Transformers 1 is better than Attack of the Clones. I'm serious and I say that as a Star Wars fan.It's better than all four Transformers movies.
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Which film was worse...The Phantom Menace or Attack of the Clones?
- Thread starter SpaceWolf
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partyphone
Banned
All the Transformers films are better than Attack of the Clones. There is nothing controversial about that. AoC is really a complete dreck of a film. The film is tonal all over the place, where it has no sense of where it wants to be or what it wants to do.
With PM, you had a very clear goal in mind. Save the Queen, get her to Coruscant, save her people. Everything else complimented it. The tone of the film also kept with the same tone as the original film. It was a more fun, light hearted adventure.
Attack of the Clones was a mess. Obi is on a mystery, Anakin is playing house and dealing with mommy issues, The Jedi are playing politics, and we have no idea who the villain is till the movie is done in 30 minutes. It's like half PM, half ROTS without committing to either. Do you want to be a more fun adventure like PM or a darker tale like ROTS?
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
ESB>TFA>ANH>ROTJ>ROTS>TPM>poop>AOTC
brandonh83
Banned
Made sense to me. Vader wasn't ruined for me either. No amount of personal explanation will matter in this conversation.
Ew fuck no.
FlaygletheBagel
Banned
Rewatched both with a friend of mine recently. Both movies are tough to make it through, but AOTC is a literal snoozefest. There's nothing redeemable about that movie; not even the end lightsaber fight is entertaining! At least TPM had Darth Maul and a reasonably compelling lightsaber fight at the end. Without those factors in TPM, both movies would be about even in the suck department.
User 479360
Banned
Attack of the Clones. It's not even close. That movie is pure and utter shit. The Phantom Menace wasn't close to that bad.
Empire > A New Hope > Jedi > The Force Awakens >> Episode III > The Phantom Menace >>>>>>> Attack of the Clones
Empire > A New Hope > Jedi > The Force Awakens >> Episode III > The Phantom Menace >>>>>>> Attack of the Clones
partyphone
Banned
what is a personal explanation mean in this context? you can't deny that everyone in the movie is an idiot and anakin's fall to the dark side is completely unearned. now maybe that doesn't bother you, which is incredible, but the movie is shit from top to bottom.
brandonh83
Banned
It means I have opinions about a movie that you clearly wouldn't agree with going by the tone of your posts so I'm deducting it as a waste of time for both our sakes in addition to prequel arguments already being beaten into the ground.
It's nothing personal.
partyphone
Banned
it's an opinion you can't defend because it's wrong.
brandonh83
Banned
I... rest my case?
I can defend it. I have before. You have super negative feelings toward the film. I don't see why I need to hammer out some personal, subjective viewpoints when you're just gonna continue being an ass about it. It's absolutely pointless, which was my original point.
EatinOlives
Member
TPM was shit for Kid Anakin (not the actor, the character), the completely aimless plot, Jar Jar Binks, and the painful mishandling of Maul.
AOTC was garbage for the cringefest "romance" scenes, tons of characters acting like dumbasses, hundreds of Jedi swigning their swords like idiots, and Yoda's comic-relief fight (it's so bad it's basically comic relief).
It's really, really hard to choose. I'm gonna go with AOTC because by that point Lucas really should have known what went wrong and what to do. TPM I could be a little more lenient on the count of having to start up cold (yes, we know that wasn't a problem at all with Force Awakens, but still).
AOTC was garbage for the cringefest "romance" scenes, tons of characters acting like dumbasses, hundreds of Jedi swigning their swords like idiots, and Yoda's comic-relief fight (it's so bad it's basically comic relief).
It's really, really hard to choose. I'm gonna go with AOTC because by that point Lucas really should have known what went wrong and what to do. TPM I could be a little more lenient on the count of having to start up cold (yes, we know that wasn't a problem at all with Force Awakens, but still).
User 479360
Banned
I really hate Attack of the Clones.
Shmuppers
Member
I second this. Transformers was at least fun to watch
cj_iwakura
Member
It is the worst one, because it's terrible screenwriting trying to be a carbon copy of Episode IV. The world building was absolute garbage.
Why is the Resistance separate from the New Republic? Read a book!
Why is the New Order so powerful now? *shrug*
What are all those planets they destroyed and why should I care?
The only elements that were even halfway decent were Finn and the ace rebel pilot, because it was actually original. Everything else should have been put through an air lock.
PdotMichael
Banned
Unlike the prequels where they made a children cartoon to tell everything that happens between episode 2 and episode 3.
cj_iwakura
Member
You don't need the Clone Wars to expand on the battles that happen between them, it's just nice to have. (Personally, I think it was like bad fanfiction. Darth Maul coming back? Sure, why not.)
Force Awakens badly needed some background detail, but we didn't get any, or it was all on the cutting room floor.
Spacejaws
Member
I agree on your points.
And why does a big ass laser shot from one planet reach another planet without any time for them to prepare/evacuate. Planets are not 5 minutes apart, or was the Order on Couresants moon? I don't know why that little piece of logic of one planet shooting at another isn't being ridiculed.
Other than your points I think the movie did a good job building likeable commradrie between the cast (poe should have stayed dead though, seems utterly generic and boring) but the scenario was nonsense.
I liked them both, not as good as the original but still enjoyable. I did, however, find Harden Christensen to be really irritating anytime he was on screen, he's clearly a terrible actor hence why the love scenes are so cringe worthy.
Also, I like Jar Jar so Phantom Menace wins.
