[Digital Foundry] Silent Hill f Review - PlayStation 5/PS5 Pro - Impressive On Base, Problems On Pro
- Thread starter Lunatic_Gamer
- Start date
- Analysis Review
TerribleAtThisGame
Member
Even as someone who doesn't notice a lot of graphics and performance issues that are discussed here, stuff like THIS drives me nuts because my eyes are constantly drawn to it. It's constant movement so you can't help it.- YouTube
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It's this bad in most UE5 games. It's partially on Sony (for not testing it enough with RTGI, RTAO and lumen) and partially on devs - it seems that they don't even look at their games when developing. PSSR should never be enabled here - maybe optional.
Reminds me of trying to watch a Horror flick on Prime and half the black space on screen is a weird flickering mess.
TerribleAtThisGame
Member
I unfortunately did, yes.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Total joke and shame on these developers that keep making such obvious bone headed decisions to force only one mode with only PSSR.....its really disgraceful and like you said, the Pro having some settings be the same as base ps5's Performance mode is enough reason to have included a Quality mode too.Game looks nice & clean on PS5 too, PS5 Pro coming in with "looks closed to PS5 Quality in stills
some areas also show settings similar to PS5's Performance mode"
That coupled with PSSR problems with lumen.
This is a joke.
These devs/pubs really just treat us like crap when they make decisions like this that did not have to be and a 10 year old could've pointed out doesn't make any sense.
The devs would've seen the PSSR noise issues ....that's enough reason to have included the other upscaler and a Quality mode. It's bizarre and PC gamers would never be treated with this much disrespect because the devs know they'd be review bombed to hell ..yet it keeps happening with ps5 pro and we have to wait ages for a fix (that may never come). It's pure disregard for that audience theres no good excuse.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
Wrong ....how can you still be thinking this way? Every game with Lumen or Ray Tracing has the same noise issues. Every game outside of just a few that has fences or mesh objects has the same pssr shimmer as well.
The upscaler has major issues since release and theres no denying it. Yet you're still blaming the devs? 90% of games with pssr have either the RT noise problem and artifacting on mesh objects.
You're going to see a lot less people agreeing with you going forward because the cat is finally out of the bag.
lastmessiah
Member
Well, there was a time when any kind of Japanese title would have an atrocious PC port, if it were ported at all. Only relatively recently has that changed. The PS5 Pro situation seems particularly bad though, being hamstringed by a boutique upscaler that doesn't even compete with AMD's is no bueno.
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ShadowkillXNA
Member
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
You'd think with that premium Sony is charging, they'd send some engineers to assist studios with PSSR implementation and general Pro upgrades, but no. They're simply content letting devs make their console look like a piece of shit.
Thankfully, I only play PS exclusives, so I've had no problems with mine. On the flip side, not many PS exclusives interest me these days. Next game I'll buy is probably Saros.
Thankfully, I only play PS exclusives, so I've had no problems with mine. On the flip side, not many PS exclusives interest me these days. Next game I'll buy is probably Saros.
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Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
I was just on Resetera reading a developers thoughts on the Pro. He has intimate knowledge having been working on adding hardware lumen to his game. He says both ps5 and ps5 pro are memory bandwith limited and that really hamstings the consoles ability to improve RT and implement hardware lumen. This is the reason both Indiana Jones and Doom had no RT improvements on the system. The Pro does have more mem bamdwith but not much...he said he has had to spend a lot of extra time optomizing to get hardware lumen working on his game which is a smaller game.
I just don't understand how Mark Cerney designed this system, "the tech genius", and then had no problem getting up there and selling us basically a bill of goods. PSSR is way worse than anyone imagined it would be. The 2-3x RT boosts are hampered by BOTH the same CPU as bas3 PS5 AND memory bamdwith. The console doubled the amount of CU's for only 45% gpu boost...like theres really no good news or silver lining other than the promise of FSR4 coming "next year".
I don't believe Cerny didn't know this consoles performance would be comprpmised like this. He knew but still sold us on PSSR being great and having big RT imprpvements as well as straight up acting as if we would see Quality modes at 60. I'm so done with Sony after this console that's how burned im feeling since about a month after the console launched but especially these last couple months .
