And painfully unfunny.
Charlie Kirk assassinated at Utah campus event
- Thread starter HeisenbergFX4
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And painfully unfunny.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Also, neither BLM or Antifa are "organizations", the proclamation kinda means nothing ... right ?
The Pleasure
Gold Member
Oh look. The party of personal responsibilities
Maga dentist jokes about giving people who don't agree with her worse care
Maga dentist jokes about giving people who don't agree with her worse care
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FalconPunch
Member
No offense but why is there a 145 page thread about this? Yea Charlie for sure didn't deserve to die for sharing his opinions but he's just a random dude. To tell you how messed up the usa is, people are fighting each over a random social media influencer? Why is the government giving special treatment to this case over similar cases? Blaming video games, triggering culture wars? Why is the president triggering culture wars and writing on social media about this shit? His job is to unify. That's the job of a president. I mean one has to be a complete idiot to ignore the cultural pendulum swings that are creating a more turbulent discourse with each government.
Even in this thread, people are fighting themselves over a random social media influencer? Literally ripping the country apart at the seams in a stupid tit for tat culture war? All while this is going on, the US dollar continues to lose value, bills have been passed triggering the biggest mismanagement of federal funds I've seen from a so called G8 country. As someone who spent some time in a 3rd world country, these are the same patterns of corruption I saw over there. People arguing over useless shit. Liberals this, Republicans that.... blah, blah, blah. Very soon, Americans will come to know poverty if this continues. There's only one big loser here as this nonsense continues and it's American citizens. The speed at which the world is rushing to reorganize itself is breakneck. If the US loses reserve currency status, it's entirely fucked for a myriad of reasons. And right now, the biggest winner is looking to be China. If any of you ever have the opportunity, go to China and you'll very clearly see first hand how the states is already being gapped in many categories.
Even in this thread, people are fighting themselves over a random social media influencer? Literally ripping the country apart at the seams in a stupid tit for tat culture war? All while this is going on, the US dollar continues to lose value, bills have been passed triggering the biggest mismanagement of federal funds I've seen from a so called G8 country. As someone who spent some time in a 3rd world country, these are the same patterns of corruption I saw over there. People arguing over useless shit. Liberals this, Republicans that.... blah, blah, blah. Very soon, Americans will come to know poverty if this continues. There's only one big loser here as this nonsense continues and it's American citizens. The speed at which the world is rushing to reorganize itself is breakneck. If the US loses reserve currency status, it's entirely fucked for a myriad of reasons. And right now, the biggest winner is looking to be China. If any of you ever have the opportunity, go to China and you'll very clearly see first hand how the states is already being gapped in many categories.
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StueyDuck
Member
Did you read the article?
The Pleasure
Gold Member
I went to her practice and now my teeth look like the British book of smiles. It's like the covid vaccine all over again. They promised magnetism, and yet I still can't get metals to bend to my command. They also promised 5g and my reception still sucks ass.
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StueyDuck
Member
Dis a bot?
The Pleasure
Gold Member
Dat a bot?
cormack12
Gold Member
What an asshole
cormack12
Gold Member
Take this is just a collectors edition yeah?
The lawmakers said that should the bill become law, no more than 400,000 Kirk coins would be minted.
Icymanipulator
Member
Why does it bother you so much?
Clearly his death impacted many. Not only was he killed doing what he was known for - debating with people. He was a good man. He welcomed gays and minorities into the conservative movement and set a good example for what a man should be as he emphasized the importance of family and marriage. People love holding up MLK as some pillar of moral virtue but Charlie exemplified all those virtues far better. MLK slept with prostitutes, had orgies and hit women.
Furthermore, Charlie provided direction and a clear message in an age where truth is nebulous and nothing seems real. He stood up to bullshit about gender in the face of massive hate and told simple obvious truths like the fact that there's only 2 sexes, male and female.
I didn't agree with him on abortion but he was entitled to his position. And finally, the fact that we all saw his brutal death was shocking and disturbing. The nation watched a man get shot and fall over bleeding out. Only truly sick and deranged people can see that and not be affected by it.
DirtInUrEye
Member
Debatable.
calico
Member
"just a random dude"
Firstly, what an odd way to describe someone who was specifically targeted in a political assassination.
Secondly, political assassinations (and other forms of terrorism) are treated even more seriously than regular crime because they are not just a crime against the individual but an attack on the foundation of society. The higher profile the victim is, the more powerful the attack is and the more robust the response must be.
