SniperHunter
Banned
How do you know any of this? Are your an accountant at Sony? Stop spouting bullshit.
yea you are probably right.
Sony's software brilliance still isn't enough ( gamesindustry.biz )
- Thread starter onQ123
- Start date
How do you know any of this? Are your an accountant at Sony? Stop spouting bullshit.
yea you are probably right.
corporate cheerleader
Member
LBP2 hit the 20 bucks spot really fast. At least in Europe.
as if halo or forza or zelda didn t do the same. sell lots when price goes down.or bundled
Mosts games drop priced quick these dayd. i bought me3 a 2 months after being released for 22 at amazon. and i am sure me3 has sold well
AdventureRacing
Member
The majority of GAF? Have you looked at the game of the year voting threads? I really don't think GAF is as anti sony as some people in this thread are making out.
Also i don't know if infamous 2 bombed but it certainly didn't set the charts on fire. Maybe sold enough to recoup it's budget but for a big budget game i'm sure they would have hoped for more.
Nintendo games are a bad example, they never drop in price pretty much
. Also halo sells a shit ton up front so i doubt it's really the case with that series either. Forza on the other hand that is definitely true of.SniperHunter
Banned
or Steam sales lol...EA was right afterall!
It's worth saying that's an enormous bullsh!t. If you means Uncharted for UC. The series has sold pretty well even at launch.
The thing that cost Sony this generation was price. Microsoft just capitalised on their mistakes by doing things right. But doing things right wouldn't have helped if Sony wasn't so intent on doing things wrong. Gamers should be pleased though, because the combination of Sony messing up, and Microsoft being able to get the focus as the HD hardware has allowed for stronger focus on things like online and so forth. If Sony had been allowed to run the show once more, who knows how crap their PSN would still be.
As it stands, there isn't anything stopping Sony from becoming number one next generation again. If there's anything they should've learnt from this generation, it's that price matters. They've already built enough studios to handle several IP, and thanks to the humbling of these past years, they've likely understood what gamers want. If they keep doing what they're doing right now from a software standpoint with good studio support, and launch their next console at a competitive price, they'll be fine.
Now, the Vita, that's another issue.
As it stands, there isn't anything stopping Sony from becoming number one next generation again. If there's anything they should've learnt from this generation, it's that price matters. They've already built enough studios to handle several IP, and thanks to the humbling of these past years, they've likely understood what gamers want. If they keep doing what they're doing right now from a software standpoint with good studio support, and launch their next console at a competitive price, they'll be fine.
Now, the Vita, that's another issue.
Uno Venova
Banned
That's probably how the mindset spreads, just a bunch of people on the forum saying bullshit with no source.
Yeah, same thing happens in MS threads and Nintendo thread, there some who things the forum is out to get only one company.
UC 1 didn't even chart when it first came out, I think it sold something like 125k, next we hear it's done 2.6m. UC 2 did better at 537k first month now it's sold 5m. The rest of those sales would have come from bundles and price cuts.
yes nintendo games especially mario related sell well have long legs and hardly drop price. zelda instead you can buy the cheap pretty fastNintendo games are a bad example, they never drop in price pretty much
halo is huge seller but lots of sells also come from bundles and such. mosst first party stuff behaves like thatSniperHunter
Banned
You are only talking about NA. What about Europe or Japan? ???
Please stop here. First you talking only of US where sony sell less than the rest of world, second I'm laugh about 125K of uncharted 1 ... thanks to the bundle, my God it's incredible the level of the discussion...
I wish Sony was doing better. time and time again, they show that they have some truly incredible developers at their side. Many of the games they just announced look quite clever and creative The Last of Us looks like another hit. They have supported more 'artsy' games like Journey and Flower. Are they perfect? No. But they really offer up a lot more quality titles than Microsoft does (IMO).
UC1 is known to have done mediocre in sales. And it was bundled quite heavily.
UC2 did 1 million in NPD in around 2/3 months. A huge improvement over the first. It's not a leap to assume it did similar figures in Europe. And the game shipped around 3 million in 3 months. It likely did most of its sales without bundling and heavy discounts. UC3 did even better than UC2.
The series didn't ship 17 million units thanks to Sony bundles and heavy discounts.
If that was the case, I'd expect a few more titles up there alongside it from Sony's side. But outside of Gran Turismo and God of War, there aren't any. We don't get many figures and people seem to be surprised when they do get them. God of War 3 is another good example. A game people thought did "okay", but then were surprised to find it has shipped over 5 million, with the HD collections shipping around 3 million also.
