So break it down for me, what would you do differently? I'd love to not make the same mistakes others do. Are you saying you'd max your gains and then deload and restart several times, or you'd move on to more advanced SS routines?
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Fitness |OT5| Intermittent Farting, Wrist Curls and Hammer Strength Machine Spotters
- Thread starter MjFrancis
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So break it down for me, what would you do differently? I'd love to not make the same mistakes others do. Are you saying you'd max your gains and then deload and restart several times, or you'd move on to more advanced SS routines?
Great thanks. Last question...before I go. I'm going to be doing HIIT on off days lifting, trying to lose body fat. Will the combo of strength training + HIIT be good for this? I've heard a lot about bulking/cutting and how trying to do both at once is a waste of time. But that is basically what I am trying to do with this. Keep/add muscle while getting rid of fat...
Thanks for all the advice. In general this stuff is a little overwhelming. So many people saying this works or that works. I think I will switch to a more beginner friendly routine such as the GSLP.
My legs are still sore as hell from leg day. I biked in to work today because its easier to bike all the way than to walk to the bus and from the bus to my office...
My legs are still sore as hell from leg day. I biked in to work today because its easier to bike all the way than to walk to the bus and from the bus to my office...
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Just remember the beginner routines may sound like a lot LESS than you expected, but it's important to build up instead of hit a wall immediately.
Efficiency is a priority for beginners, and you can get a LOT accomplished in very little time.
Efficiency is a priority for beginners, and you can get a LOT accomplished in very little time.
ReadingRambo
Member
I've had basically the same question before. It's a bad idea generally, especially if you are just starting out. Adding a couple of HIIT sessions after a few months should be ok, but something has to give somewhere, be it in your diet or in your progress.
Let go of the dream of gaining muscle while you lose fat unless you are prepared to stick a needle in yo butt. Shoot for maintaining what muscle you have while slowly trimming fat and even that is difficult. Good luck!
I'm an example of someone that laughed at the beginner programs back in the day because it didn't seem like enough. I thought it was ridiculous. But I did it.
It works guys.
Once you get advanced enough and get enough gains, you can start adding in more high volume isolation stuff. 5/3/1 is perfect imo in combination with that.
It works guys.
Once you get advanced enough and get enough gains, you can start adding in more high volume isolation stuff. 5/3/1 is perfect imo in combination with that.
Unless noob this is totally correct. If you never lifted before it is possible though.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Yeah, I got too antsy cutting weight and while I should continue cutting for 3 months, I got way too antsy and I'm on the Alienshogun plan now. I want gains, and I don't mind if I gain a bit of tub.
It doesn't sound like a good use of your time. PATIENCE!
Is there a moment where it becomes obvious a trainee has outgrown SS? When all the lifts stall around the same time?
Some people talk about doing SS for 2-3 months, Rippetoe seems to say that the ideal is closer to one year. Or is it a conscious decision at some point that one is bored with the program?
I say do it.
Everyone is different and your body will tell you if it's too much. If you have the mental willingness to do the extra work, capitalize on that. This eagerness isn't always going to be there.
You should definitely be able to do it for more than 2-3 months.
I did it a little different so I'm not sure how others work it.
I started with 5x5 and once I had to reset 3 times for a lift, I switched to 3x5 for that lift then once I reset 3 times on that I switched to 5/3/1.
You don't want to switch to 5/3/1 or something similar until you really have to because once you do, progress will be very slow.
So I can't cut bf while doing this program? I would probably rather cut and lose bf before trying to gain muscle then. I'm at 21% bf and I don't want a gut for the summer...
ReadingRambo
Member
No offense, but at 21% you're gonna have a gut this summer. I'm right there with ya.
This. As I said on the last page, I totally regret dropping my beginner program too soon. I absolutely could have squeezed out at least a few more months of steady progress, and instead switched to 5/3/1 and am behind where I likely could be.
It's a marathon, don't ever forget that.
Might be able to lose the "gut", but he won't have a washboard.