Indiana Jones, Doom, Borderlands 4, Cronos, mgs delta, Dying Light the Beast, and Silent Hill f show just how bad things are now. Can't see Yotei being good on Pro either, settings wise, all videos shown look pretty bad with FPS drops and crappy draw distance (despite DF's "draw distance looks better" claim). Look at the backgrounds you see the grass cut off point then it becomes barren just like Tsushima. Borderlands 4 has this problem too and it looks bad as a result- better lods and draw distance is the type of Pro enhancement that could've really made a difference in these games, but BL4 has no support (even tho game had its own State of Play)....
Sony deserves all the blame and they need to do SOMETHING to show Pro owners that theres a positive future for this console ...they've done everything wrong though so far ...literally everything and we're seeing the fallout from that now.
lastmessiah
Member
I don't know much about the innards of Sony corporate, but I imagine he answers to execs who require him to push out a product AND be the face of said product. So even if he knows it sucks, due to budget constraints or whatever, he still must pitch it as the best thing ever.
Seems like Sony just wanted to be able to claim the console performance crown for some reason, without regard for whatever support may be on the horizon.
Pimpbaa
Member
HDR?
Edit: google search ai says there is, and some steam deck fan site says the PC version does so I guess it does have it. Really wish they would do a detailed look into HDR in games, whether it's included and if it is, how well is it implemented. It's an important part of modern graphics!
Edit: google search ai says there is, and some steam deck fan site says the PC version does so I guess it does have it. Really wish they would do a detailed look into HDR in games, whether it's included and if it is, how well is it implemented. It's an important part of modern graphics!
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Bernardougf
Member
And it wont matter at all.. third party games wont get updated and when the games that are going to use it will probably come out almost or alteady in the crossgen period... ps5pro was just a shitty project sold at promises that didnt come into fruition... quality mode at 60 fps ? Great new upscaler ? ... riiiiight.
Bojji
Gold Member
This is what I have suspected for quite some time. Everything is constrained by that piss poor memory BW (and no L3 cache). Sony AGAIN limited their console like this (after PS4 Pro), PS5 Pro needed 384 bit bus...
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
Would you mind linking to the post here?
Ursus Vindicant
Gold Member
Again?
PS5 Pro is my biggest tech regret for years. Damn
PS5 Pro is my biggest tech regret for years. Damn
Signalis
Member
Loved my PS5 Pro at first, but really now starting to think I wasted my fucking money. PS4 Pro was a huge upgrade for me especially because I was playing Final Fantasy 15 when it released and was about more than quarter in when the PS4 Pro released and it was a night and day difference. PS5 Pro is probably the biggest regret I've had in a long time. Todd Howard.....sorry I mean Peter Molyneux......sorry I mean Mark Cerny really has become a snake oil salesman. Fucking cunt.
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It's not Wukong using Lumen? Their PSSR implementation is pretty good.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I knew the ps5 pro was a piece of shit. I got dragged over the coals for saying it. I still sold my ps5s and bought one after a few months thinking it can't be as bad as it looks to me. There was so much defence for the system.
At least death stranding 2 looks pretty decent on it. Hopefully yotei has a good ps5 pro patch.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see adding only 45 percent raster but trying to make that stretch across RT and a memory starved system then masking it with a custom made AI scaler was gonna be a shit show. Here we are.
Cerny did the same thing with the PS4 pro. It's like he forgets about memory. No pun intended.
At least death stranding 2 looks pretty decent on it. Hopefully yotei has a good ps5 pro patch.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see adding only 45 percent raster but trying to make that stretch across RT and a memory starved system then masking it with a custom made AI scaler was gonna be a shit show. Here we are.
Cerny did the same thing with the PS4 pro. It's like he forgets about memory. No pun intended.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
The PS5 Pro fucking sucks.
FalconPunch
Member
And?
What does that have to do with hardware? That's a developer driven decision. If you have a problem, go complain to Konami. If you want to ,Alex the argument that the pro is bad value for money, that's another thing all together. Although I'd love to hear the argument on why paying 50% more for the Pro to get approximately 45% more raster performance is bad value for money.... Especially when compared to the PC space.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I meant to say. What if you're a person who sold your ps5 for a pro and you don't own a pc. You can't point to games that run well that are old. So pro owners can only play the odd good game that's old?
