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[hinch7]

One company will make the OS and a bunch of companies will make the hardware. Sounds familiar but can't quite place it.

It was Valve back in 2015 with SteamOS and Steam Machines. Made from Alienware, CyberPowerPC, Origin PC, Gigabyte, Zotac, Scan Computers + more - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steam_Machine_(computer)

Iirc there were different SKU and configurations from each vendor. It was a bit of a flop though, same as their Steam controller and other random hardware at that time.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

What if the OEM vendors offer different levels of power?

If OEMs are building them, what branding will they use for it? Xbox PC is already taken up by Windows. I imagine they will call it Xbox Console?

Also why was their a need for AMD partnership if OEMs are building it? I imagine some standardisation is done by MS with Xbox Console. And maybe 2 or 3 chips will be the options.

 

[drganon]

|OT|  Post in thread '|OT| Xbox Power King Memes'

May 18, 2021

• Jemm

• 
• 

So many posters in that thread either got banned or just stopped posting.

 

[demigod]

A lot of current industry follows in xbox lead

-backwards compatibility
-Online focus
-focus on engagement
-multiple skus to give player options
-multiplatform focus to again, give player options.

It's become a huge circle jerk. Like a hive mind where people pile in.

What happened to choices?

Someone asked earlier (not to me)

"Why would you want this and why do you trust MS again" (paraphrasing)

If it's a true next gen console I'm on board price dependent. I like Game pass and the Xbox system.

I don't trust MS they are a huge corporation. I don't trust Sony either but doesn't mean I won't buy PS7.

Stop looking at this the wrong way. PS5 owners have no exclusives of note but doesn't mean they can't enjoy their console

Player options, choices. Gotta love ms for that right? So pro consumer with them choices that they are taking away physicals. You corporate boot lickers sure amaze me.

 

[Heisenberg007]

When it mentions "grounded in an open, player-first ecosystem — not locked to a single device or store." Could it not mean Xbox store on other platforms, rather than other platforms on Xbox hardware

That's exactly what it means, but people are trying to pretend it is the other way around.

It won't be an Xbox with options for Steam, Epic, etc.

It will be a PC with an option for the Microsoft Store.

 

[SomeNorseGuy]

What is this "tinkering with the backend" you are referring to? Even on Windows you just install Steam and then install games through the client. There is no "tinkering" involved.

Steam is amazing, no doubt about that and it runs as good as everything flawlessly. But there's quite a few games from the early 2000's that has plenty of issues. Early 3D games from that time had a lot of fucking weird dependencies.

Is it just a minor footnote, yeah.

 

[Fess]

@ZehDon seems to think differently.

Maybe he needs to also hear it from people that aren't me.

I don't know more than anyone else but it just seem logical. A Windows PC is not an Xbox console. For their own games they can do whatever they want, but for 3rd party games I imagine they need to follow publishing contracts. And some publishers might have strategic publishing to go Xbox first and PC later, like GTA6 for example. Let's imagine that the next Xbox would come out in 2026. Could Microsoft go around that one and run GTA6 on a PC in console-shell? Doubtful.

There is the loophole that it's Microsoft Store underneath it all. I think that's how Steam games can be on Steam Deck. Steam is Steam. Same thing but on a different device.
But to actually run an Xbox console release on what is essentially a SFF Windows PC they would need an emulation layer or virtual machine or Proton like conversion layer. It'll come with consequences.

 

[adamsapple]

That's exactly what it means, but people are trying to pretend it is the other way around.

It won't be an Xbox with options for Steam, Epic, etc.

It will be a PC with an option for the Microsoft Store.

I'll take Kepler's word until officially confirmed otherwise.

 

[Heisenberg007]

Let's imagine that the next Xbox would come out in 2026. Could Microsoft go around that one and run GTA6 on a PC in console-shell? Doubtful.

That's a VERY good point!

 

[Heisenberg007]

I'll take Kepler's word until officially confirmed otherwise.

That's fine. KeplerL2's words should be taken above mine, always.

We'll see how it goes. If it comes in 2026, I'll be very interested to see if it plays GTA 6 at launch - before the PC version is out .

 

[adamsapple]

That's fine. KeplerL2's words should be taken above mine, always.