None taking haha but I want to work on it I mean
ReadingRambo
Member
Yeah I guess if his goal is "get as thin as possible" he could do that. Just start smoking and drink 12 cups of coffee and eat a handful of grapes and a can of tuna a day. You'll get there in no time.
Yeah big difference between a big fat guy and a big muscled guy with some fat.
ReadingRambo
Member
I've met the same dilemma. I want to lose a lot of BF too. I am slowly coming around to the fact that in the end, if I do SS and keep to my diet, I'll lose the fat eventually, but I'll be 3-4 times stronger than I was when I started. I could just go do a BeachBody program and do lung burners for an hour a day all week, but afterwards I'll still be pretty weak.
You trying to say bulking more is best option? Gain muscle under fat before I cut? Couldn't I get thin (cut) then go for muscle. Same thing no?
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
I started out going thinner then muscle, but it gets boring. I want to move mountains.
Do you lift currently? Have you lifted in the recent past?
If the answer is no then you can cut with it. I weighed 310 and was like 40% fat. I cut from 310 to 229 on that program. I gained a lot of muscle and strength.
so even though I lost 90 lbs, I actually lot more than that in fat because I know I gained 20-30 lbs in muscle. I didn't even lose scale weight for 2 months straight but my waist went down.
ReadingRambo
Member
If you are new (as I am), you're going to see body re-composition on any lifting program pretty much. The ones in the OP are the best for new folks from an efficiency perspective. We will see gains while dropping some fat. For experienced folks, that's not typical and that's when they begin the whole "bulking/cutting" ride. I'm going to enjoy it while it lasts.
shittiest gym day of the year today, maybe in my top 3 worst ever. I did 7 hours of driving yesterday, then had deadlifts this morning. Apparently my back was still tired from the driving because I got a back spasm halfway through my workout. Did some light work after that then left the gym dejected. I also ripped a huge fart at the start of one of my deadlift sets right next to a group of chicks who were talking.
Truly a day for the ages.
Truly a day for the ages.
I'm new to this program but I've been doing my personal trainer (free at my work)'s program and never got great results. So I've been lifting 3 days a week or so for a few months now, in which I've gained some muscle (chest looks bigger) but also gained a lot of fat (overeating to bulk/poor diet?).
ReadingRambo
Member
I'm sorry I lol'd. I'm so mature.
ReadingRambo
Member
Trainers suck ass in my experience. Do SS with me, bro.
I'm starting to feel a pain in my lower back, but this is from an injury that's over a decade old.
Maybe we should try Ashiatsu massage?
That looks super comfortable. Unfortunately around here I don't think I would get a thin attractive asian woman I'd probably get a 250 pounder with toe fungus on my back
I could feel it but didn't think it would actually happen. Low and behold on that first rep I cropdusted half the gym.
I don't understand the smoking and coffee outlook.
Smoking for?
Coffee so you shit your brains out?
Then you will probably recomp while you do SS. Provided you are eating right.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
My upper body is so pumped right now it's ridiculous. I feel like it's made of granite. Fucking sick.
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Envy envy envy envy envy
I'll get there. You and Szu both inspire me to a huge degree.
Go destroy that fancy dinner.
While I wouldn't touch a cigarette again (smoked for five years) nicotine is pretty fucking cool when used in moderation.
http://examine.com/supplements/Nicotine/
Also note the coffee, cigarettes and (sometimes added) cocaine diet is not recommended except in jest.
You can do whatever you want. If you get thin and wait to bulk after you are satisfied with your fat percentage you will eventually put some of that fat back on while eating a calorie surplus and working on muscle growth. This is why I would recommend a modest calorie surplus and try to bulk before you decide to go on a cut. Of course if getting your gut down is priority number one then go for it! There are many different paths to achieve your goal and you will get there as long as you're patient and dedicated!
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
NOPE
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
I'm not huge, yet.
Oh, I'm gonna. Got dat golf shirt ready.
Here's what I did. (don't usually include warm up sets, but I felt like it this time so people could see I don't just DIVE into the kroc rows).
