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[Vincent Grayson]

God forbid anything ever take a moment longer than is strictly necessary.

In a game.

Which you're playing to have fun.

I mean, if you're not playing to have fun, then I understand, you want to get your chores out of the way and move on. But if that's the case, then you've made some poor decisions about entertainment time, and I'd suggest not taking MMOs this seriously.

I feel like I see this attitude more in XIV than I did even in WoW.

 

[iammeiam]

Wait are we arguing that the people who want to stand there and do nothing are having better fun than the people who don't understand wanting to do nothing?

 

[QisTopTier]

I feel like I see this attitude more in XIV than I did even in WoW.

Quite a few old school WoW players play this.

Spoiler

Including me

 

[Bittercup]

thinking of getting Heavensward to continue the journey, is the Digital Collector's Ed items worth it?

I bought the digital CE and I like the griffin and if you plan to switch races the fantasia might be handy. But I wouldn't say they are certainly worth 20$.
In case you are playing on PC, you can get the game relatively cheaply on greenmangaming. With the code GMGSUM-MERSAL-E20OFF its 28€ for the regular version and 40€ for the digital CE. I can't see the US prices but they are probably similar.

 

[scy]

We need your wise guidance.

In that case, this just sounds like a bunch of people finding ways to validate their choice of being lazy by preemptively blaming other players.

I've tanked, healed, and DPS'd everything the game had to offer pre-3.0 (barring Savage, which I've only tanked and DPS'd). You're deluding yourself if you truly think healing has a lot to do 99% of the time.

God forbid anything ever take a moment longer than is strictly necessary.

In a game.

Which you're playing to have fun.

Here's the problem that everybody misses and/or ignores: It's not about speeding up the run in and of itself. It's not about "this is a chore to me, please make it go faster so I can get out." It's why do you get to AFK? What kind of entitlement issues must a person have at that point to firmly believe they can just get three other people to do everything else? Honestly, the "it speeds up the run" is more for the person being AFK. I mean, they clearly do not want to be there so they should be doing something to make it end faster.

Also, seriously, you think people _AFKing in a dungeon_ are there for fun?

 

[Zomba13]

Wait are we arguing that the people who want to stand there and do nothing are having better fun than the people who don't understand wanting to do nothing?

Yes. The people letting the fairy heal or throwing out a cure every so often are having more fun because they are watching netflix or TV or playing another game with their downtime.

 

[HylianScribe]

Hope Square Enix sees this and tries to copy it:
http://kotaku.com/world-of-warcrafts-pvp-is-getting-a-big-change-1718177256

Being able to queue up for Frontline and be able to join any GC's team would alleviate the ridiculous wait time a bit, right? Will be interesting to see when they add new maps.

 

[Arkeband]

Hope Square Enix sees this and tries to copy it:
http://kotaku.com/world-of-warcrafts-pvp-is-getting-a-big-change-1718177256

Being able to queue up for Frontline and be able to join any GC's team would alleviate the ridiculous wait time a bit, right? Will be interesting to see when they add new maps.

It might fix the wait time but it won't make PvP any good.

 

[Zomba13]

It might fix the wait time but it won't make PvP any good.

The PVP is already fun it just sucks having to wait so long for it.

 

[scy]

The PVP is already fun it just sucks having to wait so long for it.

but waiting for queues means watching more netflix

 

[Tiops]

Pro SMN players, is Ifrit-egi still better than Garuda-egi with the recent changes? I've been using Garuda to apply Tri-Disaster + Contagion every time I enter Dreadwyrm Trance, and when I change to Ifrit to parse in boss battles I'm not seeing a big difference in DPS (I'm parsing around 680~700 in i160 on Neverreap/Fractal).

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

Now that I think about it seems kind of weird that people are speaking in an almost positive manner about how they don't have to do certain things in combat.

Going to be honest I think the game's combat system is pretty drab, I mostly play for the Final Fantasy stuff as opposed to say like a fighting game where a lot of my enjoyment would come predominantly from utilizing the game's mechanics.

Considering that I don't think I'm surprised to see people who are content to not put in more effort than they think is necessary, because they don't see a good enough return on doing so.

Compare to something like DMC where your continued effort is directly rewarded with visually stimulating rewards such as this.

 

[Korezo]

When someone pulls more mobs when I pulled I always feel like letting them die.. but don't because I would just be wasting more time. In the start of a dungeon I always pull regular portion to see if party is good enough for big pulls. I don't get how some people's brain works in this game.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

God forbid anything ever take a moment longer than is strictly necessary.

In a game.

Which you're playing to have fun.

I mean, if you're not playing to have fun, then I understand, you want to get your chores out of the way and move on. But if that's the case, then you've made some poor decisions about entertainment time, and I'd suggest not taking MMOs this seriously.

