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[Funky Papa]

This wouldn't be unprecedented

Remember the Gulf Wardebacle/fiasco with credible, CIA accredited sources, how solid the evidence was?

It should be noted that the CIA said at first that there were no assurances of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. The CIA also warned that Ahmad Chalabi was a fraud and a con-man. But Cheney and Rumsfeld wanted their damn war, so they created their own narrative and pushed for it.

The difference is that whereas the Iraq war was clearly made-up and many people saw through it, Trump's ties to Russia and his many conflicts of interests are more than circumstantial.

With that said, the government should release hard data regarding this boondoggle even if that comes at a cost since we are talking about nothing less than actually protecting America's democracy for once.

 

[rec0ded1]

The way things have gone on lately makes me believe that supporters would make t-shirts and meme the shit out of the leaked video. While the rest of the US rages and wonders "what do?"

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

I mean the headlines and articles all properly use alleged, unverified and similar language. If it turns out fake nothing is lost.

 

[Imp the Dimp]

Whether or not this will have an impact will almost entirely depend on whether evidence surfaces. Trump voters managed to turn a blind eye on the wildest things, they're not gonna falter in front on unverified claims. Multiple reputable publications claiming the original source is reliable makes this document extremely worrisome, regardless of its level of verification.

 

[Grug]

This is all I keep seeing in this thread, insults against people who have differing opinions. For that very reason I am leaving the discussion.

Ok.

 

[ebullientprism]

I genuinely wonder if a terrified Trump was actually trying his best to not get elected with all those dumb shit things he did during the election cycle.

 

[Ollie Pooch]

I genuinely wonder if a terrified Trump was actually trying his best to not get elected with all those dumb shit things he did during the election cycle.

He's an extreme narcissist. Not possible.

 

[kottila]

Tried to get to the bottom of why 4chan is claiming they have proven it's all a hoax, and it all boils down to this post?. No proof what he sent to Rick Wilson, that Rick Wilson read it or that the document uses him as a source.

 

[Fularu]

It should be noted that the CIA said at first that there were no assurances of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. The CIA also warned that Ahmad Chalabi was a fraud and a con-man. But Cheney and Rumsfeld wanted their damn war, so they created their own narrative and pushed for it.

The difference is that whereas the Iraq war was clearly made-up and many people saw through it, Trump's ties to Russia and his many conflicts of interests are more than circumstantial.

With that said, the government should release hard data regarding this boondoggle even if that comes at a cost since we are talking about nothing less than actually protecting America's democracy for once.

I'm talking about the "roaming trucks holding chemical weapons and research centers" with satellite photos as evidence. Or when Powell went in front of the security council and claimed his vial was full of Anthrax. So maybe the GOP discredited the CIA at the time, but someone must have briefed the or told them the evidence was good enough, otherwise lying to the US population and going to war over it should have been enough to put all those people behind bars.

 

[DrBo42]

I highly doubt the golden showers bits are real but I'm very interested to see if any of the connections to Russia and conversations during his campaign and beyond pan out. That's what really matters.

 

[Hjod]

I think it's obvious the report is the classified one, and it didn't come from a 400lb guy on a bed.
If it wasn't made up, if it's true, what will change now that journalists and some people who click on the buzzfeed link can read it. What will change? The FBI has had it for a long time now.
Whatever they are doing or not doing do you think will happen faster? Do you think because reporters can read it it will shake out corroboration?
Just curious
The people who should most know already know and have for some time.

Yeah the FBI have had the document for a while now, the thing that instantly changed when Buzzfeed decided to post the entire document is that more eyes are reading it, there will be more pressure on the intelligence community to find out if it's true or not.

And it's not "some" people reading the story, this news are trending world wide, so there will be a lot of eyes on the story, leading to more pressure on everyone involved in this story.

My question wasn't really how fast something would happen, but if they find corroborating evidence that this is true, what happens then?

 

[Darksol]

So everything is 100% accurate.

Pretty much. Russia is the Michael Pachter of nations.

 

[Vagabundo]

The easiest way to get Putin to dump Trump is to box the GOP congress into taking strong action against Russia. If Russia can't get geopolitical gains out of Trump, they will drop the kompromat just to undermine us. We will survive.

Obama should declassify everything he can before he leaves office. You guys have a right to know everything about the shitheel possible.

