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[Celegus]

Text

None of this is intended to suggest you can't enjoy the game as is, of course. I'm only expressing and explaining my personal preferences. By all means, enjoy.

Hm, that was rather interesting. Must just be how your brain is wired, kind of similar to how I think 99.99% of American music is garbage. Not a popular opinion, but it's not like you can always choose what you like or don't (especially with something like music), and sometimes you can end up liking something for the very reason everyone else hates it. It would certainly sometimes be easier to be "just like everyone else" instead of the odd one out, and see what everyone else does.

I've never really seen someone be like that with games though... obviously everyone has certain genres they just don't care for, but it's more interesting to see someone defend a specific element of a game that almost everyone else agrees is bad.

 

[Boombloxer]

Manipulation and comprehensive knowledge of the market. The real stock market is so efficient that manipulation of it is essentially impossible; you would have to be an inside trader to have any real hope of "gaming" the system.

The Diablo 3 AH was imperfect, however. Not surprising, of course, given that it's much smaller and the stakes were much lower. I enjoyed learning the market value not just of items but of specific stats and then applying this knowledge to profit from it. I turned 5 million gold (earned leveling up) into billions of gold simply by informed, prudent application of my knowledge of items and their worth to the marketplace at large.

I enjoy social gaming mechanics because they require knowledge both of people (how they work and what they want) and of the other game mechanics (what items are worth what? Why are they worth so much? What stats seem to be popular, and for what reason?)

Honestly, you'd really enjoy Warframe trading.

 

[Opiate]

Just as an example, you could quantify the value of "buy it now" items relative to items without a buy out on the AH.

Because people value convenience, they will frequently pay a notable premium for an item they can just click and send to their inventory. As such, a prudent trader could take items which were not being sold with a buyout and resell them with a buyout at a premium. This effect alone could net a substantial income without worrying about anything else.

There were other considerations: based on upcoming patch changes, what stats did I feel were likely to become more valuable? Invest in those statistics before patch, and reap a profit afterwards. If there were gem changes, would those changes make the gems more valuable? If so, buy a ton of gems pre-patch. All of these are fun, interesting social mechanics that require attention and diligence to effectively execute.

It's fine if you don't personally enjoy this process. I don't think social gaming is very popular on GAF, and even saying the phrase "social gaming" raises some hackles for many users. I enjoy it, however, and I'm personally sad it's gone from Diablo 3. You're absolutely right I have other games to play, I just wish those games had as much popularity on the forum I moderate as Diablo 3 does.

 

[Opiate]

Hm, that was rather interesting. Must just be how your brain is wired, kind of similar to how I think 99.99% of American music is garbage. Not a popular opinion, but it's not like you can always choose what you like or don't (especially with something like music), and sometimes you can end up liking something for the very reason everyone else hates it. It would certainly sometimes be easier to be "just like everyone else" instead of the odd one out, and see what everyone else does.

I've never really seen someone be like that with games though... obviously everyone has certain genres they just don't care for, but it's more interesting to see someone defend a specific element of a game that almost everyone else agrees is bad.

I don't think my opinion is nearly as unpopular as you think it is. Unpopular on GAF, certainly, but the D2JSP forum was absolutely huge back in the Diablo 2 days. It was only slightly smaller in its prime than NeoGAF is today. Obviously a lot of people disagree, too -- and by the looks, a majority do -- but the number of people who like AH, trading, and econometric mechanics is much larger than people tend to realize, at least here on GAF.

Also, I agree, most American music is garbage.

 

[partyphone]

are you involved in TF2 and DotA2 trading? those people are interesting.

 

[Opiate]

are you involved in TF2 and DotA2 trading? those people are interesting.

Look at my TF2 inventory. My Steam username is LittleBallofHate. I get people friending me constantly out of the blue hoping I'm an idiot who doesn't know what my backpack is worth.

 

[Jezbollah]

Yoshi has promoted me to Officer now, if you (or anyone else) wants an invite just send me a PM (Akai#1649).

Are you US or EU Akai?

 

[Shifty76]

Just as an example, you could quantify the value of "buy it now" items relative to items without a buy out on the AH.

Because people value convenience, they will frequently pay a notable premium for an item they can just click and send to their inventory. As such, a prudent trader could take items which were not being sold with a buyout and resell them with a buyout at a premium. This effect alone could net a substantial income without worrying about anything else.

