I know, right? What a pleasant surprise it turned out to be.
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COMICS! |OT| July 2013. Celebrate liberty with the ultimate patriotic superhero.
- Thread starter Spike Spiegel
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I know, right? What a pleasant surprise it turned out to be.
Spike Spiegel
Member
I must be one of the only people on GAF to be somewhat glad Damian is gone.
I liked him, but he should stay gone.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
And with that, Spike Spiegal's OT making abilities were revoked
Rafa, you wanna be a comic superstar, this is the next big step
Rafa, you wanna be a comic superstar, this is the next big step
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I'm just disappointed that Morrison decided to end his run by rehashing one of, if not the, most famous stories in Batman history. He's fond of taking his ball and going home, but dead Robin has been done many times and Damian was just too new for most people to give much of a shit. Bad end note.
GrandHarrier
Member
What does your friend dislike? The Movement is basically the idea of a team of vigilantes who want to protect the low classes of society that get abused by police, ignored by the government, the ones who suffer the most (there is also a specific storythread of
a serial killer)
It's Simone exploring several fascinating dynamics at once. She also introduces a number of new characters that are instantly identifiable.
That's my feeling about it.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Wait. You changed your name? Why???
GrandHarrier
Member
Not me. I'm the other guy Tim mentioned in the quote. I never elaborated on why I thought The Movement was good.
slightconfuse
Banned
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
Oh good.
For me, Damian might be the first character in all my years of reading comics where the 'death' actually bothered me enough that I hope he comes back sooner rather than later.
Usually I take comic book deaths in stride because of the nature of the beast and rather see what happens in the meantime. But not here. I liked the character that much. Of course, if/when he comes back he wouldn't be written by Morrison so that takes a little of the enthusiasm away.
Usually I take comic book deaths in stride because of the nature of the beast and rather see what happens in the meantime. But not here. I liked the character that much. Of course, if/when he comes back he wouldn't be written by Morrison so that takes a little of the enthusiasm away.
Speak for yourself! I fucking love Damien, and Morrison did a great job of building up that character and actually making me care that he died. The other sidekicks - aside from Dick - I couldn't give a shit about.
Plus, rehashing is kinda the name of the game of Morrison's Batman run. It's not like he just ripped off the "death of Robin" story because he ran out of ideas, his whole run has been about mining all Batman stories and all continuities. It's not so dissimilar from his New X-Men, where told his own story by paying homage to the franchise's greatest hits (Sentinels, Magneto, Phoenix, alternate dark future, etc.) - another run that he also coincidentally ended with a 'rehash death.'
Adventures of Superman #1-10: I won't know for sure till I read more of Smallville S11 to compare, but I'm calling this the best Superman book out. Even the weaker tales are enjoyable.
Earth 2 #14: I'm going to miss Robinson on this book. Really love the world he's built here. I feel like I should recognize [spoilers]Steppenwolfe's hounds, but I'm not up on my New Gods knowledge. Love Alan's plan. "We go in, fuck shit up, then I launch a PR campaign. What could go wrong?"
Earth 2 #14: I'm going to miss Robinson on this book. Really love the world he's built here. I feel like I should recognize [spoilers]Steppenwolfe's hounds, but I'm not up on my New Gods knowledge. Love Alan's plan. "We go in, fuck shit up, then I launch a PR campaign. What could go wrong?"
The Movement #3: Best issue yet. I'm amazed how much I'm enjoying this. The main leader girl is kinda dull though.
The Green Team #2: What's sad about how much I'm loving this comic is knowing it's doomed to be canceled.
Mo is definitely the worst of the bunch in that he's kind of dull, but I'm sure his story will shape up. Cecilia is probably my favorite character.
Batman Inc. #12: Holy shit that was awesome.
Green Arrow #22: Best issue since 17. Art is still stellar.
Trinity of Sin: Pandora #1: Why was this good tho? Pandora has some potential as a character.
Decided to get Superior Foes of Spider-Man, but I haven't read it yet.
The Green Team #2: What's sad about how much I'm loving this comic is knowing it's doomed to be canceled.
Mo is definitely the worst of the bunch in that he's kind of dull, but I'm sure his story will shape up. Cecilia is probably my favorite character.Batman Inc. #12: Holy shit that was awesome.
Green Arrow #22: Best issue since 17. Art is still stellar.
Trinity of Sin: Pandora #1: Why was this good tho? Pandora has some potential as a character.
I wonder how/if her story is going to tie into Shazam's.
Decided to get Superior Foes of Spider-Man, but I haven't read it yet.
Rafa=FedKilla
Banned
The OP is gonna be my first assignment?
Filthy Slug
Crowd screaming like hounds at the heat of the chase/ All the colors of the rainbow flood my face
TheKaeptain
Banned
That's because you don't have a heart.
Do you really think Damian was too new to affect people? He's been around for 7 full years now, and seems pretty popular.
