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[shamoomoo]

in the end it is what it is, console lacking in bandwidth + pssr is far from dlss

PSSR is hit or miss depending on implementation, obviously Sony's FP should be better than third party,if there are some TP implement PSSR than other TP then the fault rest mostly on third party developers if Sony provides adequate tools.

 

[Kangx]

Like I said. No DRS and a bandwidth hog engine is a recipe for disaster on consoles. Fortunately there are a few games like this on consoles

Not sure why Cerny or Sony engineers think is not worth it to match bandwidth with the percentage of compute units increase.

For keeping the same cpu, i understand but Is it more costly and difficult than replace a new cpu with increase bandwidth? I guess the only way is to put infinity cache in the die but that would cost much more.

 

[Bojji]

Why do these look nothing like the official pictures shared from Remedy themselves prior to Pro release?

Bullshots?

But ray tracing gaiz!! Turn that shit off if it's gonna be noisier and grainier than those porn channels on TV that required a premium subscription, otherwise, you'd only get the sound.

RT needs good denoiser and PC version has a decent one, PS does not.

 

[Pedro Motta]

Bullshots?

For sure, they still haven't broke even with the sales of this game, so they took the chance to do a shitty update and try to bank on the PS5 Pro hype. A shame for Remedy.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

HeisenbergFX4 Are current ps5 pro versions just weak ports or is this really all the ps5 pro can muster...because its underwhelming to say the least. I remember you mentioned devs saying it would perform close to a 4070 in realtime games but so far it isn't close. I mean even in raytracing workloads its just underwhelming.

Personally just think it’s early versions of PSSR birthing pains

 

[Physiognomonics]

This is the worst showcase of PS5 Pro and we already knew this. The game was already a bad technical showcase on PS5 and was already running the worst there. This is game optimized for PC, not Playstation.

People are praising game like Dragon Dogma 2, not this game. I wonder why they don't do any big article on DD2? It was supposed to prove once for all PS5 Pro CPU bottleneck narrative. Did they forget that game? I wonder.

 

[Kangx]

Alan Wake 2 is “one of the most technologically impressive video games” but it’s a whole year old already. Are there technically better games on the Ps5 pro? How are the the Unreal Engine 5 titles performing?

Most unreal engine 5 games performance much better on the ps5 pro. Empire of the ants and Until Dawn remake both look super sharp due to much higher internal res and appears to run well. I am guessing around 1440p here. Also the fist descendant appears to look significant sharper and run much better.

I know is a different game, but I think empire of the ants look much more impressive than this on consoles and it run at 60fps on the pro unlike the base consoles.

 

[bundylove]

Retarded question but what if rt on the pro is lower than lower setting cuz its a new amd rt card that doesnt exist in their current gpu line up therefor noone knows how to use it?

In other words its ps5 pro specific and devs just use it wrong especially someone like remedy

 

[Bojji]

Most unreal engine 5 games performance much better on the ps5. Empire of the ants and Until Dawn remake both look super sharp due to much higher internal res and appears to run well. I am guessing around 1440p here. Also the fist descendant appears to look significant sharper and run much better.

I know is a different game, but I think empire of the ants look much more impressive than this and it run at 60fps on the pro unlike the base consoles.

It could run in 60fps on normal PS5 in 1080p. Devs limited it to 30fps on purpose.

 

[Mister Wolf]

All the flaws of PSSR are laid bare. None of those other games using PSSR come anywhere close to AW2 in regards to lighting and environmental detail.

 

[BigLee74]

So .. ironically enough, the SX is still the best running version. PS5 Pro's performance mode is a few frames slower than OG PS5, which was slower than SX in-turn.

Boom. Back fire. Oh how the turn tables. Etc etc.

To be fair, XOX suffered similarly now and again. Sometimes pushing higher res and effects to the detriment of frame rate. Which annoyed me because all I ever want is that 60fps.

 

[Elios83]

I tried it last week and yeah it was nothing impressive.
The engine is just too heavy for the results it achieves and the limited scope of the game.
They needed to implement far deeper changes under the hood which they don't have the time and resources to do for a game which hasn't even recouped costs.
Using PSSR and turning a RT switch won't fix the other issues.

 

[Bojji]

All the flaws of PSSR are laid bare. None of those other games using PSSR come anywhere close to AW2 in regards to lighting and environmental detail.

They also use higher resolution. PSSR is good with 1440p, ok with 1080p+ but shit at 800p. Dragon age is also 800p.

One issue that appears both in ratchet and this is that the whole image is noisy and unstable for some reason. Even FSR doesn't have this.

 

[Fbh]

I said this in another thread. Fsr ain't that bad, it's the low resolution that some devs use that make it look so bad.

The Sony first party games looked great anyway so the pro updates looked great to.