I can't see any of the intel guys trusting him with really sensitive stuff. I can imagine they will be very careful what they tell him.

 

[Mahadev]

I mean the headlines and articles all properly use alleged, unverified and similar language. If it turns out fake nothing is lost.

If one of those things is proven to be false (hint: golden showers) no one will take seriously the Trump Russia connection anymore. The media and intelligence services are digging their own graves imo.

 

[Fularu]

Pretty much. Russia is the Michael Pachter of nations.

Russia's rather good at what it does (despicable or not). Unlike Patcher judging by his analyst rankings

 

[MUnited83]

This is all I keep seeing in this thread, insults against people who have differing opinions. For that very reason I am leaving the discussion.

Being misinformed and constantly trying to downplay stuff is not much of an opinion.

 

[Melkezadek]

This is all I keep seeing in this thread, insults against people who have differing opinions. For that very reason I am leaving the discussion.

Please.

Where did pizzagate start again? Oh buzzfeed that's right.

I must have missed when buzzfeed became a reliable news source but of course it is NOW because this HAS to be true right?

#confirmationbias.

This is how you entered the thread.

 

[Imperfected]

As far as I'm concerned, this would be the worst case scenario. Trump would get free reign and MSM would be discredited for decades to come, being replaced by BreitBart and similar identity-driven outlets.

The sad thing is that the arc of this election pretty ably displayed that credibility of journalistic sources doesn't actually matter anyway. I mean, yes, it would give the people who howl about media conspiracies/bias an example to point to... but what is the value of that?

It doesn't particularly embolden them, they were already happily--insufferably--combative on the subject. It doesn't normalize their radical views--they already got that when their idiot man-child presidential candidate started ranting out their moronic views on the national stage (and won).

Look at the Obama birther conspiracy. Did that discredit the media sources that ran with it in a way that had a meaningful impact on Republican demographics? No, it didn't even prevent the standard-bearer for the whole childish "conspiracy" from successfully running for President of the United States of America. As much as it galls us, as much as we might hate to accept it as the way of the world now, this being completely false and vindictively fabricated would not actually matter much at all. Worse, there's a certain line of thinking that says if liberals aren't viciously employing those sorts of tactics, they're shooting themselves in the foot.

This is going to get a whole lot worse before it gets better, I think. I can't imagine many outlets outside of maybe the NYT are particularly worried about "credibility" as an actual currency-in-trade anymore.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

"The Kremlin does not engage in collecting compromising information."

Get the fuck outta here.

 

[Tarkus]

What is 4chan anyway? I keep hearing about it. Is it like the darknet or something?

 

[Pop]

Has the 4Chan angle been discussed here much?

This idiot is one of the (I'm guessing many) people claiming to have fed this to various journalists and politicians: https://twitter.com/trsprudence

Buzzfeed really dropped the ball publishing this now though. You can't put stuff like this in the wild without first doing the journalistic legwork necessary to defend it's credibility. If it turns out to be bogus then watch it undermine any attempt to criticise Trump in the future.

Well, since there is no proof either way. I'll just wait then.

 

[Familienoberhauptvogel]

If one of those things is proven to be false (hint: golden showers) no one will take seriously the Trump Russia connection anymore. The media and intelligence services are digging their own graves imo.

Eh both sides are pretty entrenched, this is just ammunition for online discussions as of now.

That doesn't stop it having implications on the validity of things going forward, at best it's irresponsible (if inaccurate) and at worst, dangerous for the future.

If it is the genuine article unrelated to the veracity of the content it's already very newsworthy.

 

[Fularu]

Get the fuck outta here.

TBH every country is going to say the same thing, no one should be surprised

 

[Laughing Banana]

There are actually people who think that a foreign power has video proof of the person who will become president if the US ordering prostitutes to pee on the bed used by someone he hated so much as 'not a big deal'?

What kind of arse-perverse logical world do you people actually live in? Lol.

 

[wesleyshark]

Team Trump should have their talking points from the Kremlin for a response now.

Already used one: "witch hunt"

 

[SeanR1221]

Well, since there is no proof either way. I'll just wait then.

Why do I have a feeling we won't get direct proof either way and that will just confirm the information for whatever people think :/

 

[Melkezadek]

TBH every country is going to say the same thing, no one should be surprised

Haha it's stated in such a way where it's almost cartoonish.