Firstly, what an odd way to describe someone who was specifically targeted in a political assassination.
Secondly, political assassinations (and other forms of terrorism) are treated even more seriously than regular crime because they are not just a crime against the individual but an attack on the foundation of society. The higher profile the victim is, the more powerful the attack is and the more robust the response must be.
DirtInUrEye
Member
Yes, normally this is proportionate and procedural. At the moment though, this line framed around the current administration has a strong whiff of hypocrisy and overreaction about it. Last week's televised ceremony with cuddles and yet more rage stoking was just ghastly. Moreover, let's not forget there are many in the US who feel they are seeing attacks on the "foundation of society" emerging from places never thought possible, and not just the nutter with a gun variety.
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nush
Member
Baemono
Gold Member
I'm dying of laughter on my desk right now
He wasn't a random influencer or YouTuber. Read the ro...thread. This thread is big because this subject still literally consumes daily interactions in America. I hear about it every day and it won't stop for a long time. This event signified the actual divide in our nation and the fallout has shown which side is reluctant to come to the table. A president can't call for unity when the half that celebrates this refuse to unite and their political leaders also refuse to unite.
What about the lefts reaction (from elected officials and grave dancers) makes you think they're willing to find common ground, because the right sure as hell isn't going to budge after they're the ones being attacked.
If Trump is labeling these far left extremist groups domestic terrorists, you have to stand your ground because you NEVER negotiate with terrorists.
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Wildebeest
Member
Yes, a lot of us barely knew who he was before this happened. But have you been in a coma for 50 years? Democracy has been declining in the west for a long time now and very few even seem to care. Many are cheering on and finding it hilarious.
Hot5pur
Member
Interesting perspective. In my opinion he was more of a provocative figure with a religious agenda and made a career out of inflammatory rhetoric, almost Milo level (if you remember that guy).
Kirk had some choice quotes about:
- downgrading MLK and the civil rights movement
- making a joke about how gays can't be thrown off buildings in Ghaza anymore because their buildings are destroyed
- Being anxious about black airplane pilots because of DEI
- saying feminism was a mistake and women's jobs is to take care of the family and be home makers
- calling George Floyd a scumbag in the immediate aftermath of his death
- saying abortion is comparable or worse than the holocaust
- saying 2nd amendment was worth it despite all the mass shootings
And many, many more. Now it's possible a lot of these seem mild to some folks. To me it seems this guy was set on taking society back into the dark ages. But I think more he realized he could make a career by being a shit disturber rather than doing something valuable with his life. One less divisive inflammatory online persona I guess, but I'm sure someone will fill that role soon enough.
DirtInUrEye
Member
Please. The president has demonstrated no interest whatsoever in uniting the country, especially since Kirk's killing. Even as the dead man's widow was saying she forgives the shooter to an evangelical crowd, Trump was openly avowing the precise opposite that actually, he hates his "opponent" i.e. the left. Unite? He's doubled down on carving out a chasmic divide.
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Darkmakaimura
Can You Imagine What SureAI Is Going To Do With Garfield?
Whatever happened to the roommate? I heard she recently "disappeared l" as if she fled or something?
I don't disagree with you but what I say still stands. You can't unite when the others sides leaders refuse to also take accountability. Why should the right unite with the left when we all literally saw how the far left acted. Does that seem like a group that will accept unity even with a BS speech asking for it?
calico
Member
The procedural response isn't working. I think the magnitude of the response in this case has largely been informed by the degree of open support for the assassination rather than just by the assassination itself. This is clearly now beyond a 'crazy individual' problem, and treating it a such would be a wholly inadequate response.
The cultural shift from a near-universal instinctive response to something like this of 'I really hope this murderer isn't associated with my side', to fairly widespread celebration of a 'successful attack' and advocating for more attacks, is not something which society or government can afford to take lightly. The former response at least speaks to a mindset of still wanting to participate in a peaceful society (as turbulent as it may be at times) while the latter speaks to a mindset of someone who already considers themselves at war with society. The latter cannot be pandered to and cannot be left unaddressed.
It is only being used to media being so dominated by one side of American politics which makes most of those seem unusually divisive. Many Americans hold the view that abortion is murder, and/or the view that keeping 2A is worth the cost for instance, it is just that mainstream media will almost always present these as being the 'wrong' opinion.
crazepharmacist
Member
Do you think we live in a perfect society where we can have armed citizenry and not have a single gun death?
