John Dunbar
correct about everything
if raonic goes perfect cell he might actually start winning something.
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The 2016 Australian Open |OT| 18th January - 31st January
- Thread starter LuuKyK
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PedroPanache
Member
If gets to the final, nerves and Djokovic will probably destroy him. In 3 sets, no less. Still, he's played a great first set against Murray. Now c'mon Muzza! turn this into a match.
BigJonsson
Member
One set down... I dunno if I can stay up
Sax Russel
Banned
I hope Murray starts to put up a bit more of a fight otherwise I can't see myself staying up til this is over @_@
John Dunbar
correct about everything
If gets to the final, nerves and Djokovic will probably destroy him. In 3 sets, no less. Still, he's played a great first set against Murray. Now c'mon Muzza! turn this into a match.
raonic is definitely losing the final, should he get there. but you can't blame him. at least he will get grand slam final experience and only true legends of the game win their first slam final.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I respect how well Raonic is playing, but dear god is it dull to watch.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
This has to be the worst passing shot exhibition I've ever seen from Murray so far.
I don't think that's giving Raonic due credit. He's so hard to read at the net. I've been testing myself by trying to guess which way he'll move to cut off at the net, and I'm not doing well despite the benefit of perspective.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
rise, sir andrew. fulfill your destiny.
Kotetsu534
Member
I don't think that's giving Raonic due credit. He's so hard to read at the net. I've been testing myself by trying to guess which way he'll move to cut off at the net, and I'm not doing well despite the benefit of perspective.
I agree. Some of Murray's FH passers have been high quality but easily picked off by Raonic. Standard of serve-volleying from him was Sampras-esque in the first set.
I expect big things from Raonic on grass this year, whatever happens in the rest of this match.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I agree. Some of Murray's FH passers have been high quality but easily picked off by Raonic. Standard of serve-volleying from him was Sampras-esque in the first set.
I expect big things from Raonic on grass this year, whatever happens in the rest of this match.
I have to agree. I didn't quite buy the transformation just on the basis of the Wawrinka match, but this Raonic is a totally different player. I think Murray is the slight favourite but I would not at all be surprised by a loss, and either way I expect Raonic to make some big upsets this year.
EDIT: I'd go so far as to say that Raonic has played better in this semi than Federer did in his, and would be entirely deserving of the final if he beat Murray in every respect. Murray has been playing really well this match; he's serving much better than he normally does and he's had absolutely excellent court coverage. If Murray was playing his normal level, he'd be two sets down right now.
I don't buy that it's because of Raonic's improved volleying. He's improved no doubt but Murray has been outright missing or hitting high-ish passes easily within Raonic's reach. Murray is arguably the best in the world at passing shots and it's not like Raonic is Sampras now.
Raonic hasn't even played that well, you guys are really overrating his performance. He's served extremely well and hit some nice volleys, but his return game has been non-existent for the last set and a half. Not to mention he basically crumbled immediately when he was really under the pressure.
Raonic hasn't even played that well, you guys are really overrating his performance. He's served extremely well and hit some nice volleys, but his return game has been non-existent for the last set and a half. Not to mention he basically crumbled immediately when he was really under the pressure.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I don't buy that it's because of Raonic's improved volleying. He's improved no doubt but Murray has been outright missing or hitting high-ish passes easily within Raonic's reach. Murray is arguably the best in the world at passing shots and it's not like Raonic is Sampras now.
I'm not saying Raonic is Sampras now, but I just disagree re: Murray's passing shots. They're fine; good, even. The ones that are missing are doing so because Raonic is forcing Murray to play the margins and you can't make those kinds of shots consistently. I'm a Murray fan and I dislike how Raonic plays so I'd love to be able to say "only close because Murray is playing shit, lololol Raonic"; but that's simply not the case. Raonic's volleying has been really, really good. He's looking like a top 3 player.
