First season COULD have been fine, if they'd focused on the main cast. Instead I got to see Nina Trinity and Dark Haro while the PAINFULLY obvious Ribbons Hallmark reveal got lead up to.
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The Official Gundam Thread of Gunpla, Origins, and 35 Years of GUNDAMUUUU!
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First season COULD have been fine, if they'd focused on the main cast. Instead I got to see Nina Trinity and Dark Haro while the PAINFULLY obvious Ribbons Hallmark reveal got lead up to.
EvilKatarn
Member
I just noticed there's no Haro in Turn-A. At least not 35 episodes in.
The Kapools are the Haros, right? Is Dianna's hair Haro? The fish from Grave of the Fireflies? That fish has seen some shit.
The Kapools are the Haros, right? Is Dianna's hair Haro? The fish from Grave of the Fireflies? That fish has seen some shit.
I thought 00 was really great, up until just after the Thrones show up. All downhill from there.
Still need to watch this
Still need to watch this
There's no Haro in Wing and G, which is a little sad, but not really. My introduction to Haro was in SEED, where he seemed bound and determined to say something ridiculous during a tense or emotional moment.
Like, this didn't happen but it might as well have: Kira and Athrun
"kill"
Haro was one of 3 good characters in AGE, along with Wooolf and Dique's daughter.
Haro is also one of the best characters in 00 (as long as its Lockon's Haro) and simultaneously one of the things I hate most (Saji and more specifically Nina's.)
Honestly, did anybody LIKE Nina Trinity? I hated her from the first word she said. As in, she had a super badass intro and ruins it with some incredibly stupid statement or another.
Holy crap. Me too...what are the chances!
Ours were obtained by a friend of mine's older bro - picked them up at a comic con in Dallas.
Lostconfused
Member
Amuro stopped a giant rock from falling on earth with kind thoughts.
Agreed on OO.
Disagreed on Strike Freedom. Newtype powers + Nu (let alone High Nu which Strike Freedom is a shitty rip off of) is more then equal to Kira's Cord+SF.
Same goes for V2 Assualt Buster pretty much shitting all over everything aside from OO Raiser/Q, Turn A and MAYBE Wing Gundam Zero. Not to mention the crazy stuff like Unicorn/Banshee and Sinanju which again is easily more then a match for any AU lead villian suit aside from Turn X and maybe Reborns.
My first experince with Haro was SEED as well. I remember thinking it was so strange because I had only really watched Wing and G at that point.
Only later did I understand how odd it was for Wing and G to completely leave out a Haro.
BattleMonkey
Member
There really is no such thing, it's all pure plot armor and deus ex material
Newtypes have heightened brainwaves, or "psycowaves", which basically amounts to a form of precognition and telepathy. These are enchanced by a psycommu sensors in mobile suits. The more psycommus that are built into a mobile suit, the more amplified the pilot's psycowaves are; at a certain point, if the psycowaves are strong enough, they can manipulate minovsky particles in the area to create a psycofield and other similar asspull power-up moves.
This is what I figured it always boiled down to.
Each series usually has their own little powerup addition (Seed mode, X-Rounder, Zero system, etc), but Newtypes always seem to go that extra mile.
distantmantra
Member
SEED was the first non-UC title to have a Haro in it. They made a pretty big deal about it prior to SEED airing.
But that's acceptable seeing as how Amuro was a Newtype and the entire UC is based around this phenomenon. Setsuna is just a Gundam otaku.
Yeah, the Nu/Hi-Nu is broken but that's pretty much in the penultimate chapter of Amuro's story and several years of technological advancement had taken place.
We also have to take into account that not only was Kira a SEED but a Newtype as well. Fucking dumb.
And yeah Unicorn/Banshee/Sinanju are the most AU mobile suits in the UC universe.
distantmantra
Member
Huh? The concept of Newtype doesn't exist in Cosmic Era. SEED is their version of it.
The only non-UC show that's ever used the concept of Newtypes was X.
Hell, they show this as a flashback in Unicorn #6.
Megalosaro
Banned
I wish they would have reanimated that scene instead of just recycling footage from CCA.
Setsuna gets stabbed in the chest and suddenly can teleport. This power is not explained or touched upon. He just does it.
donkey show
Member
Eh?
It's sort of implied that Kira, Mu, and Rau are Newtypes.
lol, talk about double standards. Innovators and GN particle magic in 00 is no better or worse than Newtypes in UC, it's the exact same thing.
ambientmystic
Member
It sorta does. Mu La Flaga and Rau Le Creuset both demonstrated those NT-Like abilities (incredible spatial awareness typical only to Newtypes) on the show, Mu on several occasions when controlling the gunbarrels of his Moebius Zero craft and Rau when piloting his Providence Gundam with the funnels.
Kira demonstrated both (SEED and NT) when piloting the Strike Freedom in Destiny (with the signature lightning effect on the forehead) and taking down the entire fleet of ships and mobile suits with his newly minted suit for the first time, again using the funnels of his suit plus other assorted weaponry.
