H_Prestige
Banned
Are there really not any products in Japan with the number 4? And PS4 wouldn't even be said in Japanese. They always say the number in English.
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vg247-PS4: new kits shipping now, AMD A10 used as base, final version next summer
- Thread starter Globox_82
- Start date
Crysis 3 is one of them... And that's just the beginning.
Not sure if serious.
Lovely Salsa
Banned
You mean based on a ALPHA build? You got to be kidding me
Well if you think you can run Crysis 3 Ultra 1080p+ 60fps with no drops... Good luck.
Have you maxed out Crysis 2 Direct X 11 Max settings @ 60fps in 1080p or more?
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
That's not happening in the next 5 years.
I don't know why people are still expecting BC.
As for the used games situation... I'm expecting both Sony and Microsoft to implement something similar. I'm sure it wont be impossible to get around but it will still probably be ass.
I still have my money on Microsoft going with 8gb total system memory.
As for the used games situation... I'm expecting both Sony and Microsoft to implement something similar. I'm sure it wont be impossible to get around but it will still probably be ass.
I still have my money on Microsoft going with 8gb total system memory.
Canis lupus
Member
I don't even want PS3 BC, PS2 BC is something else, that I want.
True, but you have to take into consideration that you can change PC parts whenever you want. And console tech is here to stay unchanged for about 8 years.
If Sony is aiming for a general purpose system where CPU and GPU share tasks, CPU part becomes more important than in your average PC.
Canis lupus
Member
I don't know, Orbis sounds cool.
Lovely Salsa
Banned
ehh, yes I have....
What I was trying to say in my post is that the average dev isn't going to try to max out the system. Crytek is probably one of the devs that will
It does not. It's a rumour, one which got some things presumably wrong. I don't think you're going to see a set standard outside of the PR machine, and that's where scaling comes in anyway.
Worked for Vita.
Valueless statement.
Whatever.
That seems reasonable. Though I'm sure we'll see some experimental 4K nonsense eventually for games.
I'm going to have a fucking aneurysm from statements like these; they make me want to dismiss the list completely. It's absolutely embarrassing for this sentiment to continue when this entire forum is dedicated to gaming fans. Why don't people understand that the notion of a "standard" is nonsensical. More games in those configurations? Sure. Standard. Fuck off. But I'm sure there will be 100 more posts saying exactly this in the future. Stop. Please.
I don't buy used so this doesn't affect me personally; however, I am against it in principle and it would alter my decision-making process.
Online passes will be standard. I could even see disc-based games (non-online) needing some verification in order to be played.
What's the game to OS ratio? Best case scenario would be surplus amounts for each.
For every SKU? Downloadable titles are only going to increase in size -- as well as more retail titles being made available day 1. I hope some models still have an HDD.
Not important for me; it will not alter my buying decision.
Okay.
Good. PS+ is the best thing Sony has done as far as their online space is concerned. The service is fucking phenomenal. I could see PS+ including certain services like xgame chat for the PS4.
No. Traditional controllers are here to stay. Will not buy if true.
Yes -- but what else.
I'll predict advertisements all over PSN and eventually in games. We already saw inklings of that in InFamous 2. It varies on a case-by-case basis. If I see a Doritos add in a fantasy game, I will not continue playing it. Having adds in a GTA type game is okay. I think it even adds to the experience. If it approaches dashboard levels of absurdity I will reeavulate my stance.
Reiterates some of the sentiment in this thread. I still don't think we know.
What's that U.S.? $499 for the best SKU is fine with me. I still believe Sony will take a loss but it will be smaller amount and for a smaller length of time. They'll make it back via priced services like PS+.
It confirms nothing
It's speculation from a magazine.I hope 1080p is not mandated as a minimum though. I would like devs to have the flexibility to go lower and boost per-pixel computation if they want.
My 1080p native monitor is ecstatic about this too. Current gen looks terrible on my poor little feller (specially subHD games).
Just like we saw a standard of 720p this gen, correct? Otherwise they'll be in violation of Section 1.a of the Manual on Standardized Resolution. They'll be fined $10,000 per pixel below 1080p. Every time the frame-rate dips below 60fps, a government agent will execute a programmer.
It would be absurd for a company to require a resolution output. It'll vary. You'll see a slew of 720p/30fps games. However, I will say games will not aim for anything lower than this. No more 644p or whatever absurd resolutions Halo/CoD are in. Frame-rates will of course dip below. What we can hope for is the avoidance of a graphics race; hopefully, more developers will see value in 720p/60fps or some other combination -- even if they lose fidelity elsewhere.
