BMO = GOAT
Member
I want Widows Court for trials again, Bungie! 
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Destiny |OT39| Tainted Love
- Thread starter DrDrizzay101
- Start date
I was laughing at that - put that on the box yet hold back reviews til release date.
Just read the article. Wow that's kinda slimy.
Also no map is going to make people happy at this point. I think they're doing fine but I really really want a rotating weekend.
Sure, but prepare to be disappointed.
I'll never forget my first time.
http://www.twitch.tv/unstablelive/v/44004449
(Hawkian was so nice)
edit: The distinct lack of JohnofMars in the thread today makes me think baby is probably arriving.
Guessing I can't get Necrochasm or Vex Mythoclast from them, but otherwise my Y1/Y2 primaries are complete. ^_^
Misterthirsty
Member
I expect you and axo to be sniping machines and I'll just hide out somewhere.
BMO = GOAT
Member
What are the drops for trials this week?
DrDrizzay101
Member
Chest and scout rifle
We should coordinate our classes to cause most hate. 3x Sunsingers or Stormcallers, 3x gunslingers with 2 tripmines each or 3 bubble bros.
xplicitone
Member
I'm burnt out of Shrine because it was like Year 1 trials 3 or 4 times, and reminds me of the "Final Round Sniper" and year 1 days which was phenomenal.
However, I will try to get my Scarab this weekend.
The map still holds a place in my heart for being first Trials map AND first Mercury trip map.
oh the good ol' days
However, I will try to get my Scarab this weekend.
The map still holds a place in my heart for being first Trials map AND first Mercury trip map.
oh the good ol' days
The nerfs hurt my baby. I miss her so much. She was my favorite of the Holy Trinity.
xplicitone
Member
If they just put Hawkmoon back the way it was, I'd be OK with that.
Thorn can go die in a fire.
Thorn can go die in a fire.
FTFY X hahahahahaha
sturgboski
Member
So uh, is there going to be a 7 win carry this week like for the doctrine? =)
Edit:
Read back a few pages: Preemptive Congratulations when it happens!
JohnOfMars
Banned
In a game where kill times are between instant and ~1 second, it's easy to continually make snap judgments and not really think about your play. But simple awareness can improve your game tremendously. Way more than knowing the meta weapons & perks or having perfect thumb skill.
I want to talk about something I've been really working on and that's first shot. Getting the first shot is a tremendous advantage, and staying in a fight if you don't get the first shot is usually stupid because there are only a few ways to win that fight:
How do you ensure getting the first shot even if you're up against ELO 2000 enemies? Control your opponent by controlling your environment. Only take fights when and where you want them.
Positional control isn't just a matter of range, either, it's a matter of X-Y positioning as well. And it's not just a matter of the enemy's. It's a matter of yours. Is their start position constrained, and their cover limited? Are you unpredictable in your start location? Do you have accessible cover? (A choke point is cover that limits your positioning rather than providing an escape).
This is TrueVanguard sniping. See how he's positioned both to have a set start point for his enemies, and limited mobility. While at the same time, he has maximum maneuverability and easy to access cover? Finally, see how far away he's positioned. He's sniping, but he's not as far back as possible. He's a at a point that his primary is still viable if he misses his headshot.
I realize that's a lot of factors, but that's what I'm talking about. This technique is true whether you're sniping or not. At this point, he has set himself up for success, and it didn't involve any legendary drag scopes or l33t thumb skill. It's playing smart.
So, knowing all that, there are 3 options once you've found your enemy to ensure that you get first shot and can finish them.
1) Push
Pushing is the most dangerous method since it relies on your own intuition to know where the enemy is and what your cover will be. Pushing is about capitalizing on engagement advantages for your guns (e.g. shotguns vs primaries), using a Super/Heavy and in Trials, controlling orbs. Pushing can also be about providing pressure for a teammate's pinch, or being the pinch yourself. (I can't comment too much on pushing since I'm a sniper, but I'm sure Ape or Nami can provide lots of tips here.)
One tip for pushing, if you're unsure, think: if I die here how difficult will my orb be to rez?
One important thing to note with pushing: DO NOT CHASE. It is very tempting to chase an enemy that is one shot. You may not have killed them, but you have gained the advantage. You know the enemy's position, you've more of the map under control and since they're weak, they're out of the fight for 3-10 seconds. All of these are valuable.
