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[rodrigolfp]

Your arguments are always just "why is it not ROG ally X?"

In your dreams maybe.

 

[Buggy Loop]

In your dreams maybe.

We see you coming in Switch 2 threads not to inform anyone on the Switch 2 question with logical reason why they made the decision, you're here to say "Well well well, on PC handhelds, if you didn't know..."

The biggest PC handheld cocksucker on neogaf. Never misses a chance to promote.

 

[rodrigolfp]

We see you coming in Switch 2 threads not to inform anyone on the Switch 2 question with logical reason why they made the decision, you're here to say "Well well well, on PC handhelds, if you didn't know..."

The biggest PC handheld cocksucker on neogaf. Never misses a chance to promote.

Criticising an aspect that is better on one vs another =\= cocksucking/promoting. You seen personally attacked with SW2 critics.

And funny. You don't look mad by OP bringing the Series S in to the thread, but someone bringing PCs...

 

[Allandor]

1ghz to 2ghz seems like a lot of overclocking don't think nintendo wants lawsuits from people's houses being burnt down.

Not really. Even switch 1 clocks went up e.g. when loading. They updated switch software for that. 1.8-2ghz should not be a problem for that arm CPU. Yes, power usage would go up, but a good cooling solution should handle that.
But with such low clock speeds switch 2 is more like an overclocked switch 1 (+ more memory).
They should really have gone with at least 6 or 5nm production and not that old Samsung thing.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Criticising an aspect that is better on one vs another =\= cocksucking/promoting. You seen personally attacked with SW2 critics.

Nobody gives a shit how ROG Ally X is almost 3 times thicker. Why even come into this thread with this kind of crud answer "x86 handheld PCs CPUs run at 2+GHz and don't burn hand"

You know the answer, don't play dumb.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Why even come into this thread with this kind of crud answer "x86 handheld PCs CPUs run at 2+GHz and don't burn hand"

To say I think Nintendo fuck up with the SW2 "design" if temps are a problem for a full clocked ARM CPU in handheld mode.

Why you even came to the thread to discuss my posts and not SW2 only? /by your logic.

 

[Buggy Loop]

To say I think Nintendo fuck up with the SW2 "design" if temps are a problem for a full clocked ARM CPU in handheld mode.

I give up

Continue trolling every switch 2 threads for all I care. What a fucking idiot

 

[rodrigolfp]

I give up

Continue trolling every switch 2 threads for all I care. What a fucking idiot

Discussing technical aspects = trolling. Noted.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Discussing technical aspects = trolling. Noted.

Wishing a console to be something else than it is including its form factor yes it's fucking trolling

 

[rodrigolfp]

Wishing a console to be something else than it is including its form factor yes it's fucking trolling

Reviews wishing aspects of games/gaming machines were something else/better is fucking trolling. Noted too.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Curiously enough, the clock speeds in docked mode are actually lower than in handheld mode

Wait, how do you know that??

 

[Fake]

Noooo Bowser Sisters I don't feel so good

LordOcidax

 

[Buggy Loop]

Reviews wishing aspects of games/gaming machines were something else/better is fucking trolling. Noted too.

I wisH plAysTAtioN 5 wAS MuCh moRe POWerfUL lIKe A 5090, I MeaN i caN Fit It iN a 15L CAse, WhaT's THE EXCusE?

 

[rodrigolfp]

I wisH plAysTAtioN 5 wAS MuCh moRe POWerfUL lIKe A 5090, I MeaN i caN Fit It iN a 15L CAse, WhaT's THE EXCusE?

Yeah. Why not give a $1000+ PS5 Pro Pro in a big case with a 5090 as option for the consumers as some other past thread suggested??

 

[Mozza]

they says runs well in own vid you post oohoohoo

Gone for a while but not forgotten. Back on June the 30th by popular demand.

 

[FireFly]

From all the media videos I've passively seen, frustums/Draw distances look setup like Vita games compared to typical PS4 home console renders IMO, and lots of items look like they are statically lit immediately outside the foreground on Switch 1 and 2 game versions, and lots of facet edges on random items too.

