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*UNMARKED SPOILERS ALL BOOKS* Game of Thrones |OT| - Season 5 Offseason Thread

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K

Kain

Member
The show hasn't done many fake deaths, right? I'm saying this because Jon's "death" will be a pretty powerful blow to show viewers as they are not used to all the fake deaths GRRM throws in the books (for example Tyrion "died" in ADWD maybe three times?)
 
B

badcrumble

Member
Without knowing how things play out after Jon's stabbing we really can't know that the show will do it at all. They may reach the same plot points by another route as they've done previously.
 
D

Deleted member 98878

Unconfirmed Member
Just finished the last book. Guys, I'm kinda sad now.
 
I

Iksenpets

Banned
Forkball said:
The Hound
Maybe Cat
Syrio
Click to expand...

They're not doing Stoneheart, and Syrio is dead as hell, so one. They also did the Bran/Rickon fakeout in season 2. Other than that they've all been cut. I doubt we'll get any of Tyrion's this season, and the Davos fakeout won't happen in the show since it'll be told in chronological order, and his trip is probably cut anyway. I guess they could still end up doing Mance?
 
Moff

Moff

Member
NeoGiff said:
The final scene will be Daenerys stranded in the wilderness squirting from both ends
Click to expand...

ghl45.gif
 
F

foxtrot3d

Banned
NeoGiff said:
Reposting for the new page in case people missed it.

Alleged S05E08 (Hardhome) spoilers.

WARNING: ALTHOUGH UNCONFIRMED, THIS MAY WELL RUIN YOUR ENJOYMENT OF THE SCENE. READ AT YOUR OWN RISK.

Tormund will die this season.
Rattleshirt is selling slaves at Hardhome. Tormund is pissed and begs Jon to let him go take care of it. Jon thinks as LC he should tag along and does. At Hardhome a fight ensues. During the fight, the Night’s King shows up and starts reanimating the dead, especially those falling over the side of a cliff. Everyone panics and starts to flee, chaos everywhere. They charge at Jon who is left alone. Tormund refuses to flee and pounces on the Wights and throws Jon to the floor, protecting him. He fights off like 20 Wights trying to get at Jon before dying. They are giving Tormund a heroic death on the show, protecting Jon Snow. Before dying he tells Jon Snow to leave, get to the boats. There’s a fire torch near by. In his final act Tormund sets himself and the other Wights nearby on fire, so he can’t be brought back. Final shot of 508 is the eyes of the Night’s King meeting the eyes of Jon Snow.

Again, this is unconfirmed... but pretty cool if true, in my opinion.
Click to expand...

I want to read this SO BAD, how bad in terms of spoilers are we talking? Is it a major change from the books?
 
S

Snuggles

erotic butter maelstrom
It's a very major change. Just read it. Now that I'm caught up with the books I'm done avoiding (potential) spoilers.
 
I

Iksenpets

Banned
foxtrot3d said:
I want to read this SO BAD, how bad in terms of spoilers are we talking? Is it a major change from the books?
Click to expand...

How much do you want to know about the show's Hardhome sequence? It's about that. If it's true, you'll know what characters go, roughly what happens, and if or if not there are any major deaths there.
 
Moff

Moff

Member
foxtrot3d said:
I want to read this SO BAD, how bad in terms of spoilers are we talking? Is it a major change from the books?
Click to expand...

don't do it, it will be all the more awesome if you didnt know about it
seriously, it's so awesome you don't want to read it
 
N

NeoGiff

Member
Yeah, don't do it! Seriously, if true it promises to be the most amazing action sequence to date in the show. I wish I could go in fresh.
 
S

Szeth

Member
Glad I didn't read it, been waiting to be able to go in blind for a long time. Gonna be weird having to dodge spoilers for this now hah
 
P

Patriots7

Member
Moff said:
I don't see how that's wrong.
Robert had legitimacy through conquest, he rebelled, fought and won
Stannis has legitimacy thorugh birthright, he is the oldest brother and should be the successor.

renly does not have that claim, he was simply popular and stannis very unpopular, that's why people sided with renly, not because of legitimacy or claim. so stannis is right to call that out.
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Eh to play devil's advocate.
I don't necessarily agree. Renly staked his claim to the throne before Stannis did, if memory serves correctly. It was also under the belief that Joffrey (and the rest of Cersei's children) was the legitimate king, too.
So had Renly won, it would have been through conquest, and from that initial viewpoint, Stannis had no better claim than he did.

