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Formula 1 2017 Season |OT| Japanese Horror Story - Sundays on Sky

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A

Aiii

So not worth it
dakun said:
If you're into live timing it's quite useful. Like other people said what you see on the TV is slightly delayed to the app, so to not get spoiled you have to pause timing on the app to sync it to your TV.

What i like about the app is that you get more and extended Radio messages between Teams and drivers. Also seeing all the sector times during the race and quali is really helpful to get an overall picture of what happens.
Click to expand...

The best part is the radio messages also play when the app is in the background, so you can just browse GAF and shitpost about drivers messing up and still get all the radio messages.
 
J

John_B

Member
2017 Australian Grand Prix report by Mark Huges
http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opinion/f1/2017-australian-grand-prix-report

Great stuff from this report. It also confirms that it was indeed both Mercedes and Red Bull that had to change their suspensions. Red Bull was really suffering from it.
The talk afterwards was about the track position Mercedes surrendered with Lewis Hamilton and how that had gifted Ferrari and Sebastian Vettel the victory. But given the opposing considerations, in the actual moment it was the correct decision. The real overwhelming truth that dwarfed all the minutiae was that on the day Ferrari had a faster car than Mercedes. It was Ferrari who had the pace to have pressured Mercedes into that awkward decision. They applied the strain and made them snap. Underestimating Ferrari's pace, the Mercedes race plan was for Hamilton to open out the gap that would allow them the luxury of pitting at their own convenience. In trying to do that he overworked his tyres – and the Ferrari stayed right with him the whole time. Wait too late to pit with fading tyres and they'd have been sitting ducks to a Ferrari undercut.
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Vettel had to get his elbows out for a couple of corners as he emerged from his stop just ahead of them, but once he'd established his position he was able to pull away as Verstappen remained in Hamilton's way for a further three laps. Game over. Mercedes for a time considered a switch to a two-stop, but that would have only worked if the degradation rates on Vettel's Ferrari had been significant – and they weren't. At this point Mercedes instructed Hamilton to turn down his engine and informed its other driver Valtteri Bottas that Hamilton had been instructed to do this (the implication being, ‘hold positions').
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A

Aiii

So not worth it
Stroll was a complete joke, as expected. The way he was driving, and throwing around his steering wheel, and flat spotting his tire right away, all just showed just how underprepared he is for Formula 1. Daddy should have bought him a GP2 seat and waited a couple of years, because he pretty much ruined his F1 career by buying him an F1 seat so soon "because if Max can do it, so can you, son!" Unless he shows massive improvements during the year, there is no way he'll ever be able to shake the reputation of being an underqualified pay driver.

If only Williams hadn't taken all that money, Giovinazzi would have been a pretty good rookie to put next to Massa.
 
J

Juicy Bob

Member
Aiii said:
Stroll was a complete joke, as expected. The way he was driving, and throwing around his steering wheel, and flat spotting his tire right away, all just showed just how underprepared he is for Formula 1. Daddy should have bought him a GP2 seat and waited a couple of years, because he pretty much ruined his F1 career by buying him an F1 seat so soon "because if Max can do it, so can you, son!" Unless he shows massive improvements during the year, there is no way he'll ever be able to shake the reputation of being an underqualified pay driver.

If only Williams hadn't taken all that money, Giovinazzi would have been a pretty good rookie to put next to Massa.
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As much as I want that to be the case, I still think it's much to early to write off Stroll.

He's got the money so he's not going anywhere for this year at and if he wasn't talented, he couldn't have won Euro F3 last year. So even if he sucks this year, there's still the potential for a 19-year-old Stroll with a year of experience behind him have the potential to be a decent F1 driver.

Now, if he does more crashing and doesn't show improvement and flashes of talent as the season goes on, then he will deserve all the criticism he's going to get. I don't like the kid for some of the stuff he was doing in 2015 and if he does that in F1 I will be right there to pile on him with you. But I still think it's too early to write him off just yet.

