Professor Beef
Banned
pretty sure galactus beats Firebrand free
might need to theorycraft that though
might need to theorycraft that though
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Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 |OT4| Nothing Stops This Patch!
- Thread starter enzo_gt
- Start date
WesternHeretic
Member
Question to Dahbomb.
Do you think the Flocker vs Justin Wong match in winners cost Chris G in Grand finals?
I am asking this because Justin's storm was not able to open up Flocker once all set with tri dash low, so he went to overhead like 4-6 times in a row near the end.
In the Justin vs Chris G's set Justin got very critical hits at important times on Chris with tri dash low. You think Chris watch that Justin/Flocker set and just assumed Justin was going to go overhead from there on out or was Chris G's reactions/decisions just bad due to the nerves.
This cross my head during the match, but I never posted about it.
Do you think the Flocker vs Justin Wong match in winners cost Chris G in Grand finals?
I am asking this because Justin's storm was not able to open up Flocker once all set with tri dash low, so he went to overhead like 4-6 times in a row near the end.
In the Justin vs Chris G's set Justin got very critical hits at important times on Chris with tri dash low. You think Chris watch that Justin/Flocker set and just assumed Justin was going to go overhead from there on out or was Chris G's reactions/decisions just bad due to the nerves.
This cross my head during the match, but I never posted about it.
The Flocker match had little to no weight on the ChrisG/Justin match. Justin went low a few times and ChrisG blocked them too. Plus you would think the FChamp match was something that ChrisG was paying more attention too.
The Storm mix up is still a mix up and people always have the overhead in the back of their mind.
The Storm mix up is still a mix up and people always have the overhead in the back of their mind.
WesternHeretic
Member
The Flocker match had little to no weight on the ChrisG/Justin match. Justin went low a few times and ChrisG blocked them too. Plus you would think the FChamp match was something that ChrisG was paying more attention too.
The Storm mix up is still a mix up and people always have the overhead in the back of their mind.
True about the Champ match being more recent, but I've watch the Marvel GF 3 times now, and it seems to me that Chris was way more worried about the high than the low which is really really really really fucking strange.
It's not strange at all, ChrisG is always hyper aware of these types of things which is both a strength and a weakness.
You see how many times he X factored to save Morrigan? Quite a few times she was probably not going to be punished but ChrisG was accounted for that 5% chance that the other player might go for it. It's hyper situational awareness.
ChrisG thought that Justin was mix it up after he blocked low once. Respect was given. Also sometimes after Akuma Tatsu he could be holding up back and got clipped which happens a lot against Justin.
You see how many times he X factored to save Morrigan? Quite a few times she was probably not going to be punished but ChrisG was accounted for that 5% chance that the other player might go for it. It's hyper situational awareness.
ChrisG thought that Justin was mix it up after he blocked low once. Respect was given. Also sometimes after Akuma Tatsu he could be holding up back and got clipped which happens a lot against Justin.
biosnake20
Member
Just finished watching the Justin post-EVO interview on Live on Three:
*He had been saving Storm on point against ChrisG for 6 months. He had wanted to pull out that strat against ChrisG many times at majors but he was looking at the big picture which was EVO... and it paid off big time.
*The theory behind Storm on point was that Justin wanted to deny ChrisG having meter from making Wolverine block fireballs and Missiles. Storm's superior mobility and float allows him to evade fireballs and missiles to time out the Astral Vision. He said that once the battle came down to no AV Morrigan he was comfortable in that fight because he had Akuma Tatsu and Storm's mobility. He also said that he can punish AV activation with Storm's Element super which also cuts down her AV time by 30%... it's not about the damage it's about denying ChrisG the meter which is fundamental to his team (even Vergil uses the meter).
*Justin said that he also had a bunch of strats that he only used at EVO and never before. He pointed out his various punishes on the Vergil assist against ChrisG as Wolverine and Akuma which he wasn't doing before.
*He said that he got a lot of practice with people playing Morrigan + Doom to help prep him against ChrisG at EVO. He specifically mentioned NerdJosh and Helix who helped him prepare the match up with Storm on point. He said it's really hard to find good Morrigan + Doom to practice against because only ChrisG can play it at that level.
