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PoliGAF Thread of First Debate Election 2008 - GAF doesn't know shit

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A

artredis1980

Banned
Obama calls McCain early tuesday morning: lets hold a joint statement on the economy and tell the people our campaign is not as important as the economy

McCain: Great Idea, Suspends campaign and calls for delay of debate

Obama : Joker Smile 'Its all part of the plan'
 
B

Beer Monkey

Member
The Experiment said:
The 70% will be responding very positively to McCain's debate answers tonight when he claims that the financial markets are in bad shape because it is overtaxed and over regulated.
Click to expand...

And the answer to that they are less taxed and regulated than during the decades that they did just fine. And that our dependence on foreign debt is posing a real threat to our currency and that tax cuts will increase that debt.
 
D

Door2Dawn

Banned
Ether_Snake said:
Torpedoed it = against it. And he will make his case tonight. He's keeping his cards to himself, and as such forcing Oabam to either defend the "evil" bailout, stand against it and propose his own (won't do that), or agree to McCain's.
Click to expand...
EXCEPT THAT MCCAIN SAID THAT A BAILOUT IS NEEDED!
 
W

WrathOfOtaibah

Banned
beermonkey@tehbias said:
And the answer to that they are less taxed and regulated than during the decades that they did just fine. And that our dependence on foreign debt is posing a real threat to our currency and that tax cuts will increase that debt.
Click to expand...

Too long of an explanation. That would mean telling Americans that taxes and regulation is good, going against the grain of the mantras of the past 25-30 years.
 
S

sevenchaos

Banned
Anyone hear about Palen's mock debate?

Was listening to Ed Schultz and he just talked about this. From his website:
McCain Camp insiders say Palin "clueless"
Capitol Hill sources are telling me that senior McCain people are more than concerned about Palin. The campaign has held a mock debate and a mock press conference; both are being described as "disastrous." One senior McCain aide was quoted as saying, "What are we going to do?" The McCain people want to move this first debate to some later, undetermined date, possibly never. People on the inside are saying the Alaska Governor is "clueless."
Click to expand...
:lol :lol
 
B

bob_arctor

Tough_Smooth
Ether_Snake said:
Torpedoed it = against it. And he will make his case tonight. He's keeping his cards to himself, and as such forcing Oabam to either defend the "evil" bailout, stand against it and propose his own (won't do that), or agree to McCain's.
Click to expand...

:lol What McCain have you been watching the past whatever months? Dude has yet to make a case on anything. He can barely make on speaking on his own or to the media. His campaign is essentially in panic mode, his VP is a blithering idiot and people are getting wise to that objective fact and the only cool cucumber in the midst of all this manufactured chaos is the guy who's already seen as stronger on the economy: Obama.
 
S

soul creator

Member
CharlieDigital said:
The Draft of the Dodd/Paulson/Bipartisan proposal: http://www.politico.com/static/PPM41_ayo08b28.html

The GOP alternative: http://www.usnews.com/usnews/images/news/articles/economic-rescue-principles.pdf

Wiki is on top of this shit: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_bailout_of_U.S._financial_system_(2008)
Click to expand...

yeah, this pretty much sums it up:

# In a survey conducted September 19-22 by the Pew Research Center, by a margin of 57 percent to 30 percent, Americans supported the bailout when asked "As you may know, the government is potentially investing billions to try and keep financial institutions and markets secure. Do you think this is the right thing or the wrong thing for the government to be doing?"

# In a survey conducted September 19-22 by Bloomberg/Los Angeles Times, by a margin of 55 percent to 31 percent, Americans opposed the bailout when asked whether "the government should use taxpayers' dollars to rescue ailing private financial firms whose collapse could have adverse effects on the economy and market, or is it not the government's responsibility to bail out private companies with taxpayers' dollars?"
Click to expand...

if you say "should the government keep our financial institutions and markets secure", people support it, because they don't want their savings/retirements/paychecks/etc. fucked with. If you say "should we give private companies your money in order to save them", people oppose it.

The first poll seems to be reflected more by Dodd's plan. The second poll seems more like the initial Paulson plan, and the new Republican plan.
 
S

soul creator

Member
bob_arctor said:
:lol What McCain have you been watching the past whatever months? Dude has yet to make a case on anything. He can barely make on speaking on his own or to the media. His campaign is essentially in panic mode, his VP is a blithering idiot and people are getting wise to that objective fact and the only cool cucumber in the midst of all this manufactured chaos is the guy who's already seen as stronger on the economy: Obama.
Click to expand...

but is Obama too cool of a cucumber?
 
M

MIMIC

Banned
When people said that Palin used her proximity to Russia as an example of "foreign policy experience," I thought people were exaggerating on her comment of hers (that I had yet to hear).

And then I heard her say that living next to Russia is an example of her foreign policy experience. @_@ Am I crazy or did she really say that?
 