We'll see how it goes. If it comes in 2026, I'll be very interested to see if it plays GTA 6 at launch - before the PC version is out .

I'm not seeing the controversial thing here. If it's going to essentially be an Xbox that can sideload other stores, it's still going to play the Xbox version of the game.

It won't magically turn it into a PC version that doesn't exist.

 

[Fess]

I'm not seeing the controversial thing here. If it's going to essentially be an Xbox that can sideload other stores, it's still going to play the Xbox version of the game.

It won't magically turn it into a PC version that doesn't exist.

So you think it'll be a dual boot? Xbox OS for Xbox games and the Windows with ROG Ally UI for multiple PC store access?

 

[DenchDeckard]

Its funny how I said they'll try and get something out for next year and got jumped on for living in "hopes and dreams"

How times change.

I was only making a general suggestion too.

If they can get this thing out within 6 months of gta vi they could be on to something.

 

[DenchDeckard]

I'm not seeing the controversial thing here. If it's going to essentially be an Xbox that can sideload other stores, it's still going to play the Xbox version of the game.

It won't magically turn it into a PC version that doesn't exist.

Its strange that some people cant seem to understand this.

So much confusion trying to be generated around this box.

If you look at purely what Microsoft has said, I think its pretty clear there is a console planned.

We have had months and years of speculation that it will be a PC on here and now some people are using that speculation to cause themselves confusion, which is dont quite understand. It seems simple.

There's an xbox console coming. It will play xbox games. That includes GTA VI.

Simple

 

[GHG]

Also an aside but... GHG do you think one approach MS might take here is have two separate partitions (Xbox OS partition, Windows partition) to run respective games between the two? Because I've been thinking that's a way to get by the licensing headaches, and it'd be somewhat similar to what they did in providing DOS compatibility in the 9x Windows OSes like Windows '95 and '98.

That's the only way it would make sense IMO.

Doing it any other way creates a lot of licensing headaches along with a lot of unnecessary work.

Also everything else that they are doing and saying points towards them taking a more unified approach towards gaming on windows (e.g. The new gaming focused windows OS which has multi-store integration, etc), and everything still points towards them attempting to coax their current xbox console user base towards that. This is evident in the fact that there are now a lot of people who are disappointed by the notion of a bog standard traditional Xbox console that's limited to just the Xbox console store now that they've been warmed up to the idea of gaming on windows along with all the other perks that comes with.

 

[tronied]

So you think it'll be a dual boot? Xbox OS for Xbox games and the Windows with ROG Ally UI for multiple PC store access?

Maybe it's not necessary. This was from 6 months back:

https://www.gamesradar.com/platform...t-theyre-not-actually-using-emulation-at-all/

XWine1 is, again, a compatibility layer rather than an emulator. On a technical level, Xbox One is essentially a PC using a heavily modified version of Windows, and this software simply translates native Xbox applications into a form that can run on standard Windows PCs. It's similar to Valve's Proton compatibility layer, which translates Windows games into a form that can be run on Linux-based devices, notably including the Steam Deck.

Not emulation, but if XSX works in the same was as XO, then it might just require this "translation layer"

 

[FoxMcChief]

As long as Gamepass is a thing, I will buy the console that has it.

 

[DenchDeckard]

That's the only way it would make sense IMO.

Doing it any other way creates a lot of licensing headaches along with a lot of unnecessary work.

Also everything else that they are doing and saying points towards them taking a more unified approach towards gaming on windows (e.g. The new gaming focused windows OS which has multi-store integration, etc), and everything still points towards them attempting to coax their current xbox console user base towards that. This is evident in the fact that there are now a lot of people who are disappointed by the notion of a bog standard traditional Xbox console that's limited to just the Xbox console store now that they've been warmed up to the idea of gaming on windows along with all the other perks that comes with.

Hopefully they come up with a product and os that excites people and doesn't just pull xbox users over. We need good competition and not what xbox has been doing this gen with their first parts lackluster releases at the beginning of the gen.

 

[Fess]

Its strange that some people cant seem to understand this.

So much confusion trying to be generated around this box.

If you look at purely what Microsoft has said, I think its pretty clear there is a console planned.

We have had months and years of speculation that it will be a PC on here and now some people are using that speculation to cause themselves confusion, which is dont quite understand. It seems simple.

