SportsFan581
Member
Must have been rough considering how much time these folks had put into the whole project. That TV, TV, TV super cut they put together reminded me of the Ouya lady.
Must have been rough considering how much time these folks had put into the whole project. That TV, TV, TV super cut they put together reminded me of the Ouya lady.
Papacheeks
Banned
My biggest complaint so far in these series, is how much they sugar coat things like the Indie clause which isn't even mentioned and is the main reason for almost a entire gen indie games flooded switch and PSN. Specifically chapter 6.
Also they seem to fast forward to Gamepass which started relatively in 2018. They seem to be straight up to within 21-22 minute mark they start talking about gamepass and first thing out of their mouths is about paying $70 for games which is specifically talking about this current gen and not xbox one gen.
To me thats the red flag of why these were put up. I enjoy these for what these are, but it being un-biased is off the table. They talk about the main things that they can't gloss over during Xbox one era. But are literally talking about gamepass within first half when talking about a gen that went 7 years?
I know I'll get dog piled with dumb triggered reaction emoji's. But be honest about how this is presented.
Also they seem to fast forward to Gamepass which started relatively in 2018. They seem to be straight up to within 21-22 minute mark they start talking about gamepass and first thing out of their mouths is about paying $70 for games which is specifically talking about this current gen and not xbox one gen.
To me thats the red flag of why these were put up. I enjoy these for what these are, but it being un-biased is off the table. They talk about the main things that they can't gloss over during Xbox one era. But are literally talking about gamepass within first half when talking about a gen that went 7 years?
I know I'll get dog piled with dumb triggered reaction emoji's. But be honest about how this is presented.
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DarkMage619
$MSFT
What was a bigger issue than the X1 reveal and the red ring of death in the 360 era? They covered those things heavily and even made a poster calling out the red ring which cost the company over a billion dollars.
ZywyPL
Banned
Yeah, they went super fast forward through XB1 gen right into current one, as someone said already, the last episode is more of an advertisement rather than a documentary. I wish it was a 8-9 episode series detailing each gen equally, with the last episode focusing solely on current-gen, the ideas of GP, xCloud, Play Anywhere etc. how they came up with them, and where they see themselves in the future.
eastcoastkody
Member
a little bit of a patting themselves on the back thing towards the end...but the documentary was pretty interesting. The first 2 episodes were the best when they're still coming up with Xbox and trying to get it approved. Make Bill Gates sound like a tyrant. very enjoyable.
The red ring episode was surprisingly not sugar coated. They really just took that one on the chin.
Its sad to remember how they just had to kinda concede and let Xbox one die. When for my money it was the better console. PS4 didn't have anything worthwhile during that time either. And by the time PS4 got some great games, Xbox one X was out
The red ring episode was surprisingly not sugar coated. They really just took that one on the chin.
Its sad to remember how they just had to kinda concede and let Xbox one die. When for my money it was the better console. PS4 didn't have anything worthwhile during that time either. And by the time PS4 got some great games, Xbox one X was out
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Nah, they kind of did. Aaron Greenberg talked about how they were always more powerful up to that point.
No one cared about resolutiongate except for forum posters and Twitter warriors. And once the Xbox One X released, suddenly resolution no longer mattered to those who were pushing the resolution differences at the start of the gen.
Papacheeks
Banned
I agree, I love the first 2 parts because of all the behind the scenes with people from the software part of the company and how Windows CE team almost killed xbox by trying to make their own console that was 100% Windows based.
Just by episode 6 they gloss over majority of the xbox one gen. No talk about scalebound, no talk about MCC, 343 legacy or halo 5 blow back. Biggest thing I though they would have talked about for games at leas in that gen was Titanfall. It had the biggest splash coming out of E3 2013.
Lot's of glossing of tons of other issues the whole division had, and then just skip like 5 years to where they buy studios, fully launch gamepass, then go into current gen.
Like to me the first two chapters are the best for me anyways because I love all the backstory stuff of how they literally cobbled together a bunch of hardware in a aluminum box to showcase in 2000.