Maybe it is just early days and development pipelines are still too much in Switch 1 development, but even with Switch 2 ports having performance issues they also still look like they aren't carrying a full home console workload, yet IMO.

I'm talking specifically about the Cyberpunk port where the DF comparison showed the Switch 2 version resolving more distant detail at times than even the Series S version.

 

[Dorfdad]

In handheld mode I play smaller games, like Dead Cells for example. Big screen games don't feel good enough for me and I prefer playing them on TV.

This has become my strategy as well. Mostly platform or her side stroller and RPG's outside of the big big ones I've been playing on my handheld and I really enjoy it. I seem to play it more often.

 

[LordOcidax]

LordOcidax

 

[Valonquar]

Nintendo fanboys aren't into docking

 

[Kilau]

Noooo Bowser Sisters I don't feel so good

The reaction.

 

[Beechos]

Bro doesn't know how clockspeed works on a computer

Please enlighten me good sir.

 

[Beechos]

x86 handheld PCs CPUs run at 2+GHz and don't burn hands but that ARM CPU will burn houses??

Most pc cpus are not being overclocked by 100%. There is a reason why when people do extreme oc they have extreme cooling to go with it.

 

[rodrigolfp]

Most pc cpus are not being overclocked by 100%. There is a reason why when people do extreme oc they have extreme cooling to go with it.

it's not overclock. It's default clocks.

 

[wafflecioccy]

Please enlighten me good sir.

A computer can't set a house on fire for running at high clockspeed. If cpu/gpu temps get too high it will thermal throttle and forcefully slow itself down. If still temps rise, it will force shut down before any kind of physical damage can occur.

 

[FireFly]

The Switch 2 SoC seems to be running at ~15W in docked mode (total power consumption ~19W), like the Steam Deck. However, the Steam Deck looks to be about 70% thicker in the central portion. So, I don't get the complaint about the power dissipation.

The reason for the low CPU clocks is likely because the SoC only has ~7W in portable mode. (Accepting the strangeness of having slightly higher CPU clocks in this mode).

 

[bender]

Why not design close enough and not suck in clock/heat aspect??

Why don't you design your own Nintendo Switch 2 with blackjack and hookers?

 

[rodrigolfp]

hookers?

That would me it suck even more.

 

[IFireflyl]

I wisH plAysTAtioN 5 wAS MuCh moRe POWerfUL lIKe A 5090, I MeaN i caN Fit It iN a 15L CAse, WhaT's THE EXCusE?

You're going overboard, mate. If he bothers you then use the ignore function. Don't say you're giving up and then continue responding. For what it's worth, I agree with rodrigolfp . I prefer the Steam Deck and ASUS ROG Ally design and functionality to the Nintendo Switch 2. You don't have to agree with that, but this is a forum where people are allowed to engage in constructive discourse. You were the one who responded with apparent hate/disgust because someone brought up a tangential point in regard to the OP. Your reaction was the real disruption in this thread.

 

[Buggy Loop]

You're going overboard, mate. If he bothers you then use the ignore function. Don't say you're giving up and then continue responding. For what it's worth, I agree with rodrigolfp . I prefer the Steam Deck and ASUS ROG Ally design and functionality to the Nintendo Switch 2. You don't have to agree with that, but this is a forum where people are allowed to engage in constructive discourse. You were the one who responded with apparent hate/disgust because someone brought up a tangential point in regard to the OP. Your reaction was the real disruption in this thread.

You see me go into every Steamdeck threads saying how I would prefer a smaller form factor? No? Take example.

How does coming in a thread with a legit question from OP helps in any way with saying how PC handhelds can clock higher? How is this of any help? Bigger heatsink, well "NiNtenDo shOudL haVE biGgeR heATsiNK!! Hur hur hur" Oh yea very helpful information. Brilliant collaboration and exchange of knowledge. We really need more posters like that! /s

"Constructive discourse"... HA! Another way of saying shitposting.

 

[RoboFu]

swing low.. sweet cpu., coming for to carry me home..

 

[SScorpio]

You see me go into every Steamdeck threads saying how I would prefer a smaller form factor? No? Take example.

You don't need to because of how they nailed the design. Children to adults can comfortably play on them without issue.

