VFX_Veteran
Banned
What standard? 1080p/60fps has already been done.
Ubisoft issues totally convincing response to Assassin's Creed Unity's resolution
- Thread starter shinobi602
- Start date
What standard? 1080p/60fps has already been done.
Lol.
bigboss370
Member
just hold on a sec there lol. they said they couldn't go back to 30fps for TLoU, after having played the remaster. Thats not an indication of any hard rules they've set for future games.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
I'm sure everyone wants to see ND do the impossible but at the end of the day -- Uncharted will be limited by the hardware. You can't have your cake and eat it too (as the saying goes). No matter how "to the metal" you code -- you aren't going to just squeeze out all these taxing next-gen features and still get 1080p/60fps. You might as well say that every other studio has shit programmers except ND. And that's just wrong..
-M
They have already openly said that 1080/60 is the target for Uncharted 4 and the E3 trailer was running at 60fps.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
The target with what new graphics features? That's the big question. The E3 trailer looked as good as TLOU's cutscenes.. that's no surprise.
bigboss370
Member
i know thats their goal. but I don't think its seen as a requirement for them. i don't believe they're gonna push for 60fps if it means too many sacrifices in other areas. first and foremost they're trying to create the best uncharted game to date, meaning more spectacle than ever.
lol wat. it looked way beyond tlou cutscenes.
They did a presentation last year on adaptive tesselation on PS4 and said it was one of the big focuses for a PS4 engine. Other than that, we'll just have to wait and see.
Omnipunctual Godot
Member
This is quite the understatement.
sono
Gold Member
I blame the French.
Alternatively, I am in this camp and I still wont be buying it..
Alternatively, I am in this camp and I still wont be buying it..
I honestly hope all gamers, not just PC/PS4, send Ubisoft a message by not buying this game. While this situation favors your system for the moment, if a precedent is set, it would only be a matter of time before the shoe is on the other foot. I'm seriously not buying this game now. Seems like they have already been compensated.
So? Uncharted 4 can still set a new standard by being the best looking AAA console game at that resolution and framerate.
*parity
Yep unfortunately the footage they showed last week from the X1 version looks like a visible downgrade compared to the E3 footage which I guess was just a scripted PC demo. Flat lighting and textures,poor image quality, dumb crowds, shitty collisions and low frame rate.
Hopefully it was an old build :/
I can't be the only one thinking the opposite of this, can I?
Is this really how we want to be looked at as an audience? One that gets pissy at the drop of a hat? After taking a step back, I don't know if I even care if there is parity. How much will this matter when we're playing the game (those that get it)? Does this parity ruin a potentially good/great game? I would hope that many other more important factors come into play before we start talking about trivial resolution bumps.
And what if they did do it to avoid debates? Hell calling it debates is probably a nice thing to say to us at this point. Look at us, seriously WTF are our priorities anymore? I just want Unity to be a good damn game... I feel... Sad and kinda alone.
That's one of the most frustrating non-answers I've ever read.
They know very well what the actual controversy has been about, and they did nothing to address it.
That statement is just blatantly fucking insulting to every intelligent person following this issue. How could they possibly think this would calm things down?
They know very well what the actual controversy has been about, and they did nothing to address it.
That statement is just blatantly fucking insulting to every intelligent person following this issue. How could they possibly think this would calm things down?
Call me naive or whatever, but I really don't get why developers and the like won't just stick to being transparent about what's going on with their game. In this day and age its wayy too easy to leak info and the gaming community is far too resourceful and connected for them to try to hide things away in cryptic interviews or programming...enough for some crackers/hackers to uncover it (the Watch_Dogs graphics fiasco)
They give us all this lip service and runarounds, PR talk but I really feel like they do this in order to make sure they get at LEAST get that first week of sales outta the way, cause for example, if they know word of mouth/reviews get out about their game then surely after the first week sales will start to slump off, which I what I believe happened to Destiny. Its almost like these guys are just like "just tell them whatever, make sure its isn't enough to kill hype, and after we get those first sales numbers in, then fuck everything else. If its still bad enough afterwards, we'll issue some silly apology or explanation but really do nothing else moving forward. We already should have made the bulk of our money around release anyway."
I think just being honest, or even just a simpler dialogue with interviewers would make things much more bearable. Ubisoft should have been like "yes, 1080p/60fps is nice and we would love to shoot for it, but we can't make any promises on delivering either cause of what we're trying to do with the engine supporting all these NPCs and such. The new things we're trying to do may be a little difficult to present on top of having a high resolution and a constantly smooth 60fps, so we'll have to wait and see as we continue to develop the game. Also we have to take into consideration each system's unique architecture to best optimize the experience for the player without watering one console down to compete with the other. Fingers crossed. We'll keep you all posted."
Simple. Some folks here on GAF might not have liked it, but hell that's a straight up answer that, at the end of the day, if you are cool with it or not, at least it can be respected since they shot straight from the hip instead of this PR smokescreening we are all so accustomed to getting.
