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[polyh3dron]

ill defend bush on many issues. The war in Afghanistan was very well operated and quickly accomplished.

:lol :lol :lol
:lol :lol :lol
:lol :lol :lol

 

[Stinkles]

ill defend bush on many issues. The war in Afghanistan was very well operated and quickly accomplished.

NO it was hastily entered, poorly planned, undermanned, left unfinished and is now a disaster, headed swiftly back to Taliban control with bonus support from Pakistan, and Bin Laden is still free.

Iraq also was a successful invasion (its the occupation that has been bad at points). The surge which has been successful.

NO, it is a humanitarian disaster that was begun illegally, has resulted in millions displaced and hundreds of thousands dead. It cannot be considered a success any more than breaking all your limbs jumping off a roof for no reason can be.

His support for aids treatment in Africa.

NO he is still spending our dollars on abstinence education which not only doesn't work, it exacerbates the problem. And the program is rife with corruption.

Trying to do something with the failing education system with no child left behind.

NO this has put teachers in the hole, and students deeper in the hole concentrating on artificial test scores and Southern States are builiding in future failure with creationism tainting all of their educational worth in other areas. No child left behind is a massive failure and a bloody nose to our country.

The tax cuts, and the market reaching an all time high just a couple years ago.

NO the market is not adjusted for inflation so of COURSE it reached an all time high and the economy is in the SHITTER with only the very, very, very wealthy showing any gains.

Getting Libya To Give Up Its WMD Programs in 2003.

NO, Libya, even by Gaddafi's admission was beaten down by ten years of sanctions and could no longer function without capitulation. Two years of those were simply Bush continuing other policies.

Also, North Korea giving up its nuclear ambitions (although i know they are talking of re-instating it)

To be continued.

of course he has failures too. Katrina, failure after the fall of Iraq. Lack of oversight which allowed mortgage lenders to give low interest loans to every person who asked, and leading to the mortgage crisis. Underestimating Russia. Huge government spending and deficit. Not handling the illegal immigration problem.

Correct, more failures.

I have an enormous amount of respect for what John McCain has went through, and accomplished.

goddamnit.

 

[Extollere]

"Pal-in comparison to Obama Biden"

:lol well played

 

[captmcblack]

"mcpalin out of my uterus" :lol

 

[scorcho]

it's also worth noting that all we've accomplished with North Korea came after years of belligerence from the Bush Administration that degenerated matters quickly (quick - under what administration did North Korea actually test a nuclear bomb under?)

 

[kkaabboomm]

i'm going to hop back a couple pages, because i want to talk about Obama's August haul --

$66 million dollars? 2.5+ million donors? $77 million in the bank?

i can EASILY see them hit 3 million unique donors by election day. which is, to put it mildly, ridiculous.

anyone have DNC and RNC numbers for August?

 

[demon]

ill defend bush on many issues. The war in Afghanistan was very well operated and quickly accomplished. Iraq also was a successful invasion (its the occupation that has been bad at points). The surge which has been successful. His support for aids treatment in Africa. Trying to do something with the failing education system with no child left behind. The tax cuts, and the market reaching an all time high just a couple years ago. Getting Libya To Give Up Its WMD Programs in 2003. Also, North Korea giving up its nuclear ambitions (although i know they are talking of re-instating it)

 

[GhaleonEB]

correct me if im wrong, but haven't the weekends been bad for obama, so this is actually good news.

usually, yes. Rasmussen adjusted their party ID weightings today. If they hadn't, Obama would have gained. Flat on the Gallup, and the Resarch 2000/Kos tracker has Obama ahead by two now. Was tied yesterday.

http://www.dailykos.com/dailypoll/2008/09/14

The daily sample yesterday was McCain 45, Obama 48.

i'm going to hop back a couple pages, because i want to talk about Obama's August haul --

$66 million dollars? 2.5+ million donors? $77 million in the bank?

i can EASILY see them hit 3 million unique donors by election day. which is, to put it mildly, ridiculous.

anyone have DNC and RNC numbers for August?

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/The_RNCs_cash_advantage.html?showall

DNC spokeswoman Karen Finney says the party raised more than $17 million and has $17.5 million on hand, having spent more than $28 million last month, largely on the Democrats' ground game.

That cash figure is a fraction of the $110 million a Republican official says it has, which includes transfers of money McCain is no longer allowed to spend and money from state fundraising vehicles.

Key difference are the other party comittees - the dem side is doing very well, while the RNC is having to spread a lot further.