I think
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Juicy Bob said:
As much as I want that to be the case, I still think it's much to early to write off Stroll.

He's got the money so he's not going anywhere for this year at and if he wasn't talented, he couldn't have won Euro F3 last year. So even if he sucks this year, there's still the potential for a 19-year-old Stroll with a year of experience behind him have the potential to be a decent F1 driver.

Now, if he does more crashing and doesn't show improvement and flashes of talent as the season goes on, then he will deserve all the criticism he's going to get. I don't like the kid for some of the stuff he was doing in 2015 and if he does that in F1 I will be right there to pile on him with you. But I still think it's too early to write him off just yet.

I think
Click to expand...

When Max debuted there was this whole discussion about how F1 is not a learning school and that is what the lower classes are for. Now in that case, it was unjust, since Max learned pretty damn quick and had tremendous car control from day one. But there was certainly merit to the idea that you can't just step into F1 like that.

And Stroll is a prime example, he debuts in F1 and only then starts learning to properly drive an F1 car and compete with high level drivers. Contrast that to Giovinazzi, who has experience from GP2 and immediately is close to beating his teammate despite stepping into the car at FP3. And this is not a knock on the kid, it's not his fault, but F1 shouldn't be the place where you learn to race on F1 level. He should have taken a few years and competed with faster and better drivers. The point is that once you get a reputation, your F1 days are numbered, so taking it slowly would have been way better than rushing him to F1.
 
Spladam

Spladam

Member
John_B said:
2017 Australian Grand Prix report by Mark Huges
http://www.motorsportmagazine.com/opinion/f1/2017-australian-grand-prix-report

Great stuff from this report. It also confirms that it was indeed both Mercedes and Red Bull that had to change their suspensions. Red Bull was really suffering from it.
Click to expand...
That was a rather expert race analysis.
Spades said:
As "hardcore" F1 fans would you rather:

1) Races that can legitimately won by at least 4 different drivers

Or

2) Races that one team dominates but overtakes down the field are frequent?
Click to expand...

I think we'd all take 1.

As far as Stroll goes, it's too early to make a judgement call, it's a daunting task to step up into an F1 machine at that age and eat the pressure and perform, he might just not yet have his confidence. Was he prepared for this completely? No, he wasn't, but that still does not mean he cannot grow into the machine with some hours behind the wheel and some confidence. Yes, his dad bought him the seat, and I'm sure that's in the back of his mind all the time, his need to prove himself might be his greatest weakness/ adversary. We'll know within the next 3 GP's I think, but anything can happen at this point. All I know is I wish I was him.
 
D

DD

Member
Aiii said:
Stroll was a complete joke, as expected. The way he was driving, and throwing around his steering wheel, and flat spotting his tire right away, all just showed just how underprepared he is for Formula 1. Daddy should have bought him a GP2 seat and waited a couple of years, because he pretty much ruined his F1 career by buying him an F1 seat so soon "because if Max can do it, so can you, son!" Unless he shows massive improvements during the year, there is no way he'll ever be able to shake the reputation of being an underqualified pay driver.

If only Williams hadn't taken all that money, Giovinazzi would have been a pretty good rookie to put next to Massa.
Click to expand...

The problem with Stroll was that he crashed 4 times before the first race. That's surely a bad sign. But I don't think that going through GP2 would be of much help since his dad bought him a 2014 Williams F1 car and rented lots of F1 circuits around the globe so his son could learn in a much more advanced car than a GP2. In that sense, he is (or should be) much more prepared for F1 than Giovinazzi. But lets not forget that Lance got titles everywhere he went through. But maybe F1 is just too much for him. Guys like him (and many other) in these smaller series have the advantage of money, so they can have brand new tires every race on karts, the best mechanics and cars all the way up. But in F1 things are different. It's on another level compared to everything else. Motorsports is an expensive sport, so money counts a lot in these cases. I wonder how many good drivers don't get a chance because of that. Some guys (like Hamilton) are lucky, but most don't. Max is a 1 in a million case.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Driving around an empty track is entirely different from driving under pressure in qualifying or driving under pressure from other drivers during a race, though, which is what GP2 is about a whole lot more than getting used to the car.