Nintendo handhelds always have that flat shape that makes the hands cramp up with any extended play for anyone who doesn't have the small hands of a child.

 

[IFireflyl]

You see me go into every Steamdeck threads saying how I would prefer a smaller form factor? No? Take example.

How does coming in a thread with a legit question from OP helps in any way with saying how PC handhelds can clock higher? How is this of any help? Bigger heatsink, well "NiNtenDo shOudL haVE biGgeR heATsiNK!! Hur hur hur" Oh yea very helpful information. Brilliant collaboration and exchange of knowledge. We really need more posters like that! /s

"Constructive discourse"... HA! Another way of saying shitposting.

The OP made a comment about CPU usage not improving (and in fact, worsening) when docked. The general consensus is that this was necessary to prevent the device from getting too warm/hot in docked mode, which would make it uncomfortable to pull off of the dock to use in handheld mode. His remark, which is valid, was that if Nintendo had marginally increased the footprint of the Switch 2, they could have implemented a better heatsink or cooling solution that would allow the CPU to run at higher clock speeds when it is docked while still keeping the device cool enough to comfortably transition back to handheld mode.

Even without increasing the size, if they had used 5nm transistors instead of 8nm transistors, this would have also allowed the CPU to run at a higher clock while docked without sacrificing cooling. The smaller transistors would have increased performance per watt while also improving power efficiency (and thermals). Additionally, that would have freed up space internally, meaning thermal hotspots would have decreased. There are ways Nintendo could have improved the design to eliminate this issue. Talking about that isn't a bad thing. Nobody is telling you that you can't like Nintendo or your Nintendo Switch 2. Take a mental health day, mate. You're going off the rails.

 

[naguanatak]

The OP made a comment about CPU usage not improving (and in fact, worsening) when docked. The general consensus is that this was necessary to prevent the device from getting too warm/hot in docked mode, which would make it uncomfortable to pull off of the dock to use in handheld mode. His remark, which is valid, was that if Nintendo had marginally increased the footprint of the Switch 2, they could have implemented a better heatsink or cooling solution that would allow the CPU to run at higher clock speeds when it is docked while still keeping the device cool enough to comfortably transition back to handheld mode.

Even without increasing the size, if they had used 5nm transistors instead of 8nm transistors, this would have also allowed the CPU to run at a higher clock while docked without sacrificing cooling. The smaller transistors would have increased performance per watt while also improving power efficiency (and thermals). Additionally, that would have freed up space internally, meaning thermal hotspots would have decreased. There are ways Nintendo could have improved the design to eliminate this issue. Talking about that isn't a bad thing. Nobody is telling you that you can't like Nintendo or your Nintendo Switch 2. Take a mental health day, mate. You're going off the rails.

But isn't there no end to these suggestions? Nintendo could have waited ten years and the switch 2 would have been much more powerful. They could have used top of the line components and sold it for 1.500€ and it would have been much more powerful.
Yet, a lot of people complain about the price of the device as it is.
There is no pleasing everyone. I - and many others - are very happy with what we've got. Would I prefer having a couple of mm more in thickness to have a better cooling system? Yeah... Would I prefer having a chip in the dock or some overclocking to have a more powerful device? Yeah...
We can ruminate all day about what could have been, but some of the remarks in here and in other threads are just not in good faith it seems. And I have to agree...there are people who always bring up some other device that they love and when challenged it always comes down to 'you want an echo chamber of praise and love, this is a forum for discussion, live with it'
Same as in game OTs when people are constantly shitting on a game... Then when questioned say that people who like said game can leave if they only want to read praise... Not suggesting that the people in this conversation are trolls, but the amount of people going into threads just to shit on games or devices are through the roof these days

 

[Buggy Loop]

The OP made a comment about CPU usage not improving (and in fact, worsening) when docked.

The worsened part is just DF's and not confirmation of the dev kits. Devs on famiboards have said this is erroneous.

The general consensus is that this was necessary to prevent the device from getting too warm/hot in docked mode, which would make it uncomfortable to pull off of the dock to use in handheld mode.

Nonsense.

