Wrasslin Discussion: Week of June 26th.

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Hydro_Alexis said:
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It really isn't that hard to follow....

It was in response to
The_geche said:
How many people would love to cane a member of Creative?
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I'd like to do a little MORE than cane the creative staff.
 
credit: 411mania.com-
From Chikara last weekend: After the match there was a Brawl between all of the Chikara Tecnicos and Rudos. After they were separated, Chikara Director of Fun Leonard F. Chikarason came out and said that he just got off the phone with a Chikara big wig and pointed to the screen. Upon doing so, a message from the "Chikara Commissioner" came on, and when the mystery person revealed his face. It was none other than BOB SAGET, who announced that at the July 22nd show in Hellertown, it would be Jigsaw vs. Icarus in a mask vs. Hair match.
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Some news for you, and its not good:
Credit goes to the PWinsider.com elite hotline for this news, most of which covers ECW:


*BIG Kurt Angle News: Kurt is going to be taking some time off. It is NOT injury related, it could be something personal. It could be (this is speculation, not fact, that Angle may not be as happy in ECW as he thought he would be--he arrived at the ECW show in Philly at the last minute and has been far less social backstage than he has been in the past on other brands. Angle will be gone likely for several months after he takes his leave of absence.

*Paul Heyman is officially off the main booking of ECW. Heyman had a little bit of say in the first match and last match of this week's show, but that was it. Vince & Kevin Dunn booked the middle portion of the show, and informed Heyman prior to the show Dunn would head the booking team for ECW now, Heyman will now be the head writer.

*Gunner Scott is being sent back to OVW. Management doesn't feel he has gotten over enough with the fans. Look for his last appearance in a while to happen this week on Smackdown.

*WWE has decided to move away from making ECW an "alternative" product and more of third WWE brand. In other words, expect more backstage segments and RAW-esque storylines.
*Sabu's push won't be affected by any of this. WWE management is very high on Sabu based on his performance since joining the company.

*People Heyman were interested in bringing (CM Punk) *may* not be brought in with quite the push they were going to have originally.
*Heyman will continue to come up with ideas for new characters, as longs as fit more of a WWE style mold.

*Tommy Dreamer does not have any booking/creative control at the moment over the product.

*All the ECW originals you saw on the show last night were the only ones brought to the show. London/Kendrick were not brought up yesterday either. WWE had nothing for these people to do and have a different budget to juggle with the combined ECW/Smackdown rosters on the same show.

*Smackdown had some random drug testing at their house show last Saturday (a lot of wrestlers didn't expectto be tested at house shows). I agree with PWinsider.com that this is a good thing, as now wrestlers really will have to not abuse substances because testing can happen anytime anywhere.

*Testing was also done for several wrestlers prior to Vengeance.
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I think Vince just likes to kill his shit on purpose so he can build it up again and market himself as a genius.

Wrestling was fun for a while, but it looks like MMA is the way to go now. I'll see you guys in the UFC threads.
 
Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
I think Vince just likes to kill his shit on purpose so he can build it up again and market himself as a genius.

Wrestling was fun for a while, but it looks like MMA is the way to go now. I'll see you guys in the UFC threads.
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Yeah, looks like the one good idea to come out of WWE in awhile is going to be Tuesday night RAW, just as people feared.
 
Some more info-
From PWInsider's hotline last night:

A meeting was held before last night's Smackdown/ECW taping with Vince McMahon, Kevin Dunn, and Paul Heyman. The decision has been made to pretty much break away from all the old ECW characters, ideas, and style of booking. The new plan is to make the show a full fledged third C brand of the WWE.

Vince McMahon was really let down by the reaction of the crowd at the ECW Arena house show, last week's 15% ratings drop, and the so far low ticket sales for the Smackdown/ECW tapings especially for the July 4th taping at the Wachovia Center. Those things were said to be huge factors in this decision.

Paul Heyman now has even less control over the product while Tommy Dreamer has none. Heyman did script last night's show but alot of it was re-written by the WWE writers. Heyman did book the Sabu segment, as well as the RVD/Angle segment, but the rest of the show was because of Vince and the rest of creative. Also for the first two weeks Heyman was in charge of running the shows backstage but that all changed last night as the show was ran pretty much like the usual for Raw and Smackdown.

