D.Lo
Member
Here's the full list of 60Hz PAL PS1 games:
(Not sure if 100% true, but close enough to accurate)
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Upscalers, CRTs, PVMs & RGB: Retro gaming done right!
- Thread starter IrishNinja
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NormalFish
Banned
really? I'm surprised. Good to know, I suppose.
GayForMaster
Banned
I had a talk with a few people (the guy I bought it from, retro console accesories and Vile Tim) and the end result was all 3 of them telling me to get a csync cable, so I ended up buying that. Will wait for it to arrive and hope it works lol.
Charles Brandon
Member
Ok so with my set up it's like this
TV->HDMI cable->FM -> mini-din to euroscart female convertor cable -> standard scart cable with two male ends -> switchbox -> two cables, one going to SNES, one going to NES. My SNES cable is male scart on one end and SNES multiout with a separate audio cable on the other end, my NES cable is male scart on one end and mini-din on the other (modded RGB console).
I think you'll be OK having 50hz and 60hz sources going into the same switch but you will probably have to adjust the FM settings to reflect the change when you switch. However both my consoles are 60hz so I'm not sure about that.
None of them are. Some may be optimised, others plain slower, but the option to have PAL60 ingame didn't exist before the 6th gen.
The difference between the Playstation and the other consoles is that it can't be modded with a 50/60Hz switch, PAL games can never be run at 60Hz.
NormalFish
Banned
Well that's unfortunate. There are a handful of games with PAL releases and not NTSC-U releases that I would like to play, but that's a pain in the ass. Not to mention NTSC testations don't play so nice with PAL, I've heard.
Unrelated, there's some interesting talk on shmups about framemeister issues and different console video outputs. Seems to be some indecision over the NGC's video output quality (480i seems to be rather poor while 480p is quite nice). Can't make much of a lot of it personally, but maybe some of you folks would be interested.
D.Lo
Member
You can hack the disc images.
All Playstations play all discs when modded for region free. The problem comes from the TV set you are using: American TVs don't like anything other than NTSC-U. Europeans are luckier in that they can use RGB so don't have the problem of decoding PAL/NTSC signals from Composite/RF/SVideo. Tubes don't mind 50/60Hz when fed direct RGB.
I heard of that, do you have a nice step by step tutorial? Is the procedure standard for all discs? There are a few exclusives that I would like to speed up.
Nevertheless my point was about original discs
NormalFish
Banned
I'm also interested in details about this.
My impression is that this issue is actually an issue with the NTSC testations, and it isn't present in all models. Mind, this isn't a modded playstation. It's one of these:
I haven't looked in to it for a while, though. It's possible I misunderstood.
D.Lo
Member
Years ago I did a bunch of it, early PSP era. I ripped my PAL games and edited them with a windows app that converted them. You then had to use another app or hex edit to adjust the height of the display, because PAL is actually 625 lines, of which 576 are displayed, and the extra lines are at the top of the screen, so it always pushes the image down off the bottom of the screen when 'stretched' to NTSC.I heard of that, do you have a nice step by step tutorial? Is the procedure standard for all discs? There are a few exclusives that I would like to speed up.
Nevertheless my point was about original discs
It's fiddly as hell, and even when done perfectly can still be glitchy because those builds weren't play tested in 60Hz.
Long time ago. I'm all NTSCJ now.
sixteen-bit
Member
50 hertz? More like shitty hertz
speedlolita
Member
As a bloke in PAL land with an NTSC TEST machine myself I can give you a little insight into this.
I'm sure you're aware, but the PAL/NTSC issue with these consoles is only related to the PS1 side of things. A PlayStation 2 will default to the video region of the console for PlayStation games. Putting an NTSC game in a PAL TEST unit will have it running at 50Hz. Putting a PAL game into an NTSC TEST unit will have it running at 60Hz. If a game is PAL optimised it will be running too fast. Generally I would suggest to avoid running either configuration.
All of this is the same for any PlayStation 2 console, but obviously without a modchip you're not able to test this and most modchips have their own correctional facilities built in to compensate the differences.
