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Final Fantasy XIV: Heavensward |OT| The Midas Touch
- Thread starter Ken
- Start date
So reading through the Reddit thing, is this the Reddit guy being dumb or is this actually how they presented these:
"the same thing tuned two different ways" is not two things. You can't fool me!
(My initial hope was that the relationship between normal and Savage raids would be like the relationship between normal and HM dungeons, where things are recycled but you engage with different aspects/they feel like different experiences. I don't see them moving to that for Midas though.)
You can rejoin any time! Just, you know, only as a potato. Standards!
"the same thing tuned two different ways" is not two things. You can't fool me!
(My initial hope was that the relationship between normal and Savage raids would be like the relationship between normal and HM dungeons, where things are recycled but you engage with different aspects/they feel like different experiences. I don't see them moving to that for Midas though.)
You can rejoin any time! Just, you know, only as a potato. Standards!
Lalas are the blatant racists of eorzea *shakes head*
EndcatOmega
Unconfirmed Member
Lalafells have to stay in groups, they need at least three of them to match normal people with normal hobbies and normal names like Mytemyrgan and Dyrstwyda.
Asami, here is the analogy of what it's like so you can understand our perspective instead of interpreting it as "whiney".
You have a thread for the tv show LOST and it's in season 4 (or whichever season was getting really bad). People are complaining and voicing their concerns. Based on what they are watching right now, they would quit watching it, but they are conflicted because they really enjoyed that first season of LOST and still like some of the characters in the show.
While you still like LOST in season 4, can't you see why someone doesn't, but iis conflicted on quitting because they liked what they got before and still enjoy some parts of LOST? So it's not as easy as "just leave".
You have a thread for the tv show LOST and it's in season 4 (or whichever season was getting really bad). People are complaining and voicing their concerns. Based on what they are watching right now, they would quit watching it, but they are conflicted because they really enjoyed that first season of LOST and still like some of the characters in the show.
While you still like LOST in season 4, can't you see why someone doesn't, but iis conflicted on quitting because they liked what they got before and still enjoy some parts of LOST? So it's not as easy as "just leave".
I played during the entire 2.x cycle, quit shortly after HW's launch, came back for a month in October and saw how terrible things were...I think I'll wait until 4.0 to play again. And if it ends being bad I'll just quit.
The game turned around from 1.0 with 2.0, hopefully 4.0 will do the same.
The game turned around from 1.0 with 2.0, hopefully 4.0 will do the same.
DarknessTear
Banned
I liked all of Lost. Get rekt!
A1S feels like a Primal fight, A2S feels like a dungeon boss, A3S feels like a Final Coil fight, and A4S feels like cancer.
I actually really liked the finale and I'm in the minority on that. I didn't need to know all the tangents about the Island and just cared about the characters. I was just trying to figure out a tv show that had that "jump the shark" / disappointment element for a lot of viewers but most viewers kept watching.
It seems like it is that easy though? The people that started to hate lost continued to hate lost from that point all the way through to the end.
I mean, I'm well aware that there is a growing community of people who hate-play (much like someone hate-watches a tv show) FFXIV and I'm glad their sub money goes towards the game that I still enjoy but at the end of the day, real advice is no one should be forcing themselves to play something they don't like. It's a game. You enjoyed an earlier part and then stopped. Maybe the quality changed or maybe you got used to the formula and got bored, the formula was basically always the same (if I had to make a complaint it's that we swapped down to only two dungeons a patch for reasons) so I think a lot of it is the second point.
None of them apparently, every single modern MMO has a vocal crowd screaming ded gaem and yet, people still play them.
Please see my edit. It's not as easy as "I hate everything about this".
Using my LOST analogy again. Maybe I still like Hugo and John, but Sawyer and Sayid are boring now, Jack is crying we have to go back, and Charlie is now dead.
I forgot how season 4 of LOST went lol
So it's not hate-watch, it's being conflicted. Shades of grey exist
Using my LOST analogy again. Maybe I still like Hugo and John, but Sawyer and Sayid are boring now, Jack is crying we have to go back, and Charlie is now dead.
I forgot how season 4 of LOST went lol
So it's not hate-watch, it's being conflicted. Shades of grey exist
All those same people are still playing too, huehue
Saw this and laughed. Shouldn't everyone be happy now? No Minfilia since 3.x started.
