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[TommyT]

Anyone else finding that "hidden" damage enhancers have some items severely undervalued?

For example, I found these two items on the AH.

- The quiver on the RMAH about a week ago for $5. That was roughly $2m gold at the time.
- The bow for 10m gold.

65 dexterity so the quiver gets auto-ignored. But it has a whopping 6% bonus damage to elites on top of the 8% crit chance. With my DPS, this 6% bonus is equivalent to an additional 4.5k DPS dealt to elite packs. Using the spreadsheets, it would take an equivalent of roughly 125-135 dexterity to get that bonus. Yes, that would apply to all creatures, but 1) then we're talking a quiver with 200 dexterity + all those mods, and those don't exist outside of magical christmasland, and 2) you shouldn't need damage against white mobs anyway.

Likewise, with the bow, the 1004 DPS number turns people off. But the bow has 282 dex, using the spreadsheet again, as the equivalent of a 1180-1190 DPS bow.

Of course, maybe my numbers are all messed up, but then I blame that on the DH DPS Calculator spreadsheet.

EDIT: I left off the "increases damage" on jewelry because, while hidden, they're not easily searched. But they sure are hidden and discounted for in pricing items from people, compared to the raw dex/int/str stat.

Huh? 10m seems like it would be a solid price for that bow given the dex and socket. I would have said it's actually a bit much, but it's hard to judge what people are paying for weapons given the increase in gold on just about everything. That, and I haven't looked at a new weapon in a long time .

 

[Cagey]

Huh? 10m seems like it would be a solid price for that bow given the dex and socket. I would have said it's actually a bit much, but it's hard to judge what people are paying for weapons given the increase in gold on just about everything. That, and I haven't looked at a new weapon in a long time .

When I looked and found this last night, eliminating the monsters (1000 DPS + 80% inherent crit + socket + 320 dex), the closest was an 1180 DPS bow w/ socket (w/o dex) for roughly 18-20m. Could be basic market fluctuation, but it was something that I noticed, bought, then spent time afterward monitoring and found to be really interesting.

 

[Fenderputty]

So what does his 2.21 APS mean to you? It doesn't really mean anything without proper context and even if he tells you all his skills and other gear, are you going to calculate if he has enough APS given all the possible variables?

Since he's staying alive it means that his defence is good enough.

I'm giving some context. My build is a cheaper IAS / dodge / dual wield build. With the nerf, IAS gear has stayed down in price. 2.2 APS with those 850 resists and 1100 LOH is the context for what's keeping me alive. My armor isn't great.

I know people posting their experiences on here has helped me. I'm not sure what the issue is. If there's another IAS monk out there reading this, it does provide some context.

I'm not asking anyone to calculate anything for me.

 

[zulux21]

Here's one that Google JUST turned up... it's prettier.
http://labs.jscampos.com/D3-Demon-Hunter-DPS-Calculator/

Here's the one I use, where it's just an Excel spreadsheet
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5910721799?page=1

thanks... also I don't feel bad for not being able to tell which one is better. After putting in my gear the one with the 1026.9 damage ended up giving me 46920.36 the one with 1217.7 damage ended up giving me 47165.31 which is less than a 250 difference lol

edit: oops I forgot my skills lol
1026.9 =111832.88 and 1217.7 = 112416.7 aka still really close lol

 

[Ploid 3.0]

It helps, certainly, that they can get double the amount but Wizards can get +1.5% with a rune and DHs have it via skills as well. Both those classes scale tremendously well with Life Steal% instead of Life on Hit. Monks and WDs generally scale better with LS% as well but Monk primary spam being so good with Life on Hit outweighs their actual spirit spenders and WDs stacking DoTs are just really good LoH returns due to the Life on Hit stacking.

Are you talking about blood magic? It's near useless by the time they can use it, but if you go to normal mode it'll get the 1.5%. http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6019513218

In inferno it's wasted, maybe if you need a very small drop of life steal to go with the rest of your stacks, but it's probably best to pick something else that will add to your damage?

