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PoliGAF 2016 |OT3| You know what they say about big Michigans - big Florida

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Bowdz

Member
PBY said:
Jon Ralston
‏@RalstonReports
Sarah Palin accuses protesters of "punk-ass thuggery," turns to media and accuses reporters of enabling it. Crowd boos. No words...
Click to expand...

Thank you John McCain for unleashing Sarah Palin on the country. - No one ever
 
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besada

Banned
pigeon said:
So Clinton's position on the death penalty is kind of bizarre for a professional politician, reading the answer on Vox. Basically, she wants to have it for, like, really bad people, like terrorists, but that's it.

This is probably not that uncommon a position among Americans -- on a feelings level, it kind of feels reasonable. The problem is that it's kind of a dumb position! Aside from the potential constitutional issue with having a special punishment we keep in reserve for unusual criminals, I feel like in the end this system just boils down to "rely on the prosecutor, the judge, and the jury to select the specific people who do deserve the death penalty." Which is the system we have now, and we hate it.

I would kind of expect Clinton to have a more coherent response on this issue, especially since Democrats generally don't support the death penalty any more. So a little surprising to me. I guess it doesn't come up much.
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Not only that, but the federal death penalty is one of the worst in terms of playing politics with the lives of people. But she's always supported the death penalty, so I'm not terribly surprised that she continues to do so. Historically she's supported the state level death penalty as well -- albeit requiring DNA testing before application -- so I guess this could be seen as an improvement?
 
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B-Dubs

No Scrubs
OrangeGrayBlue said:
Unless Bernie gets crushed tomorrow and loses states he's expected to win going forward, I wouldn't be surprised to see him put $10 million+ into NY and even more into CA. That said, Jeb proves that money only goes so far.

Also worth noting that the only states that vote after March 26th but before NY are Wisconsin and Wyoming: both easy Sanders wins. So that gives Bernie three weeks of time devoted almost entirely to swaying NY.
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I think he'd be better off putting that time into California. Even if he manages to win NY it won't be by enough to make a difference, at most a one or two point win. California he could potentially sway a lot more than NY.

EDIT: Unless he could swing deBlasio into supporting him, which would never happen, there's no way he wins the state.
 
U

ugaboga232

Member
besada said:
Not only that, but the federal death penalty is one of the worst in terms of playing politics with the lives of people. But she's always supported the death penalty, so I'm not terribly surprised that she continues to do so. Historically she's supported the state level death penalty as well -- albeit requiring DNA testing before application -- so I guess this could be seen as an improvement?
Click to expand...

How is she going to get death penalty reform passed with the senate/house how it is?
 
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besada

Banned
ugaboga232 said:
How is she going to get death penalty reform passed with the senate/house how it is?
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Not relevant. The question was her opinion on the death penalty, not, what would you do to get rid of the death penalty. No one was asking her how she was going to change the death penalty, they were asking whether she thought it was appropriate.
 
H

HylianTom

Banned
He sounds like a stand-up comedian or a game show host..

"Who's gonna pay for the wall?
"MEXICOOO!"

"What game are we playing?"
"PLINKO!"

"What time is it?"
"SLEDGE-O-MATIC!"
 
U

ugaboga232

Member
besada said:
Not relevant. The question was her opinion on the death penalty, not, what would you do to get rid of the death penalty. No one was asking her how she was going to change the death penalty, they were asking whether she thought it was appropriate.
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I was just curious but good point. I feel like clinton could appeal to a lot more bernie supporters if she just spoke more about her ideals/her dream policies as well as giving more fleshed out, realistic proposals something like X is what I want and Y is what im proposing to move toward it.
 
Y

Y2Kev

TLG Fan Caretaker Est. 2009
PBY said:
Jon Ralston
‏@RalstonReports
Sarah Palin accuses protesters of "punk-ass thuggery," turns to media and accuses reporters of enabling it. Crowd boos. No words...
Click to expand...
Enough words for Ralston to keep twittering
 
M

Macho Madness

Member
ugaboga232 said:
I was just curious but good point. I feel like clinton could appeal to a lot more bernie supporters if she just spoke more about her ideals/her dream policies as well as giving more fleshed out, realistic proposals something like X is what I want and Y is what im proposing to move toward it.
Click to expand...