A decision has been made starting with last night's taping to only fly in the ECW wrestlers that are scripted to work on the show. Only for the house show events will the entire roster be flown in.

Also the old ECW referees are expected to get the axe very soon like former ECW ring announcer Stephen D'angelous did last week.

Kurt Angle will be taking time off very soon. As of late, Kurt Angle has been walking around like "the walking dead". People say that he's hurting all over all the time, but being injured isn't what he's taking time off for, and instead it's because of some sort of personal issue.

Kurt Angle stayed totally to himself at the last ECW show Tuesday night and hasn't been sociable at all with anyone in ECW. He also showed up very late for the ECW show at the ECW Arena. They speculate that Kurt Angle is now looking at everything like this just isn't worth his time anymore (being in ECW that is).
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Best idea the WWE has had in years and they're about to **** it up royally here. Unlike Smackdown, ECW had the potential to be seen a truely different and unique brand of wrestling, something that could have taken a big bite out of the current TNA demograhic. If they really are going to minimize Heyman's role and move towards making ECW "Raw Redux", they're setting themselves up for massive backlash as well as cutting into their profits in the long term on several fronts (I highly doubt future ECW DVD and product releases will sell at the same level as previous outings if the WWE incarnation becomes synonymous with a watered down, bastardization). They had a platform to create new stars and tap into a hardcore (no pun intended) base of wrestling fans who have been generally dissatisfied with pro wrestling in the past few years... and they're pissing it away.
 
From PWInsider.com
This week's edition of ECW on Sci Fi did a 2.2 cable rating, with a 4 share. That is down slightly from last week's 2.3 cable rating. The good news for the show is that the numbers built throughout the program, starting with a 1.9 quarter hour, going to a 2.1, then a 2.3, 2.3 and a 2.5.
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Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
I think Vince just likes to kill his shit on purpose so he can build it up again and market himself as a genius.

Wrestling was fun for a while, but it looks like MMA is the way to go now. I'll see you guys in the UFC threads.
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Sad part is I knew he'd do it. It's really a no win situation.

Just like I said, if it's a succes Vince will take allt he credit...tehn kill it.
If it's a bomb, Vince will blame Paul....then kill it.

Point being, he didn't create it, so it must be destroyed.

The real winner in all of this? TNA.
They'll get a nice roster boost after the plug is pulled on ECW after it's summer run.
 
*BIG Kurt Angle News: Kurt is going to be taking some time off. It is NOT injury related, it could be something personal. It could be (this is speculation, not fact, that Angle may not be as happy in ECW as he thought he would be--he arrived at the ECW show in Philly at the last minute and has been far less social backstage than he has been in the past on other brands. Angle will be gone likely for several months after he takes his leave of absence.

*Paul Heyman is officially off the main booking of ECW. Heyman had a little bit of say in the first match and last match of this week's show, but that was it. Vince & Kevin Dunn booked the middle portion of the show, and informed Heyman prior to the show Dunn would head the booking team for ECW now, Heyman will now be the head writer.

*Gunner Scott is being sent back to OVW. Management doesn't feel he has gotten over enough with the fans. Look for his last appearance in a while to happen this week on Smackdown.

*WWE has decided to move away from making ECW an "alternative" product and more of third WWE brand. In other words, expect more backstage segments and RAW-esque storylines.
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...well then. If anything I hope ECW becomes the "purple" brand and they get a better set.
 
Why Heyman is still the lead writer and most people seemed to enjoy the show this week had you not known he had little to do with that you wouldn't have second guessed it.
 
Christopher said:
Why Heyman is still the lead writer and most people seemed to enjoy the show this week had you not known he had little to do with that you wouldn't have second guessed it.
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I'll still watch, but my optimism will be gone.
 
Christopher said:
Why Heyman is still the lead writer and most people seemed to enjoy the show this week had you not known he had little to do with that you wouldn't have second guessed it.
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It's confirmed that he booked the two good parts.

