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[toythatkills]

People who wait for reviews and other's opinions instead of trusting their own judment and gut from reading and watching videos about it, pay full price. People that buy it before launch gets rewarded. I think is great.

You think it's great that people have to agree to pay $16 for something without having any idea of the final quality of the item, and also with refunds being totally banned in the event that it sucks? And that the publisher could easily allow reviews to be published 12 hours earlier to allow people to maked informed purchases, but instead are deliberatly forcing people into uninformed purchases?

You think that's great?

I mean, fair enough if you do, but that's so anti-consumer that it hurts. People aren't getting "rewarded" for buying it early, people are getting "punished" for buying it late.

Never mind though, my one-person stand won't change Sony's stance on this kind of thing when there are so many people willing to blindly buy things based on hype alone, so I'll just peacefully protest over here out of the way.

 

[Atrophis]

You now what I think? That whoever is responsible for when the review embargo ends is probably completely different to the person who controls when the pre-order bonus ends and they each have no control over the other. I doubt this is some big conspiracy to cheat you out of a few dollars.

 

[Creamium]

I think toythatkills is completely right, instead of a pre-order discount there should be an early adopter discount, that's in effect til the day after release or something. That way you can still see how the reception is and if it's something for you.

 

[toythatkills]

You now what I think? That whoever is responsible for when the review embargo ends is probably completely different to the person who controls when the pre-order bonus ends and they each have no control over the other. I doubt this is some big conspiracy to cheat you out of a few dollars.

Well that's a very naive way of looking at things but this is one of those situations where peoples opinions aren't easily changed.

People have strong loyalties to games, even ones that aren't out yet, and they don't like to think anything at all badly of them. I understand that, which is why this isn't really a conversation worth having.

 

[Atrophis]

Well, whatever the true story is I am quite certain the devs have no control over it. I'm not some fanboy for the game I won't be buying it until after release anyways (assuming its good).

 

[Matt Frost]

You think it's great that people have to agree to pay $16 for something without having any idea of the final quality of the item, and also with refunds being totally banned in the event that it sucks? And that the publisher could easily allow reviews to be published 12 hours earlier to allow people to maked informed purchases, but instead are deliberatly forcing people into uninformed purchases?

You think that's great?

I mean, fair enough if you do, but that's so anti-consumer that it hurts. People aren't getting "rewarded" for buying it early, people are getting "punished" for buying it late.

Never mind though, my one-person stand won't change Sony's stance on this kind of thing when there are so many people willing to blindly buy things based on hype alone, so I'll just peacefully protest over here out of the way.

You are taking 20$ waaaaaaay too seriously man. Is nothing, just 20 bucks. Or if you decide not to pre-order you are loosing 4$. If it sucks, I wont mind, I wont make a big deal out of it.

 

[toythatkills]

You are taking 20$ waaaaaaay too seriously man. Is nothing, just 20 bucks. Or if you decide not to pre-order you are loosing 4$. If it sucks, I wont mind, I wont make a big deal out of it.

Yeah, "it's only $4" isn't relevant. I know how much it is. That doesn't go anywhere towards disputing what I say as wrong. I already said it's not much in the grand scheme of things.

But it's the principle.

 

[NEO0MJ]

You're taking it too seriously, toythatkills. $20 isn't much at all. Heck, I bet Matt is willing to send you a $20 PSN code to buy the game for yourself!

 

[Lima]

You're taking it too seriously, toythatkills. $20 isn't much at all. Heck, I bet Matt is willing to send you a $20 PSN code to buy the game for yourself!

Jokes on you he would only need to send him a $15 card.

 

[hey_it's_that_dog]

You think it's great that people have to agree to pay $16 for something without having any idea of the final quality of the item, and also with refunds being totally banned in the event that it sucks? And that the publisher could easily allow reviews to be published 12 hours earlier to allow people to maked informed purchases, but instead are deliberatly forcing people into uninformed purchases?

You think that's great?

I mean, fair enough if you do, but that's so anti-consumer that it hurts. People aren't getting "rewarded" for buying it early, people are getting "punished" for buying it late.

Never mind though, my one-person stand won't change Sony's stance on this kind of thing when there are so many people willing to blindly buy things based on hype alone, so I'll just peacefully protest over here out of the way.

I'm in your side here. If there were refunds on PSN it wouldn't be an issue, but as things are now, it's blatantly a tactic to entice people to buy before they can carefully deliberate about the purchase.

I think the only viable counter tactic available to consumers right now is to refuse to preorder digital games until a refund system is established.