They give us all this lip service and runarounds, PR talk but I really feel like they do this in order to make sure they get at LEAST get that first week of sales outta the way, cause for example, if they know word of mouth/reviews get out about their game then surely after the first week sales will start to slump off, which I what I believe happened to Destiny. Its almost like these guys are just like "just tell them whatever, make sure its isn't enough to kill hype, and after we get those first sales numbers in, then fuck everything else. If its still bad enough afterwards, we'll issue some silly apology or explanation but really do nothing else moving forward. We already should have made the bulk of our money around release anyway."
I think just being honest, or even just a simpler dialogue with interviewers would make things much more bearable. Ubisoft should have been like "yes, 1080p/60fps is nice and we would love to shoot for it, but we can't make any promises on delivering either cause of what we're trying to do with the engine supporting all these NPCs and such. The new things we're trying to do may be a little difficult to present on top of having a high resolution and a constantly smooth 60fps, so we'll have to wait and see as we continue to develop the game. Also we have to take into consideration each system's unique architecture to best optimize the experience for the player without watering one console down to compete with the other. Fingers crossed. We'll keep you all posted."
Simple. Some folks here on GAF might not have liked it, but hell that's a straight up answer that, at the end of the day, if you are cool with it or not, at least it can be respected since they shot straight from the hip instead of this PR smokescreening we are all so accustomed to getting.
Sweet twerkin twi'leks you cannot accidentally intentionally justify a statement. The "to avoid debates" part is crucial. It's not goddamn possible. They think their audience is fucking stupid and treats them like shit, absolute shit. To expect anyone to believe this shit is one of the more egregious examples of pure consumer contempt I have seen in a while. No bad fortune for this company could possibly be undeserved.
MastaKilla
Member
He was pretty clear that they're gimping one version to avoid comparison and debate.. I don't see how we're supposed to read this and pretend he didn't mean it. Still not buying out of principle.
I just remembered how GTAV in first person mode is going to make it that much easier to forget about ACU.
Listen, most of the current outrage is not even about the seemingly forced parity.
It's about Ubisoft treating us all like we are complete morons, giving non-answer after non-answer, continuously and blatantly misrepresenting and misinterpreting the source of the debate, and dodging the real question at every step of the way in their frankly pathetic damage control campaign.
Like someone said before, I would respect them more if they just went out and said that "Yes, we have forced parity, for reasons A, B and C".
But, what they are doing is backtracking from the original (very clear statement) and misdirecting, without at any point explaining what that first faux pas actually implied.
To quote yourself, is this really how we want to be looked at as an audience? They are treating us like we are idiots.
KOMANI
KOMANI
I'm upset because I bought what i think is the better console, and ubisoft is cheapening that buy for me.
It's like if CDs were made to sound like cassettes just to hurt CD player sales.
Mr Moose
Gold Member
In some weird Nostradumbass way, I kinda noticed it wasn't as clean as Black Flag a while ago, even though it was probably PC then.
:<
:<
I'm right there with you, I bought the PS4 to get the better versions that I thought would exist on the more powerful platform. I guess I've come to the realization that it was never promised to me that it would always be that way.
Again in the end if this game is good/great does this parity topic even register in the bigger picture?
In the end I bought the PS4 not just for the power, but more importantly to play awesome games.
tokyostomp
Banned
I'm convinced!
Windom Earle
Member
What kind of obtuse question is that?
killatopak
Member
This issue kinda reminds me of Don Mattrick with the buy a 360 quote.
Started off with a wrong blurt and ended up damaging the company greatly.
Started off with a wrong blurt and ended up damaging the company greatly.
You seem to be genuinely concerned so let me try to answer some of your questions.
Firstly, this game won't be running at parity; this game will be running at forced parity. That means they've intentionally held a version of the game back, instead of just lucking into it.
Maybe if one console wasn't so significantly weaker than the other, we'd understand why both need to be stuck at 900p. However, since one console routinely performs ~30-40% better, then yes, what this practice of forced parity does is, in fact, ruin a very doable 1080p version of a game. 1080p would make it an even better game.
Should you settle for less when you buy a new console to advance the state of the art? Our priority is not to be robbed of this very basic principle. That's the crux of it.
So you see, we aren't just picking any little issue to have a 150 page thread about, "at the drop of a hat." Sorry that you feel lonely, maybe that's for the best.
I want this in all ps4 games.
I don't know if I care whether or not it is parity based on luck (which I'll honestly call out as something not likely to ever happen as development isn't that random) versus forced parity. All my comments are using the word parity as what you would call forced parity, and I never even considered the other type of hypothetical party.
I don't know if I can join ranks with gamers who think a game is ruined by not running at a slightly better resolution. Ruined as in the game is not worth playing at all, not because of the story, it's many systems, the fun etc., but because of its resolution. I'm not even sure how to translate my blank stare into words at this moment.