Which is exactly why Giovinazzi was much more prepared than Stroll was.
 
Myoclonic Jerk

Myoclonic Jerk

Member
So I read on a Kimi fan insta account that he had engine and some other issues..

True/False?

DrM said:
5 overtakes in 2017 vs 37 overtakes in 2016
Click to expand...


I'd rather see 5 quality overtakes over tens of easy ones.. Having the right strategy and capitalising on opportunities now is going to be very interesting. Having a faster car doesn't warrant you cruising through the field anymore..

Not sure about everyone else, but I think I'll like it more even with less overtaking..

If you think of it, if last year's physics applied then Hamilton would've easily kept his lead and no one would've been talking about Ferrari's "speed"
 
M

mclem

Member
Vettel had to get his elbows out for a couple of corners as he emerged from his stop just ahead of them, but once he’d established his position he was able to pull away as Verstappen remained in Hamilton’s way for a further three laps. Game over. Mercedes for a time considered a switch to a two-stop, but that would have only worked if the degradation rates on Vettel’s Ferrari had been significant – and they weren’t. At this point Mercedes instructed Hamilton to turn down his engine and informed its other driver Valtteri Bottas that Hamilton had been instructed to do this (the implication being, ‘hold positions’).
Click to expand...

Interesting if Hamilton's apparent periodic loss-of-power problem was after the engine was turned down.
 
A

AndyD

aka andydumi
That was a pretty good race to start the season. Sad for Ricciardo, but good luck to all. It seems we will have 2-3 teams duking it out at the top, then a solid battle in the mid pack.
 
Z

Zaru

Member
China will be a more interesting proving ground for the new cars. The back straight will be a real test for DRS this year and some of the corners, particularly the eternally winding turn 1, will be impressive to watch with these cars.
 
B

brotkasten

Member
Zaru said:
China will be a more interesting proving ground for the new cars. The back straight will be a real test for DRS this year and some of the corners, particularly the eternally winding turn 1, will be impressive to watch with these cars.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm very excited for the race, because we should see the true potential of the cars by then and whether or not Ferrari is truly up to the task to challenge Mercedes. It's a shame that it's so far away.
 
J

Juicy Bob

Member
Aiii said:
When Max debuted there was this whole discussion about how F1 is not a learning school and that is what the lower classes are for. Now in that case, it was unjust, since Max learned pretty damn quick and had tremendous car control from day one. But there was certainly merit to the idea that you can't just step into F1 like that.

And Stroll is a prime example, he debuts in F1 and only then starts learning to properly drive an F1 car and compete with high level drivers. Contrast that to Giovinazzi, who has experience from GP2 and immediately is close to beating his teammate despite stepping into the car at FP3. And this is not a knock on the kid, it's not his fault, but F1 shouldn't be the place where you learn to race on F1 level. He should have taken a few years and competed with faster and better drivers. The point is that once you get a reputation, your F1 days are numbered, so taking it slowly would have been way better than rushing him to F1.
Click to expand...
Oh absolutely. I would much rather have seen him in Formula 2 first for sure - even if it had to be just a single season if they were insisting on getting him in the car ASAP.
 
D

DD

Member
Aiii said:
Driving around an empty track is entirely different from driving under pressure in qualifying or driving under pressure from other drivers during a race, though, which is what GP2 is about a whole lot more than getting used to the car.

Which is exactly why Giovinazzi was much more prepared than Stroll was.
Click to expand...

Sure, but he had that everywhere he went through. :3
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Zaru said:
China will be a more interesting proving ground for the new cars. The back straight will be a real test for DRS this year and some of the corners, particularly the eternally winding turn 1, will be impressive to watch with these cars.
Click to expand...