Not singling you out here, but that type of thing really pissed me off. I'd track items for weeks trying to improve my build, and would eventually see one go up for auction with no buyout. I'd bid on it to get it on my watch list, then when it was about to end I'd toss in a sizeable bid, but would often get outbid last second.

I'd then see that very same item relisted for 10 x what it sold for. A price WAY outside my limited means.

Again, don't mean to single you out as I know hundreds, if not thousands of people item flipped. It just sucks for those of us who weren't super rich who were actually trying to buy an item to use to improve our characters who would always lose out to AH tycoons who bought items for no purpose other than flipping.

 

[scy]

To be fair, there's probably some middle ground AH option available but it's fairly unlikely with the negative association to the AH as is.

Maybe it'll be the selling point of the next expansion.

 

[lmpaler]

Well after restarting from the ground up I must say I am please with the changes in this game. The AH did serve a purpose for sure, the real money side notwithstanding, but all in all it seems better than it ever was in Diablo as a whole.

PS. Hardcore mode only is so much better than vanilla. I get scared when I start getting hurt lol

 

[Raticus79]

To be fair, there's probably some middle ground AH option available but it's fairly unlikely with the negative association to the AH as is.

Maybe it'll be the selling point of the next expansion.

I think the best "middle ground" option would have been bind-on-trade, if they were able to keep botting under control by other means. They could have even kept the auction house since people wouldn't be out to flip items any more - it would have just been players buying things they intended to use (so Shifty76 would have been able to actually get the item in the scenario above). The problem is they don't have the resources to keep bots under control with this kind of payment model, so that's why the group-found BoA approach was the better choice.

 

[partyphone]

I just want them to do something about trading legendaries. I understand they want to encourage people to play together but as we get further and further from the release of RoS the less and less that actually happens for me. It would be nice if they would let you trade to people who have been on your friends list for more than a week or something. I found a TMF the other week when a friend was looking for one but obviously couldn't get it to him. We live in different time zones and have different work schedules. It's rare that we actually get to play together.

 

[Celegus]

I don't think my opinion is nearly as unpopular as you think it is. Unpopular on GAF, certainly, but the D2JSP forum was absolutely huge back in the Diablo 2 days. It was only slightly smaller in its prime than NeoGAF is today. Obviously a lot of people disagree, too -- and by the looks, a majority do -- but the number of people who like AH, trading, and econometric mechanics is much larger than people tend to realize, at least here on GAF.

Also, I agree, most American music is garbage.

Wow, that's totally nuts. I always had a personal rule on only using items I found myself, so I never got into trading with D2. I didn't care for it in D3 because it was literally the only way to be able to progress. I'd be okay with a middle ground solution where you'd have more choice to gear up yourself or through trading, but like others have mentioned, botters and cheaters tend to ruin that for everyone. It's pretty much all or nothing. In the groups of people I've played with, I can't recall anyone sad about the AH going away aside from those making tons of money from it.

 

[Akai XIII]

Are you US or EU Akai?

EU.

 

[Opiate]

Wow, that's totally nuts. I always had a personal rule on only using items I found myself, so I never got into trading with D2. I didn't care for it in D3 because it was literally the only way to be able to progress. I'd be okay with a middle ground solution where you'd have more choice to gear up yourself or through trading, but like others have mentioned, botters and cheaters tend to ruin that for everyone. It's pretty much all or nothing. In the groups of people I've played with, I can't recall anyone sad about the AH going away aside from those making tons of money from it.

Yep, it's fine, just not the game I want personally. Enjoy!

 

[Fenderputty]

Not singling you out here, but that type of thing really pissed me off. I'd track items for weeks trying to improve my build, and would eventually see one go up for auction with no buyout. I'd bid on it to get it on my watch list, then when it was about to end I'd toss in a sizeable bid, but would often get outbid last second.

I'd then see that very same item relisted for 10 x what it sold for. A price WAY outside my limited means.

Again, don't mean to single you out as I know hundreds, if not thousands of people item flipped. It just sucks for those of us who weren't super rich who were actually trying to buy an item to use to improve our characters who would always lose out to AH tycoons who bought items for no purpose other than flipping.

This never bothered me. I had my MP10 monk built on self found and sold gear and was happy enough.