G

Gary Whitta

Member
sevenchaos said:
Anyone hear about Palen's mock debate?

Was listening to Ed Schultz and he just talked about this. From his website:

:lol :lol
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Oh snap, THIS happened on the West Wing too! Remember after Leo had disastrous debate prep? He leaked it to the media to lower expectations and then he came out and killed.

Not that this will happen in this case though. Palin is clearly beyond clueless. I think the only option for the GOP at this point is to pull every trick in the book to get the VP debate cancelled.
 
W

WrathOfOtaibah

Banned
Gary Whitta said:
Oh snap, THIS happened on the West Wing too! Remember after Leo had disastrous debate prep? He leaked it to the media to lower expectations and then he came out and killed.

Not that this will happen in this case though. Palin is clearly beyond clueless. I think the only option for the GOP at this point is to pull every trick in the book to get the VP debate cancelled.
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I agree. That might be the real reason why McCain tried to delay the first debate.
 
R

ronito

Member
You know what let the whole thing fall. I don't care anymore. If Americans are really this dumb when they've been living off of credit cards and their employers are funding operations through credit, let it happen. I'd like to see them in 6 months.
 
B

bob_arctor

Tough_Smooth
ronito said:
You know what let the whole thing fall. I don't care anymore. If Americans are really this dumb when they've been living off of credit cards and their employers are funding operations through credit, let it happen. I'd like to see them in 6 months.
Click to expand...


"Hey."

"Hey."

"You here for the free cheese?"

"Yeah"

*silence*
 
G

Gary Whitta

Member
ronito said:
You know what let the whole thing fall. I don't care anymore. If Americans are really this dumb when they've been living off of credit cards and their employers are funding operations through credit, let it happen. I'd like to see them in 6 months.
Click to expand...
In six months you'd be too busy looking for a can opener and fighting off angry mobs who want your plastic bag filled with pet food with a piece of broken glass wrapped in an old shirt sleeve.
 
W

WrathOfOtaibah

Banned
ronito said:
You know what let the whole thing fall. I don't care anymore. If Americans are really this dumb when they've been living off of credit cards and their employers are funding operations through credit, let it happen. I'd like to see them in 6 months.
Click to expand...

They think they have it all figured out until they can't pay their shit anymore.

Anyone who has debt better pay it off now while the interest rates are somewhat reasonable, especially if there is an adjustable interest rate.

If you can't, have fun paying 10-30%+ interest rates on everything.
 
K

kevm3

Member
Obama just needs to spam, "The fundamentals of our economy are strong" and "I don't know much about the economy" ads against McCain and wow.... I wonder if they will ask McCain about those quotes at the debate.
 
J

JoshuaJSlone

Member
CharlieDigital said:
Come on dude, you didn't bold the best line:



:lol :lol
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He said something similar on Countdown a few nights ago, but their transcript breaks it; I guess whoever edited it didn't get the reference.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26854009/
Fucked-up transcript said:
The amazing thing to me was the arrogance of Paulson. Because he comes along, he says, OK, we‘re in this terrible crisis, and without consultation, without any discussion, he comes up with this plan that basically is -- all your decisions, they belong to me, right, and no future review, no courts, no agency can establish accountability—without explaining. There‘s nothing from treasury explaining why this thing should work.
Click to expand...
 
E

electricpirate

Member
bob_arctor said:
:lol What McCain have you been watching the past whatever months? Dude has yet to make a case on anything. He can barely make on speaking on his own or to the media. His campaign is essentially in panic mode, his VP is a blithering idiot and people are getting wise to that objective fact and the only cool cucumber in the midst of all this manufactured chaos is the guy who's already seen as stronger on the economy: Obama.
Click to expand...


To put another way, McCain may have torpedoed it, but he doesn't come out looking like he's working for the taxpayer, he looks like he did it for partisan gain. In large part because he torpedoed a nearly complete package, to replace it with what, barely formed half baked ideas that just appeared?

The polls on the bailout are really bad, because they aren't asking "Hey do we need to do something on the crisis" they are asking about a proposal, which is now dead, and replaced by a better one from the democrats. Most american's know we need to do something, almost none supported this money drop, no one is quite sure how many would support the Dem plan since the terms have changed so rapidly.

In the end the polls are worthless till this thing is resolved, without a final plan in place there are NO GOOD PREDICTORS here.
 
S

Steve Youngblood

Member
ronito said:
You know what let the whole thing fall. I don't care anymore. If Americans are really this dumb when they've been living off of credit cards and their employers are funding operations through credit, let it happen. I'd like to see them in 6 months.
Click to expand...
It is truly baffling. I understand not wanting to piss our tax dollars away on helping out poor people, because we're never going to see that money ever again. They're just going to waste some of it on Spam, and the rest on drugs or whatever it is that they do.

