Psychotext
Member
Those Sim HQ ( http://www.simhq.com/_commentary/all_090d.html ) impressions were encouraging.
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Forza Motorsport 3 - October 2009 release (ignore the OP at your peril)
- Thread starter DuckRacer
- Start date
eso76
Member
i don't mind the MS wheel, granted i never properly tested the fanatec or the logitech, but i just turned it on again for a lap of fm2 and, shock and horror, up and down directional keys and A button are not working. The hell ? also i think a couple other keys are swapped (like, i have to hit back instead of B and start instead of A at times). The hell happened here ? : \
Fanatec at 189$ sounds good enough, though, i might bite. but i guess it's the stickshiftless version, or missing the clutch...can't access their website for some reason right now
Also. Could you guys PLEASE give us the ability to browse menus/use livery editor/use photo mode etc using a pad connected to port 2 when a wheel is connected to port one ? it's quite annoying having to switch the wheel off each time i want to do one of those things and on again.
EDIT: now that i think of it...the problem with my wheel might be MS replaced my x360 and i didn't reinstall the drivers in the bundled pgr3 disc since ? do drivers only come with that bundled version of pgr3 ?
Fanatec at 189$ sounds good enough, though, i might bite. but i guess it's the stickshiftless version, or missing the clutch...can't access their website for some reason right now
Also. Could you guys PLEASE give us the ability to browse menus/use livery editor/use photo mode etc using a pad connected to port 2 when a wheel is connected to port one ? it's quite annoying having to switch the wheel off each time i want to do one of those things and on again.
EDIT: now that i think of it...the problem with my wheel might be MS replaced my x360 and i didn't reinstall the drivers in the bundled pgr3 disc since ? do drivers only come with that bundled version of pgr3 ?
eso76 said:
Thanks! So the game is basically done. That's awesome to hear. Plenty of time for optimization, tweaks, lighting enchancements, testing, etc. With so much time for optimization hopefully 60fps cockpit view is a guaranteed thing.
New screens!
http://360racing.nl/forum/viewtopic.php?t=648&f=47
Future PhaZe
Member
Going with the original racing wheel >_>
I need more night tracks!!!
I need more night tracks!!!
Randy Lanzarote
Member
It's kind of annoying that we know loads of games had playable demos at E3, but its going to be months before we get our greasy mitts on them 
Start the hype train now MS, I promise I won't get bored of the game before its release!!
Start the hype train now MS, I promise I won't get bored of the game before its release!!
WHOAguitarninja
Member
Is that parallax mapping? It sure looks like it. Either that or actual geometry at the road edge. Man they went all out.
Spaceman Spiff
Member
RSTEIN said:
Simply fantastic.
Even considering these are photomode shots, if you were to compare them to similar shots of FM2, it would be blatantly obvious just how immense the leap in graphics quality over FM2 is, especially the car models. It's really quite astonishing.
Looking at some of these, it seems they're still using the old driver model from FM2, which frankly looks out of place considering the quality of the cars-- maybe that's why some still shots have no driver in the car! It's no big deal, though, as FM2 in turn used an old model until near the end of development. I'm sure the same will be true here.
Spider_Jerusalem
Member
WHOAguitarninja said:
They confirmed they're using normal mapping on the road surface. It's on the gamtrailers footage where they talk about the graphics techniques used.
WHOAguitarninja
Member
Spider_Jerusalem said:
Well that is not just normal mapping there where I am talking about, as the rumble strip seems to get higher a few cm from the road and normal mapping doesn't effect perspective. It is either raised using geometry, or that's a parallax map.
Holy crap at the road
. Amazing texture work.Going to try and cap some comparison shots with Forza 2.
Spider_Jerusalem
Member
WHOAguitarninja said:
Maybe the guy talking didn't exactly know the name, 'cause he first said "we're using bump mapping", and then "normal mapping", referring to the road surface. Maybe he wanted to say normal mapping... who knows. However it's surely gorgeous and incredible looking!
Randy Lanzarote
Member
Some great shots, personally I'm still waiting for some direct-feed gameplay screens. At this point its obvious FM3 >>>> FM2 in the visual stakes, I'd just like to see how far they've come without photo mode being involved.
4 months...... seems like an age away
4 months...... seems like an age away
WHOAguitarninja
Member
Comparison pics (more to come). This is as close as I could get it without knowing the tracks and spending a huge amount of time on the angles.
For the second photo there is really nothing in F2 that even compares in terms of draw distance, so I tried to match the lighting and angle as well as I could.
[/IMG]
For the second photo there is really nothing in F2 that even compares in terms of draw distance, so I tried to match the lighting and angle as well as I could.
awesome shots!
so, we have talked wheels, what about seat arrangements? years ago, i had built my own from home depot steel pipes, but the rigidity was lacking, it was heavy as hell, no racing seat, and not easy to store. i'd like to get a dedicated racing seat and frame for F3, what are the best choices?
the playseat evolution looks nice and sturdy.
so, we have talked wheels, what about seat arrangements? years ago, i had built my own from home depot steel pipes, but the rigidity was lacking, it was heavy as hell, no racing seat, and not easy to store. i'd like to get a dedicated racing seat and frame for F3, what are the best choices?
the playseat evolution looks nice and sturdy.
eso76
Member
Spider_Jerusalem said:
basically everyone mentioned bump and normal mapping being used, during interviews and presentations. In a couple of the latest interviews i've listened to they went as far as claiming they were using 'parallax mapping' and even explained how that was used ingame, which makes me think he wasn't just throwing techterms in the conversation to impress people : )
WHOAguitarninja said:
Uh, it appears that's exactly what the guy was talking about during the interview : )
parallax mapping though ? i would have thought actual geometry would be easier to handle in this case.