Don't get me wrong. I lost out on some bids myself so I understand the frustration. I just gave up on anything that didn't have a buyout on the GAH early and never even looked at the RMAH. I get how people liked to play the economies though.

The AH was just a way to efficiently trade. It was used as a means to a lot of different ends though. For me it was a way to try new builds quickly and sell shit I didn't want for shit I did. So I miss it personally. At least aspects of it.

I think the AH exacerbated the "keeping up with the joneses" effect. In the end the game itself is better overall now than before as well so I don't really complain.

Yep, it's fine, just not the game I want personally. Enjoy!

 

[Jezbollah]

EU.

Great, thanks - will PM you now. Thanks Akai

 

[AlexTrevelyan]

If the loot system was originally like it is now, people wouldn't have hated the AH. The problem was the drops were so awful you had to use the AH to gear up. You were just sitting there waiting for the day when that one legendary would drop with perfect stats that you could sell for millions. It was horrible.

 

[Kilrogg]

There are other games that do random loot drop / loot whoring, too. If the point is "there are other games to play!" you could have that sword swing both ways.

Regardless, my primary frustration is that my personal gaming preferences are always so out of sync with NeoGAF that I rarely find a situation where I seem to "fit in" gaming wise, as it were. I think games are awful at telling stories and think Metal Gear Solid is so horrifically stupid I'm embarrassed to watch the story unfold. I think Forza is derivative and fetishistic, I think Mario is boring, I don't enjoy Zelda, and I think Uncharted is an actively bad game. When I play video games, I play Chess and Go the majority of the time, which have absolutely massive communities but which are almost entirely unrepresented here on NeoGAF. My primary modern video game presently is Natural Selection 2, which has a very small community.

As such, when I do find a game I play that a large chunk of NeoGAF is also excited about, I'm happy. It's frustrating to see that the very thing I like about the game is something that everyone else here hates so much. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised at this point, though.

None of this is intended to suggest you can't enjoy the game as is, of course. I'm only expressing and explaining my personal preferences. By all means, enjoy.

I always mean to jump into go but can never find the time or energy too, sadly. I have a go board (albeit a crappy one) at home.

 

[cwmartin]

So I had a Skycutter drop for me the other day. Not great rolls but I'm honestly not even sure how I would spec (monk) for it with the %holy damage, or if it would provide any benefit over my Fulminator now.

You guy's have any tips? I can run T1 with my current setup.

 

[krameriffic]

I don't think my opinion is nearly as unpopular as you think it is. Unpopular on GAF, certainly, but the D2JSP forum was absolutely huge back in the Diablo 2 days. It was only slightly smaller in its prime than NeoGAF is today. Obviously a lot of people disagree, too -- and by the looks, a majority do -- but the number of people who like AH, trading, and econometric mechanics is much larger than people tend to realize, at least here on GAF.

Also, I agree, most American music is garbage.

Fundamentally I don't have a problem with a market playing an important aspect of a game. I just didn't like that it came down to staring at tabular data all day. That really is the kind of "gameplay" that you're better off just substituting a real job for and making infinitely more money for it.

 

[Pickman]

So I had a Skycutter drop for me the other day. Not great rolls but I'm honestly not even sure how I would spec (monk) for it with the %holy damage, or if it would provide any benefit over my Fulminator now.

You guy's have any tips? I can run T1 with my current setup.

I ran this on my holy monk before I completely FUBAR'd him:

http://eu.battle.net/d3/en/calculator/monk#UTdfRi!fXUS!bcbccc

Worked pretty well for a balance of survivability and aoe burst.


On a separate note and just to share my lamentation, I'm now 6k into Kadala trying to get a FotF as the last piece of my Sader's shotgun build. There is no end in sight...

 

[cdyhybrid]

So I had a Skycutter drop for me the other day. Not great rolls but I'm honestly not even sure how I would spec (monk) for it with the %holy damage, or if it would provide any benefit over my Fulminator now.

You guy's have any tips? I can run T1 with my current setup.

Really depends on the rest of your gear. If you can put together the Sunwuko set then you can stack Holy damage and go WotHF:FoF, Dashing Strike, Cyclone Strike (Holy rune), Exploding Palm, Sweeping Wind (Holy Rune), Mantra (or sub in Epiphany somewhere, perhaps for the Mantra if you can put together Inna's too).