His return game has not been great, but it's not been bad - you're overlooking the fact that Murray actually has a rather powerful serve which is let down because it's normally not too accurate. That hasn't been the case in this match - Murray's been at over 70% the whole match (he's normally in the low 60s) and has added an extra 11 MPH to his second serve over AO2015 anyway. That's making Raonic's return game look worse than it is. Raonic also hasn't been crumbling. Just look at how many break points he saved, it was inevitable one was going to go through sooner or later.
TheAutomator
Banned
Raonic is the Del Potro successor we deserve.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Raonic is the Del Potro successor we deserve.
...aside from the fact they don't play anything like each other?
John Dunbar
correct about everything
...aside from the fact they don't play anything like each other?
but they are both tall.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
In fact, Murray was 81% first serves in for that second set without taking any power off. Of course Raonic is going to struggle against that, those are crazy figures for a guy with a heavy serve like Murray. He's basically doing the Murray equivalent of botting.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
but they are both tall.
also I think Del Potro wore a sleeve once, maybe.
I'm not saying Raonic is Sampras now, but I just disagree re: Murray's passing shots. They're fine; good, even. The ones that are missing are doing so because Raonic is forcing Murray to play the margins and you can't make those kinds of shots consistently. I'm a Murray fan and I dislike how Raonic plays so I'd love to be able to say "only close because Murray is playing shit, lololol Raonic"; but that's simply not the case. Raonic's volleying has been really, really good. He's looking like a top 3 player.
His return game has not been great, but it's not been bad - you're overlooking the fact that Murray actually has a rather powerful serve which is let down because it's normally not too accurate. That hasn't been the case in this match - Murray's been at over 70% the whole match (he's normally in the low 60s) and has added an extra 11 MPH to his second serve over AO2015 anyway. That's making Raonic's return game look worse than it is. Raonic also hasn't been crumbling. Just look at how many break points he saved, it was inevitable one was going to go through sooner or later.
That's the norm for Raonic, holding serve and making zero inroads on return against top tier opponents. By the second set Murray started getting used to his body serve spam and as a result Raonic was pushed in every service game. The main reason he held on to 4-5 was because Murray kept bottling relatively straight forward passes on on his big opportunities. Hitting a double fault and then missing a routine volley at 4-5 is basically failing when it really matters, especially for a someone with Raonic's playing style.
Looks like a par for the course performance so far if you ask me.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
That's the norm for Raonic, holding serve and making zero inroads on return against top tier opponents. By the second set Murray started getting used to his body serve spam and as a result Raonic was pushed in every service game. The main reason he held on to 4-5 was because Murray kept bottling relatively straight forward passes on on his big opportunities. Hitting a double fault and then missing a routine volley at 4-5 is basically failing when it really matters, especially for a someone with Raonic's playing style.
Looks like a par for the course performance so far if you ask me.
Honestly, we're just going to have to agree to disagree. Personally, I think if you're trying to sell me Raonic not playing well when he has a positive winner/UE ratio and has saved 83% of break points against a player whose playstyles is almost a natural counter to his own, you're nuts.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
raonic played well at the start, but since sometime in the second set he's pretty much been base form raonic. nothing for murray to worry about for the time being.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I agree his form is trending downwards. I still think he's playing well.
Honestly, we're just going to have to agree to disagree. Personally, I think if you're trying to sell me Raonic not playing well when he has a positive winner/UE ratio and has saved 83% of break points against a player whose playstyles is almost a natural counter to his own, you're nuts.
He has a positive ratio by 1 or 2 and that's after the inflation from his aces. I don't understand how the break point stat means he's playing well, the fact he's faced 6 just means he is struggling on his service games while serving at over 70%.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
That was one of the most delicious dropshots I have ever seen.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
It was Tommy Haas-esque.
Fossil wishes.
Fossil wishes.
Watch this till the end mate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqKkg0_34nc
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I was a Hewitt boy, you'll never convince me. Old habits die hard.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
whoever wins is probably going to win in five.
the australian open will forever be the worst slam when the other semi-finalist has an extra day to recover.
the australian open will forever be the worst slam when the other semi-finalist has an extra day to recover.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
murray trying to push the error and then nets it himself, smh.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
"raonic is not playing well"
ok
ok
Murray got the bullet body serve back and then played passive the entire point and ended it with a terrible error.