*Justin Wong mentions the decision he made to snap out Phoenix during the time out situation against him and FChamp. He said that he didn't know if that was going to work out in his favor but it did end up working out.
*Justin's favorite match in top 8 was Insayne and RayRay. He said it was very "fair and beautiful".
*Justin elaborated on his "I saved Marvel" statement. He said that he wanted to make a statement that you don't need top tiers to win (he referred to Zero, Morrigan, Doom, Vergil as characters people hate seeing and thus stunting the growth of the game) and referenced other players who do extremely well despite not using those top tier characters. He said that MVC3 is an extremely creative game and he loves watching all the various techs, teams and combos.
*He had been saving Storm on point against ChrisG for 6 months. He had wanted to pull out that strat against ChrisG many times at majors but he was looking at the big picture which was EVO... and it paid off big time.
*The theory behind Storm on point was that Justin wanted to deny ChrisG having meter from making Wolverine block fireballs and Missiles. Storm's superior mobility and float allows him to evade fireballs and missiles to time out the Astral Vision. He said that once the battle came down to no AV Morrigan he was comfortable in that fight because he had Akuma Tatsu and Storm's mobility. He also said that he can punish AV activation with Storm's Element super which also cuts down her AV time by 30%... it's not about the damage it's about denying ChrisG the meter which is fundamental to his team (even Vergil uses the meter).
*Justin said that he also had a bunch of strats that he only used at EVO and never before. He pointed out his various punishes on the Vergil assist against ChrisG as Wolverine and Akuma which he wasn't doing before.
*He said that he got a lot of practice with people playing Morrigan + Doom to help prep him against ChrisG at EVO. He specifically mentioned NerdJosh and Helix who helped him prepare the match up with Storm on point. He said it's really hard to find good Morrigan + Doom to practice against because only ChrisG can play it at that level.
*Justin Wong mentions the decision he made to snap out Phoenix during the time out situation against him and FChamp. He said that he didn't know if that was going to work out in his favor but it did end up working out.
*Justin's favorite match in top 8 was Insayne and RayRay. He said it was very "fair and beautiful".
*Justin elaborated on his "I saved Marvel" statement. He said that he wanted to make a statement that you don't need top tiers to win (he referred to Zero, Morrigan, Doom, Vergil as characters people hate seeing and thus stunting the growth of the game) and referenced other players who do extremely well despite not using those top tier characters. He said that MVC3 is an extremely creative game and he loves watching all the various techs, teams and combos.
Just finished watching the Justin post-EVO interview on Live on Three:
*He had been saving Storm on point against ChrisG for 6 months. He had wanted to pull out that strat against ChrisG many times at majors but he was looking at the big picture which was EVO... and it paid off big time.
*The theory behind Storm on point was that Justin wanted to deny ChrisG having meter from making Wolverine block fireballs and Missiles. Storm's superior mobility and float allows him to evade fireballs and missiles to time out the Astral Vision. He said that once the battle came down to no AV Morrigan he was comfortable in that fight because he had Akuma Tatsu and Storm's mobility. He also said that he can punish AV activation with Storm's Element super which also cuts down her AV time by 30%... it's not about the damage it's about denying ChrisG the meter which is fundamental to his team (even Vergil uses the meter).
*Justin said that he also had a bunch of strats that he only used at EVO and never before. He pointed out his various punishes on the Vergil assist against ChrisG as Wolverine and Akuma which he wasn't doing before.
*He said that he got a lot of practice with people playing Morrigan + Doom to help prep him against ChrisG at EVO. He specifically mentioned NerdJosh and Helix who helped him prepare the match up with Storm on point. He said it's really hard to find good Morrigan + Doom to practice against because only ChrisG can play it at that level.
*Justin Wong mentions the decision he made to snap out Phoenix during the time out situation against him and FChamp. He said that he didn't know if that was going to work out in his favor but it did end up working out.
*Justin's favorite match in top 8 was Insayne and RayRay. He said it was very "fair and beautiful".
*Justin elaborated on his "I saved Marvel" statement. He said that he wanted to make a statement that you don't need top tiers to win (he referred to Zero, Morrigan, Doom, Vergil as characters people hate seeing and thus stunting the growth of the game) and referenced other players who do extremely well despite not using those top tier characters. He said that MVC3 is an extremely creative game and he loves watching all the various techs, teams and combos.