There's an xbox console coming. It will play xbox games. That includes GTA VI.

Simple

I don't see how It's simple. Think about it, how exactly will they get other stores to an Xbox? Which stores? What games will be there? The assumption has to be that it's PC stores they're talking about, and PC versions.
Steam, Epic Games Store, maybe GOG but not likely since controller support ain't the best there, Ubisoft could be there, EA. They'll all need Windows, at least in the backend it needs to be traditional. The UI can be whatever.
There is no release date for GTA6 on PC, could come 6 months later, or 3 years, nobody knows.

 

[Heisenberg007]

That's the only way it would make sense IMO.

Doing it any other way creates a lot of licensing headaches along with a lot of unnecessary work.

Also everything else that they are doing and saying points towards them taking a more unified approach towards gaming on windows (e.g. The new gaming focused windows OS which has multi-store integration, etc), and everything still points towards them attempting to coax their current xbox console user base towards that. This is evident in the fact that there are now a lot of people who are disappointed by the notion of a bog standard traditional Xbox console that's limited to just the Xbox console store now that they've been warmed up to the idea of gaming on windows along with all the other perks that comes with.

Also, the "unified approach towards gaming that's not tied to a single store" is simply not possible on Xbox. You can't bring in Steam, Epic, Humble, etc. on an Xbox.

The only way to achieve that is by having a Windows system (which is inherently open and not tied to a closed ecosystem) and then have the Microsoft Store there as just one of the many options.

And that is just a very long, complicated way of saying, "It's a PC."

 

[DenchDeckard]

I don't see how It's simple. Think about it, how exactly will they get other stores to an Xbox? Which stores? What games will be there? The assumption has to be that it's PC stores they're talking about, and PC versions.
Steam, Epic Games Store, maybe GOG but not likely since controller support ain't the best there, Ubisoft could be there, EA. They'll all need Windows, at least in the backend it needs to be traditional. The UI can be whatever.
There is no release date for GTA6 on PC, could come 6 months later, or 3 years, nobody knows.

I don't think that's anything to be concerned about right now. Just wait for them to discuss it. Theyve dropped the nugget of information. Its not difficult to make an app to run on a console that is just steam etc. Doesnt seem difficult to understand, imo.

 

[MrTired]

Hopefully they come up with a product and os that excites people and doesn't just pull xbox users over. We need good competition and not what xbox has been doing this gen with their first parts lackluster releases at the beginning of the gen.

Here's the thing the product theyre offering already exists it's called a PC. The Xbox "Console" next generation will not be subside at all because it has access to multiple storefronts. In fact they'll be adding a profit margin on the hardware, same with OEM's.

We know that this gen Microsoft's subsidised their console to the tune of up to $200. So that means the series S actually cost $500 to make and the series X cost 700 to make. Do you think Microsoft would be more competitive if sold there console at cost not even for profit against a subsided competitor in the PS5.

This "console" is going to be cost prohibitive compared to the PS6 for the USP that doesn't matter to the 90% market. Steam access, Epic store access means little to Series S owner who plays Fortnite and EAFC exclusive.

PC's with console form factors exist see Asus Nuc. The only difference is it doesn't have this Windows gaming OS there developing.

If this Xbox family of devices sells 15 million next generation I'll be impressed.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

I don't see how It's simple. Think about it, how exactly will they get other stores to an Xbox? Which stores? What games will be there? The assumption has to be that it's PC stores they're talking about, and PC versions.
Steam, Epic Games Store, maybe GOG but not likely since controller support ain't the best there, Ubisoft could be there, EA. They'll all need Windows, at least in the backend it needs to be traditional. The UI can be whatever.
There is no release date for GTA6 on PC, could come 6 months later, or 3 years, nobody knows.

I think keyboard / mouse will be supported system level.

Also no guarantee a game will work on it. If it doesn't, hopefully we get option for refund from console itself.

 

[Negotiator101]

I don't think that's anything to be concerned about right now. Just wait for them to discuss it. Theyve dropped the nugget of information. Its not difficult to make an app to run on a console that is just steam etc. Doesnt seem difficult to understand, imo.