The problem is that any time she does that, she gets accused of copying his policies. There are people predisposed not to like her, so it really doesn't matter what she says or does to them. Also, her campaign, and she said this very clearly last night is about telling people what she thinks she can actually accomplish.

On fracking:
CLINTON: So that is what I am going to try to do. And, you know, I know that others say, well, we are going to ban it. I just want to tell you, I'm going to do everything I can to regulate it and to try to limit it. No president can stand up before you and say, I'm going to ban it.

We have got too many layers of law that we have got to work through and regulation we've got to deal with.

And that's what I'm trying to say very clearly, you know, I don't want to make a promise I can't keep. I want to tell you what I think that I can do as president to be your ally in trying to stop that at the local level.
Click to expand...
 
B

besada

Banned
ugaboga232 said:
I was just curious but good point. I feel like clinton could appeal to a lot more bernie supporters if she just spoke more about her ideals/her dream policies as well as giving more fleshed out, realistic proposals something like X is what I want and Y is what im proposing to move toward it.
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I suspect, when it changes, it will be done by the SC. There's not much incentive for the legislative branch to get involved, as they frequently run on "hard on crime" tickets for re-election.

I agree, by the way. Not everything has to be a discussion about specific policy implementations. Anyone who watches politics knows that such promises are fictional anyway, given the inability to see the future of the composition of the legislature, the composition of the SC, etc. Like Obama promising to close Guantanamo, some promises aren't worth the breath they used, because they're promising something they don't control delivery of.

Sometimes voters want to know what a candidates actual feelings on a subject are, regardless of whether that's a subject amenable to change. I'd guess we're still another ten to twenty years away from getting rid of the death penalty -- although I'd be blissfully happy if we did it before then -- and a President willing to speak out against it would be helpful, but not decisive.
 
P

PBY

Banned
RustyNails said:
Whats this dude's problem when it comes to women? It's like he's a travelling comedian and says the darndest things when talking about or to women.

Kasich: Are you 16? How old are you young lady? ... Oh you're 22

*Audience laughter*
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GOLLY GEE
 
U

ugaboga232

Member
Macho Madness said:
The problem is that any time she does that, she gets accused of copying his policies. There are people predisposed not to like her, so it really doesn't matter what she says or does to them. Also, her campaign, and she said this very clearly last night is about telling people what she thinks she can actually accomplish.

On fracking:
Click to expand...

To be fair that quote has a lot of hedging and would be stronger if she said, I want to ban it, and we will work towards that with policies on X, Y and Z. It is probably a bit too late to win over the sanders supporters but I guess its a retrospect thing. I think sanders could also do a bit more of this. At the end of the day I dont get why people care so much about specific policies when there are so many variables that won't be known till next year.
 
O

OrangeGrayBlue

Member
B-Dubs said:
I think he'd be better off putting that time into California. Even if he manages to win NY it won't be by enough to make a difference, at most a one or two point win. California he could potentially sway a lot more than NY.

EDIT: Unless he could swing deBlasio into supporting him, which would never happen, there's no way he wins the state.
Click to expand...

I'm not terribly well-versed on Deblasio's policies, but isn't he ideologically closer to Bernie than Hillary on a lot of things? I always got the impression he was pretty far left.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
OrangeGrayBlue said:
I'm not terribly well-versed on Deblasio's policies, but isn't he ideologically closer to Bernie than Hillary on a lot of things? I always got the impression he was pretty far left.
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He is, the guy's basically everything people wish Bernie was, but he's also a huge Hillary supporter. He flew himself out to Iowa just to go door to door and help drive out the vote for her. Her camp has had to chain him to his desk and promise him he could help as a surrogate later on in the cycle to get him to chill.
 
M

Macho Madness

Member
OrangeGrayBlue said:
I'm not terribly well-versed on Deblasio's policies, but isn't he ideologically closer to Bernie than Hillary on a lot of things? I always got the impression he was pretty far left.
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Sure. But he's also very much tied with the Clintons. Deblasio has wanted to campaign for her for months but they keep declining his offer.
 
V

VendettaRed07

Member
I hear Arnold Schwarzenegger is going to use his Hummers to cause traffic and suppress non Kasich voters in Ohio.

Size of his cars should help give Kasich a bigger margin of victory than Hillary got in Massachusetts
 
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