But chapter 6 honestly is them taking the known stuff on the chin, but they want to skip ahead in first 20 minutes and talk about how they figured out $70 games dont work and were trying to launch gamepass.
And honestly it's the thing that makes this whole thing one big Gamepass conversation.
Outside of CHapter 6 it's fantastic. Specifically first couple chapters.
I'm a huge OG xbox guy, I still think like the dreamcast, xbox was ahead of everyone.
anothertech
Member
They also didn't need to remove all the cool features of their digital plans just because they brought back the disk. It's not like they removed digital purchase games when they reintroduced the disk to xbone.
The fact they dropped all those features of digital sharing so fast made alot of us think it was never going to be implemented anyhow.
Papacheeks
Banned
The bigger issue was exclusive reporting that came out about how this was going to work at retail. Some retailers like Bestbuy had leaks that showed that the plan had people like Activision, EA, ubisoft all on board. But it was the retailers who were scared because this in essence cut them out.
I remember that talked about having dedicated registers that were for actual de-licensing software sku's once purchased if someone where to trade them in. You basically had the game license tied to your account. If you wanted to trade it in, the license was removed from your account so it could be resold.
It made no sense, it was a backwards PC resold games. Back in the day keys were just validation to the install and no database was needed. Then key generators became a thing, and them needing the codes validated online become the norm.
eastcoastkody
Member
the first time Playstation is mentioned and shown, im like 90% certain the game thats shown on screen was an All Japan Pro wrestling game that was only on Dreamcast lol.
cuz i def had that game back then
cuz i def had that game back then
splattered
Member
Watched two episodes last night with the wife, REALLY enjoying it so far. Neat underdog story and i love how rough around the edges this whole journey has been. I originally said it would be great if Nintendo and Sony would do this too but i honestly don't know if i would enjoy them as much? I could just see them both putting out videos patting themselves on the back and counting their money in front of us. haha would put me to sleep.
CatLady
Selfishly plays on Xbox Purr-ies X
I didn't pay too much attention when this was first posted here. I thought it was just a bunch of really long videos by some fandom YouTuber and figured I watch it eventually. It popped up on my dashboard last night and watching it on my big 4k TV was vastly preferable to watching it at my desk on my computer.
It wasn't the cheesy YouTube video I expected. Instead it was a super high quality documentary series with 6 episodes and I liked it so much I binge watched all 6 episodes. Definitely recommend it to anyone who is an Xbox fan.
Papacheeks
Banned
This is made for the masses not nerds like us, lol.
It still pretty great, but I would love more in depth detail. There's a 2 hour doc on playstation it's pretty showy and bias, but the nerdy stuff on the chips they used is all there.
From Bedrooms to Billions: The PlayStation Revolution
Amazon has it. The stuff on PS1 and PS3 is pretty great. It shows you similar to Episode 6 of the xbox series how out of touch sony was by PS3 ERA. But i will say This series specifically the first couple episodes actually sheds light to Ken kutargi's plans for the living room even in PS2 era. Compared to how OG Xbox was suppose to be a gateway to rule the living room which XBox one was basically.
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Chittagong
Gold Member
Absolutely amazing documentary. The people they managed to get in front of the camera, the archive footage, the fact that they covered all the hard mistakes… a real cultural preservation effort.
And super entertaining. Binge watched it with an IPA in my hand.
And super entertaining. Binge watched it with an IPA in my hand.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
I know on the Nvidia front MS wanted to get a better price on GPUs. I believe they also would have liked to consolidate the CPU and GPU into one SOC. Neither Intel nor Nvidia were with that. MS had to go to court to get arbitration with Nvidia on the GPU price. Costs were one of the main reasons MS dropped NVIDIA and the first Xbox and went with AMD for 360 GPU.
AMD also allowed MS to own the design of their SOC so they could do die shrinks as they saw fit. Also AMD had a full blown CPU line as well so it was a natural fit to get everything MS needed in one place. Hence the X1 SOC. Sony obviously saw merit in that choice cause they too went with AMD after PS3.