A4S seems to be what people want, though. Which is super depressing.
to be totally honest if it weren't for the mount it'd be hard to find the motivation to farm that thing for 8 weeks. We only found the motivation to push because it seemed like nerfs may have been coming and it would have been silly to waste all that time, get that close, and then not beat it in its original incarnation. Nothing in the game needs the weapons at this point, the gear is ugly, and the 'fun part' of raiding stops when Waterman lets us pass.
I can't speak for everyone, but my relationship with the game at least at this point is a little more complicated. There are still parts of it I really do enjoy, but the parts I don't enjoy are just getting bigger and bigger.
The news about next raid tier freaks me out because it seems likely we're going to end up with fights more like the worst fight in the current batch, because it'll bend to overgear more easily than the more fun fights. Invoking SCoB worries me because there was a clear progression in designing better fights from SCoB to FCoB and I don't want to go backwards.
I'll have fun with Midas if it's 4 FCoB-tier fights, but it is also likely to go down quicker and the game will run out of Things to Do faster than this tier. So I'm worried. But logging in every week to see how far we can make it through Alex before Makoto curses us is still fun, so I'm more likely to want to talk about the issues I see in the game than just straight bail.
Frankly I think a lot of the discontent is a combination of, "Burn-out," + "Tougher raid then asked for," multiplied by long waits for the expansion and long waits for 3.1. I mean, even I essentially took a week off save for raiding in November.
That said.
1: I'm enjoying relic right now, I'm going back and doing a lot of content I haven't touched for the better part of a year. I'm helping a lot of new players clear stuff as well, and I've come to get a bit of a kick out of helping players progress (so long as I'm not there for multiple ice ages.)
2: I'm enjoying Void Ark two, it's good content for me to practice on classes I don't normally use. I just wish I had more classes at sixty for this. That probably won't happen until I'm done with my relic.
3: I'm happy that my static is almost done with A3S, though I think everyone agrees that there's going to need to be some major reshuffling in my group for the next stretch of Alexander. Gotta relieve the peeps that're burnt out on raiding, ya know.
Are their things they could have done better or differently, definitely. Relic should probably be more about numerous small steps, rather then one big step. They should probably introduce small pieces of new content for relic lines whenever they introduce a tier that's supposed to take awhile. A good example is the Alexandrite maps, that may not have been hugely creative, but at least it was something new.
Raid was DEFINITELY tougher then what most raiders wanted to tackle.
Still isn't enough middle tier content, and what middle tier content there is don't give a lot of incentive for players to go back and farm them after players get their weapons. (CoughHeavenswardPonyFarmCough.)
And, uh, more level sixty trials, (gadzooks it's only Singularity Reactor still, and I don't think that comes up in trial roulette!)
Still, I need to reiterate that overall I am still having a pretty good time with this game, and I don't actually think it'd take a lot to get it back to where it was before. Again, having a raid that people actually think they can possibly do should help considerably here.
That said.
1: I'm enjoying relic right now, I'm going back and doing a lot of content I haven't touched for the better part of a year. I'm helping a lot of new players clear stuff as well, and I've come to get a bit of a kick out of helping players progress (so long as I'm not there for multiple ice ages.)
2: I'm enjoying Void Ark two, it's good content for me to practice on classes I don't normally use. I just wish I had more classes at sixty for this. That probably won't happen until I'm done with my relic.
3: I'm happy that my static is almost done with A3S, though I think everyone agrees that there's going to need to be some major reshuffling in my group for the next stretch of Alexander. Gotta relieve the peeps that're burnt out on raiding, ya know.
Are their things they could have done better or differently, definitely. Relic should probably be more about numerous small steps, rather then one big step. They should probably introduce small pieces of new content for relic lines whenever they introduce a tier that's supposed to take awhile. A good example is the Alexandrite maps, that may not have been hugely creative, but at least it was something new.
Raid was DEFINITELY tougher then what most raiders wanted to tackle.
Still isn't enough middle tier content, and what middle tier content there is don't give a lot of incentive for players to go back and farm them after players get their weapons. (CoughHeavenswardPonyFarmCough.)
And, uh, more level sixty trials, (gadzooks it's only Singularity Reactor still, and I don't think that comes up in trial roulette!)
Still, I need to reiterate that overall I am still having a pretty good time with this game, and I don't actually think it'd take a lot to get it back to where it was before. Again, having a raid that people actually think they can possibly do should help considerably here.
It does.
Edit: Only say that because I queue for singularity for the free bonus law and trial roulette peeps are always surprised that they got singularity.