Thanks for the write-up. Other players seem so lazy in comparison with Justin, haha. Do you have a link to the actual interview?
Thanks!
JohnPauliuk
Neo Member
Justin's interview really inspired me to work really hard on my Ryu/Shuma team. I've been trying to find a copy of the UMVC3 bible to compare frame data between Denjin Ryu and normal Ryu for more optimal stuff and find a third character to help make Ryu more of the Ryu described on the first page of this thread.
Professor Beef
Banned
Chris G was robbed
Chris G was robbed
Justin outplayed him. Next year Evo title should be his though.
Professor Beef
Banned
Justin outplayed him. Next year Evo title should be his though.
In a perfect world Wong's stick would've broke and nobody would've offered theirs.
YES I'M SALTY
In a perfect world there would be a Marvel patch and Yipes would've won EVO with Iron Man on his team with a theme that doesn't suck ass.
You are a poet, sir.
Professor Beef
Banned
In a perfect world there would be a Marvel patch and Yipes would've won EVO with Iron Man on his team with a theme that doesn't suck ass.
More like a Bad Future
Can someone please tell me where all of my Marvel execution went? Tried messing around with the game after EVO finals and I'm so sloppy it hurt me personally. I can't FADC Seismos, can't land my old Dante combos consistently, and felt stuck with a lot of things I took for granted back in 2012... Movement is good though.
Meanwhile, I'm better than I've ever been in Melee/Project M and can handle characters I never would have looked at in that game based on the executional requirements previously.
Meanwhile, I'm better than I've ever been in Melee/Project M and can handle characters I never would have looked at in that game based on the executional requirements previously.
biosnake20
Member
In a perfect world there would be a Marvel patch and Yipes would've won EVO with Iron Man on his team with a theme that doesn't suck ass.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwvBQColmyA
Karsticles
Member
No clue. This stuff is like riding a bike for me. I get right back into it.Can someone please tell me where all of my Marvel execution went? Tried messing around with the game after EVO finals and I'm so sloppy it hurt me personally. I can't FADC Seismos, can't land my old Dante combos consistently, and felt stuck with a lot of things I took for granted back in 2012... Movement is good though.
Meanwhile, I'm better than I've ever been in Melee/Project M and can handle characters I never would have looked at in that game based on the executional requirements previously.
Karsticles
Member
Dropping Storm again, picking up Dorm. EVO was an eyeopener, I love the tech the pair have, but I need a closer.
Back to Skrull/Dorm/Strange.
Man, that team looks rough. IMO, sub out Strange and put Sentinel in. He serves a similar purpose but is a more intimidating anchor.
Are your PSN or DBM?
Did we ever recommend that hyper screen input freeze glitch fix in the patch?
Because it was cringe worthy watching FChamp get a LVL3 instead of a LVL1 in Losers Finals which resulted in his loss in the final game.
I am assuming this part of the list was supposed to mention that:
Though I don't think it's the same thing.
Because it was cringe worthy watching FChamp get a LVL3 instead of a LVL1 in Losers Finals which resulted in his loss in the final game.
I am assuming this part of the list was supposed to mention that:
Input reading changed: holding forward/back is no longer a forward/back input in terms of moves. Example: holding back, and then doing qcb, currently gives one a reverse dragon punch motion. In general, directional input buffering is toned down a bit.
Though I don't think it's the same thing.
The Mango Sentinel
Member
You think sentinel is a better anchor than Strange?Man, that team looks rough. IMO, sub out Strange and put Sentinel in. He serves a similar purpose but is a more intimidating anchor.
Are your PSN or DBM?
You just have to upback in the corner against Strange and carefully tech grabs. People get opened up by anchor Strange by staying midscreen and pressing buttons. XF2 Strange + Assist is pretty good but I feel XF Sent is still better.You think sentinel is a better anchor than Strange?
I've been working on Zero/Morrigan/Dante lately after you guys mentioned it. My Vergil is bad compared to my Zero and Dante and I like zoning. Playing casuals against top players at Curly Mustache South makes me realize my Vergil is hella free lol so I've been messing with different characters on second. Mostly Sentinel.