Renly also told either Brienne or Cat that he feared for his life (his justification for rebelling), as he believed that Cersei and the Lannisters would have had him killed soon after Robert's death. He even states he didn't want the throne, Ned refused his idea of protecting Joffrey from Cersei's influence.

And not only that, for someone who believes in legitimacy so adamantly, everyone seems to ignore the fact that Stannis states that he would never let "Lady Lannister" inherit Winterfell, despite (as Jon Snow points out) the fact it is rightfully hers (under the assumption Bran/Rickon are dead) and her being as much of a victim as anyone else (Pretty sure that as King he could get a dispensation annulling the marriage. Or just kill Tyrion).
 
I

Iksenpets

Banned
Patriots7 said:
Eh to play devil's advocate.
I don't necessarily agree. Renly staked his claim to the throne before Stannis did, if memory serves correctly. It was also under the belief that Joffrey (and the rest of Cersei's children) was the legitimate king, too.
So had Renly won, it would have been through conquest, and from that initial viewpoint, Stannis had no better claim than he did.

Renly also told either Brienne or Cat that he feared for his life (his justification for rebelling), as he believed that Cersei and the Lannisters would have had him killed soon after Robert's death. He even states he didn't want the throne, Ned refused his idea of protecting Joffrey from Cersei's influence.

And not only that, for someone who believes in legitimacy so adamantly, everyone seems to ignore the fact that Stannis states that he would never let "Lady Lannister" inherit Winterfell, despite (as Jon Snow points out) the fact it is rightfully hers (under the assumption Bran/Rickon are dead) and her being as much of a victim as anyone else (Pretty sure that as King he could get a dispensation annulling the marriage. Or just kill Tyrion).
Click to expand...

To play counter devil's advocate to your devil's advocate:

I think with Stannis you have to kind of make a distinction between interfamilial disputes and issues within a family. Two opposing families can go to war and one can take the other's stuff by right of conquest, and that can be regarded as legitimate. Stannis clearly doesn't like that and thinks for the most part rights should be respected, but he seems to recognize its legitimacy at some level. So he can forcibly disinherit Sansa, because his duty as King is to the greater stability of the country, not to any particular Stark claim. In most cases, that means enforcing existing claims, but if it means handing a whole kingdom over to the Lannisters, he can make an exception.

Within a family though, these things are absolute. Son should obey father, younger brothers should obey the elder. That's not a political arrangement made by men, but something way deeper. To violate your duty to a family member is violating the same precepts that make kinslaying so taboo. So rising up against a king is distasteful, and shouldn't be done except in extreme circumstances, but claiming something over a family member to whom you owe a duty is absolutely forbidden.

Now that puts Stannis into the awkward position of how do you deal with a brother who is being disobedient, with kinslaying so taboo, and Stannis seems to deal with it by accepting that it's permissible to kill his brother in retaliation, while also living in denial about the fact that he actually went through with it, and choosing to believe that Renly just sort of happened to die after he had some really weird dream about killing him.
 
F

foxtrot3d

Banned
Iksenpets said:
To play counter devil's advocate to your devil's advocate:

I think with Stannis you have to kind of make a distinction between interfamilial disputes and issues within a family. Two opposing families can go to war and one can take the other's stuff by right of conquest, and that can be regarded as legitimate. Stannis clearly doesn't like that and thinks for the most part rights should be respected, but he seems to recognize its legitimacy at some level. So he can forcibly disinherit Sansa, because his duty as King is to the greater stability of the country, not to any particular Stark claim. In most cases, that means enforcing existing claims, but if it means handing a whole kingdom over to the Lannisters, he can make an exception.

Within a family though, these things are absolute. Son should obey father, younger brothers should obey the elder. That's not a political arrangement made by men, but something way deeper. To violate your duty to a family member is violating the same precepts that make kinslaying so taboo. So rising up against a king is distasteful, and shouldn't be done except in extreme circumstances, but claiming something over a family member to whom you owe a duty is absolutely forbidden.