2) Run/Stall
So what do you do if you're being pushed? You have 3 options:
- Run, nothing to be ashamed of, especially if you get tagged when you're not ready. This is a very smart play if you're getting rushed by 2 players.
- Framing is about using cover to block enemies. This can be used while running, think running through doors or jumping down out of your enemy's sight lines. But it can also be used to turn a 2v1 into two separate 1v1s. If you're being pushed by two enemies, you can move into cover to prevent enemy #2 from team-shotting you. Framing is also an important part of pushing, but it's an elite skill to be sure if you used on a push.
- The last option is to prevent the push by blocking the pusher. Grenades are very effective here to give you a few seconds for recovery to kick-in, or not having a grenade to spare, you can pre-fire and attempt to give them pause.
3) Pull
Pulling offers the most control of any engagement. You're controlling the location and the timing. (Making sure you're not being actually pulled is why pushing is so dangerous.) Effective pulling puts the enemy's start position in an easy to locate position and limits their movements afterward.
How to capitalize on this advantage:
Sighting in. When you push through to a new area, you waste valuable time visually locating the enemy and then aiming at them. When you pull, you can sight in and begin firing the instant you see your enemy.
Pulling is also about getting to an optimal distance away from your target, so if you're not sniping, you can throw a grenade as they enter a choke point to instantly render them one shot. Or if you can sense when you're turning the corner, you can pre-fire your Persistence auto rifle to get to the super-strong part of the clip.
And while effective pulling is about minimizing your enemy's start position and maneuvering options, it cannot be understated about how important it is for you to maintain your own options for unpredictable starts and cover. Running & jumping through the open field of Rusted Lands may give you total range of movement, but it gives you no cover should an engagement go badly. Likewise, shooting from a doorway may seem like it gives you tons of cover, but it actually means that the enemy only has to shoot one place. So for any engagement, move between cover and pick cover that still provides movement options.
Finally, you can use pulling to bring the party to your teammates. You've scouted the enemy and you can give your teammates perfect intel. I want to distinguish deliberate pulling of enemies vs running. Running is what happens when you're being pressured and is without team coordination. Pulling is about exerting negative pressure on the enemy and having teammates ready to take advantage. To minimize the disparity between those, try not to position yourself more than 1-2 seconds away from a teammate when moving around the map.
For more on controlling the environment, watch TrueVanguard who is also a master of vertical movement.
Tl;dr:
I want to talk about something I've been really working on and that's first shot. Getting the first shot is a tremendous advantage, and staying in a fight if you don't get the first shot is usually stupid because there are only a few ways to win that fight:
- Out-shoot your enemy: hit all your crits and make the enemy miss all of theirs. Not gonna happen for me consistently.
- Have a better gun/super: maybe you have a shotgun, and they don't. Maybe you have a Smash and they don't. But it's risky.
- Be in a more favorable engagement distance for your weapon vs theirs: I may get tagged by a MIDA getting into Doctrine range, but once I do, I'll melt you.
How do you ensure getting the first shot even if you're up against ELO 2000 enemies? Control your opponent by controlling your environment. Only take fights when and where you want them.
Positional control isn't just a matter of range, either, it's a matter of X-Y positioning as well. And it's not just a matter of the enemy's. It's a matter of yours. Is their start position constrained, and their cover limited? Are you unpredictable in your start location? Do you have accessible cover? (A choke point is cover that limits your positioning rather than providing an escape).
This is TrueVanguard sniping. See how he's positioned both to have a set start point for his enemies, and limited mobility. While at the same time, he has maximum maneuverability and easy to access cover? Finally, see how far away he's positioned. He's sniping, but he's not as far back as possible. He's a at a point that his primary is still viable if he misses his headshot.
I realize that's a lot of factors, but that's what I'm talking about. This technique is true whether you're sniping or not. At this point, he has set himself up for success, and it didn't involve any legendary drag scopes or l33t thumb skill. It's playing smart.
So, knowing all that, there are 3 options once you've found your enemy to ensure that you get first shot and can finish them.
1) Push
Pushing is the most dangerous method since it relies on your own intuition to know where the enemy is and what your cover will be. Pushing is about capitalizing on engagement advantages for your guns (e.g. shotguns vs primaries), using a Super/Heavy and in Trials, controlling orbs. Pushing can also be about providing pressure for a teammate's pinch, or being the pinch yourself. (I can't comment too much on pushing since I'm a sniper, but I'm sure Ape or Nami can provide lots of tips here.)