I just wrote it shit.
There's been enough games with the same issues to show it's not JUST a developers issue.
FalconPunch
Member
It is 100% a developer issue to use PSSR. You can just release with a higher resolution on the pro. Several studios have done just that.
playbignbox
Member
PS5 Pro is a joke
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
It was literally, one of the three pillars of the whole selling pitch from Mark Cerny / Sony and you are blaming studios for using it......
At some point, people HAVE to make Sony accountable for this and I wouldnt be surprised to see a one of those court cases pop up soon.
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
Nah PC gamers are disrespected all the time it's just that we can fix it with mods, ini files etc.
Doctor Hades
Member
Sony seriously need to do something about games that are being released on PS5 Pro that look objectively worse than on the base system because that should just never be allowed to happen.
Initially I was quite impressed by PSSR but as time went on and more and more games got upgraded to use it, it became apparent that it has some major flaws in the form of added visual noise, a high performance cost (resulting in lower rendering resolutions) and flickering. This is new technology, fine, I get it might have issues but console games are rarely updated to address these so that means games are stuck using them, especially if a publisher, for whatever reason, decides to replace the base system's two modes (Quality and Performance) with a single 60 fps mode on the PS5 Pro. That means Pro users have no choice. At the very least, PSSR should be an option in the Graphics menu that can be toggled on and off, plus if the base system has two or more modes then, in my opinion, the Pro should also have all these same modes too with the expected higher quality graphical settings and/or resolution to reflect its more capable GPU.
There should never EVER be a game that looks and/or runs worse than on the base system. That is just an insult to the people who paid a lot of money to own a PS5 Pro with the promise of better looking and better running games than on the base PS5.
Initially I was quite impressed by PSSR but as time went on and more and more games got upgraded to use it, it became apparent that it has some major flaws in the form of added visual noise, a high performance cost (resulting in lower rendering resolutions) and flickering. This is new technology, fine, I get it might have issues but console games are rarely updated to address these so that means games are stuck using them, especially if a publisher, for whatever reason, decides to replace the base system's two modes (Quality and Performance) with a single 60 fps mode on the PS5 Pro. That means Pro users have no choice. At the very least, PSSR should be an option in the Graphics menu that can be toggled on and off, plus if the base system has two or more modes then, in my opinion, the Pro should also have all these same modes too with the expected higher quality graphical settings and/or resolution to reflect its more capable GPU.
There should never EVER be a game that looks and/or runs worse than on the base system. That is just an insult to the people who paid a lot of money to own a PS5 Pro with the promise of better looking and better running games than on the base PS5.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
That's how i feel. Sony should be doing everything in their power to make sure the customers who went out and purchased their "Pro" system is that it is ALWAYS better than the base console version. I can't believe that this is even having to be said, but then it just makes sense in this environment that we are all getting bent over.
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YeulEmeralda
Linux User
Interesting and true.
On PC you can use the latest DLSS4 on older games that originally shipped with DLSS2.
In console that would require a patch and nobody cares about old games.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
50% more? The digital PS5 was $450 and the Pro was 700, that's 56% more. Only recently with all the awfully raised prices in the US is the Pro is 50% more, but that's after the DE went up by $100 over the years and the Pro by $50 in less than a year in the US. That's even worse when you consider the digital PS5 was $400 at one point and the Pro came out at $700, 75% more. Here, the Pro is 65% more expensive. $960 CAD vs $580 CAD.
Even compared to PC, that's awful. The RTX 4060 came out with an MSRP of $300. The 5060 Ti 16GB is 43% faster, but only 43% more expensive with an MSRP of $430. In AMD's case, the PS5-tier 6600 XT came out in October 2021 with an MSRP of $380. 4 years later (the same amount of time between the release of the PS5 and PS5 Pro), the 9060 XT that's a whopping 61% faster is $390, a $10 price hike.
And that's without considering that the Pro's 45% better rasterization claim sometimes doesn't translate to tangible results as we've seen gains in the ~30% range, but also that in the case of PC, you don't need devs to patch in anything to get the full 43% performance increase and you never ever get a worse IQ and if you do, you can turn off DLSS.