 

[Tamanon]

i'm going to hop back a couple pages, because i want to talk about Obama's August haul --

$66 million dollars? 2.5+ million donors? $77 million in the bank?

i can EASILY see them hit 3 million unique donors by election day. which is, to put it mildly, ridiculous.

anyone have DNC and RNC numbers for August?

DNC was $17 million I think and RNC was pretty high, I think the RNC has $89 million on hand.

 

[tanod]

anyone have DNC and RNC numbers for August?

We probably won't know until the 20th. Also, then we'll know John McCain's cash on hand too.

 

[Extollere]

Obama:
Occidental College (Los Angeles) - 2 years studying Politics and Public Policy.
Columbia University (New York) - B.A. Political Science with a specialization in International Relations.
Harvard Law School - Juris Doctor (J.D.) Magna Cum Laude, Editor-in-Chief of the Harvard Law Review.

Biden:
University of Delaware - B.A. in History and a B.A. in Political Science.
Syracuse University College of Law - Juris Doctor (J.D.)

McCain:
United States Naval Academy - Class rank 894 of 899.

Palin:
Hawaii Pacific University - 1 semester - Business Administration.
North Idaho College - 2 semesters - General Studies.
University of Idaho - 2 semesters - Journalism.
Matanuska-Susitna College - 1 semester.
University of Idaho - 3 semesters - B.A. in Journalism.

My God. I thought the other two candidates had at least some education behind them. You know all signs really point towards a bad decision when casting your vote for McCain/Palin. You've got McCain saying he'd like to overturn Roe v Wade, Palin doesn't hardly know what the Bush Doctrine is, but she's ready to cross Pakistani borders anyways. You've got informed and intelligent people like Ron Paul saying preventative war is one of the great dangers of international affair, and Greenspan telling us this is the worst economy he's seen, while McCain just continues the downwards trend of Bush's tax cut plans. Anyone with half a brain would stay miles from this ticket. If McCain gets voted in we truly are a doomed and ignorant nation.

 

[Soybean]

i'm going to hop back a couple pages, because i want to talk about Obama's August haul --

$66 million dollars? 2.5+ million donors? $77 million in the bank?

i can EASILY see them hit 3 million unique donors by election day. which is, to put it mildly, ridiculous.

anyone have DNC and RNC numbers for August?

The DNC took in $17.3 million in August and now has $17.5 million in the bank. The RNC raised $22 million in August and ended the month with about $125 million in the bank.

 

[Frank the Great]

Generic Congressional Ballot
DATE	DEM	REP	UND
09/14	  47	  41	  12

 

[AndyIsTheMoran]

What the fuck have you been paying attention to?

Afghanistan a success? Half the fucking country is out of the central government control. Of the region we do have some form of control of it, a big chunk of that is because we are looking the other way on drug lords business dealings. Afghanistans destabalizing effect has now reached across to the tribal regions of Pakistan, and in case you didnt notice, that country now hates us too. Their government has given their army authorization to shoot US forces that cross the border.

No child left behind a "good point" its a complete fucking failure.

You give Bush credit for the economy hitting an "all time high" just a few years ago. It was the lack of oversight in the lending industry that allowed the market to hit that all time high. Most economists now believe we are fealing the effects of the 2001 recession that never really ended compounded by the collapse of the financial sector. The economy never recovered from Bush's first recession, smoke and mirrors propped it up for a few years and now that those have collapsed we are in worse shape than we were before real estate "saved us".

His tax cuts are assinine too, what kind of fiscal conservative cuts taxes while waging 2 wars? Its beyond stupid.

and what has the surge accomplished? A decrease in violence? That is all well and good, but the Iraqi government is fucked. There are basically 3 seperate regions that dont communicate with each other, we are having to pay off warlords to fight for us, and the Iraqi government is refusing to pay for its own security. What we have is a less violent region, but we are propping that up. Very little political reconcilliation has taken place.

North Korea isnt a success yet, it way too premature to give him credit there.

the initial attack and toppling of the Taliban was a success. Of course there is a resurgence there, With increased troop presence in Iraq, it makes Afghanistan a much more valuable target.

-It was a failure beforehand, nothings changed.

-you realize the recession of 2001 was in march, before Bush's Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001 went into effect. so the recession is a result of Clinton then, even still today? since you say today's recession is a continuation of the 2001 recession?

-agreed on tax cut during wartime

-Yes the surge has decreased violence, how else can any government be built of functioning? the Kurds, Sunnis, ans Shiites have been working together, and progress has been made towards stability. This wouldn't have been possible with violence that the surge decreased.