Pull-Up:
15 reps (+162 pts)
15 reps (+162 pts)
15 reps (+162 pts)
15 reps (+162 pts)
Standing Military Press:
135 lb x 5 reps (+99 pts)
160 lb x 5 reps (+117 pts)
180 lb x 9 reps (+155 pts)
5s week
Close-Grip Barbell Bench Press:
225 lb x 8 reps (+137 pts)
225 lb x 8 reps (+137 pts)
225 lb x 8 reps (+137 pts)
225 lb x 8 reps (+137 pts)
225 lb x 8 reps (+137 pts)
superset with facepulls
One-Arm Dumbbell Row:
110 lb x 10 reps (+62 pts)
115 lb x 10 reps (+64 pts)
120 lb x 10 reps (+66 pts)
Warm ups for krocs
Kroc Rows:
130 lb x 20 reps (+71 pts)
Lying Close-Grip Barbell Triceps Extension Behind The Head:
100 lb x 10 reps (+15 pts)
100 lb x 7 reps (+14 pts)
100 lb x 6 reps (+13 pts)
100 lb x 5 reps (+13 pts)
Tris were fried. Superset with incline curls
but are you being reasonable? what did you want to see in a couple of months? you say your chest looks bigger, that's it. Are you perhaps expecting too much in too little time?
I personally prefer to focus on getting stronger every week and throughout the months, not so much on aesthetics. If I wait until I have that awesome chest like many other guys in the gym and elsewhere I'll just get frustrated.
be careful with that overeating/bulking but besides that, follow the program of your choice and focus on strength, would be my advice.
Never quit, never surrender!!!
I've been doing SS for two months now and I'm slowing down considerably on my Bench and was thinking of going 5/3/1 However, after reading the last page of posts, I might wait a little. It gets frustrating when it's your fourth time trying a weight and you still do bad and can't progress. Plus, I feel fatter than ever.
HisshouBuraiKen
Member
Deload 10% and work your way back up, you'll probably break through the plateau easily.
Are you micro loading the bench? After a certain point the only way to keep doing a linear progression on bench and OHP is by micro loading (ie, adding 2.5lb per workout)
Also: you are supposed to deload a lift by 10% after failing to do all your reps 3 workouts in a row.
Generally doing SS while trying to lose weight at the same time is a recipe for failure.
However you might want to try paleo for a while to see if that helps you drop body fat a bit.
The rule of thumb is that you do SS until you have to reset each lift 3 times. Some people can do SS for over a year and get to a 4 plate squat with it. Some people plateu much sooner. Generally once a lift has to be reset 3 times you take that lift and that lift only off the linear progression. So say you've reset your squat 3 times but the other lifts are still progressing. You could start 531 for squats only an keep doing SS for the other lifts.
Also, SS is a very tough program, mentally. So after a while you might want to switch to something less daunting because adding weight to the bar on squats 3 times a week is a real challenge.
I think that a good progression plan would be something like this:
SS
SS Advanced Novice (the middle of the week has light squats, or front squats done with light weights)
GSLP
5/3/1 or the Texas Method.
I've just been adding 10 lbs. after each time I've successfully done a weight of 3x5's. I'll do 175 Bench for 3x5 and the next workout I'll add 10 lbs. and go from there. I'm probably gonna end up de-loading next time and see how that goes. I was stuck on 175 for my Bench for 4 straight workouts but I broke through that. I've been having the same trouble with 185 and my workout yesterday for Bench was complete shit. Also, I'll usually resort to negatives once I start to get fatigued on Bench.
10lb is a lot on bench! No wonder why you keep stalling.
Deload 10% and use 5lb increments.
HIIT seems like a poor choice for cardio on SS to me. If anything, slow steady state cardio would be easier. You might be able to get away with HIIT in the first couple weeks, but when you're constantly pushing yourself after a couple months, I don't think your body could do HIIT without it affecting your lifts. For me, my lifts are hard enough as is, I don't need to make it worse on myself, so I walk about half an hour a day.
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