I think people are possibly a little too fixated on its a "PC" idea. I'm just wondering as it obviously needs to run on the Xbox OS closed system fundamentally, if it could also run a version of Windows so it's almost dual purpose?

 

[DenchDeckard]

Here's the thing the product theyre offering already exists it's called a PC. The Xbox "Console" next generation will not be subside at all because it has access to multiple storefronts. In fact they'll be adding a profit margin on the hardware, same with OEM's.

We know that this gen Microsoft's subsidised their console to the tune of up to $200. So that means the series S actually cost $500 to make and the series X cost 700 to make. Do you think Microsoft would be more competitive if sold there console at cost not even for profit against a subsided competitor in the PS5.

This "console" is going to be cost prohibitive compared to the PS6 for the USP that doesn't matter to the 90% market. Steam access, Epic store access means little to Series S owner who plays Fortnite and EAFC exclusive.

PC's with console form factors exist see Asus Nuc. The only difference is it doesn't have this Windows gaming OS there developing.

If this Xbox family of devices sells 15 million next generation I'll be impressed.

Yeah, will be interesting to see what they do. I'll wait until we have official information instead of wildly speculating.

I think people are possibly a little too fixated on its a "PC" idea. I'm just wondering as it obviously needs to run on the Xbox OS closed system fundamentally, if it could also run a version of Windows so it's almost dual purpose?

Yeah, I'll leave it for Microsofts software engineers to worry about and not me. I don't care as long as it works. I'll see what MS come up with, but this could make a perfect system for my bedroom.

 

[DragonNCM]

If OEMs are building them, what branding will they use for it? Xbox PC is already taken up by Windows. I imagine they will call it Xbox Console?

Also why was their a need for AMD partnership if OEMs are building it? I imagine some standardisation is done by MS with Xbox Console. And maybe 2 or 3 chips will be the options.

yeah probably they will have 2-3 options in price range from 600-1000$.

 

[jm89]

I'm hoping this spawns another power king thread: https://www.neogaf.com/threads/ot-xbox-power-king-memes.1531914/

I think most of the xbox dudes from that thread are recovering from PTSD this gen

 

[buenoblue]

If next xbox is just a windows pc, surly piracy is gonna be a massive problem. And if Microsoft try and lock it down somehow then who is gonna pay high price for a locked down pc? Just buy pc at that point

 

[ILHASS]

What if the OEM vendors offer different levels of power?

But this will be an absolute nightmare for developers. Optimizing for several different configurations.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

If OEMs are building them, what branding will they use for it? Xbox PC is already taken up by Windows. I imagine they will call it Xbox Console?

Also why was their a need for AMD partnership if OEMs are building it?

The partnership with AMD is to avoid the use of off-the-shell components, because the new Xbox-PC is not a PC, it is an open console like the 3DO. Their intention is to position the Xbox-PC with better performance x price than a common PC, it will not work because you know with a traditional PC there is freedom to use Nvidia or other brands , used components etc.
.

 

[demigod]

But this will be an absolute nightmare for developers. Optimizing for several different configurations.

Did you not get the memo from xbox fans in 2019? Devs can just instantly push a button to downgrade it like they did with the xbox series x —> xbox series s.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

The partnership with AMD is to avoid the use of off-the-shell components, because the new Xbox-PC is not a PC, it is an open console like the 3DO. Their intention is to position the Xbox-PC with better performance x price than a common PC, it will not work because you know with a traditional PC there is freedom to use Nvidia or other brands , used components etc.
.

I imagine this will be positioned like a steam deck.

So probably will sell in the tune of 6-10 millions in a couple of years, just like them.

 

[justiceiro]

Looking at the announcement now, sounds like the next Xbox is just a chip line, like the AMD Z1 line for portables. I guess if they made a chip capable of playing Xbox back catalogue on Windows, they could try to sell to OEM and try to make a profit of royalties from AMD. That's the only way it would make sense to allow others stores to run on their ecosysteem.

 

[PlayStaytion]

Breakthrough gameplay? Please explain Sarah.

Idk, fanboy/fangirlish barriers maybe, or a nameless boxes assuming it won't matter down the road.

 

[foamdino]

What if the OEM vendors offer different levels of power?

Then it really isn't a console at that point is it

 

[MrTired]

I imagine this will be positioned like a steam deck.