I've never gotten on trial roulette. Gonna try queueing directly again sometime, cause uh, yeah there isn't all that much content at level sixty where you have a good chance of getting a LAW bonus.
Getting those Poetics tokens so much faster then law tokens. <_<;;
Law bonuses are also only like 20-40 tomes as opposed to the usual poetics bonus of 100 so lol
SaintGalgo
Member
SO 3.2 RIGHT?
I'm so dead
I'm aware, but after you clear through the two level sixty roulettes it's kinda hard to get big chunks of law quick. 55-60 law Tomes for a few minutes work is appreciated in those situations.
Plus: even casual trials are good "popcorn," content. The more of those there are the better. <_<;;
We need the D.
EndcatOmega
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah I hope whoever's doing Midas has the golden touch.
The problem with A4S is that it's insufficiently thought out, not that it's just inherently a bad fight. Like... In T9 if you get an extra drake you're probably still on your way to kill the boss. In A4S if you get an extra set of dolls on the third leg, you're almost certainly on your way to hard enrage. The way Nisi works, the fact that it's only cast once and how it overlaps with all the other mechanics happening at once, is just outright malicious. There's requiring coordination and then there's just this mess. It would've been fine if it was cast for each Pentacle and if the whole fight was tuned less so healers wouldn't have to contact otherworldly forces for coordination and the party could safely distract themselves with mechanics for several seconds. Compare it to T13 where even when there's multiple mechanics at the same time, they all align in a way that you can chart a comprehendable course through.
Well, and the boss is just so unexciting. It's four poles.
Well, and the boss is just so unexciting. It's four poles.
the_sun_king
Member
I'm really glad I decided to opt out of participating in Alexander Savage. I decided to go casual for Heavensward (haven't even touched Thordan Extreme) and I've been enjoying my time with the game. Is it perfect? No. (i.e. relic is still a time consuming, soul devouring grind, but that's not unexpected) But I'm not hating my life/the game like so many hardcore top tier raid people are. Plus, I still have all my gatherers in the 50s, only Carpenter at level 50 out of my crafters, Machinist nearing 50, Vanu Vanu allegiance at like...rank 5 or so... In fact, my "big" focus right now actually is collecting all the left side esoteric gear for my Warrior. Basically, I've just been taking my time with everything and I have a lot to still do that doesn't involve raiding.
Furthermore it should probably be noted that what they really said was that "the difficulty of Midas is going to be between SCOB and FCOB". They didn't really allude to how they're going to design the fights. Whether they consider FCOB the harder one of the two is a mystery however.
BTW, could there possibly have been a translation error for the live letter? Because, "2nd Alexander being tuned between FCoB and SCoB," seems like an odd statement, these raids were pretty close in terms of overall difficulty, seems like an oddly specific degree of difficulty to aim for.
Could they have meant, FCoB and Savage SCoB?
Could they have meant, FCoB and Savage SCoB?
I will point out that A3S is still probably the best thing in the expansion to me. The raid being hard didn't ruin it for everyone.
A4S has a decent fight hidden somewhere in it. Like they pulled out a bunch of things that could have worked, but ultimately didn't do anything with it. My pet fix for Nisi would have just been swapping the first three Mortal Rev casts with Pentacle, so you only have to deal with that crap in the early stages of the fight and then after leg 4 start getting Mortal Revs that build in intensity until enrage. Have Nisi convey immunity to DPS for Quarantine, blah blah blah.
My beef with the leg 3 dolls is less that the second set means you're going to hit enrage, and more that the second set poping up as you kill the leg/after you kill the leg means the run is probably going to go to hell shortly since you've got burning/feeding those and mortal rev and then more dolls a few seconds later. Really, really early on we also occasionally got the bonus leg 2 quarantine like two seconds before the leg broke, which also often meant tank stuck in quarantine 4ever gg. Fight is just full of little stupid things that make it often feel more like fighting the fight's design than the boss itself.
But all of it is ripe for overgear; stupid and annoying as it is, once everyone can eat two Carnages or Discoids without a heal it all gets much easier.
A4S has a decent fight hidden somewhere in it. Like they pulled out a bunch of things that could have worked, but ultimately didn't do anything with it. My pet fix for Nisi would have just been swapping the first three Mortal Rev casts with Pentacle, so you only have to deal with that crap in the early stages of the fight and then after leg 4 start getting Mortal Revs that build in intensity until enrage. Have Nisi convey immunity to DPS for Quarantine, blah blah blah.