 

[theta11]

Not sure if this was posted yet but it made laugh pretty hard. Athene is a pretty good troll lol
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZkZ-bUj0rk&feature=relmfu

 

[GJS]

Are you talking about blood magic? It's near useless by the time they can use it, but if you go to normal mode it'll get the 1.5%. http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6019513218

In inferno it's wasted, maybe if you need a very small drop of life steal to go with the rest of your stacks, but it's probably best to pick something else that will add to your damage?

It is reduced by the same modifier as the rest of Life Steal % in inferno, which is already taken into account when looking at how well inferno builds can use life steal.

 

[scy]

Are you talking about blood magic? It's near useless by the time they can use it, but if you go to normal mode it'll get the 1.5%. http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/6019513218

In inferno it's wasted, maybe if you need a very small drop of life steal to go with the rest of your stacks, but it's probably best to pick something else that will add to your damage?

I'm well aware how it works. It's still +1.5% Life Steal (+0.3% Inferno effective) which is still +50% what a Wizard can normally get. It's a small amount of Life Steal but it's relatively big all things considered. Though, yes, it really should be slightly higher or the penalty should be reduced so it's 33% effective to go with the numbers they allow (e.g., 3% max per slot means 1% effective).

I suppose that's basically part of the problem. They see "20% effectiveness" and immediately write the stat off despite the fact it's better for the majority of builds people actually run. For instance, every Wizard build that relied on Blizzard and Hydra saw practically nothing from Life on Hit (2% from Blizzard, 0% from Hydra).

Edit: As for it versus Force Weapon, that's debatable I suppose. If you need help keeping your health up, Blood Magic is better as Force Weapon doesn't add enough damage to make a difference for Life Steal% and it shouldn't be enough damage to speed up killing enough to not need the extra health.

 

[winnarps]

desecrator shouldn't scare you that bad, overpower/crushing advance is so good against it and plague.

and yes you should probably be able to complete inferno just fine.

If you are having trouble with desecration pick superstition instead. I think it counts as non-physical damage. (Or just don't stand on it )

I finished the game with 20k less HP, 4k less DPS (a bit more resists and more LoH) but it wasn't that hard really. I only skipped one invul minions pack, because fuck that.

I have about 2x the LOH you have, 5k more dps, the same armor, about 100 more Resist All, but 16k less HP (dude thats an amazing HP pool, the Revenge heals must be out of this world at 8% per person hit, wow) and I cleared Act 3 and Act 4 without much trouble. You can definitely go take an hour or two and carve through Act 3 and 4 real quick. A4 felt surprisingly less difficult in terms of the champ packs to Act 3. Its a shame A4 doesnt have more champs.

Thanks for the feedback guys, much appreciated. I'll bash my head against it tonight and see how far I get.

 

[theta11]

I'm well aware how it works. It's still +1.5% Life Steal (+0.3% Inferno effective) which is still +50% what a Wizard can normally get. It's a small amount of Life Steal but it's relatively big all things considered. Though, yes, it really should be slightly higher or the penalty should be reduced so it's 33% effective to go with the numbers they allow (e.g., 3% max per slot means 1% effective).

I suppose that's basically part of the problem. They see "20% effectiveness" and immediately write the stat off despite the fact it's better for the majority of builds people actually run. For instance, every Wizard build that relied on Blizzard and Hydra saw practically nothing from Life on Hit (2% from Blizzard, 0% from Hydra).

Lifesteal is only bad on tank char builds and got a bad reputation from before 1.0.3 when people had to spec more defensively and overall level of gear was lower. If you watch the video with Athene I just posted you can see he's got life steal ticks going for over 20k. This is an extreme example because he has crazy gear but it shows it's not a bad stat. =/

 

[scy]

Lifesteal is only bad on tank char builds and got a bad reputation from before 1.0.3 when people had to spec more defensively and overall level of gear was lower. If you watch the video with Athene I just posted you can see he's got life steal ticks going for over 20k. This is an extreme example because he has crazy gear but it shows it's not a bad stat. =/

Pretty much. It's a great stat that needs far less damage than people seem to think to actually be relevant but that whole "20% effective" skews things. Plus, a lot of people did gear to the point that they destroyed their DPS (e.g., sub-10k) which made them need more mitigation and more sustain due to how slowly they killed things.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

If I ever go back to hyrda blizzard wiz I'd give life steal a shot. Currently I'm doing the tornado and chain reaction thing before it's nerfed. Cold Blooded passive with frost nova/bone chill for extra damage since it's used constantly.

