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[TheBaronOfNA]

god i hate people

they will never understand my animu

Is nice that my opinions are mocked because an Avatar.

 

[Deleted member 22576]

But if it does nothing for the game, why is it there?

.

 

[The Dear Leader]

I dunno, why there is a scene where Hiro explains a random hamburger abduction?

I don't know what this means.

 

[A Sentient Keyboard]

Apparently Jeff will be on today's gamespot show (the one Danny does).

http://www.gamespot.com/shows/the-lobby/

 

[OverBlood 3]

I don't know what this means.

He's saying there's an awful lot in this game that doesn't make sense/doesn't have any reason to be there.


Also let's not forget this is an M rated game. I find the violence/sadism to be infinitely more shocking than a bit of cleavage.

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

I don't know what this means.

Exactly that.

He's saying there's an awful lot in this game that doesn't make sense/doesn't have any reason to be there.

And this.

 

[Messofanego]

Funny reading that again after finally watching the QL since Vinny actually asked Brad to run through the menus. But hey, blame Brad anyway since its a thread rule it seems.

It's that Vinny bias. They can't ever see him doing anything they'd consider a bad thing, so they think it's Brad doing everything in their reconstructive memory. Giant Bomb: Memento edition.

 

[firehawk12]

I was wondering why you guys were freaking out and then I saw the Danganronpa review. lol

I appreciate that Patrick tries, but I dunno... maybe he shouldn't. It's like asking Jeremy Parish to review the next Call of Duty.

Edit: You know, I wonder if they would hate Persona 4: Golden. It actually adds way more anime-isms that are so tropey and cliche that I think if any of them would hate Danganronpa, they'd probably hate those too.

 

[mattp]

I was wondering why you guys were freaking out and then I saw the Danganronpa review. lol

I appreciate that Patrick tries, but I dunno... maybe he shouldn't. It's like asking Jeremy Parish to review the next Call of Duty.

Edit: You know, I wonder if they would hate Persona 4: Golden. It actually adds way more anime-isms that are so tropey and cliche that I think if any of them would hate Danganronpa, they'd probably hate those too.

...eyeroll

 

[Alfredo]

But if it does nothing for the game, why is it there?

It's just a dumb trope that Japanese games/anime have. They gotta put in their sexy anime girls. Persona has it. Why does there have to be a swimsuit competition? Even Ace Attorney has it. Why does everyone Mia possesses get large breasts?

Japan obviously treats sexuality different from other countries. I feel it's more of a cultural issue than anything else. (Conversely, they have an aversion to violence, which is the opposite here in America. They have to make the blood in Danganronpa pink. They have to remove the gruesome deaths from Resident Evil games. Stuff seems backwards over there.)

Even so, I don't really know if the "Hina in her underwear scene" is actually fan service (though the bath scene definitely is). I mean, yeah, she's in her underwear, but she's also crying, so I'm not sure why that's titillating.

All they needed to was show Hina was upset in her room to explain why she was out of her dorm after night time. She didn't HAVE to be in her underwear, but she just happens to be in her underwear. I don't really think it's that big of a deal, then again, I'm thinking about how I react to it rather than the hypothetical reactions of random people watching over my shoulder.

It's not even some Michael Bay-esque "OH SHIT, HER BUTT'S A ROBOT" scene. I wonder, do we feel weirder about it because it's a cartoon girl and not a real girl?

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

Edit: You know, I wonder if they would hate Persona 4: Golden. It actually adds way more anime-isms that are so tropey and cliche that I think if any of them would hate Danganronpa, they'd probably hate those too.

Being fair with Patrick, he didn't hate the game. Still, Danganronpa is pretty tame even compared with vanilla Persona 4

 

[firehawk12]

Golden adds a SECOND bathhouse "peeping" scene to go along with the first jokey one that's already in the game. They even animated it and made it a special cutscene.

Being fair with Patrick, he didn't hate the game. Still, Danganronpa is pretty tame even compared with vanilla Persona 4

I dunno, vanilla P4 has the same number of cliches, but much less fanservice than Danganronpa or P4G.

 

[Zaph]

Patrick, no offense, but that stuff is pretty tame compared of what people read in public view in my city (not exactly proud of that).

This is why people make fun of anime and its fans.

You guys get so desensitised/accustom to all the jiggling tits, panty shots and questionably young looking characters (and this is at the low end) that you become unable to understand why others might find it off-putting and problematic for the medium (especially when it's so unpredictable).