The fact that Sony IP don't tend to do amazing in the first month in the US is what goes against them, but they have good enough sales in the long run worldwide.
Glorified G
Member
Am I the only one that took the time to read the article? It has nothing to do with there first party content is selling well. It's all about Sony's hardware being too expensive for their "brilliant" software, and they're right.
Vita and ps3 is way too expensive right now. It's a joke that the ps3 is still not $199 after almost 6 years on the market. It's great that they're taking risks and making new IP's, but it won't mean anything if they don't finally start dropping the price on the ps3.
Vita and ps3 is way too expensive right now. It's a joke that the ps3 is still not $199 after almost 6 years on the market. It's great that they're taking risks and making new IP's, but it won't mean anything if they don't finally start dropping the price on the ps3.
gundamkyoukai
Member
Sales for the rest of the world don't seem to matter to some people .
UC sells good WW but because it did not sell 2 million in NPD the other sales are bundles and price cuts to some.
GT sales must be low since it does not sell a million in the first month in NPD .....
SolidSnakex
Member
Well, we know that they have a pricedrop coming up because of the new PS3 model. We just don't actually know when that model is coming since it missed gamescom. But rumor has it that the cheapest model will be $180, so it'll put it at or near the mass market pricepoint that they need to get to.
AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
Well in the console war where your horse isn't putting out games, you run back to (NA) sales. If that doesn't work you can bash sales of the Vita. Sad but predictable.
It's called convenience. At least that's the nice way of putting it.
Within the first 3 months of UC 2 being on sale the price had already been cut. I bought it myself at £20 4 months after its release.
Edit, and no I am not saying Europe is irrevelent. Sonys biggest selling exclusives sold most of thier copies in Europe and Japan. MGS 4 and GT 5 specifically.
What an embarrassment. Lol. How do you people provide such blatant lies. We get it man. You have already stated you do not like their IP's. You are just embarrassing yourself by spouting utter bullshit about the sales and hoping that it somehow validates your opinion and will help you sleep at night.
AdventureRacing
Member
It's not true of UC2 but both UC1 and LBP both sold fairly poorly up front and had long legs (both in the US and the EU). Both sold a lot of copies at a reduced price and bundles. It's not even really that bad of a thing as it lead to the sequels selling much better.
I think you're embarrasing yourself for getting so aggressive about it especially if you don't actually know much about how these games sell.
SniperHunter
Banned
Uncharted 2 was released in October 2009 and I bought a brand new copy at full price in March 2010.
Saint Gregory
Member
That's probably a fair assumption to make upon entering any GAF thread.
I really want Sony to do better but I haven't read anything in the entirety of this thread that's going to help their situation aside from lowering their prices (and that applies to their non-gaming products as well).
God help us all and this industry if MS & Sony try to repeat this gen by releasing high-priced, bleeding-edge consoles that are meant to last 7-8 years. And Nintendo had better price the Wii U correctly as well or the games industry is going to be priced right out of mainstream entertainment.
Really, embarassing.
Fun yes. Fast - depends on the level. - precise - depends on how you define it. I know people who have mastered the physics and can absolutely destroy any new comer / mario players in terms of speed and precision. Play LBP like mario and you will not get far in getting 100%. Also 100's of reviewers were not necessarily wrong with their reviews. (Shocking I know). They just happen to have a different opinion about the games brilliance compared to yours.
So enough of how you were the only guy who realized the problem while hundreds of reviewers didn't.
Oh KZ2 is over 90 on meta because its a brilliant game. Again not because the reviewers purposefully ignored any inherent problems as you seem to indicate.
UC1 sell pretty well in UK. It's ranking in top chart for almost an year, I don't think it's that bad. Probably bombed in US, but I'm not that sure.
Nope. It sold sufficient amounts to rake in the moolah. The game need not sell poorly in the beginning to have long legs. It more than made up its investment as mentioned by Evans within the first few months. So yeah same advice - stop embarrassing yourself when you have no idea. And lol at UC1 not selling well initially. It was selling extremely well in Europe since launch. Again easily met its budget of 25 million before bundling. What a joke.
AdventureRacing
Member
I never said it didn't have long legs, i said it didn't sell that well up front and that is also true in the UK. It stayed in the charts for ages in Europe which was no doubt helped by bundles and selling at a low price, like most games that have legs like that.
Where did i say it didn't?
I know that. The difference is you have no idea how the game sold when it first came out and you're just making stuff up. The game opened to pretty mediocre numbers and not just in the US. Feel free to go back and look at the sales threads if you want.
I have no idea how much money the game made and i never even commented on it so i have no idea why you keep bringing this up.