A lot of my wins were XF3 Dante actually. (or Zero once people snapbacked my Dante once they realized it was a threat, not knowing I had an XF3 Zero too). I got to agree with everyone that Shadow Blade is better than Dark Harmonizer on this team.
The Mango Sentinel
Member
I'm just wondering cause I've always thought they were about even depending on the situation.You just have to upback in the corner against Strange and carefully tech grabs. People get opened up by anchor Strange by staying midscreen and pressing buttons. XF2 Strange + Assist is pretty good but I feel XF Sent is still better.
Sentinel at least has armor and a command grab that leads to combos. All Strange gets is Spell of Vishanti unless he has glyphs set up in the corner to OTG, and against better anchors he's gonna just get pressured over and over.I'm just wondering cause I've always thought they were about even depending on the situation.
He's a decent anchor but I feel most of my Strange comebacks are due to people not knowing the matchup vs his strengths as a character/anchor.
Karsticles
Member
Basically, what FSLink said. Dr. Strange only ever makes comebacks outside of the entry mixup when you are a fool or have chippable health. Sentinel destroys teams through high risk high reward mixups.
That was the intention of that section, yes.Did we ever recommend that hyper screen input freeze glitch fix in the patch?
Because it was cringe worthy watching FChamp get a LVL3 instead of a LVL1 in Losers Finals which resulted in his loss in the final game.
I am assuming this part of the list was supposed to mention that:
Though I don't think it's the same thing.
XF Sentinel is a much stronger character than most people give him credit for.
Even if you don't count all the benefits he has in terms of being able to go into XF Comebacks(HSF means the opponent can't call assists against Anchor Sent when he has XF on deck, Hard Drive means he has a MUCH better chance of getting started than most anchors coming in to a mixup, etc), even his XF neutral game is very strong.
In XF, Sentinel cM becomes essentially unreactable. Especially XF3. This is important, because a good player can react to it without XF, some of the time.
In any level of XF, Sentinel can confirm off of jLH xx Fly, Unfly jLM sL etc. This means in any level of XF, Sentinel can confirm on you if he lands a fuzzy. This gives Sentinel actually high/low mixups, when in XF. Any time you block a jM/jH/jS as Sentinel lands, sentinel can use that huge frame advantage to hi/low you with his great dash speed and fuzzies, etc.
In XF3, if you don't pushblock Sentinel, he can essentially keep you in blockstun 24/7, due to the huge blockstun on many of his heavier attacks. If you DO pushblock, you'll put yourself in a mixup position if he reads it. If you pushblock a late jM from sentinel, he has plenty of time to dash up to you, and do cM, jL, or command throw.
tl ; dr - When in XF, Sentinel goes from a character with some serious flaws, to a very, very strong character(Even in the comparison of other characters with XF) with screen control, low risk-high reward mixups, etc.
He keeps the problem that he has a hard time chasing air characters, and a smart player with an air-mobile character can waste most of sentinel's XF time so long as they stay high in the air, block jM boots, and tech airthrows. But against characters with bad air mobility, XF Sentinel can and will push them into the corner and bulldoze them. Strange can't really do that.
And he also keeps the fact that as soon as XF ends, and as soon as Sentinel loses his "I can hard-drive or HSF with impunity because I can XFC it" card, he becomes hugely more manageable, and undoubtedly mid-tier or worse in that moment.
Even if you don't count all the benefits he has in terms of being able to go into XF Comebacks(HSF means the opponent can't call assists against Anchor Sent when he has XF on deck, Hard Drive means he has a MUCH better chance of getting started than most anchors coming in to a mixup, etc), even his XF neutral game is very strong.
In XF, Sentinel cM becomes essentially unreactable. Especially XF3. This is important, because a good player can react to it without XF, some of the time.
In any level of XF, Sentinel can confirm off of jLH xx Fly, Unfly jLM sL etc. This means in any level of XF, Sentinel can confirm on you if he lands a fuzzy. This gives Sentinel actually high/low mixups, when in XF. Any time you block a jM/jH/jS as Sentinel lands, sentinel can use that huge frame advantage to hi/low you with his great dash speed and fuzzies, etc.