They have a wattage in dock mode just like any PC handheld have a limitation, regarless of these fucking clock speed "theoretical" performances, they cannot hold down max clocks CPU & GPU. Steam deck, rog ally, you name it.

This is a closed platform. CPU clock speed handheld = dock, this is to remove headaches from devs for both modes. Also, for the umpteenth time, LPDDR5x limitation. Useless to raise clocks needlessly when you're using the bandwidth efficiently already.

His remark, which is valid, was that if Nintendo had marginally increased the footprint of the Switch 2, they could have implemented a better heatsink or cooling solution that would allow the CPU to run at higher clock speeds when it is docked while still keeping the device cool enough to comfortably transition back to handheld mode.

Nintendo makes a closed platform. FFS

The fucking thing cannot throttle like your PC shit bricks. From a Canadian in winter cold room temperatures to some south of Spain >50°C hellhole, performance has to hold up constantly.

Even without increasing the size, if they had used 5nm transistors instead of 8nm transistors

Nobody knows really. Nvidia always uses low densities and for low clock speeds already these things don't scale with node improvements like you see in most node benchmarks. The diminishing returns of lowering nodes is real for wide, low density low frequency mobile chipsets.

, this would have also allowed the CPU to run at a higher clock while docked without sacrificing cooling. The smaller transistors would have increased performance per watt while also improving power efficiency (and thermals). Additionally, that would have freed up space internally, meaning thermal hotspots would have decreased. There are ways Nintendo could have improved the design to eliminate this issue. Talking about that isn't a bad thing. Nobody is telling you that you can't like Nintendo or your Nintendo Switch 2.

Cool dream bruh

Write in your diary how much better you would have designed this over Nvidia engineers, then please, go and @ them on twitter with your ideas. Or better yet, print that on paper and attach it to your CV and send to Jensen. Clearly they missed the brain power that you have when designing an APU. What the fuck do they know afterall.

See naguanatak 's post.

This has nothing to do with OP. You go and buy that next gen PC handheld with all of those improvements you're dreaming of. Happy for you. I'm sure a 10" wide 3" thick monster can finally clock so high you're gonna have a good 90°C hand warmer for winter.

Take a mental health day, mate. You're going off the rails.

As if I give a flying fuck about your advice lol. Read the fucking room. Nobody gives a shit about your "what ifs"

Go back to PC handheld threads and circle jerk all you want. Here and here

 

[Zathalus]

I'm of the opinion they probably should have made the Switch 2 a touch thicker for a slightly bigger battery and ported the design to some variant of 5/4nm. A extra few mm of thickness won't affect the portability that much, especially considering the overall size of the device. Naturally that would probably have tacked on an extra $60 or so to the BOM, not including paying Nvidia for the node port costs either as Nvidia didn't do any Tegra version of Ada.

Likely Nintendo didn't want to eat the cost or price it that high, but the performance and battery gains would have been significant. It will likely get ported to much more efficient node for the eventual refresh.

 

[naguanatak]

I'm of the opinion they probably should have made the Switch 2 a touch thicker for a slightly bigger battery and ported the design to some variant of 5/4nm. A extra few mm of thickness won't affect the portability that much, especially considering the overall size of the device. Naturally that would probably have tacked on an extra $60 or so to the BOM, not including paying Nvidia for the node port costs either as Nvidia didn't do any Tegra version of Ada.

Likely Nintendo didn't want to eat the cost or price it that high, but the performance and battery gains would have been significant. It will likely get ported to much more efficient node for the eventual refresh.

I absolutely understand these ideas and suggestions, but price is a huge factor and they went way higher than I initially thought.
Then you have to consider that they have to stop designing and start planning/manufacturing somewhere. You can't just toss a couple of years R&D aside and say 'ok, we take the smaller chip, make the device thicker and toss in a bigger battery'. By the time you have finished R&D, design and are able to start manufacturing, some new components will be available and people suggest or even demand that you make the device 50-100€ more expensive with those... rinse and repeat ad nauseum. There is no end to this cycle unless the company finishes their design and starts producing the device.