You're embarrasing yourself. You're making this personal because you really like the game. I am simply discussing its sales figures.
It didn't launch to massive numbers and that includes in Europe. I don't see whats so outlandish about that statement and it is in no way meant as an insult to the franchise.
I will call bullshit on this.
Exhibit A: http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/uncharted-2-ps3-platinum-pre-order-677047
That's a really, really hot deal. Very few deals get that hot. It's a pre-order for Platinum UC2 and it was in June, over 2 years ago.
Another deal from the same time is: http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/uncharted-2-playstation-3-19-99-pre-672728
This is for UC2 at £19.99 and it is pre-owned. Again, a deal that went to almost 500 degrees.
I don't believe a word of what you just said because the original UC2 was getting, what were considered, hot deals at the time when it was being retailed for £25 on Amazon.co.uk. That was happening 6 - 7 months after release. Even before the deals I posted above.
It only started dropping to £19.99 and £17.99 for the original version a few weeks before the Platinum version was going to retail. Amazon were the first to drop it to £19.99 and Play.com were the ones to drop it £17.99. So, it basically kept a high price for the duration of its original run in the UK.
TwEE-N-Toast
Banned
"Brilliance Software" is a bit strong. Personally, things like Heavy rain and Uncharted really turn me off. I've never felt the urge to play any of Sony's first party games and even my friends who grew up with Sony and buy their consoles out of loyalty pass on Sony's first party games.
Colonel Nasty
Member
A whole lot of butthurt in this thread. I know some people don't want to hear it but Sony would switch places with any other gaming company if the had the chance. Im sure the others wouldn't feel the same way. Their fall from grace isn't as bad as some are making it out to be but it is compared to their last two systems.
AdventureRacing
Member
To be fair you can find deals like this even for massive selling games like COD. UC2 no doubt went on sale and in bundles not really moreso than any normal game.
I think you're right about UC1 and LBP but not UC2.
The point with the deals was to demonstrate how hot they were in relation to price.
People are saying UC2 dropped half in 3 months. That poster said he picked it up for £20.00 3 months after release as if that was a normal retailing price for it. I'm calling nonsense on this.
The above deals show why. They're from 6 - 7 months after the initial launch and they were getting really hot because it was the first time it dropped beneath the £25.00 mark. Even for a pre-owned version of UC2 to get really hot at £19.99 is ridiculous. It's pre-owned, not even new. And that was happening 7 months after release.
Amazon had the hottest deal on UC2 for some time at £25. This was around April/May 2010. They were the first ones to drop the normal price to around £20 after that, and others followed suit. This happened in around June 2010.
UC2 had occasional offers, but it wasn't heavily discounted. It's regular price hovered around and above £25 for most of the original run. The drop didn't happen until the Platinum version was about to release. Then Amazon dropped it, Play dropped it and others like Zavvi and The Hut followed after. Supermarkets like Asda, and shops like Game/Gamestation were more expensive than the online shops even at that time.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
I wonder if they will repeat the high price point again next gen. I regretted dropping 500$/400$ on the PS3/360 and I probably won't pick up the next-gen consoles till they are around 250-300$.
AdventureRacing
Member
No it wasn't bullshit actually, in the early year sales games like UC 2 do strugle to keep thier full price.
Sure, it did. I collect games and keep a regular eye on good prices. I remember those above prices clearly, hence I was able to find them so quickly. Like I said, I don't believe you at all. A deal for £20.00 on a brand new copy of UC2 only 3 months after release did not happen in the UK. A pre-owned copy wouldn't get so hot 7 months after release if the game itself was selling so cheap for a new copy 4 months earlier. And if you did manage to pick one up at that price, it wouldn't be indicative of usual pricing as those deals demonstrate. Battlefield 3 was retailing for around £20.00 last December too. It wasn't a common price though.
Infamous 2's problem is that it released around the time Sony was hacked, and people weren't buying Sony games as a result. It really sucks, because it's the best game on the PS3.
DidntKnowJack
Member
I don't think it's as bad either. But in the long run it's probably best there isn't one console maker that's number 1 every generation anyway. It's a good thing there was competition to keep them honest and not resting on their PS2 laurels. Which is exactly what they were doing when they brought out the PS3. Microsoft made PS3 better, indirectly.
SolidSnakex
Member
$400 will be the ceiling for any console next-gen. I expect Sony and MS to have multiple models. So they'll likely have a $300 and $400 model.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
Where have I stated anything about Sony's first party titles? I've played over 80% of Nintendo's frist party offerings on the Wii. And calling Last Story mediocre is just laughable. At least if you talk generally, as the title has a metacritic of 80/100, which is actually considered "great".