In XF3, if you don't pushblock Sentinel, he can essentially keep you in blockstun 24/7, due to the huge blockstun on many of his heavier attacks. If you DO pushblock, you'll put yourself in a mixup position if he reads it. If you pushblock a late jM from sentinel, he has plenty of time to dash up to you, and do cM, jL, or command throw.
tl ; dr - When in XF, Sentinel goes from a character with some serious flaws, to a very, very strong character(Even in the comparison of other characters with XF) with screen control, low risk-high reward mixups, etc.
He keeps the problem that he has a hard time chasing air characters, and a smart player with an air-mobile character can waste most of sentinel's XF time so long as they stay high in the air, block jM boots, and tech airthrows. But against characters with bad air mobility, XF Sentinel can and will push them into the corner and bulldoze them. Strange can't really do that.
And he also keeps the fact that as soon as XF ends, and as soon as Sentinel loses his "I can hard-drive or HSF with impunity because I can XFC it" card, he becomes hugely more manageable, and undoubtedly mid-tier or worse in that moment.
SolarKnight
Member
I need your opinion Marvel Gaf.
I've been considering getting Spencer in my team for the Nova/Spencer duo. However, it'd mean losing Vajra and XF3 Strider from my current team in exchange for the ability of actually being able to kill and because of character loyalty I'd be keeping Rocket Raccoon in my team instead of going full Team Nemo.
Does a Nova/Spencer/RR team seem worth it to you guys?
I've been considering getting Spencer in my team for the Nova/Spencer duo. However, it'd mean losing Vajra and XF3 Strider from my current team in exchange for the ability of actually being able to kill and because of character loyalty I'd be keeping Rocket Raccoon in my team instead of going full Team Nemo.
Does a Nova/Spencer/RR team seem worth it to you guys?
I need your opinion Marvel Gaf.
I've been considering getting Spencer in my team for the Nova/Spencer duo. However, it'd mean losing Vajra and XF3 Strider from my current team in exchange for the ability of actually being able to kill and because of character loyalty I'd be keeping Rocket Raccoon in my team instead of going full Team Nemo.
Does a Nova/Spencer/RR team seem worth it to you guys?
It is. The ability to kill is very important. I've been learning Soencer since before Evo for that reason. Nova/Strider is good but the lack of kills is a problem.
even though Nova/Rocket/Strider shoudl have crazy resets those aren't enough anymore. But, at the same time unless you're trying to be a top player there's still a lot you can do with that team. Nova/Strider got top 32 at Evo after all.
You could swap out Nova for Vergil or Doom to fix the damage problem though. Veril with spitfire twice or Doom with log trap seem like strong combinations.
In terms of fun, of course, you should do whatever you have more fun with. That's the main reason I keep Sentinel.
In terms of competitive success, yes, you need to be able to kill off of a start of the round touch. JWong said something along the lines of, "if your team can't kill off the first hit, you need a new team".
The idea behind it is, if your team CAN kill off the first hit, you have a ~25% chance of winning the match entirely off of that first hit. Their character dies, 50% chance of mixing up the incoming character, kill or use XF to kill and build meter if necessary, 50% chance of mixing up the last character, kill or use excess meter from previous XF combo to kill, etc. For a long time, that was justin's basic flowchart.
Nova/Spencer/RR sounds like it could accomplish that pretty well.
In terms of competitive success, yes, you need to be able to kill off of a start of the round touch. JWong said something along the lines of, "if your team can't kill off the first hit, you need a new team".
The idea behind it is, if your team CAN kill off the first hit, you have a ~25% chance of winning the match entirely off of that first hit. Their character dies, 50% chance of mixing up the incoming character, kill or use XF to kill and build meter if necessary, 50% chance of mixing up the last character, kill or use excess meter from previous XF combo to kill, etc. For a long time, that was justin's basic flowchart.
Nova/Spencer/RR sounds like it could accomplish that pretty well.
No clue. This stuff is like riding a bike for me. I get right back into it.
I think it's just getting over how much time has passed since I did all this stuff regularly. I'm seeing improvement already, but I should probably stick with it longer so I get crisp again.