My beef with the leg 3 dolls is less that the second set means you're going to hit enrage, and more that the second set poping up as you kill the leg/after you kill the leg means the run is probably going to go to hell shortly since you've got burning/feeding those and mortal rev and then more dolls a few seconds later. Really, really early on we also occasionally got the bonus leg 2 quarantine like two seconds before the leg broke, which also often meant tank stuck in quarantine 4ever gg. Fight is just full of little stupid things that make it often feel more like fighting the fight's design than the boss itself.
But all of it is ripe for overgear; stupid and annoying as it is, once everyone can eat two Carnages or Discoids without a heal it all gets much easier.
Tuned a boss too much and made it drop a worthless ilvl weapon as a reward. They made the exact same mistake twice. Square-Enix everybody...
None of this next patch makes me excited for FFXIV. It further highlights Yoshida's incompetence as a Director. These changes aren't going to to suddenly fix FFXIV in the long term.
None of this next patch makes me excited for FFXIV. It further highlights Yoshida's incompetence as a Director. These changes aren't going to to suddenly fix FFXIV in the long term.
What boss are you talking about?
I mean, obviously what they should've done is had three difficulty tiers, but unfortunately they're still understaffed/server limitations/PS3 limitations/please understand etc.
Most people don't even know what A4S IS. I think it's a little early to go full doom and gloom about the next raid tier.
It's not just the difficulty though, it's the fight design itself. Everything they seem to be saying seems to be that a fight that functions like A3S may not have a place in Midas which is rather unfortunate.
They may not but that doesn't change things? People seem to want a fight that gear directly correlates to the level of execution needed for the mechanics. A4S is balanced pretty closely on Discoid / Carnage / Carnage Zero being lethal off a second hit. Removing that and most the damage out pressure is removed.
Twintania.
They tuned a certain ability too hard (twisters) which blocked everybody for months until a group beat it and released a video. The weapons she dropped at the time were i90, and Square-Enix also released relics which could be upgraded to i90.
They responded with a nerf to that ability bumping the weapons to i95.
Well, no, preserving the specialness of the raid weapon is how we ended up where we did. Essentially they wanted to keep i210 special, which apparently meant keeping relic down and keeping gobdip locked away. At first I thought "why not just bump raid weapon to i215 in 3.1?" but the obvious answer is they didn't want to bump tome weapons too, and bumping just Gordian would have pissed off anyone whose dipped Eso weapon was BiS.
Personally, I don't care about making the raid weapons special. I don't. By the time you get the weapon, you've already beat the game. I'd rather they opened max iLevel to people sooner than obsess over protecting the pride of people who think their iLevel validates them.
showing off the mount is way more satisfying.
This is part of my worry, though. People treat A3S as the horrible raid-destroying boogeyman, when it's one of the best fights in the game that people just weren't prepared for in advance. I'd be fine with that fight, tuned like that, as a final fight. But we're going to get an overcorrection specifically to address the A3S complaints, and a lower-tuned A4S seems like more or less the answer to A3S beefs.
EndcatOmega
Unconfirmed Member
My favourite FFXIV fight is Mimiron.
Pro strats, complaining like it's 2013.
Or is this supposed to be some weird parallel about how there is a relic in the game that is ilvl 210? Cause that's not the same scenario, like at all. It's been how long since A4S released?
Twintania was bugged. That is not the same.
Because it's a fight similar to T13 except with more positional requirements to be planned around. The fun in A3S was spending time drawing up diagrams and figuring out how to place people to deal with mechanics without the need of RNG specifics. Every case handled and minimal moving parts. It was like solving a puzzle.
The only thing it's missing is the spectacle to it like T13 had. Otherwise I think the mechanics in it and overall pacing of the fight is really good.
Your link is down, but it might be the same guy I encountered. Blasted the entire alliances healing and the other healer on my team and claimed we got the win because he switched to healer. Rolled my eyes when I saw I had top heals.
Still sounds like a shitty fate rush over a drab orange sky.
Not really applicable. At the time most players weren't even ready to start Coil until after the world first groups already cleared. Even a lot of very long time players I know are surprised that the T5 weapons were originally i90, because they didn't even see T5 until after the bump already occurred.
In this case, most players interested in raiding were ready to raid from day one, and their insistence on limiting the weapon ilvls to 210 prevented them from doing things like, introducing the relic earlier, putting the Eso weapon upgrade on A3S, etc etc etc. Then you have Diadem which further de-incentivized clearing Savage turns.