I think they'll extend the DRS areas to make them a bit longer a few races in this season. If you can't get as close you just need a bit extra to close the gap under DRS.
 
A

AndyD

aka andydumi
Mohonky said:
I said it earlier and I watched an interview with Toto later that pretty much confirmed it; they didnt understand the tyres. They expected others to pit earlier (particularly Verstappen). They knew Hamilton would be pulling up to him quick but expected him to pit before Hamilton got stuck up behind him which of course didnt happen.

Theres probably a bigger window between 'tyres are going to shit' and 'tyres have gone to shit' than they though coupled with a setup that was probably more aggressive on the tyres than the others (and certainly more than Ferrari which has been good on them for a few years now).

Lots of new regulations and design philosophies and it seems Merc caught themselves out today. Ferrari are definitely right on their heels and its been awhile since they've been pushed so they (and Hamilton) seemed to be in panic stations. Merc havent been great at strategy, even with a really dominant car they often managed to throw the drivers into poor positions which they've been able to claw back from with sheer pace but they wont have that luxury if Ferrari keep up current pace so they'll have to start getting their strategy right this year.
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It was interesting for sure. Hamilton even said in the pre-race interview that these new tyre compounds no longer have a cliff, but a slow slope and still let you push a few more laps if you have to. So they bet on Max pitting, but Max took advantage of the slope and pushed a few more laps. It's all strategy and sometimes you have to take that gamble.
 
F

FrankCanada97

Roughly the size of a baaaaaarge
Juicy Bob said:
Oh absolutely. I would much rather have seen him in Formula 2 first for sure - even if it had to be just a single season if they were insisting on getting him in the car ASAP.
Click to expand...

I don't know why there was such a rush to get him into F1 this year. He could have easily gotten into GP2 with the same team he had been in for years (Prema). Plus, because Prema wins every championship they enter, Stroll could've added GP2 champion to his palmarès.
 
B

brotkasten

Member
Spades said:
Are there any photos of any of Stroll's secret 2014 Williams tests?
Click to expand...

I think I found one.

0593dac137bea4d485a7989d07074905.jpg
Click to expand...
 
Z

Zaru

Member
How much money does Stroll bring?

All those repairs and missed points might cost them quite a few millions down the line.
 
A

Aiii

So not worth it
Zaru said:
How much money does Stroll bring?

All those repairs and missed points might cost them quite a few millions down the line.
Click to expand...

Unknown, but estimations are a fuckload and a half, roughly...

Also, there is the estimated 80m USD his dad spend to make him F3 champ and drive the old F1 car for a few months.
 
W

Wellington

BAAAALLLINNN'
Hello boys I am new to the sport. I watched a lot of the Australian race. Still trying to learn but I am very excited. Is there anything I should watch for that will help my understanding?

My friends and I have a trip booked to see a live race and I want to get into it before going out there so I'm going to be watching all of the races this season. Trying to figure out if I can also get to Austin for the US Grand Prix.
 
P

paskowitz

Member
Wellington said:
Hello boys I am new to the sport. I watched a lot of the Australian race. Still trying to learn but I am very excited. Is there anything I should watch for that will help my understanding?

My friends and I have a trip booked to see a live race and I want to get into it before going out there so I'm going to be watching all of the races this season. Trying to figure out if I can also get to Austin for the US Grand Prix.
Click to expand...

F1 is technically one class of racing but all the cars are NOT equal. If you split the field into three categories, top teams (Merc, Ferrari, RBR), mid field (Williams, Force India, etc) and back markers (McLaren, Sauber, etc) it becomes much more entertaining. Treat each like their own little sub race. Pick a team to root for from each level.

Second, if you are US based, Montreal is almost always terrific. Austin as well. I was at the 2011 Canadian GP and it was epic (Button went from last to first in torrential rain). Try to get a seat that is in a good overtaking area. This is something you may want to ask this thread depending on the track.