Karsticles
Member
Do you still kill without IP loops? That seems to be the major incentive for putting Spencer there.I need your opinion Marvel Gaf.
I've been considering getting Spencer in my team for the Nova/Spencer duo. However, it'd mean losing Vajra and XF3 Strider from my current team in exchange for the ability of actually being able to kill and because of character loyalty I'd be keeping Rocket Raccoon in my team instead of going full Team Nemo.
Does a Nova/Spencer/RR team seem worth it to you guys?
SolarKnight
Member
Well I know for a fact they at least have 1mil raw tag combos not counting TACs? It's not Thor killing but 1mil is enough for most of the cast.
Karsticles
Member
Good enough!Well I know for a fact they at least have 1mil raw tag combos not counting TACs? It's not Thor killing but 1mil is enough for most of the cast.
You're not gonna have much damage scaling, considering spitfire doesn't cause much. So even a DHC into Bionic Manuevers -> 80k -> 80k -> whatever would be enough for most of the cast, as far as I know.
Also, anybody on XBL want to get some games in? Feels like a modok day. Send me a message @ Mercurial Hg
Also, anybody on XBL want to get some games in? Feels like a modok day. Send me a message @ Mercurial Hg
Karsticles
Member
You should also ask in the FGW thread, since a lot of players don't visit the OT.You're not gonna have much damage scaling, considering spitfire doesn't cause much. So even a DHC into Bionic Manuevers -> 80k -> 80k -> whatever would be enough for most of the cast, as far as I know.
Also, anybody on XBL want to get some games in? Feels like a modok day. Send me a message @ Mercurial Hg
If they don't post here, then I don't know them whatsoever, and if I wanted to play people I don't know whatsoever then I could just do Player/Ranked searched, so, not really any point to that.
I can play some games if you still want, I still send u invs and messages saying wanna play but u never answer back... Come on dawg.
SolarKnight
Member
So, what's the notation for Spencer's BnBs? I'm always getting hit by them so I kinda have an idea of how it looks but I don't actually know how to do them :|
JohnPauliuk
Neo Member
So after my EVO experience, I've become determined to make a better point Ryu team. I'm open to any suggestions for a team, I'd like to make him more viable.
A way to extend his bnbs for one assist (Drones/OTG assists, etc) and/or Drones/Tatsu for fuzzies are musts imo. Good luck.So after my EVO experience, I've become determined to make a better point Ryu team. I'm open to any suggestions for a team, I'd like to make him more viable.
I'm sad I didn't see this in here.
Maximum Wesker
Midscreen BnB should be Cr. LMH xx Zip UpForward > J. MH xx Zip DownForward > J.S > J.MH xx ZipDownForward > J.S > J.MHS ZipDownForward > S xx Upgrapple.
This video by Adelheid Stark is good too.
Maximum Wesker
So, what's the notation for Spencer's BnBs? I'm always getting hit by them so I kinda have an idea of how it looks but I don't actually know how to do them :|
Midscreen BnB should be Cr. LMH xx Zip UpForward > J. MH xx Zip DownForward > J.S > J.MH xx ZipDownForward > J.S > J.MHS ZipDownForward > S xx Upgrapple.
This video by Adelheid Stark is good too.
XxSlasherMcGirkxX
Member
This was really cool. I also laughed at the Vergil part.
This was really cool. I also laughed at the Vergil part.
The Triple Maximum Wesker THC made me laugh so hard. There's just something about Tripling the efficiency of Wesker because so many supers have bad synergy with him that the best way to amplify his damage is with himself.
SolarKnight
Member
So is whatever->Spencer assist->boulder trap unblockable reset in the corner with Rocket Raccoon/Spencer an actual viable thing or just pure gimmick that people can actually get out off?
Thank you. What about corner though? And how does one get SxxUp grapple to combo? I couldn't do it at all any time I tried :|
Midscreen BnB should be Cr. LMH xx Zip UpForward > J. MH xx Zip DownForward > J.S > J.MH xx ZipDownForward > J.S > J.MHS ZipDownForward > S xx Upgrapple.
This video by Adelheid Stark is good too.
Thank you. What about corner though? And how does one get SxxUp grapple to combo? I couldn't do it at all any time I tried :|