 

[NEO0MJ]

Jokes on you he would only need to send him a $15 card.

Is there such a thing?
Don't think I ever saw it 🤔
Plus the game's $16 with discount so ¯_(&#12484_/¯

 

[toythatkills]

Haha, I don't even want the game for free. I'd happily pay for it if the reviews were available literally one day earlier.

 

[mckmas8808]

I'm in your side here. If there were refunds on PSN it wouldn't be an issue, but as things are now, it's blatantly a tactic to entice people to buy before they can carefully deliberate about the purchase.

I think the only viable counter tactic available to consumers right now is to refuse to preorder digital games until a refund system is established.

Or don't preorder games that you don't think will be good. I don't mind preordering a game and it ending up being worse than I thought, because I usually only preorder games from developers that I trust.

So if it's bad, at a minimum I gave money to a developer that I've liked for a while.

 

[nbnt]

Well that's a very naive way of looking at things but this is one of those situations where peoples opinions aren't easily changed.

People have strong loyalties to games, even ones that aren't out yet, and they don't like to think anything at all badly of them. I understand that, which is why this isn't really a conversation worth having.

.. You do realize Sony isn't the publisher for this game?

 

[Nameless]

You think it's great that people have to agree to pay $16 for something without having any idea of the final quality of the item, and also with refunds being totally banned in the event that it sucks? And that the publisher could easily allow reviews to be published 12 hours earlier to allow people to maked informed purchases, but instead are deliberatly forcing people into uninformed purchases?

You think that's great?

I mean, fair enough if you do, but that's so anti-consumer that it hurts. People aren't getting "rewarded" for buying it early, people are getting "punished" for buying it late.

Never mind though, my one-person stand won't change Sony's stance on this kind of thing when there are so many people willing to blindly buy things based on hype alone, so I'll just peacefully protest over here out of the way.

A year's worth of gameplay videos, information, and impressions count for nothing? What about developer pedigree? You act as though it's impossible to make an educated decision about a game pre-release. Most here have been gaming long enough that we are acutely aware of our personal tastes and can, pretty reliably, identify games we will like without always having to play them first time or wait for reviews.

Would discounts be nice? Sure. More options for the consumer is never a bad thing. But the implication that pre-orders or pre-order incentives in an environment without discounts necessarily constitutes a scam or some other form of trickery is more than a little off base.

 

[truly101]

I think toythatkills is completely right, instead of a pre-order discount there should be an early adopter discount, that's in effect til the day after release or something. That way you can still see how the reception is and if it's something for you.

I agree with this. I get that they want to incentivize early sales with discounts, but that really should extend to at least the first week of release. Thats the difference between encouraging customers to buy newly released games, or saying "we got your money, sucker".

For me, I preordered ABZU because I liked Journey and I liked the Endless Ocean games. I've been looking forward to it since it was announced a while back.

 

[More_Badass]

I'm in your side here. If there were refunds on PSN it wouldn't be an issue, but as things are now, it's blatantly a tactic to entice people to buy before they can carefully deliberate about the purchase.

I think the only viable counter tactic available to consumers right now is to refuse to preorder digital games until a refund system is established.

Why can't they carefully deliberate about a purchase over the weeks before release? Reviews are useful, but it's not like they're going to dissaude me from what interests me about the game in the first place: short length, visuals, music, underwater setting, etc.

 

[DoctorFling]

This game looks so beautiful, can't wait.

 

[truly101]

Why can't they carefully deliberate about a purchase over the weeks before release? Reviews are useful, but it's not like they're going to dissaude me from what interests me about the game in the first place: short length, visuals, music, underwater setting, etc.

Its not just reviews from official outlets, but also user impressions. GAF impressions have swayed me on purchases both ways. Also previews interviews, even game footage may not reveal bugs or poor performance issues that need to be fixed.

Sometimes a games premise may spark interest, but if all the preview material hype doesn't put you over the fence, user impressions and official reviews may do just that. Trust me when I say there are a few DL games like ABZU that I wished I had waited on instead of purchasing based on previews and trailers. Submerged.......yuck

 

[toythatkills]

Why can't they carefully deliberate about a purchase over the weeks before release? Reviews are useful, but it's not like they're going to dissaude me from what interests me about the game in the first place: short length, visuals, music, underwater setting, etc.

Because pre-release hype and previews are notoriously unreliable when it comes to the quality of a game.