-How is it a failure? much better off then the way Clinton left it. and you forgot about Syria in 2003

 

[Learn2read]

the initial attack and toppling of the Taliban was a success. Of course there is a resurgence there, With increased troop presence in Iraq, it makes Afghanistan a much more valuable target.

-It was a failure beforehand, nothings changed.

-you realize the recession of 2001 was in march, before Bush's Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001 went into effect. so the recession is a result of Clinton then, even still today? since you say today's recession is a continuation of the 2001 recession?

-agreed on tax cut during wartime

-Yes the surge has decreased violence, how else can any government be built of functioning? the Kurds, Sunnis, ans Shiites have been working together, and progress has been made towards stability. This wouldn't have been possible with violence that the surge decreased.

-How is it a failure? much better off then the way Clinton left it. and you forgot about Syria in 2003

We're through the looking glass here people!

 

[AniHawk]

http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0908/_SEIU_TV_for_Obama.html?showall

SEIU ad for Obama. Pretty effective.

This is perfect. This is what I was saying all along. Time to tell those out there who you'd save more money with.

 

[polyh3dron]

AndyIsTheMoney jumped the shark, I LOVE IT!

Also, can someone say that it's ok to take me off ignore because I don't have my McVampire avatar anymore.

 

[Hitokage]

the initial attack and toppling of the Taliban was a success. Of course there is a resurgence there, With increased troop presence in Iraq, it makes Afghanistan a much more valuable target.

Except we weren't there to kick their dog and make noise, we were there to capture Osama bin Laden, dead or alive, and we failed.

 

[AniHawk]

The internal polls at dailykos are interesting. Midwest and West have been moving further and further away from McCain. Same with Men in general. Women in general have been moving towards Obama. However, whites in general have been moving more towards McCain.

Fav/unfav:
McCain: 53-44
Obama: 54-39
Biden: 49-33
Palin: 47-42

 

[Frank the Great]

the initial attack and toppling of the Taliban was a success. Of course there is a resurgence there, With increased troop presence in Iraq, it makes Afghanistan a much more valuable target.

-It was a failure beforehand, nothings changed.

-you realize the recession of 2001 was in march, before Bush's Economic Growth and Tax Relief Reconciliation Act of 2001 went into effect. so the recession is a result of Clinton then, even still today? since you say today's recession is a continuation of the 2001 recession?

-agreed on tax cut during wartime

-Yes the surge has decreased violence, how else can any government be built of functioning? the Kurds, Sunnis, ans Shiites have been working together, and progress has been made towards stability. This wouldn't have been possible with violence that the surge decreased.

-How is it a failure? much better off then the way Clinton left it. and you forgot about Syria in 2003

Holy crap. So you give Bush CREDIT for going into Afghanistan and leaving it a shambles?

And recessions are normal. What's NOT normal is having policies that lead to worsening the recession instead of providing relief and waiting it out. Blaming Clinton for the 2001 recession is laughable, Hannity-esque ignorance.

About the surge - you give CREDIT to Bush for fucking up Iraq? First of all, the surge wouldn't be necessary if we weren't their in the first goddamn place. Secondly, there is almost no evidence that the surge contributed to ANYTHING resembling political reconciliation in Iraq, making it a total failure which didn't even meet its own goals.

I don't understand this. It's like you're defending Bush for fucking up.

 

[gkryhewy]

AndyIsTheMoney jumped the shark, I LOVE IT!

Also, can someone say that it's ok to take me off ignore because I don't have my McVampire avatar anymore.

Dude jumped the shark when he threw down the "I've met many CEOs, and they're just great" line. I mean, really.

What was wrong with McVampire, anyway?

EDIT: Also, I love the polling today. Looking great.

 

[M3wThr33]

AndyIsTheMoney jumped the shark, I LOVE IT!

Also, can someone say that it's ok to take me off ignore because I don't have my McVampire avatar anymore.

Wow. That's all it took?

Dude jumped the shark when he threw down the "I've met many CEOs, and they're just great" line. I mean, really.

What was wrong with McVampire, anyway?

"Met many CEOs" is slang for "I'm rich, white and priveleged, of COURSE I'm out of touch."

 

[AndyIsTheMoran]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html

"The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion."

yea he really fucked up in africa

 

[mj1108]

I don't understand this. It's like you're defending Bush for fucking up.

I wouldn't even try to reason with someone like that. What we see as a fuck up, the person defending sees a "success".

