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StarCraft 2 Beta |OT| (Beta Now Reopen, GL HF)
- Thread starter Scrow
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Ice Monkey
Member
Zerg might as well be called as "Roach race."
Here's a rundown how people play as zerg right now:
1. Build lots of roaches.
2. Is the game still going? Build hydras/mutas + roaches.
I haven't met a good player who does something different.
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Thors are the most useless Terran unit ever. According to my friend who works at Blizzard, basically the Thor inclusion in SC2 went like this:
Someone in the art department decides to draw a giant robot.
Samwise Didier goes over to Chris Metzen and says, "Put this shit in the game. It's so giant and badass."
That's according to him, so take it as you will.
It's so slow and barely has the firing capability of what goliaths used to be. If you build thors, you are basically dead unless you're messing around. You might as well save that money and build battlecruisers instead.
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I feel a lot of games on SC2 seem to stay at tier 1 hence why we see this marine marauder build + medivac or roach rush. This tier is so good enough to stay in that it doesn't really make people upgrade to a higher tier.
Perhaps blizzard needs to make these maps bigger?
Here's a rundown how people play as zerg right now:
1. Build lots of roaches.
2. Is the game still going? Build hydras/mutas + roaches.
I haven't met a good player who does something different.
=======================
Thors are the most useless Terran unit ever. According to my friend who works at Blizzard, basically the Thor inclusion in SC2 went like this:
Someone in the art department decides to draw a giant robot.
Samwise Didier goes over to Chris Metzen and says, "Put this shit in the game. It's so giant and badass."
That's according to him, so take it as you will.
It's so slow and barely has the firing capability of what goliaths used to be. If you build thors, you are basically dead unless you're messing around. You might as well save that money and build battlecruisers instead.
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I feel a lot of games on SC2 seem to stay at tier 1 hence why we see this marine marauder build + medivac or roach rush. This tier is so good enough to stay in that it doesn't really make people upgrade to a higher tier.
Perhaps blizzard needs to make these maps bigger?
That article makes me fear for Starcraft 2 quite a lot, using broad results to implement game balance is never the answer for a tactical game like this and it's not something they have done much in the past.
Much better to balance the game around the top skilled players results and let the strategies and tactics trickle down to the masses, just look at Warcraft 3 where Night Elf dominated the low/mid tier players for the longest time until more inventive strategies for the other races started appearing - All without a significant balance patch.
Much better to balance the game around the top skilled players results and let the strategies and tactics trickle down to the masses, just look at Warcraft 3 where Night Elf dominated the low/mid tier players for the longest time until more inventive strategies for the other races started appearing - All without a significant balance patch.
thedrizzle34
Member
nilbog21 said:"Dustin Browder: I think we want to maintain about 10,000. Its sort of our goal, and weve just about hit that at this point. I can see were at 9,000-something right now, and 10,000 is the goal."
pretty much...*sigh*
I think the assumptions that everyone knows what there is available is silly right now.
Give things time and work on them until you learn how to beat them, scout them, and incoorperate them into your strategy and game plans.
If any of that is not possible (and is the concensus of many players losing or winning, or say PvZ is like a 7-3 win rate then drastic action can be called on.
At least from the interview it seemed like that was the case.
I mean the harshest buff we have seen was the 2 gate proxy nerf (for gateway build time) and mothership. Should they have extended the building time by that much? Is it a fault of the maps? The players?
If things continue and people get locked into builds
See: SC II Beta podcast http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=114862
Thors are great at killing interceptors, deal 45x2 damage to ground, can be mass repaired, and 3 can snipe and building in 5 seconds. Have 3 medivacs lying around? Why not drop 3 Thors at a Nexus and kill it in in 5 seconds then pull out?
In addition their skill stuns so you can make ultras or collosi (unless it does not work vs massive) irrelevant for 1 Thor.
Just some of my thoughts. Too late to be thinking about this kind of stuff.
Give things time and work on them until you learn how to beat them, scout them, and incoorperate them into your strategy and game plans.
If any of that is not possible (and is the concensus of many players losing or winning, or say PvZ is like a 7-3 win rate then drastic action can be called on.
At least from the interview it seemed like that was the case.
I mean the harshest buff we have seen was the 2 gate proxy nerf (for gateway build time) and mothership. Should they have extended the building time by that much? Is it a fault of the maps? The players?
If things continue and people get locked into builds
See: SC II Beta podcast http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=114862
Thors are great at killing interceptors, deal 45x2 damage to ground, can be mass repaired, and 3 can snipe and building in 5 seconds. Have 3 medivacs lying around? Why not drop 3 Thors at a Nexus and kill it in in 5 seconds then pull out?
In addition their skill stuns so you can make ultras or collosi (unless it does not work vs massive) irrelevant for 1 Thor.
Just some of my thoughts. Too late to be thinking about this kind of stuff.
claviertekky said:
Keep in mind the beta's only been out for 2 weeks. The meta game is already evolving. There is a trend now moving away from roaches toward zergling+baneling early game into hydra+banelings mid game into uldras+hydra end game.
Here's an absolutely fantastic four part ZvP released by SCLegacy yesterday:
Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
Part 4
It's such an exciting game with so much carnage and back-and-forth between the hydra baneling army vs the zealot HT army in the mid game. And there's not a single roach to be seen.
infinityBCRT
Member
if they are going to add another 1,000 concurrent users, thats probably going to end up being 10,000 more users total.nilbog21 said:"Dustin Browder: I think we want to maintain about 10,000. Its sort of our goal, and weve just about hit that at this point. I can see were at 9,000-something right now, and 10,000 is the goal."