MS probably didn't want to get into the nasty court business they had with other companies for their documentary.
SportsFan581
Member
I thought Nvidia was always going to provide the GPU for OG Xbox, but AMD was going to provide the CPU until the switcheroo, though I had never heard that either until a few weeks ago. ATI and Radeon weren't associated with AMD at that point I don't think.
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Kagey K
Banned
What if the indie clause wasn't actually a thing?
Or that other companies demanded more?
Would it change your mind?
No
nush
Member
Although that's not the actual case, they knew it wasn't going to turn around. However what they did do was use it as a test bed for the features and functionality on the current gen. Backwards comparability, dual hardware specs, Gamepass and so on.
T-Cake
Member
I actually feel a bit sorry for Don Mattress after seeing him in episode 5. I never knew he was a tech wizzkid who programmed his own games and stuff, just that he was a boring guy in a grey suit. Eek. So Kinect turned out to be the best thing since sliced bread for the XBox 360. I'm intrigued to watch the final episode to see where it all went wrong with XBox One.
Papacheeks
Banned
The indie clause was put into place actually during the 360 era. It was a way in their minds to get exclusive content from indie creators. On top of what it cost to be part of xbox storefront. Wasn't until after the blunder and later on in 2015 and on did they start to turn relations around.
But even so it really wasn't until they launched gamepass and had larger initiatives for indie developers to get more money upfront without any weird clauses, fee's. Now it seems thats whats happening over at Sony which within the past couple months I guess they have corrected.
But going from games like Braid in 2008 during 360 era to johnathon blow debuting his game the Witness on Sony's stage to me is something you should talk about in how even developers associated with Microsoft for their first big game like meat boy or Braid were leaving and going elsewhere.
I mean the First 2 episodes are literally how Direct X people started and how they wanted to make a console and that spans two episodes. XBox one era is literally half of episode 6 since they go right into Gamepass and start talking $70 which to me shows why they made this series in the first place.
They knew how bad the 2011 PSN hack was.
Episode 6 to me devoid all the good work this series does specifically the first 5 episodes.
It's just one big Xbox Game Pass promo, on how they are consumer friendly now.
I still really enjoyed the first 3-5 episodes. I thought those were super insightful and interesting.
But by glossing over an entire gen in half of an episode to me shows, that they care more about their end messaging than talking about something that could have disrupted the industry in a super negative way.
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jasondefaoite
Member
Absolutely loved the OG Xbox and the 360 despite the RRoD. I think I had two 360s before the falcon revision finally resolved the problem. Third time's the charm.
But MS blew it with the Xbox One. Long term what they tried to do there is probably how we will end up, but it was way too early and once Sony didn't follow them it was game over. My first ever PlayStation was a PS4. Don Mattrick and Major Nelson had a lot to do with that decision.
But MS blew it with the Xbox One. Long term what they tried to do there is probably how we will end up, but it was way too early and once Sony didn't follow them it was game over. My first ever PlayStation was a PS4. Don Mattrick and Major Nelson had a lot to do with that decision.
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SportsFan581
Member
What is the indie clause? I've never heard of it.
Edit: Never mind, I looked it up. Hard to say how you feel about that one. On one hand you want every small game to be available, but then on the other you can see why it would be important for Xbox not to always be an after thought.
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SportsFan581
Member
If they had just kept gaming front and center they likely could have done all these things around the periphery without all the negativity. Xbox one was still a great console though, I thoroughly enjoyed mine once I gave up on PC last gen.
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Punished Miku
Gaslighter Pro: 16.7 Fireflops
The damage was done before Xbox One. I called it that Xbox was in trouble several years prior to the launch of Xbox One, and no one believed me because they were still riding high on 360.