I feel like I see this attitude more in XIV than I did even in WoW.

The fact that it's a game doesn't give people the right to waste other people's time

 

[Jayhawk]

This is what happens when I try to melee.

The world literally becomes a worse place.

Are there videos or archive footage of Angary melee? I need to be entertained until I find a source for Dusk Leathers to make those Company Tabards.

 

[gryvan]

Are there videos or archive footage of Angary melee? I need to be entertained until I find a source for Dusk Leathers to make those Company Tabards.

I may have archive footages of angary healing

 

[scy]

Pro SMN players, is Ifrit-egi still better than Garuda-egi with the recent changes? I've been using Garuda to apply Tri-Disaster + Contagion every time I enter Dreadwyrm Trance, and when I change to Ifrit to parse in boss battles I'm not seeing a big difference in DPS (I'm parsing around 680~700 in i160 on Neverreap/Fractal).

Ifrit himself is outright better damage than Garuda but, no, I don't think he competes very well with Contagion'd DWT(+RS, whenever they resync) for most encounters currently. Oddly, he might be better for the trash pulls now due to Radiant Shield but Flaming Crush is worse than Aerial Slash.

There are some training dummy-esque fights that he may be an improvement on (A1, A4) but I haven't done any live tests with him on to see if it pans out.

 

[Haly]

If you don't feel like pressing 3 more buttons, then just own up to it.

This "not my job", "I play for fun", "stop being a try hard" hand wringing just makes you look insecure.

 

[Kagari]

I'll fully admit I like playing Scholar because the fairy is a crutch.

 

[DooMAGE]

I played FFXIV long time ago and im planning to come back. Can I still enjoy the base game or I need this new expansion to play?

 

[hamchan]

I wonder if anyone really does notice the healer not dpsing in low level dungeons. I just assume everyone is as zoned out as I am during those or paying attention to something else on a second monitor.

 

[tiggerkiddo]

Pro healers go hippie mage anyways

 

[IvorB]

but waiting for queues means watching more netflix

Just play as healer then you can just carry on watching Netflix regardless.

 

[irfaanator]

I'll fully admit I like playing Scholar because the fairy is a crutch.

need that docbon no sound

 

[iammeiam]

I have yet to do anything on melee hilarious enough to be worth preserving. Wait until Sohm Al, where maybe I'll face the wrong way and Elusive a comet onto the tank.

I may have archive footages of angary healing

is it going to be FCoB where I don't clerics at all and look like a giant hypocrite.

 

[irfaanator]

I have yet to do anything on melee hilarious enough to be worth preserving. Wait until Sohm Al, where maybe I'll face the wrong way and Elusive a comet onto the tank.



is it going to be FCoB where I don't clerics at all and look like a giant hypocrite.

cant beat me accidentally elusiving off of bismarck and running straight off of ravana. Already back to the drg ways

 

[Sorian]

Page 187 and 188 on 50 posts per page has been a riveting game of spot the idiots. Thank you all.

 

[scy]

...where maybe I'll face the wrong way and Elusive a comet onto the tank.

Who would do a thing like that.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

In that case, this just sounds like a bunch of people finding ways to validate their choice of being lazy by preemptively blaming other players.

I've tanked, healed, and DPS'd everything the game had to offer pre-3.0 (barring Savage, which I've only tanked and DPS'd). You're deluding yourself if you truly think healing has a lot to do 99% of the time.



Here's the problem that everybody misses and/or ignores: It's not about speeding up the run in and of itself. It's not about "this is a chore to me, please make it go faster so I can get out." It's why do you get to AFK? What kind of entitlement issues must a person have at that point to firmly believe they can just get three other people to do everything else? Honestly, the "it speeds up the run" is more for the person being AFK. I mean, they clearly do not want to be there so they should be doing something to make it end faster.

Also, seriously, you think people _AFKing in a dungeon_ are there for fun?

Where did AFK come into this? I thought we were just arguing over whether players should be doing things outside their explicit role they signed up for.

I definitely do not remember seeing people bitch about healers doing DPS in WoW. It seems to be a XIV-specific phenomena to me. I mean, I don't heal, so I have no dog in this fight. It's more that the entire "but you're making a thing take longer than it might under optimal play" argument holds no water, IMO, and is a shitty sentiment.

 

[Valor]

The sheer amount of stupid going on in this thread right now is simply astounding.

 

[Sorian]

Where did AFK come into this? I thought we were just arguing over whether players should be doing things outside their explicit role they signed up for.