Nah, we would never doing anything like that,that's not us man, c'mon man"

 

[JaggedSac]

So is the Alt-Right changing their mascot to PeePee?

 

[Audioboxer]

Has the 4Chan angle been discussed here much?

This idiot is one of the (I'm guessing many) people claiming to have fed this to various journalists and politicians: https://twitter.com/trsprudence

Buzzfeed really dropped the ball publishing this now though. You can't put stuff like this in the wild without first doing the journalistic legwork necessary to defend it's credibility. If it turns out to be bogus then watch it undermine any attempt to criticise Trump in the future.

I've mostly been reading as following all of this is just harrowing.

Ultimately either there is going to be a huge embarrassment for the media and intelligence services and criticisers of Trump are going to be shutdown so hard their internet will turn itself off.

Or the mad man gets some comeuppance.

I know most want the second, but the first is far more scarier. Unprecedented times. It'll be one hell of a hard lesson to take in the digital information sharing age. I'm also going to assume Buzzfeed would probably be sued into oblivion.

The memes are hilarious but I think most should take a minute or two to realise how serious this is either way.

 

[SlipperyFishes]

Has the 4Chan angle been discussed here much?

This idiot is one of the (I'm guessing many) people claiming to have fed this to various journalists and politicians: https://twitter.com/trsprudence

Buzzfeed really dropped the ball publishing this now though. You can't put stuff like this in the wild without first doing the journalistic legwork necessary to defend it's credibility. If it turns out to be bogus then watch it undermine any attempt to criticise Trump in the future.

I could say the same that this is all bunk created by me in order to fool duh mainstream mediuhhhhhh.

It's an attempt at deflection. Screenshots can be doctored.

 

[Log4Girlz]

So is the Alt-Right changing their mascot to PeePee?

Feels good man

 

[ForsakenLotus]

I'm still trying to wrap my head around this, but if this is true wouldn't somebody or some organization somewhere have done something? I don't know who or what or when, but my goodness IF this is true Trump can't be our president - and that's after all of the their reasons he shouldn't be our president.

 

[slider]

Hutton, Butler, Chilcott. It'd be fascinating to know all the details around the reporting.

Edit: I mean, apparently much of this is from a now discontinued agent. Was the reporting provided before or after discontinuation? What are the assessments of its veracity based on? Really interesting!

 

[Guy.brush]

I'm talking about the "roaming trucks holding chemical weapons and research centers" with satellite photos as evidence. Or when Powell went in front of the security council and claimed his vial was full of Anthrax. So maybe the GOP discredited the CIA at the time, but someone must have briefed the or told them the evidence was good enough, otherwise lying to the US population and going to war over it should have been enough to put all those people behind bars.

Cheney and Rumsfeld were not satisfied with what the CIA had dug up and they had Wolfowitz create their own Office of Special Plans (OSP) that was basically located at the White House.
Man this stuff is not so far back and people already have forgotten. Scary.

The Office of Special Plans (OSP), which existed from September 2002 to June 2003, was a Pentagon unit created by Paul Wolfowitz and Douglas Feith, and headed by Feith, as charged by then-United States Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, to supply senior George W. Bush administration officials with raw intelligence (unvetted by intelligence analysts, see Stovepiping) pertaining to Iraq.[1] A similar unit, called the Iranian Directorate, was created several years later, in 2006, to deal with intelligence on Iran.[2]

 

[Tarkus]

The memes are hilarious but I think most should take a minute or two to realise how serious this is either way.

The stream is hard to stop once you get going

 

[Zoggy]

I highly doubt the golden showers bits are real but I'm very interested to see if any of the connections to Russia and conversations during his campaign and beyond pan out. That's what really matters.

Yeah but now we have peepee the frog lulz

 

[kitchenmotors]

This is all I keep seeing in this thread, insults against people who have differing opinions. For that very reason I am leaving the discussion.

Ok, bye!

 

[encephalon]

1.The intelligence source is CLAIMED to be former British intelligence, no proof.

2.The intention is to present it as fact or it would not be published in the first place. The intention is to undermine the president elect and by publishing this information without evidence is is liable to be harmful, even more so if it is disproven because like another poster said it will then make all information regarding Trump and Russian seem false going forward.

If this is fake news then it is going to be very dangerous and should teach us all a lesson going forward, if it's accurate well then it's pretty clear Trump needs to be removed.

