hands/
All you have to do is read Fox News comments to figure that out.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...r-says-ending-fiscal-problems-in-obama-hands/
And just like the shutdown, no one will buy it and point the finger at the GOP.
jamesinclair
Banned
PD's look isn't good on you.
Aaron Strife
Banned
PPP: Democrats leading Republicans in 17 Republican-held House districts
itshappening.gif
After some push polling, Democrats lead in 4 more.
itshappening.gif
We still have a year to go, unfortunately...
Which is the frightening thing. Something is going to have to break this fever, but I have no idea what it could possibly be.
Aaron Strife
Banned
During which their poll numbers will drop further.
RustyNails
Member
Too far out, and once Immigration bill passes, everything will be back to normal.
rocketknight
Member
I just don't understand why, if Boehner is going to capitulate in the end anyway, he doesn't just do it now. He gets fucked either way. Non-insane Republicans who vote for clean CR/debt limit raise get fucked either way. Is he just holding out to make sure these two things are combined in one vote? Does that even help them anyway? Can they even use the the seriousness of the debt limit as an excuse to sneak in a clean CR? They know Obama isn't going to "move towards" them in the next two weeks - it's just going to be more of this. None of this makes sense to anybody, does it:?
The Librarian
Banned
It ain't gonna pass, my esteemed colleague.
No it doesn't... you underestimate the forgetfulness of the american people. In a year, they can just advertise bullshit on TV and the people can eat it up.
i really don't understand why people think republicans begrudgingly allowing a (very draconian) pathway to citizenship to pass is suddenly going to boost their numbers. it's not like latinos are a sleeper demographic for the party that they can't reach simply because of their stance on immigration.
in fact, they're the most liberal demographic across the board on most issues. passing immigration reform is good for the long-term survival of the republican party, but in the short-term, it'll just create more democrats.
you don't think the dems are going to exploit the shutdown with their own ads in a year? The ads practically make themselves!
I guess that's what happened in 2010?
PhoenixDark
Banned
Immigration is dead. Especially after this debt fiasco ends and Boehner is neutered.
Yup. Though I think it was dead the moment the House stayed in GOP hands in 2012. I think the effort was more about drawing contrast than any serious hope it would pass.
T
thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Indeed. What happens if a clean CR is passed today, but it results in tea party replacing the old guard and gerrymandering still holds the house for them in 2014?
We could be seeing this same thing again in 2015, and we'll be wishing Boehner was still around to protect us.
Aaron Strife
Banned
What like in 2012?
If we default 2014 is up for grabs. People will go crazy,
Aaron Strife
Banned
Bullshit, everyone will know whose fault it was.
If we default, would there even BE a 2014 election?
Nope. The entire nuclear arsenal automatically launches in the event of a default.
The Librarian
Banned
A modern-day Doomsday Machine.
zero shift
Banned
I see. I'm sorry for posting ignorant things. I feel very dumb now.
I thought all of the discrimination they faced was limited to the 1800s.
I'm actually interested in learning more. Anybody have anymore links please PM me.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Doubtful. I don't think you understand the sheer magnitude of what would happen if we default. People ultimately blame the president for economic hardship. If we enter a depression due to this, sure republican support will plummet. But that doesn't mean Obama will have decent approval ratings as the economy implodes, people lose their jobs, etc.
And let's not forget that the media has been pretty consistent with a "both sides to blame" narrative. It's not working right now, obviously. But perhaps that changes if unemployment hits 10% and the dollar becomes useless.
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