I got a 360 at launch over a PS3, and didn't get a PS3 until far later. But quietly over that gen, Sony started PS+ and had free online, free games, and their first party was slowly starting to be impressive. During the 2nd half of the 360 gen, MS had multiple casual-friendly E3s with almost nothing to show except Nike workout aps, Kinect, or timed Call of Duty marketing or DLC deals. Their first party was hollowed out during the 360 gen. It wasn't until PS4 that Sony finally hit their peak in terms of first party and the contrast was laid bare.
Xbox One was always going to be worse off, but people were in denial about it for at least the last 3 years of the 360's life because they were invested in the ecosystem and didn't want to admit it.
I jumped back to Xbox this gen after I saw them making a lot of correct calls, and adding value for gamers again (like Sony initially pioneered on PS3 with PS+ / free online and then later abandoned). I just jump back and forth depending on which company's head is inflated with ego like a balloon, and which one is trying this gen.
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SportsFan581
Member
Definitely true that the lack of first party left the end of the 360 gen a bit dry. I assume because they had already transitioned to spending their money on 3rd party projects for X1 like Quantum Break, Ryse, and Sunset Overdrive. You get a repeat of that in the second half of the X1 gen as well. Purchasing 3rd party content is great as an extra thing (the way Sony has figured it in), but consistent first party launches are critical. Good to see that they have taken steps to improve that situation now.
I still think that X1 could have launched strong if the console was equal or higher in raw power than the PS4 and competitively priced. I don't think you can overstate what being cheaper and more powerful did for Sony at launch, especially since Sony's software lineup was far from stellar in the early going.
Son_of_Zardoz
Banned
Really good stuff, especially the first few episodes about the beginnings of the Xbox. I never knew about the possibility that the Windows CE team could have been handed the reigns and boy did we dodge a bullet there. Amazing at how forward-thinking the OG Xbox was. First console I ever got at launch and been an Xbox fan ever since.
Hitchyhero
Banned
Pretty much how it went for me. I had an x360 and the end gen was cack because of the of the kinect push. Luckily 3rd party kept me interested.
With the XB One launch they completely mismanaged the reveal and messaging. There was still a push for kinect, so the price pushed me away and likely games in develmentment for kinect that just didnt interest me. Completely slipped and went ps4 that gen and I'm glad I did.
This gen I'm back on the Xbox, and I feel like I've made a great decision. First party is there by numbers alone. Game pass is the best. Think this will be a good gen.
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
Really good documentary. Could have used J Allard interviews, but maybe he doesn't want to do them. Last episode was definitely a commercial for the current Gen, and how much they care about the consumer. I think the best thing they have done was the personal museum for people at 20 years.
Iced Arcade
Member
tell me you haven't watch before commenting without telling me you haven't watched before commenting.
anothertech
Member
Tbh, I'm still surprised they haven't made Xbox a windows machine.
Helghan
Member
But that was only the last episode that was basically too much info crammed in a 45min window. I would've preferred if it was a 8-episode documentary, because I agree that they went too quickly over last gen. They could easily have made another episode about Xbox One, and followed that up with Xbox Series X/Game Pass plug episode.
The_Observer
Member
This was amazing. I recommend it to everyone who loves gaming regardless of what platform they play on. Really nostalgic and gives you a sincere insight that is really rare in this industry. They also don't hide their fails at all, but talk about them sincerely. It's so refreshing. And for the record, I'm not a fan of any shitty corporation, I just enjoy gaming and this is an amazing piece of gaming history.
oldergamer
Member
i still think j Allard should have been interviewed
skit_data
Member
Watching this now (despite never owning an Xbox) and wow, what a well edited and interesting documentary. I wish both Playstation and Nintendo did similar documentaries, there's so much to tell!
Really interesting to see the whole DirectX vs WindowsCE situation. Gonna watch the whole series, they really did a great job with this.
Edit: Steve Ballmer is fucking priceless btw. His energy level doesn't fall in line with E=mc^2
Really interesting to see the whole DirectX vs WindowsCE situation. Gonna watch the whole series, they really did a great job with this.
Edit: Steve Ballmer is fucking priceless btw. His energy level doesn't fall in line with E=mc^2
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