We can blame the devs all we want, but Sony has a responsibility to this console and the buyers and it doesn't look like they're doing a damn thing to assist devs in implementing PSSR when they're clearly struggling with it.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
PSSR Has had issues across multiple games especially those that use next gen engines and effects. I only think Sony should be doing more for their customers that purchased the PS5 pro.
ElFenomeno
Member
Its not Sony's responsibility to optimize 3rd party games.
Should they be doing more? Of course but they should have started with the disc drive and a stand. The writing was on the wall since the beginning.
Should they be doing more? Of course but they should have started with the disc drive and a stand. The writing was on the wall since the beginning.
Gaiff
SBI’s Resident Gaslighter
No, it isn't. You're just fanboying. People have legitimate grievances and you frame it as trolling. Sony is a multi-billion company charging a premium for a Pro console and there are too many cases where it does not deliver.
xrnzaaas
Member
The problem is that they can only do so much on the software side for their existing Pro owners. Can't resolve hardware bottlenecks and other hardware-related issues.
That is the reason they are porting FSR4, instead making that evolution a PS6 exclusivity.
No one forced developers to use PSSR or deliver only one graphic mode where on ps5 base there are 2. Maybe some developers should care more about the state of a porting of the ps5 pro, Sony has surely its fault but some developers are deliberately obtuse because it's not the first time.It's both hilarious and sad that this is the experience a 700$ console provides.
I know many of you don't like him but here are a few observations from Alex.
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The hell you are talking about. Most of the people complain about the PRO are not about the hardware bottlenecks but the PSSR implementation which mostly are from modest developers.
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Bojji
Gold Member
You mean it's better to ignore the problems and praise devs/Sony? That surely will motivate people responsible to fix the problem... You can call DF "haters" but their videos are the reason why many games were fixed after lunch. Reviewers are tech illiterate most of the time.
This is on devs as well, Sony dropped that PSSR ".dll" and told them to use it. They use it but algorithm sucks for some games and engines. Why not fix it?
And there are more and more UE5 games, not less. We have wait for who knows how long (potentially even Q4 2026) for PSSR fix. I was told by people here that they will update PSSR like Nvidia was updating dlss? Turns out they don't give a fuck about PSSR1 at all and we are stuck with it for now.
Ah come on. There are mostly posts in the last pages about the console pro as a piece of shit or I never buy this shit and so on, the hell of contribution give such stupid stuff. If you don't like or regret about the Pro, sell it or never buy one. Otherwise those people are trolling and nothing more.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
"The three pillars of the PS5 Pro are its upgraded GPU, advanced ray tracing, and the new AI-driven upscaling technology called PlayStation Spectral Super Resolution (PSSR). These enhancements allow for significantly improved performance, visuals, and overall clarity in compatible games, enabling smoother frame rates and more detailed, lifelike graphics compared to the base PS5 model. "
And it's not true because PSSR has flaws? Are you claiming ps5 pro hardware will elevate mediocre developers to the excellence?
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MatrixReloaded101
Member
Before the ps5 pro released I as well as others said it was a bad idea because a "pro" console wasn't needed this gen.
If you care that much about performance a PC is a better option.
Now it looks like Sony rushed this console out without properly venting the PSSR or at least giving devs the guidance to use it properly.
PS5 Pro was just a greedy move by Sony and it will damage their reputation. You can't have your premium console preforming worst than the base console and telling people "waiting next year for an update".
If you care that much about performance a PC is a better option.
Now it looks like Sony rushed this console out without properly venting the PSSR or at least giving devs the guidance to use it properly.
PS5 Pro was just a greedy move by Sony and it will damage their reputation. You can't have your premium console preforming worst than the base console and telling people "waiting next year for an update".
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
If you're pro device is not good enough to out perform your base console on every game then it shouldnt exist in the form that it is.
Thats why they should have just gone with brute GPU power and a CPU upgrade, plus giving the options for people to say they don't want to use PSSR. locking people into using what is clearly throw away tech is out of line. Anyway, it doesnt matter. it will just force more people to move to PC as I see more on more people fed up with this shit.
I'm lucky as I only use my playstations for exclusives, others have PCs. its the people that use it as their main console and upgraded from a base PS5 I really feel for. At least i have options for my stupid decision.