AlphaTwo00
Member
Do you know how many people are still very very happy about the $60/car they are saving? A lot.
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Rob Ford: Still smoking crack. On video. Taking leave of absence.
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gutter_trash
Banned
I'm a center wing Liberal, and I would have voted for Rob Ford if I was in Toronto.
the Lefty-Left should stop raising taxes on everyone
But... Rob Ford raised taxes, and user fees, and transit fares also? Also polls indicate that David Miller would have probably won had he run again?
AlphaTwo00
Member
This is the part that usually gets me. A lot of people see exclusively on the direct impact of taxes on them, and not the overall picture. TTC prices went up? Doesn't matter to non-transit riders! Library closes? Didn't care, don't read. Property Tax went up to pay for services? That's ok, I'm renting and don't directly pay it! Car registration went down! Fantastic!
That's the narrative.
Speak for yourself. I have no issues with paying more taxes if those taxes are being put to good use and improving the stature of this city.
The movement against property tax increases that got Ford in angers me to such a degree I can barely talk about it in public. My disgust and hatred of the suburban me-first mentality and greed amidst the continued growth of the suburbs knows no bounds.
The sprawl in Toronto is unique for a city our size, and it's ripping this city to shreds and holding it back, and suburbanites MUST pay their fair share for this. Not to mention when examining similar cities in the states, Toronto has one of the LOWEST percentage of property tax rates relative to housing values.
But instead this city has to endure money from so many services being cut to facilitate the parasitic suburbs and help them out EVEN MORE with an absurdly priced subway expansion in a sector of the city that DOESN'T need it, connecting it to the only two damn lines we have here that are ALREADY over capacity as it is!
And what are city residents to do when the growing suburb population just says fuck you we got ours? Walk or ride your bike I guess. OH WAIT.
The sprawl in Toronto is unique for a city our size, and it's ripping this city to shreds and holding it back, and suburbanites MUST pay their fair share for this. Not to mention when examining similar cities in the states, Toronto has one of the LOWEST percentage of property tax rates relative to housing values.
But instead this city has to endure money from so many services being cut to facilitate the parasitic suburbs and help them out EVEN MORE with an absurdly priced subway expansion in a sector of the city that DOESN'T need it, connecting it to the only two damn lines we have here that are ALREADY over capacity as it is!
And what are city residents to do when the growing suburb population just says fuck you we got ours? Walk or ride your bike I guess. OH WAIT.
You can stop paying taxes when you go live somewhere with no roads, no schools, no government, no construction, no libraries...
What a dumb reason to vote for someone who runs a city.
Funny thing about those property taxes, IIRC they went down here in Scarborough after amalgamation because property values were lower on average compared to the core. :lol
AlphaTwo00
Member
Woah there, now you're mixing a few things. Growth of suburbs? Toronto City Proper doesn't technically have growth into the suburbs, and any growth you may be attributing to that, those people a) can't vote in the city and b) while technically may be using city infrastructure, isn't the group that matters to what happens within the city. Should the cities around GTA contribute to the costs that it's incurring in the city? Maybe, but that's a discussion either at a provincial level or other means (and really, can you put a toll booth right across the steeles border, charging everyone coming in for the roads?)
You should probably think about which suburb you're blaming this on, cause really, it sounds like you're blaming the problems and causes on one, whereas it's the other group that's affecting your actual decisions.
You also can't brush over the fact that the "parasitic suburbs" that is the GTA are also filled with people commuting in daily, paying for the share of GO, TTC and other services. I can tell you, I wouldn't mind paying into it if it helps, and I think that plenty of people who have to commute and travel to the downtown core is more than willing to do the same.
Oppo
Member
Toronto pays some of the lowest property taxes of anywhere in Canada, and has for awhile. Which taxes are you referring to?
Liberty4all
Banned
I hated the war on cars myself.
For example, when they shrunk Jarvis from 5 lanes (with the reversible lane) to 4 (eliminating that reversible lane), in order to create a bike lanes, this measure drastically increased my commute time.
If memory serves that bike lane was eliminated as soon as Ford got in.
Those are the sort of things that are going to be popular with suburbanites (or even downtown folks like me with cars). Bike lanes are great, but not at the cost of gridlock in the city.
Echoing gutter-trash's sentiments, under Miller the suburbs saw many "improvements" downtown, while the suburbs felt ignored ... while at the same time the suburbs felt like they were paying for all those wonderful improvements in the core.
Not saying whether it's true or not .... but that is a big reason why the suburban backlash lead to Ford getting in. There were MAJOR resentments as to how tax dollars were being used and who they were benefiting.
For example, when they shrunk Jarvis from 5 lanes (with the reversible lane) to 4 (eliminating that reversible lane), in order to create a bike lanes, this measure drastically increased my commute time.