I know a couple of people who think Bush has done a great job as President. I've tried telling them time and time again that he's fucked up, but do they listen? Hell no.

 

[Pakkidis]

My God. I thought the other two candidates had at least some education behind them. You know all signs really point towards a bad decision when casting your vote for McCain/Palin. You've got McCain saying he'd like to overturn Roe v Wade, Palin doesn't hardly know what the Bush Doctrine is, but she's ready to cross Pakistani borders anyways. You've got informed and intelligent people like Ron Paul saying preventative war is one of the great dangers of international affair, and Greenspan telling us this is the worst economy he's seen, while McCain just continues the downwards trend of Bush's tax cut plans. Anyone with half a brain would stay miles from this ticket. If McCain gets voted in we truly are a doomed and ignorant nation.

You forgot about their energy policy...DRILL BABY DRILL...

Im still baffled how they can believe this.

 

[gkryhewy]

"Met many CEOs" is slang for "I'm rich, white and priveleged, of COURSE I'm out of touch."

I read it more as "I'm completely full of shit!" Perhaps my mediocrity translating skills are bit off-target lately.

 

[reilo]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html

"The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion."

yea he really fucked up in africa

Except what you don't tell is that the only way many of those African countries get that aid, is if they agree to teach ABSTINENCE ONLY in an area ravaged by AIDS, HIV and overpopulation. Meaning, no teaching of contraceptives or safe sex.

FUCKED, UP.

 

[Frank the Great]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html

"The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion."

yea he really fucked up in africa

I actually agree. I think Bush has made a lot of progress in regards to US-African relations.

Though part of me says that we shouldn't be giving money to Africa when we have such fiscal problems at home (because of Bush), my bleeding heart half of my conscious thinks it was a great move. We'll live, they need the money a lot more.

BUT (there's always a butt) that's not an excuse for fucking up THIS country as bad as he did.

Except what you don't tell is that the only way many of those African countries get that aid, is if they agree to teach ABSTINENCE ONLY in an area ravaged by AIDS, HIV and overpopulation. Meaning, no teaching of contraceptives or safe sex.

FUCKED, UP.

It's better than nothing. When President Obama gives money to help with the AIDs epidemic and doesn't qualify it with abstinence-only education, less people will bitch because Bush already did it and it won't look like Obama is starting this massive Africa initiative just because he's black.

 

[scorcho]

-How is it a failure? much better off then the way Clinton left it. and you forgot about Syria in 2003

if you're talking about North Korea, do you even know what you're discussing?

http://www.nybooks.com/articles/19923

this is somehow a success.

 

[Learn2read]

-How is it a failure? much better off then the way Clinton left it.

It really wouldn't be possible for you to be more wrong.

Clinton almost went to war with NK over them getting them acquiring nuclear weapons in the '90s, but instead negotiated an agreement where there nuclear energy production would be monitored. The Bush admin of course decided to pull out of this agreement over what turned out to be bogus intelligence and in the meantime replaced that agreement with absolutely nothing. During that time, NK was able to produce enough material for several weapons, and even detonated one feable one. Any agreement reached just put them back to the Clinton years, except now NK is several nukes richer.

It was a fuck-up of monumental proportions.

 

[GhaleonEB]

The internal polls at dailykos are interesting. Midwest and West have been moving further and further away from McCain. Same with Men in general. Women in general have been moving towards Obama. However, whites in general have been moving more towards McCain.

Fav/unfav:
McCain: 53-44
Obama: 54-39
Biden: 49-33
Palin: 47-42

Look at the Palin number. Here's the internal from the first day of the poll: 52%- 35%

Her favorable rating dropped five points, her unfavorable went up seven. Net swing of twelve, in a span of three days.

 

[Extollere]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html

"The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion."

yea he really fucked up in africa

To be fair $9 billion isn't really a whole lot for an entire continent. Ok sure, it's great that he's helped there I agree, but this hardly seems like a selling point.

 

[demon]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html

"The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion."

yea he really fucked up in africa

Hasn't it mostly been abstinence-only, anti-condom education? In other words, a waste of our money?

 

[Frank the Great]

To be fair $9 billion isn't really a whole lot for an entire continent. Ok sure, it's great that he's helped there I agree, but this hardly seems like a selling point.

Compare it to how much money has been given in previous administrations.

For a REPUBLICAN especially, it is pretty impressive. Can't believe I'm defending Bush.

 

[tanod]

Look at the Palin number. Here's the internal from the first day of the poll: 52%- 35%

Her favorable rating dropped five points, her unfavorable went up seven. Net swing of twelve, in a span of three days.