Now that puts Stannis into the awkward position of how do you deal with a brother who is being disobedient, with kinslaying so taboo, and Stannis seems to deal with it by accepting that it's permissible to kill his brother in retaliation, while also living in denial about the fact that he actually went through with it, and choosing to believe that Renly just sort of happened to die after he had some really weird dream about killing him.
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As Victarion later muses to himself, would it still be considered kinslaying if he got someone else to do it? Also, everything you said is right. The younger brother yields before the older, Renly went against this sacred law and died the traitor that he was.

EDIT:

On another topic entirely, does anyone else have a different view of Viserys after knowing everything about his past and what not. I'm just rewatching some episodes from the first season and when Viserys is pissing on the Dothraki and their culture calling them savages and what not I'm just thinking, he's right. The Dothraki are savage, drunken, reavers and slavers and he (Viserys), the blood of the Dragon, blood of Aegon the Conqueror who united the Seven Kingdoms must curry favor with these savages to take back his rightful throne. No wonder the guy went absolutely crazy. Now, I still think he is a cruel fool but fuck the Dothraki and their entire culture.
 
Moff

Moff

Member
Patriots7 said:
Eh to play devil's advocate.
I don't necessarily agree. Renly staked his claim to the throne before Stannis did, if memory serves correctly. It was also under the belief that Joffrey (and the rest of Cersei's children) was the legitimate king, too.
So had Renly won, it would have been through conquest, and from that initial viewpoint, Stannis had no better claim than he did.

Renly also told either Brienne or Cat that he feared for his life (his justification for rebelling), as he believed that Cersei and the Lannisters would have had him killed soon after Robert's death. He even states he didn't want the throne, Ned refused his idea of protecting Joffrey from Cersei's influence.
Click to expand...
yes had renly won he would have had legitimacy through conquest, but that legitimacy comes only after he won. when we saw it in the books stannis had the bigger claim.
 
N

NeoGiff

Member
Cross posting from WotW where we're doing a fun little survey for people to speculate on the episode titles. Here are my picks.

Ep. 501 - Valonqar
Ep. 502 - The Griffin Rejected
Ep. 503 - Fat Pink Mast
Ep. 504 - Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken
Ep. 505 - Fear Cuts Deeper Than Swords
Ep. 506 - The Shy Maid
Ep. 507 - The Roose is Loose
Ep. 508 - The Long Night
Ep. 509 - A Lion Still Has Claws
Ep. 510 - For the Watch

I’m pretty rusty on when what we know is happening is happening, but you get the point. There are a few joke ones thrown in too just so I didn’t leave any blanks. Any takers?
 
L

Loke13

Member
NeoGiff said:
Cross posting from WotW where we're doing a fun little survey for people to speculate on the episode titles. Here are my picks.

Ep. 501 - Valonqar
Ep. 502 - The Griffin Rejected
Ep. 503 - Fat Pink Mast
Ep. 504 - Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken
Ep. 505 - Fear Cuts Deeper Than Swords
Ep. 506 - The Shy Maid
Ep. 507 - The Roose is Loose
Ep. 508 - The Long Night
Ep. 509 - A Lion Still Has Claws
Ep. 510 - For the Watch

I’m pretty rusty on when what we know is happening is happening, but you get the point. There are a few joke ones thrown in too just so I didn’t leave any blanks. Any takers?
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The Roose is Loose. That's too good not to be legit.
 
I

Iksenpets

Banned
1. Wherever Whores Go
2. Nipples on a Breastplate
3. The Mannis
4. Hey Look, Turtles
5. Fat Pink Mast
6. The Myrish Swamp
7. Roose on the Loose
8. Guess Who's Not Dead Now
9. The Mannis, Redux
10. Spewing from Both Ends

Had to borrow a few of NeoGiff's.
 
N

NeoGiff

Member
Loke13 said:
The Roose is Loose. That's too good not to be legit.
Click to expand...

It's the one actual legit title on my list.