JimmyRustler
Member
This. I don't expect it either.
With the currently overblown games market no one would even buy PS4 games for a long time without full BC. It would take ages to establish the new consoles.
I'd really love to see the next gen consoles completely seperating each other from the old one. Even full Gamerscore/Trophy resett.
In this case... For a few games at Xbox 360's launch
I think a more inhuman torture would be to force them to play a console game at 540p.
The vast majority of HDTV are 1080p native, and this further cements my belief that 1080p will be to next-gen what 720 has been to current gen.
Seriously I don't think we will see 720p games at all next-gen, they still have room for lower resolutions if they deem it necessary. For instance, 1280*1080 is perfectly fine.
jeff_rigby
Banned
I have no confirmed information but it appears that Sony wants to support 4K TV and a technology lecture slide show that you found by a Sony Technical officer has 300FPS and 10X GPU to support 5 separate glassless S3D views on a 4K TV at 1080P@30hz. This goes way beyond the power necessary to support 1080P@60hz so if one is true then I expect the other is true. This also can't be supported by the current HDMI standards but can be supported by Display Port and specs for AMDs Eyefinity can support this. http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43333077&postcount=59It confirms nothing
I hope 1080p is not mandated as a minimum though. I would like devs to have the flexibility to go lower and boost per-pixel computation if they want.
http://eandt.theiet.org/magazine/2011/12/maasaki-tsu-interview.cfm said:
To get the performance to support this implies a 22nm SOI SoC or a horribly expensive 28nm bulk APU + GPU and two pools of memory with a as yet undisclosed connection between APU and GPU that supports a 2014 design full HSA for the discrete GPU. One rumor has this and a very quick 2014 refresh to a 1 SoC 22nm design.
Target does imply they will try for it but may not implement if the cost is too high. 1.8Tf is about 10X and is in several rumors.
However ridiculous that might sound to you I still think (like, really) that SW1313 and Watch_Dogs don't "need" a GTX 680 but were demoed on such hardware because they are not fully optimized yet.
I'm sure that those games will run just as good on the Orbis/Durango even if those machines don't have a GTX680.
Architecture efficiency is not a myth, this generation has proved it.
Yes, I still stand by my belief that at launch we will see games like WD or SW1313 and they will look just as good as when they were demoed at E3 2012.
You can quote this post if you want, I will woefully admit I was wrong if it turns out otherwise.
gundamkyoukai
Member
I expect more than a APU from both MS and SONY if it's a APU only the system better be cheap as hell like $300 .
Unless they really do some changes a APU only system is going to be a joke gfx wise after 8 years .
Not having BC or can't play used games don't affect me so i don't care about that .
Unless they really do some changes a APU only system is going to be a joke gfx wise after 8 years .
Not having BC or can't play used games don't affect me so i don't care about that .
Whatever components Sony decides to bring in, I hope they cater their efforts towards a more balanced design this time around. My hope would be a Gamecube +++ architectue; one that is powerful enough not to be ridiculed by MS coming machine -which I expect to be more powerful- so that it runs multis without many concessions, while giving first party developers sufficient potential to express their technical and artistic visions. The PS3 could have ended up just as powerful as it turned out to be without the overengineering trip it suffered : The poor yields on the Cell, the last minute GC addition, the BR incorporation...
I am wondering whether ND, Guerilla and SM have had their say in the final architecture of the machine...
I am wondering whether ND, Guerilla and SM have had their say in the final architecture of the machine...
I would guess heavily.
One part of the vg247 rumour is that 'The hardware is not being made in Japan' - I do not think that is a reference to manufacturing (systems have not been made in Japan for ages), but a reference to the machine's design being led outside of Japan for the first time.
A part of me also hopes it means much heavier involvement of SCEA/SCEE in the OS design. I think SCEJ did a good job with Vita's OS, but I am sure SCEA/SCEE have good ideas here too.
Any next gen playstation console released by sony that does not have BC with ps3 and psn games will be considered as a failure in my opinion. It is bad enough to forgo disk based games but if i cant transfer my psn games to a new system then it will be the first sony console i dont buy at launch.
Sure they don't, far from it even.
Sure they don't, far from it even.
We will see.
Those are "early" next-gen titles. They are not representative of anything we will see later in the next-generation (which will vastly surpass those games I believe), this leads me to believe whatever MS and Sony come up with won't have any trouble running SW1313 or Watch_Dogs at 1080p/30fps.
I know they are one and the same thing, but I'm more concerned about BC on PSN compared to retail discs. Sure a lot of PSN games might not be as optomised as retail games or coded as close to the metal, but stuff like Journey would have no chance. I even heard somewhere they devoted 3 SPE's of the Cell just for the sand animation alone.