But once devs start feeding low res into pssr it will just look as shit as fsr

Yeah stuff like this is what has slowly made me go from being super excited about upscaling tech on consoles to becoming more skeptical and weary of it.
On paper it sounded great because I thought it would allow devs to target the same resolution as Ps4 pro (1080p-1800p), while giving us a nicer and sharper image.

But now it's like every other dev just uses it to go back 2 consoles gens in terms of resolution, and the results aren't great

 

[Little Chicken]

@SlimySnake another example of the cost of PSSR, the Performance Mode actually runs a few frames worse on Pro compared to the OG PS5.

Also surprising to see them mention that some effects like SSAO, Volumetric etc are actually a bit more unstable with PSSR than even FSR2.

 

[Mister Wolf]

They also use higher resolution. PSSR is good with 1440p, ok with 1080p+ but shit at 800p. Dragon age is also 800p.

One issue that appears both in ratchet and this is that the whole image is noisy and unstable for some reason. Even FSR doesn't have this.

What is Rebirth's input resolution? Doesn't PSSR display instability on the small detail foliage in that game.

 

[Bojji]

What is Rebirth's input resolution? Doesn't PSSR display instability on the small detail foliage in that game.

1200-1080p dynamic res I believe.

 

[shamoomoo]

RT:

This is vs. low RT setting...

And? The Pro is a different architecture with its strengths and weaknesses. Remedy's short notice support isn't that bad since they have other projects and they are working on an already shipped game they state supporting after the DLC.

 

[rkofan87]

What we've been waiting for.

not me the 60fps mode is trash

 

[Bojji]

And? The Pro is a different architecture with its strengths and weaknesses. Remedy's short notice support isn't that bad since they have other projects and they are working on an already shipped game they state supporting after the DLC.

They cut down features below PC low to optimize it. On console that is supposed to have 3x higher RT performance than base PS5.

 

[Lumpyoatmeal]

Most unreal engine 5 games performance much better on the ps5 pro. Empire of the ants and Until Dawn remake both look super sharp due to much higher internal res and appears to run well. I am guessing around 1440p here. Also the fist descendant appears to look significant sharper and run much better.

I know is a different game, but I think empire of the ants look much more impressive than this on consoles and it run at 60fps on the pro unlike the base consoles.

Kangx, are these games making full use of the Unreal Engine 5 feature set for example the shadow maps and nanite? I’ve never seen these two games.

 

[bundylove]

PSSR has a long way to go, as does RT on Playstation, it appears. Pretty poor case study here. Once you hit the Pro with a rendering challenge like AW2 it just collapses. Even a 3070 wipes it out because it has better RT and RR.

Which cave did you crawl out of ?

 

[Senua]

This is the worst showcase of PS5 Pro and we already knew this. The game was already a bad technical showcase on PS5 and was already running the worst there. This is game optimized for PC, not Playstation.

People are praising game like Dragon Dogma 2, not this game. I wonder why they don't do any big article on DD2? It was supposed to prove once for all PS5 Pro CPU bottleneck narrative. Did they forget that game? I wonder.

They are clearly going to cover all the big Pro updates, patience my little warrior.

 

[omegasc]

Hopefully with more development and further AI training, PSSR can improve dealing with lower resolutions.

 

[Kangx]

Kangx, are these games making full use of the Unreal Engine 5 feature set for example the shadow maps and nanite? I’ve never seen these two games.

Empire of of the ants both use nanite and lumen. All those extreme detail is the result of nanite.

Not sure about until dawn, but it look really impressive on the pro with smooth 60fps. I am sure it uses lumen not sure about nanite.



Here the first descendant. Look surprisingly sharp on performance mode with RT on. This also use both lumen and nanite.

 

[kevboard]

ok,
I always said that the 4070 might be the wrong PC card to compare the Pro to. but I didn't expect to see a game with such an extreme performance deficit compared to it.

so we are talking more 4060ti here I guess.


for the Performance mode I think they should have kept the settings the same and increase the internal resolution, while targeting 1440p for PSSR. that possibly would result in a much more stable image.

 

[RoboFu]

Where are all the RT reflections? no trashcan, no benches, no fence .. not too impressive

 

[Kangx]

ok,
I always said that the 4070 might be the wrong PC card to compare the Pro to. but I didn't expect to see a game with such an extreme performance deficit compared to it.

so we are talking more 4060ti here I guess.


for the Performance mode I think they should have kept the settings the same and increase the internal resolution, while targeting 1440p for PSSR. that possibly would result in a much more stable image.

I think they need DRS to reach 1440p indoor or in the city. In the forest, it can get down to 1080p to get the stable frame rate.

 

[shamoomoo]

They cut down features below PC low to optimize it. On console that is supposed to have 3x higher RT performance than base PS5.

And? This is still a quick port/update vs stuff you get on PC if the developers implement decent enough ray tracing.

PlayStation games that go beyond the PlayStation still have a year+ worth of development time and not a few months, assuming remedy weren't given a Pro dev kit a years out before release.