Even after years of mainstream acceptance, video games still carry a social stigma, most adults don't want to exacerbate this by playing a (otherwise enjoyable) game which might, at any moment, awkwardly shoehorn in fan service and live up to the creepy stereotypes.

All "anime is for jerks"/P4 jokes aside, we can probably agree that Giant Bomb isn't known for its extensive anime coverage and features a demographic with a much higher average age compared to most game sites (Jeff's stated so multiple times). Patrick quite obviously wrote his review with that in mind - a review for the wider audience - an audience who, like myself, might consider giving something different a try, but appreciates a fair warning of what to expect.

I'm sure there are hundreds of Danganronpa reviews from other niche, anime/visual novel-centric sites, written for a well-versed audience who do not have a need for such warnings. Maybe you should stick to them if a review written for the outside audience makes you react with such incredulity.

 

[Incandenza]

Guys guys, Alt+F1 is up!

 

[OverBlood 3]

This is why people make fun of anime and its fans.

You guys get so desensitised/accustom to all the jiggling tits, panty shots and questionably young looking characters (and this is at the low end) that you become unable to understand why others might find it off-putting and problematic for the medium (especially when it's so unpredictable).

Even after years of mainstream acceptance, video games still carry a social stigma, most adults don't want to exacerbate this by playing a (otherwise enjoyable) game which might, at any moment, awkwardly shoehorn in fan service and live up to the creepy stereotypes.

All "anime is for jerks"/P4 jokes aside, we can probably agree that Giant Bomb isn't known for its extensive anime coverage and features a demographic with a much higher average age compared to most game sites (Jeff's stated so multiple times). Patrick quite obviously wrote his review with that in mind - a review for the wider audience - an audience who, like myself, might consider giving something different a try, but appreciates a fair warning of what to expect.

I'm sure there are hundreds of Danganronpa reviews from other niche, anime/visual novel-centric sites, written for a well-versed audience who do not have a need for such warnings. Maybe you should stick to them if a review written for the outside audience makes you react with such incredulity

This game doesn't have any of that though. It's incredibly tame, I'd be much more embarrassed about reading FHM than playing this on the train.

 

[firehawk12]

All "anime is for jerks"/P4 jokes aside, we can probably agree that Giant Bomb isn't known for its extensive anime coverage and features a demographic with a much higher average age compared to most game sites (Jeff's stated so multiple times). Patrick quite obviously wrote his review with that in mind - a review for the wider audience - an audience who, like myself, might consider giving something different a try, but appreciates a fair warning of what to expect.

The thing with Japanese games is that I feel like there's no real audience to be served with reviews anymore. If you're already someone who hates anime or whatever, why would you ever be interested in a game like this outside of reading a review that confirms their biases.

I don't want to limit it to Japanese games though. I think the same goes for Sports games. The reason why the Jeff and Vinny QLs of the sports games are fun is because they don't like sports and sports games. They're not running Madden leagues with other game journalists and playing fantasy football, so they just try to break the game and shit on the rules/teams/players/etc. But a sports gamer would probably find their opinions infuriating.

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

This is why people make fun of anime and its fans.

Eh, I was referring that I live in Mexico City (in a country with pretty fucked up sexual and gender views in both sides of the spectrum ) than my circle of friends.

 

[A Sentient Keyboard]

Lol, one of the suggested names for Alt+F1 was 'The Irish Carbombcast'.

 

[funkystudent]

Maybe it was smarter then we think for Titanfall to be exclusive to one console over full multiplat.

If it wasnt for the Rha Rha Fonboy crowd on both sides arguing about it I dont think anyone would give a shit about that game.

 

[Chance Hale]

Edit: Ignore this.

 

[FStop7]

Apparently Jeff will be on today's gamespot show (the one Danny does).

http://www.gamespot.com/shows/the-lobby/

Jeff is this week's Star in a Reasonably Priced Car. He will be driving his Lexus around the Gamespot Test Track.

Maybe it was smarter then we think for Titanfall to be exclusive to one console over full multiplat.

If it wasnt for the Rha Rha Fonboy crowd on both sides arguing about it I dont think anyone would give a shit about that game.

If it weren't for fanboys you don't think anyone would give a shit about the first game the core Infinity Ward team members have created since Modern Warfare 2?

