FrankCanada97
Roughly the size of a baaaaaarge
So how many more races does Stroll have to complete before he loses his "crasher" stigma?
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Formula 1 2017 Season |OT| Japanese Horror Story - Sundays on Sky
- Thread starter Ark
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The only convincing can be done on track, with a decent and reliable engine
xrnzaaas
Member
They'd switch Verstappen again before he got any chance.
Dutch Gronk
Banned
I bought the new F1 game (on PS4). Did the first race weekend in my shitbox Mclaren, getting overtaken by everybody even on that short straight is something else. Poor Alonso.
Yeah, I tried the McLaren for a bit. It's funny how fast you start saying "GP2 engine!".
scorcher59
Member
Oh I'm sorry I thought shitposting wasn't allowed?
It's Wax, he is either a troll, or delusional, or both. We keep him around as the thread's court jester.
JadedWriter
Member
Wax is nothing more than Honda's stand.
DHC-Shannow
Member
Iirc a poster called SenjitsuSage got gifted a free X Box one and a copy of Ryse for defending the game tirelessly against all comers, maybe Wax is hoping for a free Civic...
Him not crashing any more is good to see. But he still doesn't drive very well. When he was chasing Ocon you could see he was braking way earlier into turn 1 for no good reason other than lack of confidence, and it was the same in Baku.
I don't know if it's partly a physical thing from being so young, but it's really noticeable in the onboards.
His effort would be worthy of Senna's NSX.
Fox Mulder
Member
I'm glad they made mclaren and Honda fucking suck for people that want that challenge. I hopped in Toro Rosso instead and it's still hard to meet their goals. Already lost a gearbox in Russia as well.
That sounds exactly like what Senjitsu would do.
Jezbollah
Member
The McLaren car is one of the better ones in the game. It's just that the engine is utter dogshit, and by a distance.
Speaking of which, Barrichello had the chance to drive it some time ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=izX5BEvz1wk
I picked up on that too. He was close enough to overtake, but didn't continue drafting and take the chance.
I kinda get it tho when you're in a good position and don't wanna crash and ruin it.
xrnzaaas
Member
So it's a pretty realistic game then?
Deaf Spacker
Memb
Is there an announcement today in regards to McLaren's engine supplier?
Norwegian Rudo
Member
DS Virgin are announcing their driver lineup today and rumour is both Bird and Lopez are out, with Alex Lynn taking one of the seats. Bird is expected to move to Jaguar.
http://ltmsport.com/bird-lopez-not-feature-ds-virgin-lineup/
Hopefully Jaguar has a competitive car as Bird and Mitch Evans is a strong driver pairing.
http://ltmsport.com/bird-lopez-not-feature-ds-virgin-lineup/
Hopefully Jaguar has a competitive car as Bird and Mitch Evans is a strong driver pairing.
It should be sometime this week but I'm not sure if it's today.
Adam Scott Aukerman
Member
Last I heard on Sunday was that Sunday was the official deadline, but it could be shifted to the end of Monday if absolutely need be.
I would imagine whenever a deal is officially made, the official announcement will come days or weeks later. It will leak in seconds though, too many people need to know the answer asap to keep it secret.
Apparently the deal is done but is being delayed because F1 management had to pull some strings. Rumors around many media say everyone is getting something out of this to make this deal happen and that's why they are taking a lot of time to announce it. Also they are trying to engineer a PR way to make it seem like Honda won too.
What it seems clear from last weekend paddock is that F1 management would veto any deal that would force Honda out of F1 (unless they wanted to leave, which they don't) and Red Bull would veto any Renault engine deal with McLaren unless they would get a compensation too.
Result:
- McLaren gets Renault engines
- Honda gets to supply Toro Rosso
- RBR gets Honda money directly and also a exclusivity clause for Honda engines that can be activated until 2021 even if Honda has other non-Red Bull teams under contract. i.e. Honda signs a deal for 2019-2021 with Sauber, if the engine starts being good, RBR has the option to make Honda an exclusive engine manufacturer for them until 2021 and Honda has to pay to get out of the Sauber deal.