Laggy and unresponsive controls in a FPS game = design decision? also Alan Wake's sub-HD resolution was a design decision to enhance the atmosphere of the game. Am I doing it right?
BTW I don't know if you ever played Gears but it's controls are perfectly smooth, I guess you confuse slower movement with imprecise controls.
Last story was OK (not awesome, but fun, at least) but I don't know why we are talking about Wii games lol.
Same thing can be said about Gears (except that Gears is awesome).
More on subject : do you think that PS All Star can grab some of the SmashBros sales? How much SmashBros is selling? 50% of that amount will be good?
Same thing can be said about Gears (except that Gears is awesome).
More on subject : do you think that PS All Star can grab some of the SmashBros sales? How much SmashBros is selling? 50% of that amount will be good?
It boils down to this. As good as some of Sony software is ... its not resonating with the average Joe gamer. Those guys are buying Gears, Call of Duty, Halo .. not Uncharted, Infamous or Killzone. Granted, those 3 sell well, they don't sell as well as the MS portfolio and ... lets be honest .. outside of MGS4, I don't think Sony has released 1 single game this entire generation that has really granted them a sales boost to the point where the game could really, really honestly be called a 'system seller'.
Thinking back Sonys first month on a 3 month run where they outsold MS in NA was when MGS4 released. Every other major Sony franchise debut did nothing of the sort, and likely sold mostly to the already established Sony base who already owned a PS3. Everyone thought GT5 would do it, but that didn't happen.. at least in translated sales according to NPD.
I may be wrong, but at a high level I think the guy I quoted is spot on. Gamers, gamers just don't care enough about Sonys software regardless of how amazing it may or may not be. Nintendo sold well because its Nintendo and because of the Wii fad that was infectious. The 360 steamed ahead because of its Live infrastructure, and community built around that which brought attention to the platform and made it stand out. People bought 360s to play online with their friends and that meant playing gams like Call of Duty or Halo. Sony and PSN being free isn't enough (clearly) to swoon the consumer away from Live.. clearly consumers see Live has the superior service.. in both sales and subscription rates. A few bothered enthusiasts on GAF doesn't change that..
I think Sonys biggest problem this generation was their lack of buzz. Sure they have PSN.. but its no Live. Its no XBLA .. and it lacks a standard experience across all games that Live offers... with less features. PSN has come a long way, but even with the marketable FREE moniker attached to the service .. it doesn't matter. THe proof is in the pudding, and the numbers just don't add up for Sony. Software wise Sony has a great portfolio.. but apparently that isn't enough.
Looking forward to next gen, Sony needs to re-evaluate itself and figure out what it needs to do to stand out against the competition. Great games isn't enough anymore, its not the 90s. Services, infrastructure etc.. play key roles now and will in the future. Sony isn't going to be able to directly compete with MS against Live.. they have to know that. MS is unifying Live across all platforms, Phone, Console, PC, Tablet next gen, and Sony has no way to compete head to head with something like that. MS is going to sell a unified Live as a major deal and they know nobody else can do that. So what Sony needs to do is come up with ... something. Something that sets them apart from Nintendo, and something that sets them apart from Microsoft.
If they can't manage to do that, they're in deep shit. Great games are not enough.
I dont see why that isnt a reasonable conclusion.
With some other forms of media like movies or music, you could make the argument that some products are made for purposes other than entertaintment; Jared Diamonds book Guns, Germs, and Steel, for example, makes little attempt to entertain, but rather to inform.
There really arent any games yet which have successfully transcended the label of "entertainment," and when discussing entertainment I feel sales are a fairly accurate measurement of quality. The exceptions would be games from very small publishers and indies which cannot reasonably afford to advertise their product the way EA/Activision/Nintendo/Microsoft/Ubisoft/etc. can, but Sony actually spends more on gaming than anyone but EA, so that really isnt relevant for them, I feel.
SolidSnakex
Member
There's just so much wrong what you just said. For starters Uncharted is as big as Gears. No, it isn't as big as Gears in the US (which some people in this thread are focusing WAY too much on), but it balances out once you take the rest of the world into account. It's like people just completely ignore Sony's pull in Europe. And GT5 is the best selling exclusive on the console. So, that in combination with Prologue definitely helped boost hardware sales.
gundamkyoukai
Member
You would be wrong , once again Sony has games that sell just as much as MS expect for Halo cause GT was down this gen .
UC or GOW sell near as much as Gears just not in NA , hardware and software sales are not only NA .
People when they talk about Sony seem to only focus on the NA market and the major problem there was not software but price and live.