One tip for pushing, if you're unsure, think: if I die here how difficult will my orb be to rez?
One important thing to note with pushing: DO NOT CHASE. It is very tempting to chase an enemy that is one shot. You may not have killed them, but you have gained the advantage. You know the enemy's position, you've more of the map under control and since they're weak, they're out of the fight for 3-10 seconds. All of these are valuable.
2) Run/Stall
So what do you do if you're being pushed? You have 3 options:
- Run, nothing to be ashamed of, especially if you get tagged when you're not ready. This is a very smart play if you're getting rushed by 2 players.
- Framing is about using cover to block enemies. This can be used while running, think running through doors or jumping down out of your enemy's sight lines. But it can also be used to turn a 2v1 into two separate 1v1s. If you're being pushed by two enemies, you can move into cover to prevent enemy #2 from team-shotting you. Framing is also an important part of pushing, but it's an elite skill to be sure if you used on a push.
- The last option is to prevent the push by blocking the pusher. Grenades are very effective here to give you a few seconds for recovery to kick-in, or not having a grenade to spare, you can pre-fire and attempt to give them pause.
3) Pull
Pulling offers the most control of any engagement. You're controlling the location and the timing. (Making sure you're not being actually pulled is why pushing is so dangerous.) Effective pulling puts the enemy's start position in an easy to locate position and limits their movements afterward.
How to capitalize on this advantage:
Sighting in. When you push through to a new area, you waste valuable time visually locating the enemy and then aiming at them. When you pull, you can sight in and begin firing the instant you see your enemy.
Pulling is also about getting to an optimal distance away from your target, so if you're not sniping, you can throw a grenade as they enter a choke point to instantly render them one shot. Or if you can sense when you're turning the corner, you can pre-fire your Persistence auto rifle to get to the super-strong part of the clip.
And while effective pulling is about minimizing your enemy's start position and maneuvering options, it cannot be understated about how important it is for you to maintain your own options for unpredictable starts and cover. Running & jumping through the open field of Rusted Lands may give you total range of movement, but it gives you no cover should an engagement go badly. Likewise, shooting from a doorway may seem like it gives you tons of cover, but it actually means that the enemy only has to shoot one place. So for any engagement, move between cover and pick cover that still provides movement options.
Finally, you can use pulling to bring the party to your teammates. You've scouted the enemy and you can give your teammates perfect intel. I want to distinguish deliberate pulling of enemies vs running. Running is what happens when you're being pressured and is without team coordination. Pulling is about exerting negative pressure on the enemy and having teammates ready to take advantage. To minimize the disparity between those, try not to position yourself more than 1-2 seconds away from a teammate when moving around the map.
For more on controlling the environment, watch TrueVanguard who is also a master of vertical movement.
Tl;dr:
- Get the first shot, run if you don't have a power weapon or super, maybe even if you do
- To get first shot, control cover and choke points for yourself and your enemy
- Only take 1v1 engagements
- To begin each engagement, consider what gives you the advantage: push, run/stall, pull
Stormcaller... huddle together for the first round and profit!
milkham
Member
Rollo Tomasi
Member
Or he's banging out another essay
JohnOfMars
Banned
No baby today. Just spent morning hard at work and lunch break hard at work on that post.
Also, Burning Shrine. Ape, when I said I wanted to go to Mercury this is not what I meant.
ಠ_ಠ
That's right. Hey essay, yeah you:
Also, Burning Shrine. Ape, when I said I wanted to go to Mercury this is not what I meant.
ಠ_ಠ
That's right. Hey essay, yeah you:
Let me know if you need a third
TheAquaticApe
Member
Yup yup. I should be on around the usual time!
No baby today. Just spent morning hard at work and lunch break hard at work on that post.
Also, Burning Shrine. Ape, when I said I wanted to go to Mercury this is not what I meant.
ಠ_ಠ
RUSH DOWN!
El_Fenomeno
Member
This is glorious lol
Rollo Tomasi
Member
That's right. Hey essay, yeah you:
I forgot to add the word "informative" to that post. I do appreciate your insight and hope I can learn some things to make me a better PvP player.