But Wall Street? Come on, I know that the Subprime mortgage crisis doesn't reflect overly well on them, but aside from that minor misstep, they're pretty good with money. Thus, we can trust them with some small loans to get them back on their feet. They're not going to blow it on crack and shiny rims like some other beneficiaries of government handouts.
 
K

Krowley

Member
What would happen if congress decided to screw this bill, and instead passed a bill that split 700 billion dollars among the people as a massive stimulus plan. That would be massivley larger than the last stimulus, and presumably that money would help them deal with the upcoming market correction.

I would favor that sort of socialism over the current corporate socialism that's being talked about. Send us giant checks and let the wallstreet fuckers fall.
 
R

ronito

Member
Gary Whitta said:
In six months you'd be too busy looking for a can opener and fighting off angry mobs who want your plastic bag filled with pet food with a piece of broken glass wrapped in an old shirt sleeve.
Click to expand...
Bring it on.
 
S

SpeedingUptoStop

will totally Facebook friend you! *giggle* *LOL*
I don't think people realize mcCain was part of the responsibilty for fucking this deal up. i tried to explain this to my brother and he started shouting at me about how the house republican's leader was at fault for the whole thing and mccain did nothing. wten i said "Oh, mccain did nothing? I thought he was going to fix things." he began losing his shit.


When I began pointing out how Obama was leading in swing states and showing him the Detroit free Press head lne that said Obama had double his lead in the state over the past month, he tore the newspaper in half and said he was gonna fucking kick my ass if I didn't get out of the room:lol I laughed all the way out
 
G

gkryhewy

Member
Krowley said:
What would happen if congress decided to screw this bill, and instead passed a bill that split 700 billion dollars among the people as a massive stimulus plan. That would be massivley larger than the last stimulus, and presumably that money would help them deal with the upcoming market correction.

I would favor that sort of socialism over the current corporate socialism that's being talked about. Send us giant checks and let the wallstreet fuckers fall.
Click to expand...

$2300 per person? Yeah, that'll solve everything.

Synth_floyd said:
Voicing an opinion that opposes the bailout is a troll? Wow.
Click to expand...

When it's completely without substance and repeats itself from the previous one-line post that was ignored? Yeah.
 
C

Cloudy

Banned
All the people railing against this plan don't seem to realize that MANY will lose their jobs if these companies fail. With 7% unemployment already, does the economy need more people who can't pay their bills?
 
S

Suikoguy

I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Krowley said:
What would happen if congress decided to screw this bill, and instead passed a bill that split 700 billion dollars among the people as a massive stimulus plan. That would be massivley larger than the last stimulus, and presumably that money would help them deal with the upcoming market correction.

I would favor that sort of socialism over the current corporate socialism that's being talked about. Send us giant checks and let the wallstreet fuckers fall.
Click to expand...

The "Bailout" is the government purchasing assets that nobody wants to have right now,

Yes, it could be a 700 billion stimulus, but for it to be comparable, it would have to be paid back eventually.
 
G

GenericPseudonym

Banned
Synth_floyd said:
http://www.cnbc.com/id/26895236

Don't know if that's just posturing or legit but it's nice that the GOP is doing something good for once.
Click to expand...

You have to bail Wall Street out, there is no choice in the matter. The only thing that is necessary is that in exchange the federal government gets Canadian style banking regulation, enforces major ethics reform for Wall Street executives and guarantees that this plan can be subject to the courts. But make no mistake, Wall Street has to be saved.
 
A

adg1034

Member
Is any network streaming tonight's debate in HD? I'm a campus organizer for Obama, we're hosting a debate watch party, and I want our people to see something better than an upscaled CATV signal.
 
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
K

Krowley

Member
gkrykewy said:
$2300 per person? Yeah, that'll solve everything.
Click to expand...


Well I can say that in my family, that would be a massive help right now. It would amount to a lot in my household, and presumably that would filter back through the economy and eventually get to the top, therby helping out any mortgage firms that survive.

Suikoguy said:
The "Bailout" is the government purchasing assets that nobody wants to have right now,

Yes, it could be a 700 billion stimulus, but for it to be comparable, it would have to be paid back eventually.
Click to expand...


Yeah, that's true. I keep forgetting that part. At some point in the future, this is supposed to actually make some money.

Still don't like it though. I think I'm willing to take the risk and see what happens. I think the shit is going to hit the fan anyway, and I don't think this is going to make much of a difference, other than tying up the governments money for a long long time and making the crash happen slower.
 
A

AstroLad

Hail to the KING baby
Suikoguy said:
The "Bailout" is the government purchasing assets that nobody wants to have right now,

Yes, it could be a 700 billion stimulus, but for it to be comparable, it would have to be paid back eventually.
Click to expand...

Need to go with the private solution. There are literally billions of dollars of investors just chomping at the bit to get into this credit market and that will accomplish much more than a bailout and also it will protect the American taxpayer.
 
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