If memory serves that bike lane was eliminated as soon as Ford got in.
Those are the sort of things that are going to be popular with suburbanites (or even downtown folks like me with cars). Bike lanes are great, but not at the cost of gridlock in the city.
Echoing gutter-trash's sentiments, under Miller the suburbs saw many "improvements" downtown, while the suburbs felt ignored ... while at the same time the suburbs felt like they were paying for all those wonderful improvements in the core.
Not saying whether it's true or not .... but that is a big reason why the suburban backlash lead to Ford getting in. There were MAJOR resentments as to how tax dollars were being used and who they were benefiting.
"Galloway was referring to statements by John Mende, the citys acting general manager of transportation services, who clearly told council Tuesday the bike lane installation in 2010 initially increased motorists rush hour commute by eight minutes each way, but staff changed traffic signals and brought that down to two minutes."
Groan.
Don't get me wrong, I'm fully aware of the negative impact that the outside suburbs have, but I'm talking North York, Scarbs, Etobicoke, etc. Trust me, they ARE growing. I'm from Mimico and still live very close to there but technically in the core now.
I mean, is this just a coincedence or a direct result of his platform and the greed and selfishness I referred to before?
Liberty4all
Banned
Galloway and John Mende can say all they want. I drove down Jarvis every day during rush hour and I can assure you it was more than "2 minutes". What a load of crap.
See this is a prime example of why the suburbs voted for Ford.
It's a shame he's imploded in on himself.
The suburbs don't like studies?
Get your facts out of here! Only anecdotal evidence allowed
AlphaTwo00
Member
Interesting. I just did a quick search.. the final value for residential/commercial/industrial in 2013 for Toronto and neighboring cities.
City of Toronto: 2013
http://www1.toronto.ca/wps/portal/contentonly?vgnextoid=6245ff0e43db1410VgnVCM10000071d60f89RCRD&vgnextchannel=63b0ff0e43db1410VgnVCM10000071d60f89RCRD&vgnextfmt=default
Code:
Residential 0.7457653%
Commercial General 3.0355262%
Industrial 3.0550538%Mississauga 2013:
http://www.mississauga.ca/portal/residents/taxrates
Code:
[B]Residential 0.926648%
Commercial 2.154999%
Industrial 2.521798%Richmond Hill 2013:
http://www.richmondhill.ca/subpage.asp?pageid=finance_the_basics_of_taxation
Code:
[B]Residential property class[/B] [B]1.0000 [/B]
Commercial property class 1.1000
Industrial property class 1.3000Vaughan 2013:
https://www.vaughan.ca/services/property_tax_and_assessment/General%20Documents/Final%20Tax%20Rate%20By-law%20060-2013.pdf
Code:
[B]Residential and Farm[/B] [B]1.0000[/B]
Commercial 1.1172
Industrial 1.3124Markham 2013:
http://www.markham.ca/wps/portal/Markham/MunicipalGovernment/TaxBudgetInformation/AssessmentTaxes/TaxRates/!ut/p/a1/04_Sj9CPykssy0xPLMnMz0vMAfGjzOJNLIIcnd38DALdAowsDTxdXTyMPd39jT18TfULsh0VATlIDsU!/
Code:
[B]Residential & Farm[/B][B]0.866362[/B]
Commercial - Occupied 1.825068
Industrial - Occupied 2.118792Pickering 2013:
http://www.pickering.ca/en/cityhall/resources/2013TaxRates.pdf
Code:
RT
[B]Residential[/B] [B]0.01321446[/B]
Commercial 0.02779632
Industrial 0.04097126Wow. Pickering BLOWS! And it pays to live in Toronto, and have your business outside of it.
Ford rhetoric is not going to help your case..
Sorry, but no. This city has always had a gridlock issue during rush hour regardless of bike lanes on Jarvis. This is the price of driving downtown and thus contributing to the gridlock you so hate. Don't blame it on bicycles and cyclists.
I also hate this talking point as Jarvis isn't the only major artery in this city and there are several other routes that people could take to their destination. BUT IT'S TEH WAR ON CARZ.
Traffic signals are a much bigger problem than any bike lane.
When driving along certain major arteries in Scarborough, every single light turns red as you get to it. If they'd synchronize the bloody timing, like they've been proposing for ages (Toronto has 4 distinct signalling systems all mixed together), THAT would make driving easier.
It's amazing how Fordites will, in one breath, demand bike lanes downtown that downtowners use be removed, and in the next breath bitch about LRT being "forced" upon their part of town.
I think I read an article on the Star recently where a city official noted that if you synchronized the lights for one street then that would cause much slower times for every other street that intersects it.