Quite interested in the BC via USB dongle method. I'd buy one. For those more tech minded, how much do you think such a dongle would cost? Would they only need the Cell with the rest of the PS4 emulating everything else?
Quite interested in the BC via USB dongle method. I'd buy one. For those more tech minded, how much do you think such a dongle would cost? Would they only need the Cell with the rest of the PS4 emulating everything else?
It has nothing to do with wanting. Quite simply, unless all the hardware rumours are wrong, the only way to do BC would be to include (almost) an entire Cell in the system. And it seems like they don't want to do that.
I really think there would be a ton wrong with a 4 core Jaguar. Even if you somehow get developers to put all their FP centric code that is suitable for GPGPU on the GPU. Which you won't.
These cores are already tiny enough that they really should be putting more in there.
I think this is the most positive rumor in a while, except for the in-game ads part (which would be enough for me on its own to make me refuse buying any games that suffer from it).
You'd basically need an entire PS3, except for the disc drive. Even with USB3 you don't have the BW to have PS4 "partially" do any emulation.
NemesisPrime
Banned
Most Japanese companies will avoid it when possible.
I see. That would be one big dongle! Still if they did do one, and it was under £70, I'd get it. I'd just sell my PS3 to make the difference
CadetMahoney
Member
because as much as ppl say "it doesn't matter", in reality the competition having flawless account migration and all their retail and digital games still working out the box will make a difference.
Without cell hardware somewhere inside (increasing the base cost of console) then it's unlikely as re-coding costs money too.
Chuck Norris
Banned
Yakuza 4, Final Fantasy 4, Monster Hunter 4, Resident Evil 4, MGS4, Dragon Quest 4, SMT4...
Talk about an urban legend
BradleyLove
Member
I don't get why Sony or Microsoft would implement the blocking of used games at a hardware or OS level. It simply makes no sense when an online pass system for all games can be easily implemented by the publishers. Or to use an existing example, Steam and license keys (aka online passes).
Gemüsepizza
Member
Not all games have and should have online modes.
Maybe Sony is pushing for devs to go 1080p and/or 60 early in the generation and as the generation goes on, and the cost per pixel rises, devs go back down to 720p30. It would make sense to have higher resolutions early in the generation, where these consoles aren't pushed quite as hard. Plus it would be a cheaper way to have better looking games.
Also, there was a tweet recently that MS has been communicating something similar to devs too, at least regarding the resolution.
So maybe there's some truth to it. Though I think this rule will change or be dropped if it's really there.
You don't need super duper powerful tech to be expensive, the 360 wasn't quite as exotic as the ps3 and it was expensive at launch as well. Also I expect at least one of the SKUs to be $500, easily. On top of the perceived value, especially against the $349 Wii-U, you have to keep inflation in mind.
Higher resolution games are usually easier to do early in the generation, not later when developers try to do more per pixel, so the cost goes up. IF we see any 4K games, they'll likely be the smaller download games that look like shit comparatively.
Also, since when has a rumor confirmed anything? The whole point of something being a rumor is that it's not confirmed.
I could be wrong, but I thought I read FP registers of some kind were a good possibility. I find it hard to believe that they wouldn't do some customization with the cores.
How do we know the competition will have flawless BC or are you talking about just the Wii-U?
In the grand scheme of things, it really doesn't matter.
JimmyRustler
Member
BC didn't really matter at the start of this gen, what makes you think it will matter the next? The vast majority of people rather plays new games instead of old ones. BC would be a waste of money for both Sony and Microsoft.
NemesisPrime
Banned
When possible...
Plenty of hotels in Japan without a room 4.
But yeah.... attitudes are changing.
I think the proliferation of digital libraries and account systems might make a difference. It could also lead to gamers being less willing to migrate to a different manufacturer's ecosystem.
The start of the gen didn't have digital games, xbla etc so its different.
This, I think next gen will see gamers being less fluid about moving from one console to another. With online being so big this gen, your more tied into a console. I play pretty regularly with friends and family on the xbox, always in a party. If the next xbox comes out and even a couple of them get the next xbox and day one they can play along with us on xbox live etc then everyone of the rest of us will love over tot he new xbox in time
Brad Grenz
Member
Well, it doesn't have to be USB. But even if you're right, being able to piggyback on the PS4's optical drive, hard drive, networking, Bluetooth, power supply and a/v output would be a substantial savings over an actual PS3. I could see a sub $100 backwards compatibility accessory in late 2013, even with a full Cell and RSX inside plus memory for both.