 

[Buggy Loop]

Lower node would have been either lower yields or super expensive on TSMC or just not even available for mass production, yes, mass production, everyone is a semiconductor expert until you have to manufacture >50M of these devices and don't want to charge over a grand for it because you have to push Apple and AI chipset priority away to make that low node production line.

This ain't hobby level production lines where after over 3 years you barely clawed your way to 3M units, this has to to be pumped out tenfold those tiny numbers.

Low density wide low frequency mobile chipsets also fo not benefit node shrinks like you think. It's not linear at all.

I'm building a list to infest PC handheld threads with constant sequences of what ifs. Why don't they have microSD express over those old slow ones? Why don't they come with a dock? How come most of them I can't detach the joysticks? I have to buy a controller to play without holding it? Where's the integrated stand? Why does it make so much fan noise? Where's physical media? How come they have no AI upscaler worth a shit? Dogshit pixel soup from FSR or the worse XeSS version on DP4a I have to get from GitHub. Sleep mode? Surely that works nicely in windows PC handhelds right ? (lol no). Why they have smaller screens ? Why do expensive, I have no dock, no stand, no detachable joysticks and smaller screens. Pretty good start … sounds annoying enough right?

 

[sendit]

In my opinion, Nintendo should add a mode where they heavily overclock the CPU in docked mode, to atleast 2 GHz or higher for titles like that, that would help immensely. Handheld will continue to run shitty like that but atleast in docked mode it would run decently.

That would reduce the battery down to 30 mins.

 

[IFireflyl]

The worsened part is just DF's and not confirmation of the dev kits. Devs on famiboards have said this is erroneous.



Nonsense.

They have a wattage in dock mode just like any PC handheld have a limitation, regarless of these fucking clock speed "theoretical" performances, they cannot hold down max clocks CPU & GPU. Steam deck, rog ally, you name it.

This is a closed platform. CPU clock speed handheld = dock, this is to remove headaches from devs for both modes. Also, for the umpteenth time, LPDDR5x limitation. Useless to raise clocks needlessly when you're using the bandwidth efficiently already.



Nintendo makes a closed platform. FFS

The fucking thing cannot throttle like your PC shit bricks. From a Canadian in winter cold room temperatures to some south of Spain >50°C hellhole, performance has to hold up constantly.




Nobody knows really. Nvidia always uses low densities and for low clock speeds already these things don't scale with node improvements like you see in most node benchmarks. The diminishing returns of lowering nodes is real for wide, low density low frequency mobile chipsets.




Cool dream bruh

Write in your diary how much better you would have designed this over Nvidia engineers, then please, go and @ them on twitter with your ideas. Or better yet, print that on paper and attach it to your CV and send to Jensen. Clearly they missed the brain power that you have when designing an APU. What the fuck do they know afterall.

See naguanatak 's post.

This has nothing to do with OP. You go and buy that next gen PC handheld with all of those improvements you're dreaming of. Happy for you. I'm sure a 10" wide 3" thick monster can finally clock so high you're gonna have a good 90°C hand warmer for winter.

As if I give a flying fuck about your advice lol. Read the fucking room. Nobody gives a shit about your "what ifs"

Go back to PC handheld threads and circle jerk all you want. Here and here

Not sure why you're acting like an absolute cunt in this thread. Cry more, I guess.

But isn't there no end to these suggestions? Nintendo could have waited ten years and the switch 2 would have been much more powerful. They could have used top of the line components and sold it for 1.500€ and it would have been much more powerful.
Yet, a lot of people complain about the price of the device as it is.
There is no pleasing everyone. I - and many others - are very happy with what we've got. Would I prefer having a couple of mm more in thickness to have a better cooling system? Yeah... Would I prefer having a chip in the dock or some overclocking to have a more powerful device? Yeah...
We can ruminate all day about what could have been, but some of the remarks in here and in other threads are just not in good faith it seems. And I have to agree...there are people who always bring up some other device that they love and when challenged it always comes down to 'you want an echo chamber of praise and love, this is a forum for discussion, live with it'
Same as in game OTs when people are constantly shitting on a game... Then when questioned say that people who like said game can leave if they only want to read praise... Not suggesting that the people in this conversation are trolls, but the amount of people going into threads just to shit on games or devices are through the roof these days

So you're saying nobody should be able to have a discussion about how to make products better because there are always ways products could be better? This is a discussion forum. People are allowed to discuss. If you don't like the conversation you don't have to participate...