The 'problem' with Toronto compared with a lot of other places is that EVERYONE drives EVERYWHERE now, there's no traditional split where everybody lives in one place and drives in to work in one direction and drives back out the opposite direction at the end of the day. So you can't do a lot of the traffic route optimizations that other places can because they just don't' make sense or apply.
It's a complicated issue, and Ford-like (really a euphemism for child-like) simple solutions just make things worse, not better. Of course they're much easier to sell than the more complicated plans that would actually improve matters.
Zombie James
Banned
Ford said he would cut taxes and save billions of dollars with "no service cuts, guaranteed.". He's been a complete failure.
I haven't watched Rick Mercer since he was on 22 minutes and it's bizarre seeing the 90s IN YO FACE rapid camera tilts in an unironic way today.
I dunno. He's not exactly great for the local reputation or economy.
They would synchronize only one street at a time instead of synchronizing them all? And without a computerized, centralized system that modifies the flow of traffic based on the traffic conditions, like many cities in North America are doing? My thought would be that the only way to fix the lights is to centralize the system, not merely sync the lights in highly trafficked areas and hope for the best.
Apparently 85% of Toronto's streetlights *are* centrally controlled. The point is having green lights all the way through on a main road which is what most people think of and want when they say they want traffic lights synced. Synced for THEM only.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I still think Toronto should have a downtown car tax like London and charge people who want to drive downtown. Then put all that money toward public transport infrastructure. But that will never happen. lol
I agree. I often take the bus down Mt. Pleasant and Jarvis. The biggest factors in delays on Jarvis are (1) right-turning cars being unable to make right turns until an entire green light has expired; (2) cars/trucks stopped in the right lane illegally; and (3) terribly unsynchronized stop lights.
Certain streets off of Jarvis need to have advance right turn signals (with no pedestrians able to cross), and possibly certain other streets need to have right turns banned.
Anyone blocking a lane on Jarvis in rush hour should get absurdly escalating tickets, culminating with license suspensions, since the delivery and paper shredding guys just incorporate the ticket costs into their fees. In return, let them park wherever they want during non-rush hours.
The lights seem to be timed specifically so that you will get every single red light in rush hour, even if traffic is otherwise moving smoothly. Why that has never been addressed is a mystery.
Removing the Jarvis bike lanes was pretty stupid, especially, since the curb lanes are now used for parking most of the time. That's insane. There are some streets where parking should be banned at all times, and Jarvis should be one of them. I would propose banning parking on most of Queen and King too, and allow parking on all the surrounding side streets at all times. Anyone who owns property in or near downtown on a side street should expect to have to deal with cars parked on their street as one of the tradeoffs of living downtown.
My favorite part about Rob Ford's stupid, idiotic platform was in regards to the TTC, and his promise to stop the escalating fare hikes. Which he did.
BUT WHO GIVES A SHIT!
Not one single person in this city will care about 4 extra bucks a year on their metropass if you do something about the:
a) horrific mismanagement of the service
b) non-empathetic contempt that permeates the culture of the TTC and what results in so many TTC workers not giving one iota shit about riders DESPITE THEM WORKING IN A SERVICE CAPACITY, and finally
c) HORRIFIC MISMANAGEMENT that somehow has resulted in a continually ongoing test cycle for the new streetcars (that's ALREADY been ongoing for 11 months) overnight, and they've missed their rollout twice now with Spring 2014 now looking to be the earliest.
If the TTC was privately run, shareholders would be doing flips. For a guy who lied through his teeth about fixing and eliminating 'the gravy train', he has absolutely, positively NOT done anything of the sort.
BUT WHO GIVES A SHIT!
Not one single person in this city will care about 4 extra bucks a year on their metropass if you do something about the:
a) horrific mismanagement of the service
b) non-empathetic contempt that permeates the culture of the TTC and what results in so many TTC workers not giving one iota shit about riders DESPITE THEM WORKING IN A SERVICE CAPACITY, and finally
c) HORRIFIC MISMANAGEMENT that somehow has resulted in a continually ongoing test cycle for the new streetcars (that's ALREADY been ongoing for 11 months) overnight, and they've missed their rollout twice now with Spring 2014 now looking to be the earliest.
If the TTC was privately run, shareholders would be doing flips. For a guy who lied through his teeth about fixing and eliminating 'the gravy train', he has absolutely, positively NOT done anything of the sort.
TTC prices are going up again next year. Eliminating the vehicle registration tax was a mistake though. Toronto has so few mechanisms for getting money that don't involve begging other levels of government, that removing one of the mechanisms they do have is counterproductive.
I agree though that everything the TTC does seems to take 100x longer than it should. Other countries can build entire subway networks before we can even complete all the environmental assessments that are apparently required before we can start anything in this city.
We also spend way too much time and money building "pretty" stations for the LRT and subway. Just build cheap, functional, uniform stations and get on with it. Architecture is nice, but it shouldn't come at the expense of actually building public transit in a reasonable time frame.