I think if anything's contributing to a slightly underwhelming feeling with Morrison's run it's that the New 52 ended up overshadowing it and distracting people. That and the break between chunks of Batman Inc.
If this doesn't stir something in your cold, dead heart, then I just don't know.
Thanks for the write up. So basically everything you like and describe as a positive she hates, especially the new characters. Sounds like the perfect book to trade wait on for me.
Yeah, that has some serious potential.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
New 52 B&R run with Bruce had a great Damian too, Tomasi & Gleason did a great job with the character.
I love Damian, so it's one of the deaths I wouldn't mind seeing reversed eventually. It will be interesting to see how long his absence lasts though. I mean, his family deals with organ harvest and magic life pools...
I love Damian, so it's one of the deaths I wouldn't mind seeing reversed eventually. It will be interesting to see how long his absence lasts though. I mean, his family deals with organ harvest and magic life pools...
Spike Spiegel
Member
Look, Damian had some great stories told under Morrison's wing (and Tomasi too from what I understand, but what I've seen of those were manufactured saccharine), but he's been around for seven years and is leaving at the right time, with an impactful death and at the climax of the story he was introduced for. If he hadn't died when he did, if he hung around after Morrison's exit, then I can almost guarantee you that Damian would have overstayed his welcome, become "another" Robin, and eventually grown up just like the rest of them to compound the issue of "Old Man Bruce Wayne." My personal opinion falls in line with others who believe that there are too many Robins already, and that when they grow up -- not if, but when, because writers can't help themselves when it comes to "aging up" child characters -- they contribute to the overall sense that Batman is the adult, the old guy, the "no fun" mature one of the League bunch. And, at a time when DC is struggling to renew and refresh its iconic characters for younger generations, can one honestly say they would accomplish that with Batman if Damian Wayne graduates high school, and Bruce ends up with a biological son in college? Not to mention what that would do to Tim, Jason, Babs, and Dick?
You guys know how I feel about the New52, but honestly? At a time when every other major DC character was getting the "Fountain of Youth" treatment, they neglected to do so with a character who arguably needs it the most -- and their most popular character at that. Killing Damian off at least kept the problem from getting worse, and potentially went a little ways toward rectifying their mistake.
You guys know how I feel about the New52, but honestly? At a time when every other major DC character was getting the "Fountain of Youth" treatment, they neglected to do so with a character who arguably needs it the most -- and their most popular character at that. Killing Damian off at least kept the problem from getting worse, and potentially went a little ways toward rectifying their mistake.
That's why we have alternate future tales and books like these.
D
Deleted member 13876
Unconfirmed Member
Personally I want to see how we eventually get to Old Man Bruce Wayne, but the business side of the medium won't allow it.
Spike, you would have then just complained about what DC 'did to their most popular character.'
Seriously though, how many 'real life' years Damian's character has been around is irrelevant. What's important are good characters that are handled well, and that's what he was for the most part. You're essentially saying 'man I hate New 52 and what it's done to these characters, but I'm glad Damian's gone because him being around really kept them from doing that stuff to this character!'
I mean, unless I'm mistaken, you've already shown a disdain for Year Zero, essentially DC moving forward with New 52ing up Batman more.
Seriously though, how many 'real life' years Damian's character has been around is irrelevant. What's important are good characters that are handled well, and that's what he was for the most part. You're essentially saying 'man I hate New 52 and what it's done to these characters, but I'm glad Damian's gone because him being around really kept them from doing that stuff to this character!'
I mean, unless I'm mistaken, you've already shown a disdain for Year Zero, essentially DC moving forward with New 52ing up Batman more.
Alright so all this Damian talk has me wanting to go back to read the character's origins. My only exposure has been on the New 52 Batman & Robin series and I quite liked the little scamp.
Can someone compile a reading list or can link me to a reading list? I don't need to read absolutely everything he's been in, just the core, important stuff.
EDIT: found this link... is this accurate? - http://deconstructingdamian.tumblr.com/post/27633778980/essential-reading
Can someone compile a reading list or can link me to a reading list? I don't need to read absolutely everything he's been in, just the core, important stuff.
EDIT: found this link... is this accurate? - http://deconstructingdamian.tumblr.com/post/27633778980/essential-reading
GrandHarrier
Member
Looks pretty legit yeah. It seems overly precise with a reading order though. And stuff like the Batgirl isn't really "essential".
I'd say all you REALLY need would be “Batman and Son”, Batman and Robin Pre New 52 and Batman and Robin New 52, then of course Batman Inc.
BlueScrote
Member
I am about two-thirds of the way through Perdido Steet Station. Miéville has a crazy imagination.