If advancement of state of the art in gaming is so heavily dependent on resolution, than I will proudly stand alone and hope for the best.
If we were never satisfied, we'd have mega threads like this on every 30fps/sub1080p game out there.
If they're struggling so much, maybe they should look at how other companies deal with it, by saying something that makes sense or not say anything at all.
Memorabilia
Member
I understand where you're coming from and agree to a point. However, the issue for me (and I suspect many others) is how Ubi handled this by straight up admitting publicly they artificially limited the PS4 version and then doubled, tripled down on an outright lie to cover that admission up.
The fact that one version is running at less resolution than its capable of running in order to maintain forced parity is troubling...but far more troubling is what this fiasco means for the future.
It feels like Ubi crossed a line here and I'm not sure they can go back after so blatantly lying and disregarding the relationship they have with the gaming community. We expect shenanigans from MS...but this has taken things on a disturbing new path.
Aces&Eights
Member
I already preordered it. I usually just reserve a game but I hear so many people whining about how preorders are destroying the planet I intentionally pay off a game ahead of time now. Should the PS4 get a better version? Who knows. Did Ubisoft meet MS in an alley and take a bag full of money? Who knows. Do I give a shit? No.
I love AC games and I sure as shit am not going to not allow myself to enjoy the very first nextgen only version of one because Ubisoft "might" be intentionally taking some P's away. If you find there is no one else for coop since everyone is in boycott mode look me up. I'll run some missions with you.
Memorabilia
Member
A sad by-product of collective willful ignorance combined with nearly zero actual journalism which attempts to bring the truth to consumers. In the United States, the 4th estate is largely owned by the same people who want to tell you bullshit and sell you rainbows. The US has one of the worst freedom of the press ratings in the developed world. It shouldn't come as any surprise that Americans are ignorant as fuck bc of this when it comes to things that actually matter, so why should we expect it to be any different with relatively meaningless shit like video-games?
Aces&Eights
Member
Ridiculous. You are saying American press is more deceitful than North Korea's state run news network? Or Iran's? The majority of people are not mindless sheep who believe everything they see on TV. Sure, the world has those kinds in it but everyone I know does their own due diligence when looking into a subject.
As for this topic, for christ's sake, they came out and were HONEST in the press release about forced parity. It was the backlash that has turned it into a PR campaign. All these gamers slicing their wrists in protest and the inhumane treatment they feel they are receiving for not having more P's than the Xbox. Even in the event Ubisoft decided to intentionally make both versions the same even if they could bump up the PS4 version is their call to make. Sure, you don't have to buy it as that is your call to make. But, they came out and were honest as I have ever seen a company be with their product and it turned into a witch hunt. Of course they are going to release statements like this now.
Bottom line. There is no world ending conspiracy here. Ubisoft is not going to take over the planet because we don't stop their evil war machine from forced parity on a video game. Life will go on, we will all be OK, I promise. If it really bothers you then don't buy their games but to suggest this is a boycott of the ages and all those who don't agree are weak minded fools who are just being a slave to the man is total hyperbole.
If you don't care about forced parity, and you only care about the game being playable, then there's good news for you, the game will be playable regardless of resolution, as you well know.
I stated that the forced parity ruins a 1080p version of the game; that's because it has been downgraded to a lesser resolution to match the hardware limitations of a competing console. If you're feeling sad and alienated because gamers aren't satisfied with what a developer has admitted to being a compromised product, then by all means, please do find solace in your enjoyment of the game based on its other merits nonetheless.
To you, the distinction between the why and why not of a game not running at a better resolution doesn't matter, while it matters dearly to us. We care about forced parity. Yes, to me, that makes the game not worth playing, because it is an affront to me and the ranks that I'd like to join. We don't have money to throw around, and we certainly don't reward anti-consumer practices in order to subsidize a developer's optimizations for one platform over another.
Sorry that you might still have a blank stare on your face. I don't know how you thought that resolution isn't a factor in the advancement of the art.
Good point, and if this level of public outcry doesn't make them change course it's most likely that they have obligations to fulfill, because their reputation is taking quite a hit right now and we know it's not the hardware holding them back.
Why is it that shady business in this industry always seems to have Microsoft lurking around the corner with a vested interest? I thought they had given up on trying to fuck gamers over after their DRMpire fell flat but apparently not (allegedly).
Aces&Eights
Member
That's pretty condescending. He has a blank stare because, why? He can't grasp how recondite this matter is to "the advancement of the arts?" They are not making the game in 8bit, you know. It's a slight drop in resolution. As you feel that is unacceptable then fine, you have the right. But to talk to someone like they are a simpleton because they do not agree is prickish. Ubisoft has every goddamn right to do whatever they want. It's their game. I am pretty sure art galleries and artists around the world are not going to give up on creating new mediums for us because of this choice they are making. The game is still shaping up to be the biggest step in nextgen gaming. thousands of NPCs, 1 to 1 scaling, new climbing mechanics and tons of animations but this isn't advancement? Jesus Christ.