 

[DanielG165]

I think ultimately, perhaps lackluster port aside, Alan Wake 2 is one of the most demanding games on the market, with some of the most advanced RT in any game, full on path tracing being the peak of its visual capability. I personally never expected the PS5 Pro to work miracles here, as good of a performer as it is for the console space.

 

[SmokSmog]

PISSER

 

[Neo_game]

Remedy has messed up this upgrade. They should just use quality mode but running 40fps instead of 30fps and performance mode with same settings but more smoother experience where it does not drop into 40's.

 

[Kaiserstark]

RT:

This is vs. low RT setting...

The more I see, the more it looks like they made a patch in a hurry to be present during the release of the Pro to attract the most potential sales, which is not surprising when we see that the game is still not profitable maybe they could have gotten a better result with more time or their engine is just not well optimized enough for console.

 

[Leonidas]

Damn, 4070 is a BEAST!

 

[TintoConCasera]

Damn, 4070 is a BEAST!

You should see the 4070 Super.

 

[kevboard]

And? This is still a quick port/update vs stuff you get on PC if the developers implement decent enough ray tracing.

I don't think you can call a game that got this amount of changes to the way it handles raytracing done, specifically for this one port, a "quick port"

a lot of care and thought went into the way they adjusted the raytracing here. a "quick port" would have been to just dial everything down until it runs stable.
but that's not what they did. they deliberately adjusted things in a way that makes it run faster but also still look cohesive.

like the way they adjusted the distant mountains. a quick and dirty port would have just reduced the BVH distance and left it there (see Watch Dogs Legion). but they hand adjust what gets included in the BVH so that, while the trees get culled, the underlying geometry of the hills still gets traced against, even tho these mountains are far further away than their general BVH distance is set up.

they also hand adjust the BVH update rate for specific objects. so that important characters like Alan and Saga update every frame, while other less important objects update at half or even lower rates as their importance goes down.

the PC version didn't have any of these adjustments in place, so all of this had to be specifically implemented for the Pro version.
in the video Alex even explains why they couldn't just implement these settings easily on PC as it would clash with some RT settings, so if implemented in the PC version it would basically need to be a completely separate RT mode that, when toggled on, would need to lock you out from the more granular settings you have.

 

[OverHeat]

Damn, 4070 is a BEAST!

285k doing all the job!

 

[bundylove]

PISSER

I try to feed asparagus to my pro so at least i can smell it since i dont see but even then nothing.

 

[bundylove]

Remedy has messed up this upgrade. They should just use quality mode but running 40fps instead of 30fps and performance mode with same settings but more smoother experience where it does not drop into 40's.

40fps vrr should be on system level of the pro.
But hey we just want your money so live the 30fps life you losers

 

[Mozzarella]

Remedy has one of the best talents at Art Direction, its a shame their gameplay isn't up to the par though.

 

[zeroluck]

At this rate PS6 is about to be 4070 super performance in 2030.

 

[Senua]

Remedy has one of the best talents at Art Direction, its a shame their gameplay isn't up to the par though.

It's funny because Max Payne 1 and 2 had incredible gunplay on PC. Control was good too.

 

[Desprado123]

I know people are missing me on this topic but can anyone tell who exactly told that RTX 4070 will perform same as PS5 Pro expect DF BS?

I told already that on RT, RTX 3060 TI would easily compete with PS5 PRo on third party games.

 

[Kangx]

The more I see, the more it looks like they made a patch in a hurry to be present during the release of the Pro to attract the most potential sales, which is not surprising when we see that the game is still not profitable.

I know they couldn't do much on the performance mode because of DRS but
This mode could do much better with upping the res from 1260p to 1600p Without RT which created more noise with little visual improvement. This will give the game image quality much better with sharpness and stability.

They also can throw us a bone and implement a 1440p at 40fps.

 

[MikeM]

Still do not get why Remedy decided to throw more effects into the game rather than raise the resolution.

Especially at sub 1080p baseline. Should have gotten that up to 1080p prior to cranking settings.

 

[Mozzarella]

It's funny because Max Payne 1 and 2 had incredible gunplay on PC. Control was good too.

I mean they are alright.
I found Control to be lackluster in gameplay though, sure the physics are neat and the gunplay feels satisfying, but its too easy and shallow and quickly becomes repetitive.
I mean lets compare Returnal to Control as both have similar design in TPS, wow the difference is staggering.

 

[Danknugz]

rather save the 700 and put it toward the 5090

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

PSSR struggles right now with image stability and noise,

Not in SM2, TLOU, Ratchet, SB

 

[adamsapple]

Damn, 4070 is a BEAST!

Wait just a fucking second ..

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

All the flaws of PSSR are laid bare. None of those other games using PSSR come anywhere close to AW2 in regards to lighting and environmental detail.

The last of us looks better