Now that's an extremely well played tiebreak from Raonic under pressure.
Yeah he's been playing normal up until the breaker and then stepped it up. That doesn't suddenly mean he was playing fantastically before.
Now that's an extremely well played tiebreak from Raonic under pressure.
"raonic is not playing well"
ok
Yeah he's been playing normal up until the breaker and then stepped it up. That doesn't suddenly mean he was playing fantastically before.
Like I said....Murray isn't making the final.
Murray's only hope is to expose Raonic's movement (with drop shots or frequently pulling Raonic wide to the forehand and backhand). He isn't likely to get a lot of drop shot opportunities, and Murray's game doesn't revolve around pulling opponents wide, side to side. He is more about extending rallies. And you can only extend a rally if no one attacks a neutral ball....which Raonic does at every opportunity.
But even if Milos wins today, he'll be too nervous in the final. I can already see him tightening up on FH shots that he hit with confidence against Monfils and Wawrinka. Like that BP he had at 5-5 against Murray. After the ball clipped the tape, he hit the FH to make it neutral, instead of killing it. I got the sense that he could feel the opportunity to be up 2-1 in sets, closer to his GS final.....and he was overwhelmed by it. He's not going to get as many opportunities against Djokovic, and Djokovic will do everything against Raonic that Murray cannot/will not.
Murray's only hope is to expose Raonic's movement (with drop shots or frequently pulling Raonic wide to the forehand and backhand). He isn't likely to get a lot of drop shot opportunities, and Murray's game doesn't revolve around pulling opponents wide, side to side. He is more about extending rallies. And you can only extend a rally if no one attacks a neutral ball....which Raonic does at every opportunity.
But even if Milos wins today, he'll be too nervous in the final. I can already see him tightening up on FH shots that he hit with confidence against Monfils and Wawrinka. Like that BP he had at 5-5 against Murray. After the ball clipped the tape, he hit the FH to make it neutral, instead of killing it. I got the sense that he could feel the opportunity to be up 2-1 in sets, closer to his GS final.....and he was overwhelmed by it. He's not going to get as many opportunities against Djokovic, and Djokovic will do everything against Raonic that Murray cannot/will not.
I don't know if Raonic plays extraordinarily well, but so far he's playing better than Murray in a slam semi-final, and really has a chance to beat him. That's something he was never in a position of doing before. He seems to have more purpose in his game than before, there's a reasoning behind his shots. He won the third without serving that well, against Andy it's something.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
"raonic is not playing well"
ok
good breaker from him, but neither player has shown anything special for a good while. boring match, really.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
good breaker from him, but neither player has shown anything special for a good while. boring match, really.
I don't think that's because they're not playing well, it's because Raonic's playstyle is entirely revolving around ending points immediately. There were 2 (yes, 2) points of more than 9 shots in the whole 3rd set; that's why it is dull tennis.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I personally don't think it's dull, it's quick tennis. When there's winners it's fun to watch.
I don't know, I feel it lacks suspense.
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Anyone known when the final will be tomorrow?
9:30 CET, I think.
Anyone known when the final will be tomorrow?
The women's final is at 7:30 pm local (3:30 am ET)
Men's is 24 hours later
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Hewitt's commentating is adding to the dullness. For someone who was so smart on court he's a pretty boring commentator. States the obvious most of the time and takes ages to make his point.
Tomic should just retire and do all the commentating from now on.
Tomic should just retire and do all the commentating from now on.
Murray should just commentate an entire match purely from his exasperated grunts.
9:30 CET, I think.
The women's final is at 7:30 pm local (3:30 am ET)
Men's is 24 hours later
Thank you!
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Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
Murray should just commentate an entire match purely from his exasperated grunts.
They're not grunts, that's just what Gaelic sounds like.
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