 

[Akai XIII]

I'm piecing together my Eye of Peshkov/Suwuko build. I want to PP everything in for CC and heal/do damage at the same time. I've got my CDR over 50% and with the EoP legendary affix it should go nicely.

 

[Dahbomb]

So apparently one of the Monk's Daibo was changed. the one that reduced WoL's resource cost per enemy killed is now changed to a flat percentage reduction just like the SSS Daibo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qsGMFboa61k&feature=youtu.be

Allows Monks to use a no Spirit Generator Holy Bell build with the Sunwoko set.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Oh shit, looking at the 2.1 PTR notes

Skill Rune - Duty to the Clan
Has been redesigned
Enemies hit are now chilled reducing Movement Speed by 30% for 2 seconds
Chilled enemies have a 10% increased chance to be critically hit
Damage type changed from Physical to Cold

Yessssssssssssssssssssssssss

 

[Celegus]

Oh shit, looking at the 2.1 PTR notes



Yessssssssssssssssssssssssss

Yeah I'm super psyched for my cold barb once it hits. Cold will finally be a viable option instead of all fire!

 

[Barack Lesnar]

So I got back into RoS about a week ago and am loving it again. I guess I just needed a break. Perfect timing too with 2.1 coming up. The patch notes are just glorious.

 

[Pickman]

I like how in the 2.1 Patch Notes they have these long, glorious lists of tweaks for every class, and then you have Crusaders kind of just doggeared in there. "Oh, uhm.. you guys are working damn near on point... shit, people even figured out a thorns build for you. Why..don't...we...just...... there. Phalanx is quicker. One of you guys is using Phalanx, right? Okay. There you go, Phalanx fast, as you were."

 

[cdyhybrid]

I like how in the 2.1 Patch Notes they have these long, glorious lists of tweaks for every class, and then you have Crusaders kind of just doggeared in there. "Oh, uhm.. you guys are working damn near on point... shit, people even figured out a thorns build for you. Why..don't...we...just...... there. Phalanx is quicker. One of you guys is using Phalanx, right? Okay. There you go, Phalanx fast, as you were."

That's because Crusaders were already in a pretty good spot.

 

[Jackben]

I was about to say...c'mon. That'd be like complaining about Death Knights right after wotlk came out.

 

[Pickman]

That's totally what I was saying. They looked at Crusaders like proud parents, gave a satisfied nod, and did a tweak so they could include the word "crusader" in the patch notes.

 

[Fenderputty]

That's totally what I was saying. They looked at Crusaders like proud parents, gave a satisfied nod, and did a tweak so they could include the word "crusader" in the patch notes.

In the previous patches I believe crusader has had the most balance tinkering. It's about time the other classes got some tinkering IMO.

 

[CRA5H]

Finally got my last piece for the jade set. I played it for a bit and it took some getting used to but I think I'm getting the hang of it. Anyone have tips on how to CC and be efficient with a jade build?

 

[Shifty76]

Treasure realm is fun. Went from zero to 200m gold over two of them.

Also, new madstone plus rimeheart is insane.

 

[RDreamer]

Manipulation and comprehensive knowledge of the market. The real stock market is so efficient that manipulation of it is essentially impossible; you would have to be an inside trader to have any real hope of "gaming" the system.

The Diablo 3 AH was imperfect, however. Not surprising, of course, given that it's much smaller and the stakes were much lower. I enjoyed learning the market value not just of items but of specific stats and then applying this knowledge to profit from it. I turned 5 million gold (earned leveling up) into billions of gold simply by informed, prudent application of my knowledge of items and their worth to the marketplace at large.

I enjoy social gaming mechanics because they require knowledge both of people (how they work and what they want) and of the other game mechanics (what items are worth what? Why are they worth so much? What stats seem to be popular, and for what reason?)

Popping in to say I really liked this part of the AH, too. I personally never went hog wild on it, because I never felt I really really had to. I just used some tricks to get by, and I liked that. I'd be changing a build or something and need a bit more gold and would look up some things and figure out what to try and flip to help myself out. It was pretty cool.

I think one of the things I miss about the AH though was incremental building. I could work toward something and even when I got some item I would never use it would still help me get to that item I would use. I could sell it for some gold and get that much closer. Or I could trade it straight up for an item I will use. With the system the way it is now I just... toss that other item.

Switching up builds was fun, too. If I felt like it I could trade in most of my equipment for another build.