This game looks brilliant, but it could turn out to be 25 minutes long, full of game-breaking bugs and crashes, and with a control scheme that only those with a degree in PS4 controllers can hope to master. That's the kind of thing I want to know about before I buy a game, which I'm being told by some publisher that I'm not allowed to know unless I pay them more money.

Again, it's the principle.

 

[Humdinger]

You think it's great that people have to agree to pay $16 for something without having any idea of the final quality of the item,

You don't "have to agree to" do anything. It's a minor discount for people who want to take it, on the terms offered. If you don't want it, you don't "have to" take it. You're making it sound like it is being forced down your throat. It's a choice. If you don't like the terms, then give it a pass. Seems rather absurd to paint it as some kind of forced oppression.

Anyway, hope we can get back to talking about the game.

Looks beautiful and entrancing. Sounds wonderful and evocative.

One week.

 

[More_Badass]

Because pre-release hype and previews are notoriously unreliable when it comes to the quality of a game

I've almost never found this to be true, at least for me

Especially with indie games and devs, who don't have the safety net of assured sales and other franchises. A broken game, a misrepresented debut, and their reputation is done.

 

[ChanMan]

Dang the tone of this thread has changed the last two pages I am sure it wasn't intentional but any who I am excited to play this. The only issue I have now my fiance wants to play this as she is a huge Journey fan. Kind of wish this had co op now I can only imagine how fun that would be.

 

[HStallion]

While I do see the issue with dropping the pre order discount before reviews its not nearly an expensive enough price to dissuade me from jumping in before the reviews. I can already tell I will enjoy the music from both the sample we were given earlier in the thread and the past work by Austin Winory. The visuals are some of the best I have ever seen so that's good and the gameplay from I've seen looks suitably relaxing and laid back. I find myself basing sales less on less on reviews unless something is absolutely hammered or is getting praise well beyond what I expected.

 

[nbnt]

Because pre-release hype and previews are notoriously unreliable when it comes to the quality of a game.

This game looks brilliant, but it could turn out to be 25 minutes long, full of game-breaking bugs and crashes, and with a control scheme that only those with a degree in PS4 controllers can hope to master. That's the kind of thing I want to know about before I buy a game, which I'm being told by some publisher that I'm not allowed to know unless I pay them more money.

Again, it's the principle.

Dude, you're really taking this the wrong way. The game is $20, that's its price on PSN and on Steam, the 20% pre-order discount is part of Sony's yearly Play promotion. Meaning if the game wasn't part of this promotion it would've been $20 whether you pre-ordered it or not. Sony's been doing this promotion since 2011: http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/08/05/psnplay/

 

[m@cross]

Had a chance to play this at PAXEast. Was enjoyable, but I was unsure of what the point of the game was. Seeing that there is a central story, even a rough one or not, and things to do beyond just exploring, I am sold.

Plus the price makes it an easy choice, would have to be absolute garbage for me to feel like I wasted such a small sum. This type of game is a good example of how small developers keep the hobby interesting.

 

[toythatkills]

Dude, you're really taking this the wrong way. The game is $20, that's its price on PSN and on Steam, the 20% pre-order discount is part of Sony's yearly Play promotion. Meaning if the game wasn't part of this promotion it would've been $20 whether you pre-ordered it or not. Sony's been doing this promotion since 2011: http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/08/05/psnplay/

The game is $16, or $20 if you want to wait to see if it's good first. I mean, I know it's only $4 but that's not important, those are the facts. The publisher has decided that they're happy to take peoples' money and they're going to make damn sure it's locked in before they let people know whether or not the game's okay. It probably will be, but it's the practice in general I disagree with for this or any other game.

If this doesn't bother you then it's fine, I don't care if you live your life that way, but personally it's not something I can support, whether it's about $1 or $4 or $40. As a community we're taken advantage of time and time again by publishers and we still eat up shit like this as if it's totally fine to have our money taken sight-unseen without any hope of a refund in the event that (God forbid) the game turns out to be terrible.

There's literally no reason at all why they couldn't have ended the review embargo one day earlier. Copies are out there, people are playing it, this decision is solely to make sure people have paid their money and they can't get it back. There's no other reason for it. They knew when the pre-order promo would end, and they timed the reviews to fit it.

Anyway, I won't say anything further because anyone reading this has got more than enough information to come to their own conclusions now, we're just repeating ourselves, and y'all can talk about the game.

 

[Lima]

Had a chance to play this at PAXEast. Was enjoyable, but I was unsure of what the point of the game was. Seeing that there is a central story, even a rough one or not, and things to do beyond just exploring, I am sold.