Source:
HBO

Iksenpets said:
1. Wherever Whores Go
2. Nipples on a Breastplate
3. The Mannis
4. Hey Look, Turtles
5. Fat Pink Mast
6. The Myrish Swamp
7. Roose on the Loose
8. Guess Who's Not Dead Now
9. The Mannis, Redux
10. Spewing from Both Ends

Had to borrow a few of NeoGiff's.
Click to expand...

I also nominate "The North Remembers Again", "What is Dead Will Never Rise", "Nodor", and "I'm Looking for a Girl of Three and Ten".

CassSept said:
True, this has to be the final scene of the season. Too epic to pass up on it.
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I'm dying! The sincerity of his reading is hilarious out of context.
 
I

Iksenpets

Banned
NeoGiff said:
It's the one actual legit title on my list.

Source:
HBO



I also nominate "The North Remembers Again", "What is Dead Will Never Rise", "Nodor", and "I'm Looking for a Girl of Three and Ten".



I'm dying! The sincerity of his reading is hilarious out of context.
Click to expand...

I really don't enjoy audiobooks, but I have to consider listening to these just for the awkward a bits like that.

In the show, I hope they just use that narration verbatim, over a montage of Emilia Clarke wandering around a desert and soiling herself repeatedly.
 
S

Steelyuhas

Member
Okay, I'll give it a shot:

501 - Valonqar
502 - The House of Black and White
503 - Lord Commander
504 - Sand Snakes
505 - High Sparrow
506 - The Sorrows
507 - The Ghost of Winterfell
508 - The Cold Winds are Rising
509 - God of Death
510 - The White Raven


The first two episodes are actually on HBO's schedule now, but the titles are black as of now.
 
B

biosnake20

Member
Slow news day but there's this at least:

He has spent much of his run on "Thrones" in his own "isolated storyline," so when his story does intersect with other major characters, as it did at the end of season four when he met Stannis Baratheon (Stephen Dillane), he has to remind himself to forget what he knows about them. "The one thing I had to do was take away my vision of who these people were having watched the show," he explains. "I kind of knew Stephen's work, and I have a lot of scenes with him this year … and I was trying to remind myself that Jon had no idea what this man was about … Jon Snow doesn't watch 'Game of Thrones.'"
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http://www.goldderby.com/news/8494/kit-harington-interview-how-to-train-your-dragon-2-game-of-thrones-entertainment-13579086-story.html

The more stannis scenes the better.
 
I

Iksenpets

Banned
If I'm being serious:

1. Valonqar
2. Sons of the Harpy
3. Him of Many Faces
4. Unbowed. Unbent. Unbroken.
5. The Sorrows
6. Broken Men
7. A Ghost in Winterfell
8. Dead Things in the Water
9. Daznak's Pit
10. Walk of Shame

Seven-Pointed Star or Faith Militant would also be good. If Manderly were in, I could see The Mummer's Farce being a good episode title, since The North Remembers is already taken. For the Watch or Daggers in the Dark work for the finale, too, if that's in.
 
E

Exterminieren

Banned
Just to pass the time, these are my guesses for this year's episode titles.

1. Valonqar
2. Black and White
3. Sons of the Harpy
4. Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken
5. The Seven-Pointed Star
6. No One
7. A Ghost in Winterfell
8. Dead Things in the Water
9. The Mortal Art
10. Salt and Smoke (>:D)
 
B

biosnake20

Member
http://www.menshealth.co.uk/_mobile/building-muscle/cover-model/jamie-lannister-covers-game-of-thrones

Nikolaj Coster-Waldau on…
…the future for Game of Thrones

[The show bosses] know as much as George RR Martin knows. He hasn’t written the books, but he knows how he wants it to end. Well, I think he’s written one of them now. I don’t know when it comes out but I’d assume soon. All the details, they’re going to have to come up with them themselves. It’s going to be interesting because I think the show is going to finish before the last book comes out. There’ll be quite a big difference when it does.
Click to expand...
 
SpaceHorror

SpaceHorror

Member
I don't think he has any idea. GRRM just posted a few days that after a trip to Texas he's going back to working on that huge monkey (the Son of Kong) on his back The Winds of Winter. If he had finished it already he probably wouldn't say that. He just cleared up that he doesn't joke about that kind of thing, so I'm guessing he still has plenty of work to do.

I do think he'll finish this year.

I hope.
 
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