Actually, what the AH did for me most was builds in general. The game with the AH felt like you were building your character. You were searching stats you wanted and upgrading those as you went and building things towards an end goal. Now? You're forced to use whatever skills work best with what you've randomly found. There is no building. None. Characters are pure luck, really.

 

[Pickman]

Almost ended up in tears last night from the emotional roller coaster of rift grinding.

Spent about two hours without a legendary drop, and then had 5 in 10 minutes. The last one was a 2 handed flail, and on first glance I thought it was finally my FotF. I was literally high-fiving the air around me, scaring the hell out of my dog with my cheer of exaltation.

When I identified it, it was a Baleful Remnant.

Many sads were had that day. :-/

 

[EscapingJail]

Still waiting for my fotf drop too buddy.

Steaming some T6 Crusader rifts right now
http://www.twitch.tv/escapingjail

Gonna keep the music low this time and try to do some commentary.

Edit: Done

 

[Sarcasm]

So can I get this for 30 yet? RoS that is.

 

[Krassus]

So is anyone who ladders here looking forward to 2.1? I dont feel the excitement with Rifts just being +hps and +dmg. Hoping they add some really wild legendaries to mix things up and make viable builds more diverse.

 

[Dr_Boris_Goltz]

Having all the classes at 70 is overwhelming. I feel like I never have enough resources to go around.

The DH maurader 6 set is incredibly fun though. It changes the way I play the game and lets me focus more on staying alive.

 

[Pickman]

Having all the classes at 70 is overwhelming. I feel like I never have enough resources to go around.

The DH maurader 6 set is incredibly fun though. It changes the way I play the game and lets me focus more on staying alive.

Thought I had a handy little nestegg set aside for my characters, enough for repairs and forging as needed, maybe a gem or two.

6 Flawless Royal Emeralds later (and 4-5 flawless imperial per toon) and I'm wearing my intellect Spaulders of Zakara on my crusader until I can grind enough gold to repair my toons.

 

[Boogdud]

Actually, what the AH did for me most was builds in general. The game with the AH felt like you were building your character. You were searching stats you wanted and upgrading those as you went and building things towards an end goal. Now? You're forced to use whatever skills work best with what you've randomly found. There is no building. None. Characters are pure luck, really.

I didn't mind the AH, I hated what it did to the game though. The fact that the drop rates were infinitesimal on any decent item solely because you technically could buy any item on the AH pretty much made playing the game to get an item a self-punishment.

You could spend $20 on bliz gold, flip it in the AH for a few weeks and get the best items in the game (that you haven't even played), is just a bit counter-intuitive to me.

 

[Celegus]

Having all the classes at 70 is overwhelming. I feel like I never have enough resources to go around.

The DH maurader 6 set is incredibly fun though. It changes the way I play the game and lets me focus more on staying alive.

I got all mine to 70, but decided I really only like Crusader/Barb/Wizard, so the other classes will mostly just get hand-me-downs, and I'm not really actively trying to gear them up. That's just too much.

 

[Dr_Boris_Goltz]

I got all mine to 70, but decided I really only like Crusader/Barb/Wizard, so the other classes will mostly just get hand-me-downs, and I'm not really actively trying to gear them up. That's just too much.

So far I'm really focusing on the crusader and DH, but you were with me when my friend gave me that tall man's... Now I feel obligated to play the WD haha.

 

[Fatphotog]

Holy shit! The treasure realm in the PTR is the real deal! I just got 122,000,000 gold in one realm!(T6) 25 imperial gems too!

 

[Ricerocket]

Still nothing on PTR updates.

Class progression so far on greater rifts. You can clearly see who is above and beyond (cough EP cough) DH is broken with beckon sail so not worth it looking at their solo boards.

 

[Dahbomb]

Pretty much every thing that is 50 or above is clearly broken and will get nerfed or removed. Anything that is in the 40-50 range will probably get looked at and is really a toss up if it will get changed or not.

I saw that Crusader and read that as Scy... lol

 

[Granadier]

Monk's are going to become broken and OP!!!!

 

[cdyhybrid]

Still nothing on PTR updates.

Class progression so far on greater rifts. You can clearly see who is above and beyond (cough EP cough) DH is broken with beckon sail so not worth it looking at their solo boards

So you're telling me female characters are OP?