 

[Krauser Kat]

Should i pay 2mill for 860dps 99%crit damage pluss dex and vit?

 

[theta11]

Should i pay 2mill for 860dps 99%crit damage pluss dex and vit?

How much Dex and Vit and whats the weapon type?

 

[Trickster]

Should i pay 2mill for 860dps 99%crit damage pluss dex and vit?

What kinda weapon is it ?

 

[Ramirez]

Any DH's on here farming A3/4? What build are you using?

 

[scy]

If I ever go back to hyrda blizzard wiz I'd give life steal a shot. Currently I'm doing the tornado and chain reaction thing before it's nerfed. Cold Blooded passive with frost nova/bone chill for extra damage since it's used constantly.

I assume also using Blades? That has a nice return for Life on Hit, though Energy Twister > Wicked Wind isn't that great (then again, it's also returning far better on Critical Mass than it should so I may need to recheck that when I get the chance).

I'd still think you're doing enough damage to make Life Steal% more relevant than Life on Hit though :x Though you do basically need a 3% Life Steal weapon as just Magic Weapon > Blood Magic won't be close to enough.

 

[scosher]

Should i pay 2mill for 860dps 99%crit damage pluss dex and vit?

Not sure on current prices lately, but I bought a similar weapon for my Wiz, but with Int and Vit (and even less crit damage) for 3.3M about two weeks ago. Not sure if prices have crashed that much, but seems like a good deal.

 

[Iadien]

Well, I was hoping it would go for 5 million... it's at 26 million with 20+ hours remaining.

I obviously don't know the value of items.

Edit: I was hoping for 5 million before searching the AH.

 

[Trickster]

Well, I was hoping it would go for 5 million... it's at 26 million with 20+ hours remaining.

I obviously don't know the value of items.

What did you search for when trying to determine price? Because when I search for 70 str, 800 loh and 45 crit dmg. The weapons that pop up in your dmg range are over 30 mil

 

[Krauser Kat]

Not sure on current prices lately, but I bought a similar weapon for my Wiz, but with Int and Vit (and even less crit damage) for 3.3M about two weeks ago. Not sure if prices have crashed that much, but seems like a good deal.

lets hope it doesnt go above that. Shitting thing is a have another million in a weapon that is not as good. i dont know if i will be able to turn that one around for a profit either.

 

[Bradach]

Are elites the yellow individuals or the blue teams?

 

[rCIZZLE]

Do people search for stats on weps in the AH? I'm trying to determine whether or not this would do better on the forums or in game. :\

 

[Number45]

Are elites the yellow individuals or the blue teams?

Blue are champions, yellow are elites (I think).

EDIT: But I'm sure for the purpose of stats (i.e. increased damage to elites) both kinds count.

 

[Bradach]

Blue are champions, yellow are elites (I think).

So am i correct in saying the weapons that have +5% DMG against elites have no benefit against the blues?

 

[Trickster]

Do people search for stats on weps in the AH? I'm trying to determine whether or not this would do better on the forums or in game. :\

why wouldn't they?

So am i correct in saying the weapons that have +5% DMG against elites have no benefit against the blues?

Yellow mobs arent elites, they're rares. I'd imagine dmg agains't elites works for both blue and yellow mobs.

 

[Number45]

So am i correct in saying the weapons that have +5% DMG against elites have no benefit against the blues?

Yellow mobs arent elites, they're rares. I'd imagine dmg agains't elites works for both blue and yellow mobs.

Thanks for the correction, and yeah I'm pretty sure both types will count for the modifiers.

 

[scy]

So am i correct in saying the weapons that have +5% DMG against elites have no benefit against the blues?

Elites is the catch all term for both blues (Champions) and yellows (Rares). If it gives you NV, it's an Elite. I imagine the bonus works on Uniques and boss caliber enemies as well (Purple) but ... hey, who knows.

 

[Bradach]

Yellow mobs arent elites, they're rares. I'd imagine dmg agains't elites works for both blue and yellow mobs.