It's not hard to see that we'll be unsatisfied now that Vince is in charge and the whole show will be the bad parts of this week's show.
 
Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
It's confirmed that he booked the two good parts.

It's not hard to see that we'll be unsatisfied now that Vince is in charge and the whole show will be the bad parts of this week's show.
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I can see Heyman having a few good nights of drinking this summer.
 
It's amazing how Vince can understand some audiences so well to be able to create an international multimedia monster, yet at the same time can't understand the most simple and basic desires of other audiences.

It's really unbelievable.

Ratings dropped, the ECW crowd wasn't happy, and Smackdown and ECW aren't mutually drawing crowds for one another the way they wanted? I WONDER WHY THAT IS.

How Vince can't see that his solution IS the problem in the first place is just stunning...and very very McMahon.
 
I don't know how he doesn't see the potential in the last two ECW PPVs and how badass it would be if they just copied TNA and wrestled in the Hammerstein every week. It would be just an incredible weekly atmosphere, and you know Heyman would book to that crowd perfectly.

TNA's atmosphere that they've created with the same crowd in that same little arena every week is just infectious, even if some of them are ugly rednecks and their chants are annoying. There's just something great about booking to a small, loyal crowd and everyone on TV watching and getting caught up in the moment with them. WWE show #3 is just redundant and no one wants it.
 
****. ****. ****.

Ugh. Poor RVD. Poor CM Punk, whose great push died stillborn. And poor Heyman. If I were Paul E., I would seriously give Vince the finger and call up TNA to see if they needed a booker.
 
pilonv1 said:
At least Brent Albright is going back to OVW so CM Punk will have someone else to feud with.
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What's irritating is that they didn't give Albright a chance at ALL to try and get over. They didn't give him anything to work with!

It's almost as if they call these guys up just to fail.
 
Everyone in this thread pretty much predicted Vince would do this, but it still sucks none the less. He didn't even give it a chance, though. We all said his Ego would get in the way and that is exactly what happened. Heyman booked ONS I and it was a resounding success critically, by both the fans and wrestling media. Vince mostly booked ONS II and while it was entertaining(atleast compared to most of his PPVs) it wasn't as well recieved. Vince booked the first ECW on Sci-Fi show and EVERYONE hated, Heyman booked the 2nd and everyone loved it.

The ratings have been good(better than SD's) so he can't possibly expect that excuse to fly. How did he expect the crowd to react at the ECW arena? All counts said it was run EXACTLY like a WWE houseshow--so of course the crowd let him have it. Vince didn't even give it a chance to succeed on it's own merits--this was obviously his plan from the start.

I sort of knew something was up this past tuesday when during the opener styles was like "This is an extreme rules match--meaning everything goes"..I was like Uhhh isn't that supposed to be with every ECW match? And sure enough no more 'extreme' stuff was done for the rest of the show.
 
Only took 3 shows for McMahon to take away ECW from Heyman. Sad. That wraps it up totally. Oh well, I got the cool RVD/Angle match out of it. I feel sorry for all the ECWers stuck in a C level WWE program now. I guess it's a paycheck though.

Back to puro for me. =x
 
Kintaro said:
Only took 3 shows for McMahon to take away ECW from Heyman. Sad. That wraps it up totally. Oh well, I got the cool RVD/Angle match out of it. I feel sorry for all the ECWers stuck in a C level WWE program now. I guess it's a paycheck though.

Back to puro for me. =x
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Well, Guys like Doring, Credible, and CW Anderson i.e. older ECW guys who they have no intentions on EVER pushing could be on their way out, as one report said--in favor of some development talent.

We'll see, though. This tuesday's show will be a good indication of what we should expect from now on. Heyman is still lead writer, and has gotten his way more than most people not named Steph do with Vince, so hopefully he'll atleast have a thumb print on the programming.

I still say that Punk should take Punk and go to TNA. IMO Tna should take on the WWE head on. Monday nights from 8pm-10pm just like Nitro did. Even if they lose everyweek, the buzz created by the return of the "Monday Night wars" will easily get TNA higher ratings than the 0.8-1.2 ratings they've been seeing.
 