So probably will sell in the tune of 6-10 millions in a couple of years, just like them.

If they (Microsoft) are happy with that I'm happy for them. If it meets the need of those users who buy it I love it for those people.

 

[Heisenberg007]

I imagine this will be positioned like a steam deck.

So probably will sell in the tune of 6-10 millions in a couple of years, just like them.

So from 80 million to 56 million to 35 million to 6 million.

The future sure seems bright.

 

[PlayStaytion]

So from 80 million to 56 million to 35 million to 6 million.

The future sure seems bright.

And PC
from 400M to 1.8B, they understand PC is the primary platform, It's the first time actually someone from MS said that in this video, they really don't care now.

 

[Clintizzle]

Then it really isn't a console at that point is it

Have you heard of the Xbox Series X and the Series S?

 

[Mister Wolf]

Then it really isn't a console at that point is it

If it has hardware accelerated backwards compatibility then it is.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

So from 80 million to 56 million to 35 million to 6 million.

The future sure seems bright.

There is more to it than just hardware sales.

Players will get great hardware. Xbox gets to become biggest game dev out there.

Its a win win situation.

Trying to sell highest no of consoles will come in the way of what both of them want.

It will cripple the specs to make it mass market friendly. Their software adaption will be limited by install base.

I think they are going in right direction.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

And PC
from 400M to 1.8B, they understand PC is the primary platform, It's the first time actually someone from MS said that in this video, they really don't care now.

Oh. They do care. They see that 1.8B (is that a real number) as potential customers, eventhough those customers have been there for many many years and have REJECTED their store for good reason. It's crap. MS have to deal with that pesky pro-consumer (not perfect) store known as Steam.

Let's not kid ourselves. These Xbox branded machines will heavily (and possibly in an anti-trust manner) promote their own store and I wouldn't be surprised if they use manipulation tactics to fool customers into thinking their purchasing it on Steam when they are purchasing from MS.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

There is more to it than just hardware sales.

Players will get great hardware. Xbox gets to become biggest game dev out there.

Its a win win situation.

Trying to sell highest no of consoles will come in the way of what both of them want.

It will cripple the specs to make it mass market friendly. Their software adaption will be limited by install base.

I think they are going in right direction.

Being a 3rd party publisher is their ONLY direction.

 

[SmurfMustard]

People (of course mostly the bottom of the barrel warriors) are so hung up on semantics.
Who cares if it's per definition a PC or a console. If it's a box to put under my TV to play games it's a console. If it plays my XBox library and GamePass then it's an XBox.
If it also has access to my Steam, Gog and Epic accounts even better.
I'll happily take one, preferably end of next year,

 

[twilo99]

Also, the "unified approach towards gaming that's not tied to a single store" is simply not possible on Xbox. You can't bring in Steam, Epic, Humble, etc. on an Xbox.

The only way to achieve that is by having a Windows system (which is inherently open and not tied to a closed ecosystem) and then have the Microsoft Store there as just one of the many options.

And that is just a very long, complicated way of saying, "It's a PC."

The current Xbox runs on a modified version of Windows already…

 

[vaibhavpisal]

The notion that puny companies got xbox to quit hardware business is hilarious.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

The notion that puny companies got xbox to quit hardware business is hilarious.

It's also hilarious that after all MS failures people like you somehow think this strategy will be the one that works.

That's hilarious.

 

[JohnnyFootball]

The current Xbox runs on a modified version of Windows already…

So? His point it still valid. The Xbox kernel still has things in it that directly access the hardware exclusive to the platform that it is on. You can't simply take a PC game and run it on Xbox Series X without devs coming in.

 

[Negotiator101]

If next xbox is just a windows pc, surly piracy is gonna be a massive problem. And if Microsoft try and lock it down somehow then who is gonna pay high price for a locked down pc? Just buy pc at that point

I think you've answered your own question.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

It's also hilarious that after all MS failures people like you somehow think this strategy will be the one that works.

That's hilarious.

I highly doubt it does anything for them in the sells figures and honestly we don't know what they are comfortable with even

I also can appreciate them trying something different as I have said before they no longer wanted to release almost the same product in the same launch window as the PS6 and get destroyed again