Thanks for the correction, and yeah I'm pretty sure both types will count for the modifiers.

Thanks for that. To the AH!

 

[Fenderputty]

Elites is the catch all term for both blues (Champions) and yellows (Rares). If it gives you NV, it's an Elite. I imagine the bonus works on Uniques and boss caliber enemies as well (Purple) but ... hey, who knows.

HA, Their life already melts away.

I always wonder what the decision was to make the Uniques so weak in comparison to the Elite packs in inferno. They all drop crap too.

The Warden isn't considered a Unique is he?

 

[BigBlue1974]

HA, Their life already melts away.

I always wonder what the decision was to make the Uniques so weak in comparison to the Elite packs in inferno. They all drop crap too.

The Warden isn't considered a Unique is he?

I'm trying to recall but one of the more recent patches made it so the Uniques drop crap. Warden isn't considered a Unique I'd say because he drops rares.

 

[DSmalls84]

So i'm level 29 about to roll into nightmare with my Wizard.

Currently using:
Magic Missle
Blizzard
Hydra
Teleport
Energy Armor
Magic weapon.

Using Glass Cannon and Blur for passives.

Should I drop one of those skills for Diamond Skin as I go into Nightmare through Inferno? Seems like I will probably need it at the latest in Inferno. Also what passives do you guys think would work the best?

 

[rCIZZLE]

why wouldn't they?

Figured it wasn't as important as just searching for crit dmg with the highest dps for the budget of most searchers.

 

[Woo-Fu]

Figured it wasn't as important as just searching for crit dmg with the highest dps for the budget of most searchers.

While they might not search for those particular stats it doesn't mean they'll ignore them when deciding what to purchase/bid upon.

If I have a target DPS in mind I'll look at that range and then I'll look for a bargain at a lower listed DPS that will make up the difference in stats.

 

[Fenderputty]

I'm trying to recall but one of the more recent patches made it so the Uniques drop crap. Warden isn't considered a Unique I'd say because he drops rares.

The patch before that made them drop just gold. People complained and the recent patch made them drop crap and gold again.

I don't see why they just don't buff their damage and difficulty and give us NV and rares from them. As of now, there's hardly a reason to fight a Unique above a standard gray. They're just in the way of my next Elite pack.

 

[TommyT]

Any DH's on here farming A3/4? What build are you using?

Skill wise?

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/demon-hunter#aRYXlV!aYe!baZZbc

 

[Krauser Kat]

some one on the offical forums posted an asian player with 100k unbuffed monk dmg. he was dual wield two 200% crit damage spears with crazy deepz (i feel like douche for saying that) on each

add on breath of heaven sweeping wind cyclone and MoC he was strolling through act III.

 

[inky]

The Warden isn't considered a Unique is he?

I think he is considered a boss. He drops more rares than any other Act I boss for me anyway. Anything from 3-6 rares.

 

[michaelius]

So i'm level 29 about to roll into nightmare with my Wizard.

Currently using:
Magic Missle
Blizzard
Hydra
Teleport
Energy Armor
Magic weapon.

Using Glass Cannon and Blur for passives.

Should I drop one of those skills for Diamond Skin as I go into Nightmare through Inferno? Seems like I will probably need it at the latest in Inferno. Also what passives do you guys think would work the best?

You won't need diamond skin before inferno or worst case late hell.

As for passive glass cannon , 2x time of Energy Armor (gives life regen), faster mana regeneration.

 

[RDreamer]

I was testing out some builds while farming today, and I'm really kind of liking Earth ally. I've never used the allies before, but he seems to be doing pretty well. He's distracting things well enough, doing some damage, and lasting way long enough to justify his spirit cost. Probably not as good in group play, but he seems to be pretty awesome for solo.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

I assume also using Blades? That has a nice return for Life on Hit, though Energy Twister > Wicked Wind isn't that great (then again, it's also returning far better on Critical Mass than it should so I may need to recheck that when I get the chance).

I'd still think you're doing enough damage to make Life Steal% more relevant than Life on Hit though :x Though you do basically need a 3% Life Steal weapon as just Magic Weapon > Blood Magic won't be close to enough.