I've always felt that favorability ratings are a lead indicator in spotting trends. Let's hope I'm right.

 

[Barrett2]

ill defend bush on many issues. The war in Afghanistan was very well operated and quickly accomplished.

:lol :lol Wow. Spoken like a true Bush supporter!

 

[polyh3dron]

What was wrong with McVampire, anyway?

POW

 

[JayDubya]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html

"The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion."

yea he really fucked up in africa

Giving that much of the taxpayers' money away is fucking up, and significantly.

 

[lopaz]

Giving that much of the taxpayers' money away is fucking up, and significantly.

I know, cuz Africans are from a different country so it doesn't matter if they die of AIDS

 

[AniHawk]

Look at the Palin number. Here's the internal from the first day of the poll: 52%- 35%

Her favorable rating dropped five points, her unfavorable went up seven. Net swing of twelve, in a span of three days.

Good to know. It's a really small sampling size (less than 400), but hopefully it's a greater sign that more people aren't trusting the McCain/Palin ticket anymore. It'll be interesting to see the narrative on Monday. I'm hoping it's more of the "GOP: OUT OF TOUCH LIARS" stuff. Drive it into peoples' skulls for the next two weeks and prove it at the debates.

 

[Frank the Great]

From the Kos poll:

Northeast	244	(22%)
South	314	(29%)
Midwest	306	(28%)
West	236	(21%)

Is that a normal proportion for the South? Seems high.

 

[Learn2read]

Giving that much of the taxpayers' money away is fucking up, and significantly.

That money should be used toward the creation of the Department of Utero-Security, amirite?

 

[reilo]

From the Kos poll:

Northeast	244	(22%)
South	314	(29%)
Midwest	306	(28%)
West	236	(21%)

Is that a normal proportion for the South? Seems high.

How do the two areas with the highest concentration of people [Northeast and West], get the least amount of sampling?

 

[Juice]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/30/AR2006123000941.html

"The president has tripled direct humanitarian and development aid to the world's most impoverished continent since taking office and recently vowed to double that increased amount by 2010 -- to nearly $9 billion."

yea he really fucked up in africa

I think Bush's increased aid to Africa, including drug campaigns against AIDS and (moreso) malaria has been one of the few bright spots of his presidency.

If it happens to mark the beginning of an upward trend in African health and/or stability, I think his administration should/will get a good amount of credit for it.

 

[Hootie]

I know, cuz Africans are from a different country so it doesn't matter if they die of AIDS

Dying of AIDS is not super rad.

Spoiler

This is text covered by a black bar.

 

[scorcho]

Any agreement reached just put them back to the Clinton years, except now NK is several nukes richer.

It was a fuck-up of monumental proportions.

yep - to argue that this new agreement is somehow better than the one agreed to under the Clinton administration takes an amazing level of ignorance.

then again, most of his prattlin' in that post displays the same.

 

[JayDubya]

I know, cuz Africans are from a different country so it doesn't matter if they die of AIDS

Yes and no.

No, because like I care what country you're talking about when using taxpayer money for healthcare services.

Yes, because by any chance have you seen the national debt lately? We're in no position to giving money away. If China wants to give the $9 B directly, great, but let's not borrow it from them to give it away to Africa and then we're still on the hook for it.

 

[gkryhewy]

POW

Really? Eff that noise. The POW John McCain died in ~2004. The present version may actually be a vampire.

His mother is 92 - could she be prolonged through vampirism? Have you seen Cindy McCain? Think about it.

 

[Stinkles]

Yes and no.

No, because like I care what country you're talking about when using taxpayer money for healthcare services.

Yes, because by any chance have you seen the national debt lately? We're in no position to giving money away. If China wants to give the $9 B directly, great, but let's not borrow it from them to give it away to Africa and then we're still on the hook for it.

Would you spend taxpayer money to reduce abortion in Africa?

 

[frankthurk]

Yes and no.

No, because like I care what country you're talking about when using taxpayer money for healthcare services.

Yes, because by any chance have you seen the national debt lately? We're in no position to giving money away. If China wants to give the $9 B directly, great, but let's not borrow it from them to give it away to Africa and then we're still on the hook for it.

I errr... I kinda have to agree with this. If I look at how I handle my finances, if I'm heavy in debt I'm not going to be spending much money in donations, I'm going to get rid of that debt first till I'm in a better position financially then I'd look at giving donations... I think I have to agree.