Lord Phol
Member
Korea powers kicked in and I won my first two 1v1 PvT matches 
.
Then I met a zerg player and my dreams were crushed as I watched an army of roaches eat me alive. Any strategies against early zerg rushes? tried to zealot rush him first but his army was bigger.
After seeing that video further up I'm guessing Immortals?
Can you get them up fast enought to counter roaches?
.Then I met a zerg player and my dreams were crushed as I watched an army of roaches eat me alive
. Any strategies against early zerg rushes? tried to zealot rush him first but his army was bigger.After seeing that video further up I'm guessing Immortals?
Can you get them up fast enought to counter roaches?
Ah, gotta learn to locate my buildings better :x. Always seem to forget about sentries, they do cost quite alot of vespene gas though.Freki said:
Lord Phol said:Korea powers kicked in and I won my first two 1v1 PvT matches
Then I met a zerg player and my dreams were crushed as I watched an army of roaches eat me alive
simcity your ramp + sentries for splitting the army
Zapperkhan
Member
Yep.Minsc said:
The Lamonster
Member
Fantastic interview, thanks! Just the info I was hungry for.Gribbix said:
So are there alot of people using ghosts online? the EMP ability with no research required and only 75 energy seems to be huge gain for terran. And if statistically terrans are losing more I think it might be players opting to go with brute force.. which doesnt work so much at least against protoss.
Freakinchair
Member
One thing about these high play replays that bothers me is that alot of the time, especially in this one, the zerg could have won if he had attacked and been more aggressive. Alot of the time the protoss player had very little units to work with and the zerg player still had his whole army intact after a large fight, just kind of sitting there and waiting for the protoss to come back. Almost every replay has one player at a huge advantage in the game, only to lose in the late game because he wasnt aggressive early on.
Fragamemnon
Member
KnightM7 said:
I get a ghost out at about 25-28 food or so in every PvT. I use it to slaughter the Immortal push most Protoss players do and then expand+ get medivacs/vikings while they cower in their base.
If they don't kill anything and don't run away I just go ahead and bowl them right over, of course. EMP is basically to PvT in SC2 to what Psi Storm is to PvZ in BW: an ability you can't win the game without as Terran, and something that Protoss has be aware of and deal with.
Elixtar said:
The noble Crota! He's currently the best shoutcaster for StarCraft 2 hands down (Day 9 and HDStarCraft are excellent as well). He uploads like 5-6 games a day whereas most folks are doing 1-2.
http://www.youtube.com/user/BlizShouter
TurtleSnatcher
Member
I'm in Middle Coastaznpxdd said:Let's do it!!
I need to play with a partner that can take care of himself while I try out new strats.
Are you on West coast or East coast?
aka Central Time.
The Lamonster
Member
Mississippi River CoastTurtleSnatcher said:
TurtleSnatcher
Member
But i live no where near the MississippiThe Lamonster said:Mississippi River Coast
CharlieDigital
Banned
claviertekky said:
Saw a very nice replay where the Zerg was bunker rushed early and the Terran player's second wave had 4-6 Thors. He owned the Terran with an army of Infestors and Broodlords...amazing replay.
The Lamonster
Member
What's a good Terran build order for MMM?
Ice Monkey
Member
TurtleSnatcher said:
how close do you need to be to jokingly call it mississippi river coast? I live 4 hours from the beach but i still refer to myself as living on the east coast
The Lamonster
Member
haha exactly. It was just a joke, good sir.Ice Monkey said:how close do you need to be to jokingly call it mississippi river coast? I live 4 hours from the beach but i still refer to myself as living on the east coast
However, I live in St. Louis so I really could accurately say Mississippi River coast :lol
TurtleSnatcher
Member
Vikings and Thors.. Terran is a bit weak in that dept (Not as bad as toss though).. But you should also use a ghost and EMP that stuff and maybe ravens with seekers.54-46! said:
CharlieDigital said:
Care to share?
Fragamemnon
Member
54-46! said:
I've had success fighting off small carriers with viking spam, but in reality you really need to push the Protoss and kill some expansions to cut off his income once you comsat the fleet beacon and stargates.
edit: Thors are absolutely terrible for AA unless you are just trying to fend off one or two units. Vikings are your goliaths, build them or go with a big marine ball.
Ice Monkey
Member
54-46! said:
as was kinda already said, once it gets to the point where you're fighting 150-200 food of carriers you'd better have that many food of vikings or battlecruisers or else you're toast. Again just to emphasize, your secret weapon at that point is emp in order to win that matchup.
really if you go the whole game not realizing till the end that he has been massing carriers then the guy pulled it off successfully, you could have done the same with battelcruisers if you'd have known.
gets me everytime too!
Ice Monkey
Member
anyone have any idea how mathematically good the point defense drones are? like how many separate attacks can be taken down per second with one drone.
Pretty sure as many shots as it has energy (20).Ice Monkey said:
I've seen two fire off 40 times in maybe 1.5 seconds in the face of a stalker army.
Completely nullifies attacks, keep in mind it can also be used as a deterrent since it lasts so long (180 seconds). The range is rather large also (Maybe like 8 or 9?)
CharlieDigital
Banned
claviertekky said:
Not in the beta...haven't played any console/PC games in a loooong time but looking forward to SC2. Brings back fond memories of my dorm days.
TurtleSnatcher said:
KHB (Z) vs TeamEG (T) on Steppes of War (Infestors + Broodlord)
Replay highlights what I guess would be a fairly non-standard Zerg army and tight unit control. Great battles.
Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qs6Ljkyd7io
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oqh55Dwqo4Q
Part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SgsJr_J6q8