Yeah but what do you even do in this game?

🤔

 

[ironcreed]

I have so much stress in my life right now that this is exactly what I need to wind down with. Perfect timing.

 

[Jimmyfenix]

Just noticed the discount is live in Europe. Pre ordered

 

[m@cross]

Yeah but what do you even do in this game?

🤔

Pretty much summed up in the OP. Also just enjoyable to chill and explore the world they created, play with the animals etc.

 

[Lima]

Pretty much summed up in the OP. Also just enjoyable to chill and explore the world they created, play with the animals etc.

Eh you know the No Mans Sky meme. Fits this game as well tbh.

 

[HStallion]

Eh you know the No Mans Sky meme. Fits this game as well tbh.

And it was annoying and stupid and tired in NMS over a year ago and its just as tired for ABZU today.

 

[NEO0MJ]

Is there any idea about how long the game is? That's the only thing that might detract me from buying it. I'd prefer it to be a short experience.

 

[ghibli99]

Why are people choosing to take this out on Abzu? It's weird. People preorder full-priced $60 and higher games without batting an eye, but here Sony's giving PS+ members an opportunity to not only save 20%, but get even more if they preorder 2 games. This is nothing new. It's an incentive, not a punishment for waiting. It's not like on day one the game will now be $25. At the end of the day, it's a "whopping" $4 difference. That's more than what I pay in sales tax for a new game, even with the GCU or Amazon preorder/new release discount.

 

[Veritigo_X]

Just pre-ordered. Been looking forward to this game since it was announced.

 

[nbnt]

Is there any idea about how long the game is? That's the only thing that might detract me from buying it. I'd prefer it to be a short experience.

It'll most definitely be short (and sweet ), here's something from a pretty old preview:

At this point it's difficult to gauge how long the game will be. A representative of publisher 505 Games said "sub-five hours." This is likely going to be a game for people who enjoy short, emotionally punchy stories without much in the way of player violence.

http://www.polygon.com/2015/6/10/8732577/abzu-underwater-wonderland

 

[ChanMan]

Is there any idea about how long the game is? That's the only thing that might detract me from buying it. I'd prefer it to be a short experience.

I can't imagining this being longer than 3-5 hours.

 

[Fakeknowledge]

Pre-ordered 🙌🙌🙌

Hope the theme is decent, the Transistor theme's run has gone on for far too long.

 

[NEO0MJ]

It'll most definitely be short (and sweet ), here's something from a pretty old preview:

http://www.polygon.com/2015/6/10/8732577/abzu-underwater-wonderland

I can't imagining this being longer than 3-5 hours.

Well, I'm in.

 

[Deckard Chapel]

Well, I'm in.

It will most likely be between 2-5 hours.

 

[Kremzeek]

I finally preordered it last weekend.

I don't care if it's "short" - I'm just happy a dev is making something this beautiful.

 

[Ferr986]

Just noticed the discount is live in Europe. Pre ordered

Same. Didn't know about a discount!

 

[FiveMinuteHero]

If it's even half as good as Journey, it'll be incredible.

Hopefully not half as long though!

When will the reviews be up? Hopefully in time to snap the pre-order discount.

 

[Humdinger]

When will the reviews be up? Hopefully in time to snap the pre-order discount.

lol, read the last two pages.

tldr: 8/2, and no, not in time. Pre-order if you're confident you'll like the game. If you need reviews to make up your mind, just buy it at the regular price.

 

[NateDrake]

It will most likely be between 2-5 hours.

This sounds reasonable. Depending how much one chooses to swim around and explore, it could be on the higher end of that figure.

 

[dreamfall]

Just been listening to that one song of the soundtrack on the Austin Wintory bandcamp page over and over again.

So ready to get lost !

 

[FiveMinuteHero]

Pre-ordered, for the discount and because I'm a sucker for underwater/diving games. Are there any good, more realistic diving games out there (any platform). I really enjoyed Everblue and the sequel on on the PS2 and Endless Ocean 1 and 2 on the Wii. They stopped making them though

 

[NEO0MJ]

It will most likely be between 2-5 hours.

I'm probably going to be one of the 2 hour people. Maaaybe three.

 

[Deckard Chapel]

I just pre-ordered ABZÛ and Bound. I am ready!

I also pre-ordered the ABZÛ soundtrack [digital]. $7 seemed too low, so I gave $20

I will be gifting this soundtrack to friends and family, as well as buying the physical version when it's released. The title track is without equal in my opinion - truly perfection.