- Some rumors yesterday said Renault gets Carlos Sainz as a compensation for supplying a direct competitor.
- Those same rumors say that Red Bull would get free Renault engines in 2018 in return for releasing Sainz and not vetoing the deal
JadedWriter
Member
So I get Sainz and Hulkenberg next year? Excellent.
Shame about Kubica though...
I seriously hope the Sainz rumor isn't true but Helmut Marko even gave an interview yesterday saying he can't rule out Sainz leaving anymore. Which is completely the opposite of what they said 2 months ago.
There is a rumor going around about Williams being interested in Kubica if they can't sign Alonso. But I'm not convinced it isn't just a guessing game after Kubica said this weekend there were multiple teams interested in him.
JadedWriter
Member
Yeah I do feel sorry for him. Would've been a dream story and a PR boon for F1, sounds like it wasn't in the cards. I'm just happy knowing he can still use that hand.
brotkasten
Member
Can you provide links to those rumors?
Sounds a lot like what I was expecting from all this, as no one is going to want to look like a fool to the press from this debacle. Also, I'll echo that comment about Kubica as it was reported that there was interest in more than one team from the F1 about him, so that talk of him going to Williams isn't that far of a stretch.
I can't link the tweets I've seen since last weekend because my timeline only allows me to see the last 15 hours apparently and I can't remember exactly who posted what. Some were spanish media (Sainz rumors), some were british and german media (red bull part of the deal). But here are some links I've seen today about the subject on my browser history:
http://grandepremio.uol.com.br/f1/n...nao-me-surpreenderia-ao-ve-lo-em-outra-equipe
http://www.marca.com/motor/formula1/gp-italia/2017/09/02/59aae26046163f38368b45ca.html
http://www.crash.net/f1/news/881715/1/horner-toro-rossohonda-deal-would-give-red-bull-an-option
https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/l...la-williams-offre-una-chance-a-kubica-949591/
Fox Mulder
Member
I expect Redbull to make out like bandits. They're sacrificing Toro Rosso to keep Honda in the sport and Mclaren would be a direct threat for them with a better engine.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/brawn-grid-penalties-talks-fia-949839/
Good, Boulliers suggestion is the right way to go.
I don't think it is, at all. For the big teams that's no penalty at all and for the small teams it could force them out of the sport.
Points penalties may work, but I don't think there's much wrong with what we have now. Provides overtaking and good racing.
Yes it's a bit complex but so what.
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
The idea was financial penalties that are a percentage of their annual expenditures, or position on the grid.
It has to at least be points. WDC or WCC or both.
The system was designed to stop the big boys spending their way out of trouble, so making it fines defeats that purpose.
What the fuck do Ferrari care about $5M, $50M or $500M fines if it means they can slap a new motor in the back after every session and waltz to victory at every GP.
You think they wouldn't be willing to pay a fine that would bankrupt any other team on the grid if it meant they got a 1-2 at Monza?
Jezbollah
Member
I think penalties (be it financial or constructors championship points) should be scaled depending on the previous year's position in the constructors standings. That way the smaller teams get less of a penalty (the expectation being they wont be as competitive) and the bigger teams larger.
I think the strength of the penalty (grid positions or whatever) should simply be inversely proportional to your WDC standings at the time or from last season.
That way, wealthy teams with a lot of points and high reliability (Mercedes, Ferrari) would still be afraid of passing the parts limit and they'd make reliable engines from which their customers profit. At the same time, a struggling team like McLaren would, regardless of their budget, not have to be glued to the back, same for all the Renault-powered teams.
There's no way to abuse this if you're a top team contending for championships, and a team in bad form (performance or financially) wouldn't get stomped on even further.
Not sure why the mid-field inbetween would have reason to complain then.
(Was typing this before Dan was done)
That way, wealthy teams with a lot of points and high reliability (Mercedes, Ferrari) would still be afraid of passing the parts limit and they'd make reliable engines from which their customers profit. At the same time, a struggling team like McLaren would, regardless of their budget, not have to be glued to the back, same for all the Renault-powered teams.