Spike Spiegel
Member
Having Damian gone now when he's still young and appealing prevents future writers, writers who aren't Grant Morrison, from resorting to "firsts" stories: first day at school, first kiss, first serious girlfriend, first day of high school, first homecoming dance, first day at college, et cetera. In other words, those important events in a young person's life that signify their growing up, that writers resort to telling because they've run out of stories to tell... stories that inevitably age the characters around that child, which becomes a serious problem when the child is not the main character.Spike, you would have then just complained about what DC 'did to their most popular character.'
Seriously though, how many 'real life' years Damian's character has been around is irrelevant. What's important are good characters that are handled well, and that's what he was for the most part. You're essentially saying 'man I hate New 52 and what it's done to these characters, but I'm glad Damian's gone because him being around really kept them from doing that stuff to this character!'
I mean, unless I'm mistaken, you've already shown a disdain for Year Zero, essentially DC moving forward with New 52ing up Batman more.
At the end of the day, there are only three things you can do with a child character: age them, kill them, or pull a Franklin Richards. And Marvel barely manages to pull that last one off most of the time; people call them out on it, but I guess they get away with it because the FF is sort of this crystallized Silver Age family archetype? I don't think DC could get away with it, certainly not with Batman.
Damian's dead. If some writer wants to tell "firsts" stories about him, that's what "What If"s are for, books like this upcoming Kubert mini.
Yeah, that site's list is broken up into two lists - essential and "continued reading" ... Batman Inc isn't mentioned in there anywhere, but I will take your word for it and check it out. Thanks!
BoosterDuck
Banned
Pull a Franklin Richards?
GrandHarrier
Member
Batman Inc isn't going to have as much Damian as something like Batman and Robin, for example, but he is still one of the main side characters and it "concludes" his story for all intents and purposes for the time being. If you didn't want to get it, I'd suggest at least getting issue #8 of the New 52 version, which has his death.
Eternally 6 years old or whatever he is, I think.
Also I'm with Spike on this: not for the "it ages the character" reason but I know the next writer or the writer after that will fuck him up [I get that a lot of y'all dig the Tomasi/Gleasn BatRob but that shit is thoroughly mediocre].
There are some characters that shouldn't be written by other people and Morrison has already made a bunch (Marvel Boy, Quentin Quire) that feel wrong in the hands of others.
Batman Inc. Vol.1 (8 issues + Leviathan Strikes) has very little Damian, while Vol.2 (post new 52, ongoing) is the one that has the character running around more (which eventually leads to his demise and the conclusion of all the stuff Morrison did with Batman through all these years). Vol.2 would definitely fall on essential reading for Damian, but that list is from July 2012 which is the exact month Batman Inc. Vol.2 started being released.
Spike Spiegel
Member
While we're still on the subject of Damian...
Could the new 'Damian: Son of Batman' miniseries be pre-Flashpoint continuity? (Bleeding Cool)
Could the new 'Damian: Son of Batman' miniseries be pre-Flashpoint continuity? (Bleeding Cool)
If I had to guess I'd say no, if anything DC has altered the story so that it fits into New52. I remember reading something from a con panel not long ago, where DC honchos immediately shot down some attendee's suggestion of returning to the old DCU through specials and minis.
slightconfuse
Banned
It only needs to match up with 666 really.
Thanks for this. His death was kind of glossed over in Batman & Robin, so I will definitely need to check out Batman Inc.
WanderingWind
Mecklemore Is My Favorite Wrapper
I guess you're right. It doesn't seem like he's been around that long, but that's clearly incorrect. That doesn't change the fact that the death of Robin is well-worn territory and for such a fantastic run as Morrison had on the book, it's a lame duck end. Having Damian live would've been the shocking thing here. As it stands the death was expected, boring and will be retcon'd faster than electric Superman.
I don't think Batman knows where to find one.
Plus, isn't there some story about the Pits losing their power or whatever?
If you like invincible's first arc you're probably set for at least 50 issues, the series only got dull for me during 51ish for a few issues, then again later for another small stint, but overall it's been consistently fun.
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
IMO if you go skipping about in the Morrison run missing chunks out then you're likely to get a bit confused with the story itself. Read the whole thing, start to end and you will have a good time with a complete story. The order is :
Batman and Son
The Black Glove
RIP
Batman & Robin Vol 1-3
Time and the Batman
The Return of Bruce Wayne
Batman Inc
I think it's the only place with the 'proper' Damian, I don't think any other writers quite got the character down. Others will and have argued that Tomasi did but tbh his books were kinda boring and the voice was still off.
If your funds and time are limited, I say just read Batman and Robin 1-3. That right there is god-tier Damian and will make you LOVE the character and his partnership with Dick Grayson in particular.
When did Wolverine bang her?
Spike Spiegel
Member
...Oh crap, you just reminded me. :O
In Aaron's last run on the Wolverine solo series,
Mystique disguises herself as Yuko and has sex with Logan; it's what breaks up he and Melita, since Mystique videotaped the whole thing and sent it to her. What if blue boy is Aaron's callback to that tryst? Or what if Mystique did it again later, disguised as someone else?
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