Makes more sense than normal mapping either way, which would be of no use anywhere except on cars.
eso76 said:9 minutes 1up interview with game producer and a funny guy i've never heard of called Che Chou.
Including lots of HD, apparently direct feed (or so it seems, i've only seen the low res youtube version) footage from car selection screen, ingame, replay...
http://gamevideos.1up.com/video/id/25061
Edit: not sure why when devs demo the game they ALWAYS stop right after the race starts and allow for cpu controlled cars to go ahead and spread on the track...hmmm...
i may be mistaken, but che says the "community at play" video was put together capturing real race footage and editing in software like premiere. pretty amazing if all that really was in game
Rad Agast said:The damage model in Forza 2 covered almost every thing except for the cosmetic stuff (which was there but not to the degree I expected it to be).
Engine, gearbox, tire wear, aerodynamics, brakes, etc... they were all possible to damage during a race. How you can call that cosmetic damage is beyond me. The physics might not stack up to the PC stuff but for a 2007 game it was beyond most of the stuff on consoles.
Regarding Forza 3 damage, it's natural to expect it to be improved on when compared to 2 but I still need a demo to check the tire deformation model. I doubt that they'll add the ability to blow the tires even though I think that would be sweet to have.
I'm hoping for tire blowing as well -- but I think at the very least we'll get an improvement on tire wear characteristics affecting handling.
I don't plan on spending much time in the wall, so I'd be happy if they can iterate on the collision physics of F2 and make a proper disincentive for cars bumping into one another to keep the online play semi-clean.
WHOAguitarninja
Member
There is pretty much no way those graphics were real time. The cars were reflected in their own cubemaps, which generally means it wasn't a cubemap at all but a raytrace. Which means it was not real time. I think the video was meant to give off the feel of what you can do with the editor, rather than actually being from the editor itself. They asked Dan on gamespot (i think it was gamespot) about it and he wouldn't say that the video was done with the editor, so I think you can draw your own conclusions from that.op_ivy said:
WHOAguitarninja
Member
duk said:
We'll have to wait until we have the actual game to judge that. The problem In Forza 2 was that there is no clear way to anti alias reflections. AA works on geometry edges, and so it hits the edge of the car, but misses reflections entirely. Photomode seems to be snapping a photo in super high res and then down sampling, which effectively anti-aliases everything on the scene. You can't really do this in real time though with this graphical complexity.There is wayyy less contrast in the reflections though, which should go a very long way towards alleviating the issue.
Diablohead
Member
One of the next things turn10 should look at is making flat spots on your wheels, those non abs races would really make you take care of your tires more.
op_ivy said:
If your not going to use a monitor mounted on it, the Obutto is a good entry for the price but not as sturdy as the more expensive stuff. The seat is adjustable though so that's a plus. Haven't tried one so all the info is from reviews really.
http://www.obutto.com/products.html
WHOAguitarninja said:
It's a pretty standard thing in a lot recent racers. The same thing happened with pgr4 when it came out, the intro movie was all realtime and no one believed it because of the reflections and the motion blur. I forget exactly which recent games, but I know I've seen it in other games than pgr4.
Besides, Che himself confirmed that the cars are indeed reflected in their own cubemaps earlier in this thread.
eso76
Member
TheKurgan said:
Part of the problem is Forza 2 uses the same amount of AA ingame and in photo mode (i believe it was still 2x for pics taken ingame and 4x if you took pics in car selection screen).
op_ivy said:
No, not the community at play video. Probably using all ingame assets for cars and scenery, but prerendered for sure. Now, that video starting with the Audi R8, then switching to Ford GT and Nissan Z, yeah, that's direct captures of actual ingame (well, replay) footage edited together.
Psychotext
Member
Great work WHOAguitarninja.
Randy Lanzarote
Member
Bit late but; that gamersyde off-screen footage is fecking awesome. Well done gamersyde, you really know what gamers want to see.
(A cookie to the first site to deliver direct-feed realtime gameplay pics!)
(A cookie to the first site to deliver direct-feed realtime gameplay pics!)
WHOAguitarninja said:
Actually Che said in one of the interviews that cars are in the reflections now. He specifically said it looks amazing when in hood cam view seeing the cars ahead of you reflected off the hood.
However, that "Community at Play" video is CG.
Here's confirmation on the forums:
http://forums.forzamotorsport.net/forums/post/2617531.aspx
Also, they've been dodging questions about that video like crazy. People keep asking them during interviews "wow that video was awesome" or whatever and Dan and Che bob and weave around the answer.
For example, Che was asked most recently during the 1up interview / demo about the video "with the acrobatics - who set that up, it was awesome!" and Che diverted the conversation to talk about the other two real-time videos, and the Project Blackjack guy who they hired to work on them.
I feel bad for them actually - it was probably marketing and management that decided to do that video and now they have to try to deal with it.
eso76 said:
absolutely, but that clearly isnt the video che is referencing. the "community at play" video, from che's mouth, was created using clips of the game edited together in premiere. i think i agree that their was some "magic" going on to render it with better effects (likely higher res, better reflections, etc) though.
ah, thanks. wtf che?
those have to be in game assets though. cant wait to see gameplay from those environments and others
op_ivy said:
You'll have to link me to where he says this, because for example in the IGN video he says that the Project Blackjack guy worked on the "B roll video" and edited it in premiere. What is the "B roll video" - I'm pretty sure he dodged the question. Besides, refer to my post above from the forzamotorsport.net forums moderator who says the Community At Play video is CG and "inspired by" Project Blackjack.
http://forums.forzamotorsport.net/forums/post/2617531.aspx