That would reduce the battery down to 30 mins.

What does the battery life matter in docked mode?

 

[Zathalus]

I absolutely understand these ideas and suggestions, but price is a huge factor and they went way higher than I initially thought.
Then you have to consider that they have to stop designing and start planning/manufacturing somewhere. You can't just toss a couple of years R&D aside and say 'ok, we take the smaller chip, make the device thicker and toss in a bigger battery'. By the time you have finished R&D, design and are able to start manufacturing, some new components will be available and people suggest or even demand that you make the device 50-100€ more expensive.

Time wasn't really a problem in this case. T239 was designed all the way back in 2021. Porting to a new node doesn't take that long. The costs are probably the reason though, TSMC 4/5nm are both vastly more expensive compared to Samsung 8nm, like over double. Plus, asking Nvidia to do it would have probably come with a price tag. The costs for the console are already up there, and the leap over Switch 1 is already significant so thus it makes sense to stick with 8nm for the first version of the console. The thicker console and better node speculation is just wishful thinking on my part. Well, true wishful thinking would have been a Tegra variant of Ada, but that never happened.

 

[Danjin44]

I don't know why you guys expecting PS5 level power on Switch 2.

The system was design around being hybrid, the decision was made in order keep it cool and easy to use.

Maybe my expectations was very different than you guys, what I wanted was big upgrade over original Switch which exactly what I got.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Nobody knows really. Nvidia always uses low densities and for low clock speeds already these things don't scale with node improvements like you see in most node benchmarks. The diminishing returns of lowering nodes is real for wide, low density low frequency mobile chipsets.

We are not arguing about different revisions of 3nm, but Samsung optimised 10nm (which is what the 8nm node we mention is) vs 3-5nm TSMC (3nm being available but out of Nintendo's self imposed conservative budgeting reach). I am not saying to expect 100% clock speed improvements, but a decent clock speed boost or an even bigger power draw reduction yes.
Do we have the two chips to compare in front of us no, but let's be honest it is very darn likely. Nintendo wanted to hoard SoC's with the cheapest manufacturing process as soon as possible instead of getting to the end of 2024 and being only able to start manufacturing the volume they intended at a much larger cost with rushed orders for a mid 2025 launch.

nVIDIA had Ampere ported to TSMC 7nm and Blackwell now is on their optimised 5nm (4LP) process. I am not finding sources that do not generally show Samsung processes being behind the "equivalent" TSMC ones and optimised 10nm vs 5nm TSMC mmmh… I find it hard to believe it is as a wash as you say (otherwise Apple would not spend so much money to be on the very latest process from TSMC for their A series SoCs either ):

Nvidia’s Ampere & Process Technology: Sunk by Samsung?

While chronic GPU shortages dominate the current news cycle (exacerbated by a myriad of individual factors set to continue for the foreseeable future), the massive increase in power requirements for high-end graphics cards is just as newsworthy.

open.substack.com

TSMC and Samsung 5nm Comparison - Semiwiki

Samsung and TSMC have both made recent disclosures about their 5nm process and I though it would be a good time to look at what we know about them and compare the two processes. A lot of what has been announced about 5nm is in comparison to 7nm so we will first review 7nm. 7nm…

semiwiki.com

Write in your diary how much better you would have designed this over Nvidia engineers, then please, go and @ them on twitter with your ideas. Or better yet, print that on paper and attach it to your CV and send to Jensen. Clearly they missed the brain power that you have when designing an APU. What the fuck do they know afterall.

Nobody is quite claiming to be able to do a better job than nVIDIA did, but nVIDIA could just like they would have for PS3 if Sony did not run to them at the last minute with a reduced budget as they already blew theirs over without finishing with Toshiba's GPU design.

The SoC, based on the leaks, was finalised a few years ago (active development starting in 2019 and the chip being finalised around 2021) and under instruction of their client. Manufacturing tech was not forced on them, feature set (what from Ampere, what from Ada or what became Blackwell, etc…).