Considering 50Hz PlayStation games are awful I like to consider my DTL-H30101 E the ultimate PlayStation 2. lol
D.Lo
Member
We need to remember PAL is a superior and 20 years more modern TV standard than NTSC. Higher resolution, more features (captions, teletext) and vastly superior colour. NTSC is a piece of crap colour system slapped on top of an ancient black and white image.
There's also no real perceptible difference in fluidity between 60Hz and 50Hz interlaced images, and the refresh rate was largely based on the alternatiion of local AC power supplies.
It's just that video games were dominated by Japanese companies (and some US companies), who developed for quirks of their own TV standards.
There's also no real perceptible difference in fluidity between 60Hz and 50Hz interlaced images, and the refresh rate was largely based on the alternatiion of local AC power supplies.
It's just that video games were dominated by Japanese companies (and some US companies), who developed for quirks of their own TV standards.
Charles Brandon
Member
yeah this fucks me off slightly as well. Our standard was best and you used it against us, god damnit!
speedlolita
Member
I'm just glad we don't have to worry about any of this pap any longer.
Lovely universal HD standards. For video games though, I'm perfectly happy with NTSC video.
Lovely universal HD standards. For video games though, I'm perfectly happy with NTSC video.
Ivan Amiibo
Banned
huh, i thought those just fixed the display, not a total conversion to 60hz. I probably don't fully understand how regions work tho. there's only 1 PAL ps1 game I wanted to play (Hellnight) and i used a pal-to-ntsc program to fix it up.
I run it on a DTL-H50001 with no problems. its not really a game that relies on strict timing or anything though.
So, I have the opportunity to purchase either a widescreen BVM or a 4:3 BVM.
I want to go widescreen because I love Wii games and all of them are in widescreen. But I also love GCN stuff. Will 4:3 gaming with borders cause burn-in or any other adverse affects on a widescreen CRT monitor? I'm trying to avoid spending $300 on both considering I already have no room left for more CRTs.
I want to go widescreen because I love Wii games and all of them are in widescreen. But I also love GCN stuff. Will 4:3 gaming with borders cause burn-in or any other adverse affects on a widescreen CRT monitor? I'm trying to avoid spending $300 on both considering I already have no room left for more CRTs.
sixteen-bit
Member
Maybe you could use Swiss to force widescreen on GCN games
I've played my Wii in widescreen since day1. I also occasionally play PS2 and GC games with or without widescreen depending on the games. There is no specific deformation due to displaying 4/3 on a 16/9 screen, having black borders instead of the TV bezel makes it look funny but you'll get over it eventually. There won't be any burn-in on the side because the electron beam won't scan the sides. In 4/3 mode, the beam behaves just like in a 4/3 tube.
Cool. Good to know. I'll ask if they have the bezel.
Charles Brandon
Member
Were there there any consoles that actually took advantage of PAL properly ans used the full resolution? Maybe the Amstrad one?
speedlolita
Member
Think it depends entirely on the software. Lots of stuff during that era of PlayStation was actually developed in the UK (Psygnosis for example) so the PAL version is technically the best version to get anyway...
Just a quick question - I ordered the XRGB Framemeister Mini and as far as I know, I'll need to look for a JP-21 pin cables in order for my old systems to work with it right? Is there a difference in quality between JP-21 and SCART? Should I be looking for a JP-21 to SCART converter?
Charles Brandon
Member
do the games actually make use of 576 lines though?
Charles Brandon
Member
Optimised 3D games do and extend the field of view, so you have slightly more information on screen. The ratio is still wrong though, and the gameplay is still 17% slower. Music and sound effect are usually good as it's using redbook audio and/or samples instead of chip-generated audio.
And having Europeans developers doesn't mean much. Tomb Raider was made in the UK and is "PAL-optimised": the field of view is bigger, Lara and the landscape are fatter, and she moves more slowly. The music is still at the correct pitch and there is no black bars so yay, PAL-optimised!