This right here. I am right at Bremner and Spadina and there is no stop here anymore. There is a shuttle bus but it's few and far between and is pretty much the main reason I've had to take a cab to work for the last year. I feel like I should be able to bill the TTC.
Are you referring to Museum station? I believe the city/TTC only had to foot 25% of $2mil cost. The rest was either raised or came from the private sector. Also the design of a station has little to do with how long the project takes. A lot of the delays have to do with the areas they are building in. How old the infrastructure is, the digging or tunneling, etc.
You Are Viewtiful
Member
Downtown should synchronize the streets for pedestrians, that's what Copenhagen and Amsterdam are doing. Synchronizing for cars makes walking traveling time take longer and that reduces walkability.
I'm not a fan of punishing one method of transport so people are forced to use the other, but a downtown is free game. If you bring your car there it is really at your own risk.
I'm not a fan of punishing one method of transport so people are forced to use the other, but a downtown is free game. If you bring your car there it is really at your own risk.
Zombie James
Banned
Meet Ford's new personal trainer:
http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/1...id-trafficker-banned-from-coaching-in-canada/
http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/1...id-trafficker-banned-from-coaching-in-canada/
killer rin
Member
Aren't the Environmental Assessments both a Provincial and Federal thing though. Not much the city can do about those... other than to stop cancelling projects which have already been approved and had funding set aside for.
We have no pretty stations
Museum is nice
Can Ford associate with anyone that doesn't have a criminal record?
You Are Viewtiful
Member
Honestly I missed the designs completely when I first went there. It's 'nice' but doesn't really stand out.
Edit: wow at those Pickering taxes. It pays to live near that power plant. Maybe Mississauga and Oakville shouldn't have wasted everyone else's cancelling theirs.
And Miller not caring about the poor? Is Harper an environmentalist?
Wyndstryker
Member
That would mean he actually associates with normal people. He's far too gone for that.
Ehhhhhhhhhh
He's giving these people a second chance, just like the kids who are kicked out of their homes that he lets sleep on his couch!
Did anyone actually believe that story? lol
OpinionatedCyborg
Member
http://m.imgur.com/a/9qDXm
Rob Ford's personal trainer planning on inviting him out to a night if partying with a porn star.
Rob Ford's personal trainer planning on inviting him out to a night if partying with a porn star.
If I were mayor, I'd throw 407-style electronic tolls on all the major arteries into the city so people who DON'T pay for infrastructure but take advantage of it would have to do their fair bit to offset downtown/the boroughs who pay for everyone. I'd also commission a report from Metrolinx on the most cost effective fare-by-destination system for the TTC and electronic ticketing to replace fare collectors. All the unioned employees offset by the removal of the booths would be provided subsidized education to become skilled repair and maintenance workers to keep their jobs.
I would push the provincial government to let me legalize, regulate and tax marijuana and use the subsequent billion dollar surplus I created to subsidize more men's and women's shelters to help people become taxpayers and put money into the development of more commercial real estate rather than residential condo buildings to provide them with more job opportunities.
Stet for mayor 2014.
I would push the provincial government to let me legalize, regulate and tax marijuana and use the subsequent billion dollar surplus I created to subsidize more men's and women's shelters to help people become taxpayers and put money into the development of more commercial real estate rather than residential condo buildings to provide them with more job opportunities.
Stet for mayor 2014.
AlphaTwo00
Member
As much as I'd like the idea of a private, for profit transit system, it just won't work for a City like Toronto.
2012 Ridership stats - Previous years had included "revenue", but it's a really skewed statistic.
The problem with for profit system, in the case of looking at the Toronto network, would be that only 10% of the routes (in older calculation) was profitable. If a for profit were to run the TTC, Wheel-trans and most suburb bus routes would be dropped, leaving only main corridor service. You can also probably say goodbye to 24hr service, or even weekends/holidays.
Personally I don't know how I feel about the unions running it, but the TTC is still limited in it's revenue possibilities: the large swaths of land that they have can and should be used for money generating possibilities.
Impossible, because what's stopping me from entering on side-streets? What about properties that are sitting at the border, that don't pay into Toronto's taxes but exit directly into the city?
You Are Viewtiful
Member
You should run. A voice of reason would be very refreshing
If TTC is privatized, there should be NO public subsidies and it should be done in piecemeal, contracting out profitable routes first. YRT is an example of a terrible way to privatize something. The profits are guaranteed so there is no incentive to put price in control or increase ridership. Completely inefficient.
That can't be real, after all that Ford has gone through you think his new trainer would hold such a public conversation that would get him into trouble? Unless he's trying to get him in trouble...
WrenchNinja
Member
Museum is cheesy
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