A character on the show can have one or both the abilities or neither. As the Ultimate Coordinator, Kira has both of them. His natural born sister has the SEED factor, which seems to be independant of the nature of your birth in the show, i.e. one does not have to be from PLANT and subsequently genetically augmented to have it.
To recap,
NT:- Kira, Mu and Rau (lightning on the forehead effect). Seems to be only present in those individuals.
SEED:- Nearly all of the main protagonists on the show have the factor. (seed exploding in the mind, eyes glazed out effect) (Kira, Lacus, Arthrun, Kagari, Shinn, etc.). Can occur in any individual regardless of genetic manipulation.
EDIT:- Tookay's also on the money.
distantmantra
Member
I think we're just interpreting things differently. I've always viewed SEED as the Cosmic Era version of Newtype, not something separate. Just like X-Rounder in AGE.
edit: Huh. Fukuda actually retconned Newtypes into the show, even though the term is never mentioned. LOL.
BattleMonkey
Member
The engineered soldiers like Nu La Flaga and others were considered newtypes in the CE universe. Licensed products like the Gundam War card game also referred to the characters as newtypes as well,. They were not natural evolutions like they were in the UC era though. SEED was a separate concept.
Kira is the Ultimate Coordinator and a Newtype. It's like SSJ4 + Mystic in terms of DBZ bullshit.
Sinanju isn't now that I think about it, just absurdly fast. Actually maybe Banshee isn't even. Unicorn is the only one that displays doing anything absurd.
Sinanju isn't now that I think about it, just absurdly fast. Actually maybe Banshee isn't even. Unicorn is the only one that displays doing anything absurd.
Lostconfused
Member
At least he is never listed as such in SRW games and it's the only metric that matters really.
Psycho-frame resonance is pretty up there in terms of mystical bullshit.
donkey show
Member
ambientmystic
Member
He's still no Tobia Arronax.
dude is blind in Crossbone Ghost and still handles business
So much potential in a U.C. Gundam F91/Crossbone anime T.V. series. It's sad that you could only ever see it animated in video games and drawn manga.
It's mystical shit sure but in terms of what it has done so far is pretty tame by comparison.
Somebody hold me back.
distantmantra
Member
It's gonna be ok.
Maybe it's just that I haven't SEEN enough UC yet, but no way in hell are Innovators and GN Particle Magic in 00 equivalent to Newtypes from what I've seen.
GN Particles let you fucking warp reality around your goddamn suit so that a sword goes right through you and then you fucking teleport and go into magic rainbow Trans American Mode. Innovators, in addition to being ridiculously named cyborgs with psychic powers, are allegedly part of some master plan by a dead man to prepare humanity for a fucking alien invasion. MAYBE. Newtypes are human beings with psychic powers. It's not part of some crazy ass scheme.
GN Particles sound like they're supposed to be Minovsky Particles, really, except Minovsky Particles don't come in three flavors, one of which, much like Red Krypton and Red Lantern, is EEEEEEEVIL. MAYBE.
Similar concepts, perhaps, but one is executed in the utmost ridiculous way conceivable. Besides, the Innovators aren't meant to be 00's Newtypes. The Super Soldiers are, as evidenced by the fact that they've got QUANTUMBRAINWAVESQUANTUMBRAINWAVES and I'm pretty sure Alleluia even does the whole NewType Flash.
SEED and NewType are different in SEED. Kira, Mu, Rau and Ray are all NewTypes. Because Kira is also Jesus Christ, he is also the Ultimate Coordinator, Pilot of the Nuclear Powered God-Moding Freedom/Strike Freedom Gundam, and a SEED bearer, on top of being a NewType. EDIT: That said, you might as well compare SEED to NewType, since it's the equivalent power up, and that Kira, Mu, Rau, and Ray are NewTypes is never really touched upon by the plot.
IN SPITE OF THIS, Kira still isn't as BS as Flit, who has a machine that invents whatever he needs, when he needs it, including the power to turn a battleship into something entirely different when said ship was not constructed to do that. Flit's an X-Rounder, a Genocidal Pedophile Terrorist who overthrows the ENTIRE WORLD GOVERNMENT and points GODDAMN SUPER NUKES at the Martian Successors.
And then they build a statue to him with a permanent dick for all to come and suck. Gundam AGE is the only Gundam series where the villain wins. For kids!
He's still no Tobia Arronax.
dude is blind in Crossbone Ghost and still handles business
Why we don't got a Crossbone anime? Damn it.
ambientmystic
Member
Damn it Corvo, now I'm seriously tempted to finish up that god forsaken series to its bitter end.
Calling Flit a paedophile is a bit extreme though. I'm not that far into the series yet but he never really displayed those psychopathic, paedophiliac tendencies as a child lol.
Innovators = Newtypes, Innovades = Cyber-Newtypes. The former are the next evolution for human beings that are part of some grand scheme for humanity, the latter are manmade fakes grown in a lab. Same thing.