Sega Rally is the same, except the gameplay speed has been accelerated: the clock and the cars run at the correct speed and the European version can be used for records. The cars are still slightly vertically challenged though, and you can see more of the blue sky.
speedlolita
Member
One of these would be a better solution honestly.
https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk...emeister-xrgb-mini-passive-converter-for-sale
JP-21 and SCART are identical quality wise.
https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk...emeister-xrgb-mini-passive-converter-for-sale
JP-21 and SCART are identical quality wise.
Charles Brandon
Member
yup. that's what I when In talk about a convertor - that cable
That's a bad idea if you ever want to use a switch. And if you have more than one system, you want to use a switch.
Charles Brandon
Member
Thanks for that post. Very interesting.
speedlolita
Member
Running PAL Sega Rally on a 60Hz console is pretty fun.
Awesome! Just bought one of these and a PSX SCART cable. I can't wait to see it in action.
I wouldn't buy from Retro Gaming Cables UK. I have a few of theirs, and some of them have rusted pins. I think they're harvesting old cables without actually QCing them in some cases.
I have, however, never gotten anything short of a spectacular cable from Retro Console Accessories on eBay.
http://stores.ebay.com/Retro-Accessories
speedlolita
Member
I wouldn't buy from them either, I'd make my own adapter.
i tried the "make my own adapter" route and it didn't go so well. when i got a cable from Retro Accesories from ebay, the picture quality was leagues ahead of what i had hacked together and was much nicer looking.
unless you're a pro at soldering and making cables, the extra $$ for good cables is very worth it.
unless you're a pro at soldering and making cables, the extra $$ for good cables is very worth it.
robot
Member
I have 7 systems and don't use a switch. I don't switch systems too often though. It's not the end of the world if you need to switch out cables - the FM would be fine, it's the adapter or cables that would need replacing in a worst case scenario.
I disagree. The connector on the FM is definitely jostled whenever one changes what is connected to the adapter. I think over time it would get damaged. It's kind of an iffy little port.
Anyone have any idea why I can't get my UK made Supergun to sync correctly to my CRT TV?
I'm trying to run Progear (CPSII board) through a Toshiba CRT with a Euroscart cable through a YUV converter box and everything works except for the fact that I get a rolling picture. The converter box worked flawlessly with my Sega Saturn when I had one. Any ideas so I can actually play this game which was quite the investment?
Edit:
Well I'm just an idiot and had the JAMMA cable on the opposite way. Turned it around and bam, problem solved.
I'm trying to run Progear (CPSII board) through a Toshiba CRT with a Euroscart cable through a YUV converter box and everything works except for the fact that I get a rolling picture. The converter box worked flawlessly with my Sega Saturn when I had one. Any ideas so I can actually play this game which was quite the investment?
Edit:
Well I'm just an idiot and had the JAMMA cable on the opposite way. Turned it around and bam, problem solved.
IrishNinja
Member
#TeamCantAffordaGoodSwitch
#TeamJostleTheConnectors
#TeamJostleTheConnectors
speedlolita
Member
I have a Bandridge manual switch and would recommend it. I don't use it though, bit bulky for my liking when I can just individually plug into my Trinitron. Hold on to it for when I can accommodate the size mind.
sixteen-bit
Member
I like my Bandridge a lot. They're pretty hard to find nowadays, unfortunately.
Friend of Sonic
Member
That's really unfortunate. I should have sprung for a fourth one in case I ever wind up RGBing hardcore
I wouldn't do that. Scart sockets are fragile and prone to break with too much manipulation. Solder break and you have to wiggle the cable to display a picture. At least use a cable extender so you can break that instead of your TV. It's easy to repair, just redo the solder, but you have to open your TV and it can kill you.
theSlacker
Member
Sad since it wasn't so long ago that they became so popular because of being the easiest to find good quality switch.
Oh well, time to wait for that custom one to become more readily available.
Can you daisy chain them without signal loss? I'm out of inputs on mine.
Thanks! Guess I will just have to try out different possibilities. This sounds like the way I want it eventually, well including a few more consoles and different regionalized stuff.
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