 

[sendit]

What does the battery life matter in docked mode?

It doesn't. However, my reading ability is in question.

 

[IFireflyl]

I don't know why you guys expecting PS5 level power on Switch 2.

The system was design around being hybrid, the decision was made in order keep it cool and easy to use.

Maybe my expectations was very different than you guys, what I wanted was big upgrade over original Switch which exactly what I got.

I don't think that people are asking for PS5 level power on the Switch 2. I could be wrong, but I didn't see those posts myself. I think the point was that the expectation for docked mode is that it boosts performance across the board, but for some reason Nintendo has decided to reduce clock speeds on the CPU in docked mode (although the GPU does get a boost). I don't know the real-world performance impact the reduced clock speeds are having. If the impact is zero (or so limited as to be indistinguishable from zero), then this is much-ado about nothing. I know the OP posted an example, but I am not taking a single example as gospel truth of a widespread issue when that could also be chalked up to poor optimization by the developer.

 

[Danjin44]

I don't think that people are asking for PS5 level power on the Switch 2. I could be wrong, but I didn't see those posts myself. I think the point was that the expectation for docked mode is that it boosts performance across the board, but for some reason Nintendo has decided to reduce clock speeds on the CPU in docked mode (although the GPU does get a boost). I don't know the real-world performance impact the reduced clock speeds are having. If the impact is zero (or so limited as to be indistinguishable from zero), then this is much-ado about nothing. I know the OP posted an example, but I am not taking a single example as gospel truth of a widespread issue when that could also be chalked up to poor optimization by the developer.

CPR similar to Bethesda always have technical issues every time they release game.

This was case with Witcher 3 when first came out even PS5 version had issues.

No matter what power a system has these devs can't release a game without suffering from some kind of technical issues.

 

[IFireflyl]

CPR similar to Bethesda always have technical issues every time they release game.

This was case with Witcher 3 when first came out even PS5 version had issues.

No matter power these devs can't release without suffering from some kind of technical issues.

That's why I'm not going to raise a pitchfork over this. If this was across the board I would lambast Nintendo, and I wouldn't feel bad doing it. If a company screws up, they should be called out for the screwup. I do think they could have mitigated this concern when they designed the console, but unless we see a widespread issue specifically revolving around this issue I don't think this is worth getting that upset over. Realistically, I'm not sure what the real-world difference would be with a difference of 103MHz. It is weird that the docked version has a (marginally) lower CPU clock speed than the OG Nintendo Switch, but at this point I don't know what the reasonings were for this.

 

[naguanatak]

So you're saying nobody should be able to have a discussion about how to make products better because there are always ways products could be better? This is a discussion forum. People are allowed to discuss. If you don't like the conversation you don't have to participate...

exactly what I described happening in a response... not surprised.

No, I don't say that nobody should be able to have a discussion. We're having a discussion right now. You can wish for a better product, you can suggest how to make the product better, nobody is going to hold you back. But at the end of the day, the device we got is in our hands. If we're happy with it or not is our own making.
Sure, I would want a beefier chip, a more capable GPU, a bigger battery, a bigger screen, preferably OLED (as I never had a device with it), more ram, more storage capacity. There is no end to the dreams and wishes one could have.
But on the other hand, am I happy with the NS2? Very much so. Playing Hogwarts Legacy right now... and it doesn't look nearly as good as I wish it would. The PS5 version was much more beautiful. But on the Switch 2 it looks good enough for me to be able to have fun with it while I'm on lunch break at work. The way I mostly play these days with a 1 1/2 year old and another one due October.
If I want better visuals, I'll play Death Stranding 2 come next week when I have the time for it at home.

So, by all means, discuss, wish, suggest. It won't matter, not for the device that released, not for the next one. But that's what this forum is for.
All I suggested is that there are people on here not discussing or suggesting, but merely shitting on anything that isn't their prefered way of playing/device/game... whatever. I mostly lurk and do not participate that often. There is a reason for that. I'm the guy that ignores OTs for games I do not enjoy or do not care about. I can go into a CoD OT and shitpost about it, suggesting that it would be a better game with Death Strandings traversal mechanics and that the game we got does not look good enough, that the devs could have waited a year or more to incorporate better features...