There's no way to abuse this if you're a top team contending for championships, and a team in bad form (performance or financially) wouldn't get stomped on even further.
Not sure why the mid-field inbetween would have reason to complain then.
(Was typing this before Dan was done)
Make it a financial penalty + WCC points penalty.
The penalties should increase everytime a new part has to be replaced. Let's say it costs 10K + 1pt for the 1st part, the 2nd should be 20K + 2pts, 3rd should be 40K + 4pts, etc. This way repeat offenders start getting heavy penalties after 10 or 15 parts being replaced while not penalizing smaller teams with lower budgets. This would also stop teams accumulate parts in the same weekend while getting 75 grid penalties and 2 new engines to use the rest of the year.
Also the financial penalties should be put into a pot that is split between the 5 teams that replace less part during the season. This way even if Ferrari or Mercedes abuse the system, they end up financing all the lower tier teams. Maybe it can help close the gap.
The penalties should increase everytime a new part has to be replaced. Let's say it costs 10K + 1pt for the 1st part, the 2nd should be 20K + 2pts, 3rd should be 40K + 4pts, etc. This way repeat offenders start getting heavy penalties after 10 or 15 parts being replaced while not penalizing smaller teams with lower budgets. This would also stop teams accumulate parts in the same weekend while getting 75 grid penalties and 2 new engines to use the rest of the year.
Also the financial penalties should be put into a pot that is split between the 5 teams that replace less part during the season. This way even if Ferrari or Mercedes abuse the system, they end up financing all the lower tier teams. Maybe it can help close the gap.
Norwegian Rudo
Member
WCC doesn't work. Of the big teams that could afford to massively cheat the system Mercedes is basically the only ones that care about constructor titles.
If the penalties this season were financial and WCC points Vettel would have a brand new engine every race, guaranteed.
adamantypants
Member
Yeah if they're gonna start financial penalties, why even have the penalties to begin with? Just give them more engines if you're gonna fine them. The whole purpose was to reduce cost but fining them increases cost (effectively), no?
While Boullier didn't specify who'd be on the receiving end, I personally doubt he -- as McLaren's team manager -- would come out in favor of financial penalties on McLaren. So, like I've said before earlier in the year, it makes more sense to me to penalize the engine manufacturers than the teams itself. Ferrari, Renault and Mercedes are obviously both but when the Renault engine in a Red Bull or Toro Rosso fails prematurely, it's more likely the fault of Renault, not RB or TR.
That's going to require checks and regulations to make sure Red Bull doesn't falsely claim the engine failed after two races just to get a brand-new one, for instance, but I don't see this as a huge obstacle when everything else is already hyper-regulated in F1.
As for WCC penalties, I don't particularly mind them but trying to work out a formula that scales based on last year's performance seems ... kind of difficult to get right? It's not an exact science. Plus given F1's drive to make the series easier for viewers to follow it may also be counter-productive in that regard.
That's going to require checks and regulations to make sure Red Bull doesn't falsely claim the engine failed after two races just to get a brand-new one, for instance, but I don't see this as a huge obstacle when everything else is already hyper-regulated in F1.
As for WCC penalties, I don't particularly mind them but trying to work out a formula that scales based on last year's performance seems ... kind of difficult to get right? It's not an exact science. Plus given F1's drive to make the series easier for viewers to follow it may also be counter-productive in that regard.
The entire foundation of the current system came from a desire to control costs in F1 and make it more affordable for lower end teams to compete
I think they have done plenty to convince them
to switch engines
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
I'm ok with the deduction of WDC points as well as WCC points, because the driver could potentially get a benefit.
Maybe for the first of any component over and above the annual allotment there's a WCC penalty, but any more are WCC and WDC penalties.
Maybe for the first of any component over and above the annual allotment there's a WCC penalty, but any more are WCC and WDC penalties.
nekkid
It doesn't matter who we are, what matters is our plan.
Not at all. One affects the championship, the other affects the championship AND the racing.
There has to be something in there, because failures can occur, but equally a team could swap an engine to benefit a driver unnecessarily.
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