I had the same thoughts. To put things in perspective, as of August 300 people have died in school shootings this year in the US, there were more in September, even on the same day Charlie was killed!
No one in the government cares when the kids die, only if these kids had conservative podcasts....
Trunx81
Member
how many of them were killed for their political views?
ComeBackBaby
Member
Score 1 for COINTELPRO shitposting
. Letting an FBI smear campaign (which ultimately led to them ragequitting and telling MLK to kill himself) dictate your narrative on him is awful.
calico
Member
CNN has it at 19 deaths this year as of three days ago?
Trilobit
Absolutely Cozy
1. Charlie Kirk represented free speech and respectful debate between opposing sides. He was killed for it and many celebrated it. Which is why it's a big deal for Americans, especially for the right.
2. I think people can hold more than two thoughts at one time. For example, I can care about Charlie Kirk and also care about my family and about the future of my country.
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BlackTron
Member
It means a lot, by trying to blur the line of antifa like that, he's creating a legal pathway for anyone who identifies as being "anti fascist" to also be a terrorist, in other words, start to get nervous about telling the truth about who you are.
You've already been told this and it seems like you're ignoring it. You aren't seeing the government act the way it is because Charlie Kirk was assassinated. You're seeing the government act this way because the far left, leftist media, and certain left politicians are grace dancing, lying about the reality, and celebrating / endorsing political violence.
If someone said these kids deserved to die because they were Christian's and their families hate gay/trans people and believed in banning abortion, you SURE AS HELL would see a societal backlash to crush people who say that and they will be societally punished, right or left.
In the end it's about what's being said and how society as a whole views something. No one said "fuck them kids, they deserved it" so we don't have to have that conversation. But people are saying "fuck Charlie Kirk and his views, he deserved it" and THAT needs to be addressed because more than half the nation agrees with Kirk and they feel as if the crazy lefts they know also want THEM dead. That's bad for society.
DirtInUrEye
Member
Reasonable and I do understand this angle. The usual militant left culprits on places like reddit were waaaay to quick to celebrate a person's cold-blooded murder, those freaks are equally just as bad as their opposite number on the extreme right. Nobody expects any authority to just stand back and do nothing about it.
However, when the ruling government itself is demonstrably at least partly to blame for such inflammatory reaction and rhetoric related to myriad incidents of late, well the otherwise sensible argument you make rings hollow.
calico
Member
This association between 'Antifa' and 'being anti fascist' only exists in the minds of people who align themselves with Antifa. The vast majority of Americans are opposed to fascism and want absolutely nothing to do with the terrorist organization Antifa and do not support their acts of terrorism.
FalconPunch
Member
It bothers me a lot for a myriad of reasons but 2 in particular come to mind. I had in the past lamented about the slow degradation of the US due to the promotion of policies that stifled competition and innovation. Policies that restricted education to the mass populace which in the long run makes the country less competitive. I mean, you can even see it in this thread. Look at the reasoning behind some of the arguments that are posed in this thread and it's very easy to see how 54% of Americans have a literacy rate at or below grade six level. The shocking part is that many of these people can vote.
Initially, you could liken it to looking at the slow crumble of an empire however lately, y'all have decided to speed run this bitch… The problem for me is that personally, I don't want an unstable country as my next door neighbour. Its in my best interest that the states is functioning well. The last thing we need is a Russia 2.0 chilling next door. Secondly, having made many concessions to align our policies with the states, a change in world power means a change in policy. A change in policy means an increase in tensions and hostilities.
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FalconPunch
Member
Nope, I've traveled around to different parts of the states for work, and travelled to a lot of countries around the world. The US is being gapped in a lot of areas by a lot of countries. The best and most brilliant workers in the states are not american by birth. They come from other countries.I lived there for 16 years. You've drank the CCP propaganda if you think this.
If you look at the development China has made from the 70s to now and then compare it to the progress the states has made in a similar amount of time, its really easy to see how badly the growth rate of the US is lagging behind. If we look at GDP as one metric, since the 1970 the US has had a declining growth rate with GDP growing roughly at 3-4% in the 70s. Now it averages 2-3%. Meanwhile China since 1970ish to now has an average gdp growth of 9% annually. In terms of infrastructure, in terms of education, even innovation, etc, the US is easily being gapped.