I definitely do not remember seeing people bitch about healers doing DPS in WoW. It seems to be a XIV-specific phenomena to me. I mean, I don't heal, so I have no dog in this fight. It's more that the entire "but you're making a thing take longer than it might under optimal play" argument holds no water, IMO, and is a shitty sentiment.

There's a lot of down time in healing in FFXIV in dungeons, specifically, but other content too. If they aren't dpsing then they are literally sitting there doing nothing for multiple GCDs.

 

[The Elite]

I played FFXIV long time ago and im planning to come back. Can I still enjoy the base game or I need this new expansion to play?

The base game is good to play right now. You won't need Heavensward until you reach Level 50.

 

[VanillaCakeIsBurning]

For their next MMO they should contract the DMC team or PlatinumGames to develop their combat system.

 

[MogCakes]

I've EJ'd off the island in BisEX and off the ledge in RavEX. I've also EJ'd into the mini AoEs of A4. I've got notches all up on that belt.

 

[iammeiam]

You can only effectively heal until health bars are full. Once they're full/you have a shield up, you stand there waiting for another healing opportunity... Or you DPS. Standing still doesn't help the group and is boring as hell after you know a fight. Over healing gives you something to do but is, again, not helping. DPS--with the fairly decent DPS tools given to healers in this game--always helps.

People can choose to do nothing and I won't care that much, unless and until they decide to defend it as a good/right thing. It's a selfish choice, just own it. We all do suboptimal things sometimes, no point in pretending there's a moral justification behind it.

Who would do a thing like that.

Don't worry you'll find out.

 

[Xion_Stellar]

You guys have a funny way of shifting the conversation.

Yesterday I mentioned that I didn't like how certain players just Tank through easily dodgeable hits instead of moving out of the way which forces me to waste time/mp to heal them when I could be focusing on other things (Such as helping DPS),but I was told that moving out of the way from those Attacks causes DPS loss.

But now you guys are talking about Healers not participating or helping do damage.

Come Gaf...

 

[irfaanator]

You guys have a funny way of shifting the conversation.

Yesterday I mentioned that I didn't like how certain players just Tank through easily dodgeable hits instead of moving out of the way which forces me to waste time/mp to heal them when I could be focusing on other things (Such as helping DPS).

But now you guys are talking about Healers not participating or helping do damage.

Come Gaf...

nobody wins bro. no friends in here

 

[hamchan]

Looks like every role gets its fair share of hate. This just means that the entire userbase hates themselves.

 

[scy]

Where did AFK come into this? I thought we were just arguing over whether players should be doing things outside their explicit role they signed up for.

The start of the entire thing this time was about an auto-follow Scholar.

I definitely do not remember seeing people bitch about healers doing DPS in WoW. It seems to be a XIV-specific phenomena to me. I mean, I don't heal, so I have no dog in this fight. It's more that the entire "but you're making a thing take longer than it might under optimal play" argument holds no water, IMO, and is a shitty sentiment.

There's a thing to this, though? The game makes a pretty big deal of pointing out to Conjurers (the only actual starting healing class) that they have damage dealing things and not just heals. That they can do both. Scholar starts off as a DPS class. A lot of really powerful AoE abilities in general are given to healers (Holy and Gravity, for instance) that for most purposes is not really usable in solo play.

Basically, this game kind of pushes it more as an option than WoW did, though there were still moments of that in WoW's design. Besides that, most of it is the encounter design? A lot of WoW design focused around HPS throughput while XIV is basically just dealing with the spikes; output vs timing as the primary focus.

If you ever do heal, you'll probably see what we mean? AFK is a bit disingenuous for most of the time but you really do have ~10s between heals usually in dungeons? Considering the length of most low level trash pulls, that's pretty much one heal per fight.

Yesterday I mentioned that I didn't like how certain players just Tank through easily dodgeable hits instead of moving out of the way which forces me to waste time/mp to heal them when I could be focusing on other things (Such as helping DPS),but I was told that moving out of the way from those Attacks causes DPS loss.

There are hits you sometimes take and hits you don't. Standing in avoidable AoE that you can dodge and keep DPSing (e.g., no need of a positional so you can dodge tail cleaves) is wrong. Standing in an AoE to finish a GCD instead of missing 1-2 is usually worth it due to the time lost dodging and getting back in position. Basically, take the hits that are a net gain for everyone.

Don't worry you'll find out.

See, you already forgot that one time I EJ'd onto the tank!

 

[DMTripper]

I'm a completely new mmo player and now level 46 DRG. This game has been a total eye opener in more ways than one.

I've been grinding Dungeons and some of the stuff you see can be unreal. Such as tanks running through half the level and then complaining when we all wipe. Healers going AFK during a boss fight. People calling each other names etc etc.

BUT, the amount of people who help each other out, those that kick bad eggs and the random friendships even if they last a short while are well worth it.