 

[Buggy Loop]

We are not arguing about different revisions of 3nm, but Samsung optimised 10nm (which is what the 8nm node we mention is)

Sigh

Being part of family of a node technology and improving down the line is not bad. Slapping 10nm here like it's a bad thing shows how much people don't understand these technologies and put too much emphasis on a node number

Especially since this is a custom nvidia node at Samsung

Repeat after me

Nvidia does not push high density silicon for their mobile tech

Doesn't matter if you have double density elsewhere, mobile low frequency tech they do NOT use high density.

They don't even use Samsung 's full density for mobile chips, including AGX Orin's $$$ AI platform.

vs 3-5nm TSMC (3nm being available but out of Nintendo's self imposed conservative budgeting reach)

Fucking hell pana

You've been around long enough

You want to produce, MASS produce a chipset and remain low cost

Is now the time to go and fight Apple, AI chipset makers at TSMC for barely a gain on the architecture? Are you insane?

. I am not saying to expect 100% clock speed improvements, but a decent clock speed boost or an even bigger power draw reduction yes.

No. You see those gains on high frequency chipsets that are narrow.

Do we have the two chips to compare in front of us no, but let's be honest it is very darn likely. Nintendo wanted to hoard SoC's with the cheapest manufacturing process as soon as possible instead of getting to the end of 2024 and being only able to start manufacturing the volume they intended at a much larger cost with rushed orders for a mid 2025 launch.

Mass production. Yes.

Because real engineering is not just a unicorn wish list of nice things to have. ´

nVIDIA had Ampere ported to TSMC 7nm and Blackwell now is on their optimised 5nm (4LP) process. I am not finding sources that do not generally show Samsung processes being behind the "equivalent" TSMC ones and optimised 10nm vs 5nm TSMC mmmh… I find it hard to believe it is as a wash as you say (otherwise Apple would not spend so much money to be on the very latest process from TSMC for their A series SoCs either ):

*ampere high clock desktop version which again, meaningless. Semiconductors gains scale like that with frequency

The SoC, based on the leaks, was finalised a few years ago (active development starting in 2019 and the chip being finalised around 2021) and under instruction of their client. Manufacturing tech was not forced on them, feature set (what from Ampere, what from Ada or what became Blackwell, etc…).

Tapeout is 2021, revisions happened afterwards. Tapeout marks the end of design phase, not that it's ready to produce and error free. What does that matter?

AMD allegedly proposed their biggest deal for an APU and it was refused. There's a lot of factors here than a wishlist. True engineers know what I'm talking about.

 

[IFireflyl]

All I suggested is that there are people on here not discussing or suggesting, but merely shitting on anything that isn't their prefered way of playing/device/game... whatever.

It is absolutely fair to compare a new device to an existing device to see what compromises were made. It is fair to critique either device. What was offered in this thread was critique. Who gets to decide when someone is genuinely critiquing a product and who is "merely shitting on anything that isn't their preferred way of playing"? Is it Buggy Loop ? Because I will create my own account suicide thread right now if that's the case.

Show me where rodrigolfp was just shit-posting and I'll retract my comments. He has an opinion, and he's entitled to it. You and Buggy Loop are free to disagree, but the only one that made a scene in here was Buggy Loop . He flipped out because he has seen multiple posts comparing the Nintendo Switch 2 to the Steam Deck. That's going to happen. They're similar devices. I compare my Steam Deck to my Nintendo Switch, and to my PlayStation Portable, my PlayStation Vita, and my ASUS ROG Ally. If I had a Nintendo Switch 2 I would be doing the same thing.

This is one of the easiest ways to judge how poor or well something is made - by comparing it to an existing product that is similar. How do the aesthetics compare? What about the build quality? How about hardware/software? Real-world performance? All of that is valid to discuss in this forum, and your piggybacking off of the discussion I had with a guy who was losing his marbles for no reason makes it seem like you disagree with the discourse taking place at all. Otherwise, why did you respond to me?