If you are watching on TV, try to finding a bootleg stream from the UK. Coverage is much better and there are no commercials during the race.

In terms of the racing... DRS and the hybrid engines are the big differences between other series. DRS is a little flap on the rear wing that reduces drag and increases straightline speed. During the race it can only be activated if you are within 1 second of the car in front AND WHEN you are in a specific part of the track, usually a straight. F1 is very aerodynamic dependant. Cars can't pass each other at will. This is why DRS exists. Pit strategy, tire wear, safety cars etc all play a big role as well. There are a lot of micro battles beyond just outright position.

For the drivers, Lewis Hamilton of Merc, Sebastian Vettel of Ferrari, and Fernando Alonso of McLaren are the three most talented drivers. The later is unfortunately on a shit team. This year is looking to be a Lewis vs Seb battle. With that said, it is entirely possible other drivers and even other teams put in a surprising performance. There is also usually a "punching bag driver" who is always shit or crashes a lot. In past years it has been Pastor Maldonado. This year it might be Lance Stroll. Expect humorous memes around this driver or any driver who does poorly.
 
Spladam

Spladam

Member
Wellington said:
Hello boys I am new to the sport. I watched a lot of the Australian race. Still trying to learn but I am very excited. Is there anything I should watch for that will help my understanding?

My friends and I have a trip booked to see a live race and I want to get into it before going out there so I'm going to be watching all of the races this season. Trying to figure out if I can also get to Austin for the US Grand Prix.
Click to expand...

There are also some cool documentaries that will get you up to speed on the history and lore of the sport, of which there is much. There is a 2013 documentary called 1: Life on the Limit that I highly recommend, which covers a great deal of the history and drama of Formula 1. Here's the trailer.
Also, you'll want to check out this podcast: Shift F1

Also, the doc Senna, about the legendary Ayrton Senna, is really good.
 
A

AndyD

aka andydumi
Do you guys think Bottas would have been allowed to pass Hamilton had he caught up and pushed it? Or would the team call it off?
 
D

Doikor

Member
Dan27 said:
I think the fact he was told not to catch up to him tells you enough.
Click to expand...

At that point Hamilton was told to go low power mode. He could have switched back if needed but why waste engine mileage by pushing it if you can just have both drive in a safe train.

The 4 engine limit and the fix on the parts stacking mean that if it's a close championship it very well might be decided by who took the least DNFs and penalties.

The teams are always going for the constructors championship and give fuck all about the drivers.
 
D

DBT85

Member
Wellington said:
Hello boys I am new to the sport. I watched a lot of the Australian race. Still trying to learn but I am very excited. Is there anything I should watch for that will help my understanding?

My friends and I have a trip booked to see a live race and I want to get into it before going out there so I'm going to be watching all of the races this season. Trying to figure out if I can also get to Austin for the US Grand Prix.
Click to expand...

If you want a bit of a history lesson about the safety (or lack of it) at least, watch Grand Prix The Killer Years documentary. Frankly advised viewing for anyone who's not seen it.
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x14el38_grand-prix-the-killer-years-documentary_auto

Also watching Senna and Rush would be cool. The first is a documentary about one driver, the other is a film about the title fight between Lauda and Hunt in 1976 which included Lauda being nearly burned to death, Hunt beating the shit out a reporter and two of my favourite lines from a film "ITS A FERRARI!!!" and "It's a shitbox!"


AndyD said:
Do you guys think Bottas would have been allowed to pass Hamilton had he caught up and pushed it? Or would the team call it off?
Click to expand...

I'm sure he'd have been allowed, however, Hamilton would have turned his engine back up and they'd have both just finished where they were as they weren't likely to catch Vettel.

With only 4 engines per driver and the new engines full reliability still not being that well known, it's got to be better in the shirt term to just wind it down and cruise home.
 
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