I'm trying to be a good player and I'm open to learning. It's a whole new world this MMO business, but it's a lot of fun.

Not sure what it's gonna be like at end game but I hope it's the same.

 

[Sorian]

You guys have a funny way of shifting the conversation.

Yesterday I mentioned that I didn't like how certain players just Tank through easily dodgeable hits instead of moving out of the way which forces me to waste time/mp to heal them when I could be focusing on other things (Such as helping DPS),but I was told that moving out of the way from those Attacks causes DPS loss.

But now you guys are talking about Healers not participating or helping do damage.

Come Gaf...

Nah, you're trying to find equal ground while there is none. You were talking about movement heavy fights where its either the DPS moves and loses up time or stands still and the healer has to switch from dps to healing. We're now talking about fights where hardly anything is happening and the healer has everyone topped off and they are now standing there doing nothing.

 

[SliceSabre]

Nah, you're trying to find equal ground while there is none. You were talking about movement heavy fights where its either the DPS moves and loses up time or stands still and the healer has to switch from dps to healing. We're now talking about fights where hardly anything is happening and the healer has everyone topped off and they are now standing there doing nothing.

Actually he has a point because it happens in trash mob fights too that dps will simply take the hit so they can keep up their SICK DEEPS.

I laugh when I see dps get too cocky about SICK DEEPS and get in front of the thing the tank is tanking and get their heads instantly cleaved off.

 

[Sorian]

Actually he has a point because it happens in trash mob fights too that dps will simply take the hit so they can keep up their SICK DEEPS.

I laugh when I see dps get too cocky about SICK DEEPS and get in front of the thing the tank is tanking and get their heads instantly cleaved off.

There are hits you sometimes take and hits you don't. Standing in avoidable AoE that you can dodge and keep DPSing (e.g., no need of a positional so you can dodge tail cleaves) is wrong. Standing in an AoE to finish a GCD instead of missing 1-2 is usually worth it due to the time lost dodging and getting back in position. Basically, take the hits that are a net gain for everyone.

I'll use Scy's much better written post to answer yours. Slice, bruh, just take the L on this one, you're ridiculous.

 

[Tiops]

I'm a completely new mmo player and now level 46 DRG. This game has been a total eye opener in more ways than one.

I've been grinding Dungeons and some of the stuff you see can be unreal. Such as tanks running through half the level and then complaining when we all wipe. Healers going AFK during a boss fight. People calling each other names etc etc.

BUT, the amount of people who help each other out, those that kick bad eggs and the random friendships even if they last a short while are well worth it.

I'm trying to be a good player and I'm open to learning. It's a whole new world this MMO business, but it's a lot of fun.

Not sure what it's gonna be like at end game but I hope it's the same.

It's usually a nice community. I met way more polite players than the angry, whining ones. It gets a little more frequent in the harder content (end game raids, basically), unfortunately, but unless you're trying to clear the absolute harder content of the game with random parties, it's still fine.

 

[Ken]

See, you already forgot that one time I EJ'd onto the tank!

Lewd.

I don't even know what EJ stands for in-game.

 

[Sorian]

Lewd.

I don't even know what EJ stands for in-game.

It's gotta be EJaculated. It's the only thing that popped into my head each time I read that sentence.

Sorry for lewd.

Spoiler

Not really that sorry.

 

[SliceSabre]

I'll use Scy's much better written post to answer yours. Slice, bruh, just take the L on this one, you're ridiculous.

Healers don't take Ls, we revive them and send their asses back into the fight With Brink of Death status regardless of how poorly it is going.

 

[Ken]

It's gotta be EJaculated. It's the only thing that popped into my head each time I read that sentence.

Sorry for lewd.

Spoiler

Not really that sorry.

Oh wait, it's Elusive Jump.

But the other thing makes posts like these really...strange.

I've EJ'd off the island in BisEX and off the ledge in RavEX. I've also EJ'd into the mini AoEs of A4. I've got notches all up on that belt.

 

[IMBored]

Bard will always be cool because hats, though. It's just currently no fun. I'm not sure where hipsters stand in fun.

Hipsters hate fun and 3.0 has no cool brd hats. Yoship hates brds. Yoship = hipster.

 

[Sorian]

Healers don't take Ls, we revive them and send their asses back into the fight With Brink of Death status regardless of how poorly it is going.

Healers are the hottest shit around and extremely more important then everyone else. Those scrub DPS should shut up and bow down, it's not like their job is hard anyway. Or something. When did people forget that it was called a trinity because all 3 pieces were needed in top form?

Oh wait, it's Elusive Jump.

But the other thing makes posts like these really...strange.

EJ'd everywhere. I can respect that.