Also, Newtype magic allowed Amuro to push back a whole asteroid and allowed Kamille to channel the souls of dead people to literally hack the final boss suit. The heroes only win and the conflicts are only resolved because of Newtype plot devices. I don't think that ever really happens in the 00 series (though it does in the movie).
distantmantra
Member
I didn't think AGE was that bad. I mean, it's clearly not as good as other Gundam shows, but I was able to watch it and not want to gouge my eyes out.
You can't say Flit has Pedo tendencies when he's still a kid. His creepy obsession with a little girl doesn't become apparent until he's a 60-70 year old man. He's definitely a psycopath and it's definitely obvious as early as the end of Arc 1. Looking back though, his inability to distinguish between what the Euba and the Zalam were doing and what he was doing, and the fact that the show never points it out, makes it pretty clear that dear little Flit is a total monster.
I have no idea what an Innovade is. When are those introduced and how do they differ from Innovators? I've watched almost the entire series and have no idea what they are. The Innovators never solve problems in 00 because they're the ones making them, but you can bet some goddamn GN particle Trans Am nonsense is the ONLY reason anything gets solved for Pretentious Being.
Never, EVER has Setsuna solved a problem himself. Nor, for that matter, has Tieria. Both just pull bullshit out of their asses and watch as it works. For Tieria this means some new trick his Gundam can do, and it isn't that bad. For Setsuna it's some new power made up on the spot. Alleluia I don't even know. Lockon 1 solved at least one of his problems with his own skill, though.
Setsuna killed his Gauron because A CHILDREN'S SONG PLAYED OVER THE PSYCHIC RADIO.
I wanted to gouge Hino's eyes out before my own.
EvilKatarn
Member
And I just found out today there are actually people who seemingly loathe 00 as much as I do SEED Destiny. Unbelievable.
00 is what got me into Gundam in the first place. Maybe a rewatch will make me hate it, but I don't think so.
An Innovade is what Tieria, Ribbons, Revive, et. al are, however they do not know this and assume that they are Innovators. However Tieria explains this after he merges with Veda, the quantum-computer in the Celestial Being.
Setsuna becomes an Innovator naturally, and spurs human evolution after the conflict with the aliens in the movie.
Yes, it's dumb. No, it isn't explained clearly. Yes, I liked 00.
The first half of 00 is actually decent, its the second half that just throws everything out the window and decide to just fuck around.
I'm so glad I watched AGE, because that sounds like the most absurd bs ever. How Aeolia Schenberg foresaw all of this I don't know. It's like Asimov's Foundation, where it starts out "Okay I can see how Hari Seldon predicted this." and then suddenly they're fusing with an entire galaxy at the behest of an ancient robot detective.
Like I said, it's not explained very clearly. I suppose the Mangas might go into better detail, exposition wise, but it's a lot for the viewer to swallow.
idk though, I liked 00, thought it's 2nd season was weak, (Neil > Lyle), but it's entertaining in the battles.
That being said, I prefer the combat style of UC/Unicorn to AD/00. Mobile Suits feel like...military equipment as opposed to 00's style of GN PARTICLES EVERYWHERE.
ambientmystic
Member
That goes without saying. The UC based 08th MS Team and 0080 War In The Pocket OVAs encapsulates those feelings perfectly; it has the least amount of NEWTYPE POWAH! in that timeline. The use of real world military tactics and strategies are emphasized over fanciful mystical powers and asspull deus ex machina scenarios. Normal folk over powered individuals.
Until 08th MS team goes off the rails and suddenly what is technically just a GM with a Gundam head jumps on a giant blimp with a Zaku head taped on and lasers everywhere and I don't know what even happened there.
Still, I think you can have a healthy balance of it. Gundam Wing managed to maintain a fairly straightforward power the whole way through. Oh, sure, Wing Zero got crazy, but then, the mooks had also gone up some levels, and there was Epyon to balance that out. But stuff like the Sandrock and the Heavy Arms just had to plow through and do as well as they did.
That someone larger than life like Treize went out in so simple a way was one of the best parts of the show. I mean it's TREIZE KHUSHRENADA, KING OF EARTH, and he dies faster than some of the mobile dolls.
Lostconfused
Member
Gundam Wing shouldn't be good example of anything other than extremely heavy handed use of plot armor. Every mobile suit in the show had an impenetrable protective barrier whenever it was piloted by a named character and it couldn't be destroyed short of getting shot with pure plot.
Most people who like 00 are probably only talking about the first season. The rest doesn't exist!
Personally, I loved the first season, some of the best gundam has to offer, while the second is some of the worst.
I actually thought 00 was the most realistic when it came to military tactics (well in season 1 anyways), all of the tactics the various nations used to try and capture the gundams made sense. AD has faaaaaaaar worse offenders.
Lavalamp1138
Member
Even though I've seen a ton of criticism for Gundam AGE, I feel like I have to watch it. So my question is: is it worse than Seed Destiny?
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