Nameless said:
Well, Guys like Doring, Credible, and CW Anderson i.e. older ECW guys who they have no intentions on EVER pushing could be on their way out, as one report said--in favor of some development talent.

We'll see, though. This tuesday's show will be a good indication of what we should expect from now on. Heyman is still lead writer, and has gotten his way more than most people not named Steph do with Vince, so hopefully he'll atleast have a thumb print on the programming.

I still say that Punk should take Punk and go to TNA. IMO Tna should take on the WWE head on. Monday nights from 8pm-10pm just like Nitro did. Even if they lose everyweek, the buzz created by the return of the "Monday Night wars" will easily get TNA higher ratings than the 0.8-1.2 ratings they've been seeing.
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TNA is almost there.

They need to get it in their head that people like Samoa Joe and AJ Styles should have the NWA belt, not the X Division belt. Some of the new guys need to be pushed into main event status. This was one of the problems with WCW, as I recall, and it is currently TNA's problem.

We definitely don't need to see Jeff Jarrett win the NWA belt AGAIN. We don't need to see ex WCW and WWE guys win the belt 8000 times. We need to see guys like Sting, Jarrett, and Steiner, feud with the newer guys, and let the newer guys get a few title holds. We need to give them a good push, and makes some names as TNA stars, not just WCW and WWE stars in TNA.

Whenever TNA realizes that they aren't going to make all of their money on taking talent that is fed up with the WWE, and begins to really utilize the awesome young talent we know they have, we will see a war.
 
CM Punk dropped the OVW title last night, so that probably means he'll be going up to ECW full-time!!!! *knocks on wood* I don't think even Vince could ruin CM Punk *knocks on wood*
 
Nameless said:
CM Punk dropped the OVW title last night, so that probably means he'll be going up to ECW full-time!!!! *knocks on wood* I don't think even Vince could ruin CM Punk *knocks on wood*
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They'll probably make him a drug using child molesting ice cream man.....who talks with a lisp.
 
I hope CM Punks comes in and royally sucks or has some lame gimmick for all the ****ing times I hear his name in this thread that would make me a happy man.
 
Bloodwake said:
TNA is almost there.

They need to get it in their head that people like Samoa Joe and AJ Styles should have the NWA belt, not the X Division belt. Some of the new guys need to be pushed into main event status. This was one of the problems with WCW, as I recall, and it is currently TNA's problem.

We definitely don't need to see Jeff Jarrett win the NWA belt AGAIN. We don't need to see ex WCW and WWE guys win the belt 8000 times. We need to see guys like Sting, Jarrett, and Steiner, feud with the newer guys, and let the newer guys get a few title holds. We need to give them a good push, and makes some names as TNA stars, not just WCW and WWE stars in TNA.

Whenever TNA realizes that they aren't going to make all of their money on taking talent that is fed up with the WWE, and begins to really utilize the awesome young talent we know they have, we will see a war.
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Well if you read the TNA taping spoilers, the next PPV is looking like it could set up Joe to win the belt in rapid fashion. So it's a thing they are starting to remedy. IT's almost as if Cornette is doing a little booking to go with the on-air role.

As for ECW. I was talking to my wife and eas considering getting one of the ECW football jerseys that WWEShopzone is selling. Bear in mind she doesn't watch any wrestling, but she'll occasionally catch a show with me.

Wegot to talking about ordering the jersey and she said something that floored me.
"Why order it? ECW is going to flop anyway."
That stunned me, so I asked her why..
"Vince is in control. He's the reason I won't watch any of the shows with you anymore. It's crap."
Maybe she's right. Then I told her about Heyman getting control yanked and she just replied with a "told ya so". Maybe she's been right all along and I've been viewing things through rose/nostalgia colored glasses.

I WANT ECW to succeed. They manage to get more wrestling on that show in an hour than they get one their two hour shows. I just want something hard edged and catered to more of my more matured tastes. Basically I wanted something TNA already provides, an alternative from the soap opera BS.
 
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