Also, I like Jar Jar so Phantom Menace wins.
cj_iwakura
Member
The movie was well made. It was just built on terrible material.
The prequels have good ideas, and bad execution. In a way, they're the exact opposite.
I think the idea of love being what brought Anakin to the dark side was brilliant, but it falls flat on its face when you have romantic scenes that are as wooden as Pinocchio.
(I also think their chemistry was far better in RotS, but too little, too late.)
PdotMichael
Banned
Unlike your nitpicking about random details, because they didn't really hurt the flow of the movie.
The jump from episode 2 to 3 was the most jarring thing ever. Not just that we never got an explenation why there is a war in the first place suddenly the chancellor is kidnapped and we are somehow supposed to know Grievous
LookAtMeGo
Member
I can watch TPM. Clones is one of the worst movies I've ever seen. I try to force myself to watch it every once in a while because I can never remember anything that happens but I just cant make it through the whole movie. I dont even know if I've ever seen it from start to finish and I was there on opening night in the theatres. Clones and Crystal Skull can go to hell.
I agree that the world building could have been significantly better but my god if you think TFA is a worse film than AToC.
That's just straight up delusional.
The relationship between Han, Leia and Ben wasn't original? Kylo's story and how it impacted Luke wasn't original? Rey's character and personality weren't original?
Lots of willful denial here.
cj_iwakura
Member
It's an opinion, and I stand by it. TFA is the only SW film I have no interest in ever watching again. At least AToC has interesting elements like Kamino and Coruscant. TFA is just one giant retread.
LookAtMeGo
Member
Its a horrible opinion though.
cj_iwakura
Member
God forbid someone criticize a film everyone seems to love.
I suggest rewatching it then. I did not like TFA the first time I saw it. I edited my post above btw.
LookAtMeGo
Member
Thats fine. To each there own but I just cant wrap my head around how someone could think TFA is as bad or worse than Clones. It just doesnt compute.
cj_iwakura
Member
I have, I watched it again on the flight to Tokyo. It's a very well made film with a terrible script. It has good ideas built around copying familiar territory.
All the things you say are good elements, but when they're built around Rebels VS Empire VS Death Star: Third Edition, it falls flat. The script felt thin.
I could go on about things that just flat out irritate me, especially Snoke. Guess we better have a new Emperor! Who is this guy? Who cares!
And no, 'student goes rogue and wipes out the Jedi Academy' isn't original, pretty sure it's been in at least three books. At least the books build up the students and have you care about them.
In TFA we get a thirty second flash back of a bunch of faceless people getting massacred.
Subpar Scrub
Banned
Hahaha omg I forgot about this shit. Why do they spin so much?!
There's a vast difference between criticizing TFA and being unable to recognize it being an overall superior film in comparison to AToC. Can anyone really deny that's it's made better? Opinions are opinions but I can't wrap my head around that.
cj_iwakura
Member
It is made better, I'm not contesting that. But the script is garbage. A ton of love went into TFA. The look, acting, even the art design, it's all great.
And, sadly, wasted.
So the script is "garbage" because it's got surface similarities with ANH? I think you're being pretty unrealistic about how many things TFA actually does quite differently.
cj_iwakura
Member
I've already voiced my complaints with how poorly TFA explains or builds on even the most crucial elements of its backstory.
I still plan to watch Episode VIII, and I'm hoping it's going to fill in the blanks TFA didn't even touch, but I'm not very optimistic.
MidnightCowboy
Member
The Phantom Menace is mediocre, Attack of the Clones is pure garbage.
cj_iwakura
Member
To answer the question, I honestly think it's Phantom Menace(of the two), because the opening text scroll still makes my head hurt. I have no clue what the hell is going on with the taxation route drama to this day. It's really confusing. AotC cuts right to it, and fixes a ton of TPM's flaws(namely the JJ focus).
I enjoyed the build up for Anakin and Palpatine's rise to power, but the rest needed serious work.
I enjoyed the build up for Anakin and Palpatine's rise to power, but the rest needed serious work.
Ennosuke
Member
I said it earlier TFA is a well made film and I think this is something everyone cam agree. I wouldn't say something like thid about AToC. But the story and worl building are so bad in TFA, I feel disappointed on the same level as others feel about AToC. In both cases too much wasted potential, what a shame.
El-Guap-Cakes
Member
I look at the positives of both films. Phantom Menace had the most epic lightsaber fight ever.
And say what you will, but when I was a kid, this scene from AOTC got me so hyped up. I had never seen so many Jedi in one place before, and it blew my mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fP7YJtjbZY
And say what you will, but when I was a kid, this scene from AOTC got me so hyped up. I had never seen so many Jedi in one place before, and it blew my mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fP7YJtjbZY
brandonh83
Banned
I don't know what's worse, 20 years of the same repetitive prequel hate or 8 months of TFA = retread.
But I guess the former at least has some validity to it?
But I guess the former at least has some validity to it?
Attack of the Clones is worse for me
The movie is such a chore to sit through that I always skip straight to the end with all the action bits. Even then, Phantom Menace still has a better ending duel (also Duel of the Fates is still the GOAT)
Same here. I got obsessed with Star Wars for a while after seeing that (that was even how I got exposed to the Star Wars EU).
The movie is such a chore to sit through that I always skip straight to the end with all the action bits. Even then, Phantom Menace still has a better ending duel (also Duel of the Fates is still the GOAT)
Same here. I got obsessed with Star Wars for a while after seeing that (that was even how I got exposed to the Star Wars EU).
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