ToyMachine228
Member
Any Trials pros on Xbone willing to carry me to the Lighthouse in an hour or so?
I definitely will try and make use of this stuff. I've picked up on some of this of late, but it's good to see it put into words. I'd really like to improve to a point beyond 'mildly competent.'
<3 you guys
lol you know me so well. But nah, I meant with a genuine dualshock 4.
called it.
Let's do it. Not sure when I'll be on. Could be late. Just depends on what the wife wants to do. She has an online photography class going right now though, so I'm expecting to have the TV to myself.
DrDrizzay101
Member
BShrine is still my most played PvP map by far thanks to Y1 Trials. It's at 634 matches, second place is Rusted Lands at 465 thanks to Iron Banner.
I'd love to see another rotation week although they apparently don't want to do that again since it's been so long. Bottom line is variety is the spice of life. I'd rather see a new map even if it's bad. BShrine is cool for people who have played less Trials though, it's still a good map.
I'd love to see another rotation week although they apparently don't want to do that again since it's been so long. Bottom line is variety is the spice of life. I'd rather see a new map even if it's bad. BShrine is cool for people who have played less Trials though, it's still a good map.
Misterthirsty
Member
Haha, I'd be up for giving that a go. Then we can all snipe with our melee.
Just shoot me a message
Kor of Memory
Member
Except they did actually say that, it's just taken widely out of context, just like his own article is doing there.
How are you going to take a line out of context, and point out how dumb it is by using your own line out of context?
That seems in very poor taste.
xplicitone
Member
hahahaha NO!!
JohnOfMars
Banned
Thanks. I'm no expert, but I've been working on improving. My writing is mostly for myself and helps me organize my thoughts. I'm glad others get benefit out of it.
What I really need to learn, and what I'm helpless with now is "Calling the play". I'm spoiled playing with better players who are masters of it.
One other thing I wanted to post today, the first day of Trials weekend:
At your final boss and getting nervous? Well, here's something to try if calming down doesn’t work.
Implications: This study challenges the conventional wisdom that you should try to calm down if you’re feeling anxious before a performance. Brooks posits that this is because anxiety and calm are radically different emotions—one is high arousal, one is low. In contrast, “anxiety and excitement have divergent effects on performance, but the experience of these two emotions is quite similar,” the study reads. So it might be easier to switch to excitement from anxiety than to calm down, a change which could dramatically improve your performance.
http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/01/study-fight-performance-anxiety-by-getting-excited/282886/
TheAquaticApe
Member
Still waiting on that PvP blog like Nami is waiting on that Thunderlord post.
Kappa.
When we play this weekend I'm going to be quiet and listen for you calling the play John! Should be fun!
Edit: One thing you're way better at John is centering yourself. I tend to wear my heart on my sleeve.
mehrmantrout
Member
It's stupid just had a match against 3 from I'm guessing the Middle East and we were dead before we knew it
WheelHoss1
Member
Sons of Mithras streaming Trials: http://www.twitch.tv/shijierui
igordennis
Member
Burning Shrine was my first experience with Trials so there's nostalgia. Back in year 1, stabie and drizz offered to carry me to Mercury...and surprisingly failed haha. It was great though, i miss stabie and year 1 ;_;
Later that weekend i got to mercury with math and todd. Math ;_;
The feels
Later that weekend i got to mercury with math and todd. Math ;_;
The feels
Kor of Memory
Member
I put this up on Reddit:
https://www.reddit.com/r/DestinyThe...w_about_we_all_work_together_in_an_effort_to/
Would appreciate any attention you could throw at it.
ChubbleDucks
Member
4 legacy engrams:
TLW
Red Death
Hawkmoon
Hard Light
I already own all them in yr2. So still no Thorn/Bad Juju or Vex.
Not happy
TLW
Red Death
Hawkmoon
Hard Light
I already own all them in yr2. So still no Thorn/Bad Juju or Vex.
Not happy
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Damn I'm gonna mistrials =[
I should be home on reset day on Tuesday afternoon
There better be a KFHM going when I'm back
I should be home on reset day on Tuesday afternoon
There better be a KFHM going when I'm back
To be fair you can't get Vex or the Necrochasm from the legacy engrams. Still that sucks
I wish we could trade shit in this game. I wanted Red Death, didn't get one. I have Bad Juju and Thorn, don't need more of them. Always annoying to see others get what you want, and vice versa.