Okay, we get it, you need the man to sit in your lap and tell you he's a former agent.

 

[Audioboxer]

The stream is hard to stop once you get going

Once you pop you can't stop.

 

[Silent Chief]

I'm talking about the "roaming trucks holding chemical weapons and research centers" with satellite photos as evidence. Or when Powell went in front of the security council and claimed his vial was full of Anthrax. So maybe the GOP discredited the CIA at the time, but someone must have briefed the or told them the evidence was good enough, otherwise lying to the US population and going to war over it should have been enough to put all those people behind bars.

I listened to the guy leading the UN inspectors on the ground saying everything had been destroyed at the end of the first Gulf war, before the US starting preparing the invasion. A lot of countries, including Canada, refused to participate because the evidence was pointing the other way.

They just made sure they had enough plausible deniability to avoid facing any consequences later.

 

[RawNuts]

I'm having the time of my life going through the Breitbart comments section on this story.

 

[MUnited83]

So is the Alt-Right changing their mascot to PeePee?

Back to the origins

 

[Imp the Dimp]

I'm having the time of my life going through the Breitbart comments section on this story.

What are they claiming? The 4chan angle doesn't seem too likely given that most reputable sources acknowledge that the informant is in fact reliable. Getting played by Reddit or 4Chan seems a little 2009-y to me. You'd think people would know by now.

 

[Sgt. Kabukiman]

Well, this was quite a read.
Cold War 2, huh? Putin is an incredible danger to the entire planet. What strange times we live in.

 

[Etrian Oddity]

Just finally read through all the mod updates to the OP. Holy shit, this is some wild stuff.

Whether or not this will have an impact will almost entirely depend on whether evidence surfaces. Trump voters managed to turn a blind eye on the wildest things, they're not gonna falter in front on unverified claims. Multiple reputable publications claiming the original source is reliable makes this document extremely worrisome, regardless of its level of verification.

It's gonna fall to people like John McCain -- who, GOP aside, is a genuine patriot -- to really zero in on this debacle and not let the party hand-wave it just because Trump ran on their platform. Scary thought.

 

[Vagabundo]

I've mostly been reading as following all of this is just harrowing.

Ultimately either there is going to be a huge embarrassment for the media and intelligence services and criticisers of Trump are going to be shutdown so hard their internet will turn itself off.

Or the mad man gets some comeuppance.

I know most want the second, but the first is far more scarier. Unprecedented times. It'll be one hell of a hard lesson to take in the digital information sharing age. I'm also going to assume Buzzfeed would probably be sued into oblivion.

The memes are hilarious but I think most should take a minute or two to realise how serious this is either way.

I doubt either will happen. He's been smeared, rightly or wrongly. And proof will be very hard to come by, we might get some stuff about the meetings etc, but unless Russia get s tired of him or wants to cause a major distraction we wont get the hard evidence they most likely have on him.

Just finally read through all the mod updates to the OP. Holy shit, this is some wild stuff.


It's gonna fall to people like John McCain -- who, GOP aside, is a genuine patriot -- to really zero in on this debacle and not let the party hand-wave it just because Trump ran on their platform. Scary thought.

I think some of the less insane republicans might do something. Here's hoping. At least the Big Don will be distracted by this and probably other dark shit he's done surfacing over the years.

 

[Ozorov]

So what's up with 4Chan is all behind this? Can they be?

 

[RawNuts]

What are they claiming? The 4chan angle doesn't seem too likely given that most reputable sources acknowledge that the informant is in fact reliable. Getting played by Reddit or 4Chan seems a little 2009-y to me. You'd think people would know by now.

They all already claim it as fake news, but yeah, lots of posts about it being a 4chan story.

Then a lot more posts about how Trump should sue and punish the MSM, and how crooked the left is, lol.

 

[jellies_two]

I like the top recommended NY times comment on this, puts its finger on things, coming as it does right under The NY Times reluctance to repeat any allegations.

"Wait, so it was ok for political operatives and the FBI to derail Secretary Clinton's candidacy with bogus allegations regarding a private email server, but allegations that potentially can include treason, prostitution, corruption, and bribery were kept hush until now?

Regardless of the outcomes of this report, this is an epic failure of our media and politicians on how one sided their focus was just on Hillary's emails. Shame."

 

[-Plasma Reus-]

Comey needs to be investigated.