No blades, just wicked wind, and chain reaction rune on explosion. Using diamond skin and freeze stunning things help keep my health up to where I don't need blades. I like nova blast to keep things in one package to continue the life on hit and to prevent things from running in multiple directions. I have a lot of resists, armor and health as well, usinc shield if I need it (Ghom), and teleport/fracture (two decoys take my place) when I need space or something else to take hits for me (bombers in act 3, or heavy hitting elites when diamond skin isn't up).

 

[Cipherr]

some one on the offical forums posted an asian player with 100k unbuffed monk dmg. he was dual wield two 200% crit damage spears with crazy deepz (i feel like douche for saying that) on each

add on breath of heaven sweeping wind cyclone and MoC he was strolling through act III.

Was he streaming? Is there a link?

Stuff about Earth Ally

One if the best tanking pets in the game. For a while there was a bug where he wouldnt spawn with full HP, is that still around?

 

[Fenderputty]

I think he is considered a boss. He drops more rares than any other Act I boss for me anyway. Anything from 3-6 rares.

I mean he HAS to be a boss. Though he's almost as week as the Uniques. They kind of buffed him with desecerator and jailor, but he's still a joke.

I think the way they have the "boss character" difficulty levels balanced is kind of strange. Elites can be and often are more difficult than ending act bosses. Uniques are only slightly more difficult than grays. Some special events don't trigger Uniques, they trigger Elites. Most trigger ueless Uniques though. Some rare Uniques are tough (those large things in Act IV), and they still drop garbage.

I wonder if the decision to make Uniques weak and usless was so that players couldn't build NV stacks quicker.

 

[Ploid 3.0]

Do people search for stats on weps in the AH? I'm trying to determine whether or not this would do better on the forums or in game. :\

Might want to take that gem out, people searching for slot and crit dmg might skip over it thinking it showed up because you had that gem in it. Maybe put any other gem in instead.

 

[DSmalls84]

You won't need diamond skin before inferno or worst case late hell.

As for passive glass cannon , 2x time of Energy Armor (gives life regen), faster mana regeneration.

Is it necessary to use Diamond Skin in Inferno or is Energy Armor enough? I don't really want to give up Teleport or Magic Weapon, but I guess I would drop Magic Weapon if it came to that.

 

[Neki]

I mean he HAS to be a boss. Though he's almost as week as the Uniques. They kind of buffed him with desecerator and jailor, but he's still a joke.

I think the way they have the "boss character" difficulty levels balanced is kind of strange. Elites can be and often are more difficult than ending act bosses. Uniques are only slightly more difficult than grays. Some special events don't trigger Uniques, they trigger Elites. Most trigger ueless Uniques though. Some rare Uniques are tough (those large things in Act IV), and they still drop garbage.

I wonder if the decision to make Uniques weak and usless was so that players couldn't build NV stacks quicker.

He is a boss, just like Siegebreaker and Cydea.

 

[Artanisix]

Might want to take that gem out, people searching for slot and crit dmg might skip over it thinking it showed up because you had that gem in it. Maybe put any other gem in instead.

No dont do that. whenever i search for crit damage i put in a value of 101 to look for crit damage + socket weapons since the stupid AH doesn't differentiate between the two.

 

[RDreamer]

wtf decides where you revive at? You really should be able to choose from two options when you die and the revive timer is done, "checkpoint at the level you're in" or "in town." In group play you pretty well always want to revive in town so you can hit a banner. In solo play you definitely don't. I just died and went to town while fighting some elites... yay that means they'll be completely full health because I have to run all the way back where I was from town, because I have no way of getting there quicker...

Also, them healing to full after about 10 seconds of running back from the checkpoint is goddamned annoying. How do you guys solo this stuff sometimes? This is why I had solo farming...

 

[scy]

Also, them healing to full after about 10 seconds of running back from the checkpoint is goddamned annoying. How do you guys solo this stuff sometimes? This is why I had solo farming...

Don't die? :x

 

[RDreamer]

Don't die? :x

I guess that's the takeaway... But I mean sometimes you screw up a little and die. It just sucks when you've got them down to 20% health, get frozen in a desecrator spot and then you have to redo the entire thing.