When you spend time travelling around the world, its so easy to see. You don't need CNN or Fox news telling you what to believe when you can see it with your own eyes.
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FalconPunch
Member
There have been more concerning things that have happened than this incident which failed to receive a similar amount of attention. You had political leaders in one of your states killed, I didn't see a thread this big for it. Your congress is not working as intended, nobody is talking about that… Where is the 145 page thread for the "Big Beautiful Bill"? Have you read it? If you had, i'm certain that there would be things there that would immediately be of pressing concern to you.
As an outsider who has the benefit of having no side in this battle, its very to see how the country has swing so badly in the wrong direction. So much time is being spent on trivial meaningless discussions that have no real impact on the trajectory of the country. Meanwhile, very poor decisions are being made in the background that are eating away at the country's future.
It's so very meaningless and short sighted. Now one party has gotten into power after being on the outskirts for so long. They've made the exact same mistake as their predecessor forgetting that you need to make decisions keeping the country as a whole in one context. Now the pendulum has swung 2-3 steps to the right. What they forget is that they'll eventually lose power, then the pendulum will swing 3-4 steps to the left. America is not really focusing on going forward. Its just going side to side while going absolutely nowhere.
Since the beginning of time, people have always had differing opinions, beliefs and views. In the past, discussions could be had and concessions could be made to move forward. Now it's an environment where people refuse to engage in discourse and use social media as a representation of world views. The reality being social media couldn't be further from the truth.
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BlackTron
Member
I hope this post ages well but I fear it won't.
I think targeting neo-nazis handing out flyers in the mall with sniper rifles (or Charlie Kirk) is political extremism and being "anti-fascist" isn't an excuse for that behavior.
On the other hand, Hitler's subordinates who planned an assassination attempt were gallant anti-fascists who deserve heroic medals.
The difference is context, fascists coexisting with others in a society with laws, and fascists tearing down that legal framework to hunt and destroy other people at their discretion -they have to be stopped at all costs.
Unfortunately, in order to have the unequivocal moral high ground to take that kind of action to assassinate the leader, they must have already taken over and destroyed countless lives (ie Putin), even if you already see the chess board being set up, you must respect the laws and remove them through conventional means first (much like Hitler was jailed before his return).
They weren't antifascists. Mainly they thought Hitler had become incompetent, and were largely still on board with Nazi ideology otherwise.
The Pleasure
Gold Member
They're not making that face because of the coin. They're making that face because you don't believe in deodorant, Smash Bros player.
BlackTron
Member
I may be conflating history with movies, and the military hierarchy with embarrassed members of society. So no, they don't deserve medals.
Yeah, movies like Valkyrie romanticize those men and carefully sidestep the elephant in the room.
It's the communist hunt all over again.
Icymanipulator
Member
Wow so convincing. Do you have anything to back to that up lol.
Angry_Megalodon
Gold Member
He would probably become the future POTUS in 10-15 years. No, not a random dude. You can tell he was not random but how cheerfully leftist celebrate his death. He was a threat, and that's why they killed him.
It's curious you mention the degradation of the US, which runs parallel to the whole West decay (the disease is the same for everyone) but you don't link this assassination as a consequence of such degradation. Those things are related. When you stir up the country to create racial and social tensions, this is what happens: a state of pre civil war.
China is progressing at full speed because they don't have those internal obstacles. They don't embrace anti-China ideologies that drive its society insane. Their politicians can think in the long term because they are not elected. The only advantage of democracies over a technocracy (what China is Today) is freedom. Remove that and you are left with nothing. We are living in democratic countries without the theoretical advantages of a democracy, but with all their bad things: high criminality, short-sighted politicians, social clashes.
For many, Charlie Kirk symbolized the freedom we have lost.
DirtInUrEye
Member
Convincing? It was meant as a remark, not a well thought out persuasive argument.
Icymanipulator
Member
So this is why your upset that people are spending 145 peaches talk about Charlie Kirk?
Taking examples from a thread and extrapolating
that out of all of society and then making sweeping grand claims about what it all means seems to be highly suspect in my view.
I'm assuming from your post, you are from Canada? You say we're your neighbors.
Yes it was a low effort drive by post that tried to dismiss an entire chain of thought with one witty remark.
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daffyduck
Member
Sure. Right up there with the desire to visit North Korea.
DirtInUrEye
Member
It was witty? Thank you.
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