Really?

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

I dunno, vanilla P4 has the same number of cliches, but much less fanservice than Danganronpa or P4G.

Eh, I will say that are pretty heavy moments. But they are managed in a better way.

I don't want to limit it to Japanese games though. I think the same goes for Sports games. The reason why the Jeff and Vinny QLs of the sports games are fun is because they don't like sports and sports games. They're not running Madden leagues with other game journalists and playing fantasy football, so they just try to break the game and shit on the rules/teams/players/etc. But a sports gamer would probably find their opinions infuriating.

And neither Jeff or Vinny review sports games.

 

[SteveWinwood]

Is nice that my opinions are mocked because an Avatar.

I mean ultimately that's what this is about man, judging from a small amount of exposure. The two examples so far are first you're on a bus and someone glances over your shoulder and sees an anime chick in underwear with an outline of her labia right there, they're going to judge you. Maybe not in wherever you're from tacoland or whatever, but guess what in a majority of the world that's a fucking weird thing to sit on a bus in public looking at.

I don't remember what the second half of this post was going to be about.

 

[Alfredo]

This is why people make fun of anime and its fans.

You guys get so desensitised/accustom to all the jiggling tits, panty shots and questionably young looking characters (and this is at the low end) that you become unable to understand why others might find it off-putting and problematic for the medium (especially when it's so unpredictable).

Even after years of mainstream acceptance, video games still carry a social stigma, most adults don't want to exacerbate this by playing a (otherwise enjoyable) game which might, at any moment, awkwardly shoehorn in fan service and live up to the creepy stereotypes.

All "anime is for jerks"/P4 jokes aside, we can probably agree that Giant Bomb isn't known for its extensive anime coverage and features a demographic with a much higher average age compared to most game sites (Jeff's stated so multiple times). Patrick quite obviously wrote his review with that in mind - a review for the wider audience - an audience who, like myself, might consider giving something different a try, but appreciates a fair warning of what to expect.

I'm sure there are hundreds of Danganronpa reviews from other niche, anime/visual novel-centric sites, written for a well-versed audience who do not have a need for such warnings. Maybe you should stick to them if a review written for the outside audience makes you react with such incredulity.

Is the perviness what really turns people off, though? Here in America, it seems anime still gets that "cartoons are for kids" thing that turns adults off from watching anything animated ever. I mean, that recent Academy Awards drama about Frozen proves that that stigma is still in effect.

It feels like Japan is more "accepting" of this content because they take animation more seriously, while elsewhere, it's all for kids, so they wouldn't even be aware of all the pervy or "adult" content in them. And when it does become apparent that this stuff is in them, it's weird because they're cartoons.

If your only exposure to anime is through Giant Bomb, you're gonna think all anime is pervy anyway, lol. Giant Bomb Anime Coverage consists of stuff like GalGun, Otomedius Excellent, Deathsmiles, Hatsune Miku, Persona 4, and Dragon Ball. Even a game as innocent as Hatsune Miku gets dirtied up by the Giant Bomb crew, and it's hilarious.

 

[FStop7]

Is the perviness what really turns people off, though? Here in America, it seems anime still gets that "cartoons are for kids" thing that turns adults off from watching anything animated ever. I mean, that recent Academy Awards drama about Frozen proves that that stigma is still in effect.

It feels like Japan is more "accepting" of this content because they take animation more seriously, while elsewhere, it's all for kids, so they wouldn't even be aware of all the pervy or "adult" content in them. And when it does become apparent that this stuff is in them, it's weird because they're cartoons.

If your only exposure to anime is through Giant Bomb, you're gonna think all anime is pervy anyway, lol. Giant Bomb Anime Coverage consists of stuff like GalGun, Otomedius Excellent, Deathsmiles, Hatsune Miku, Persona 4, and Dragon Ball. Even a game as innocent as Hatsune Miku gets dirtied up by the Giant Bomb crew, and it's hilarious.

America loves perv movies. See: Porky's, The Hangover, American Pie, etc.

They just don't like the combination of animation and perviness, especially when the girls are drawn like they're children. It's fucking creepy. It is. Deal with it.

That said I still loved Persona 4 Golden, in spite of that cringeworthy shit.

 

[SteveWinwood]

America loves perv movies. See: Porky's, The Hangover, American Pie, etc.

They just don't like the combination of animation and perviness, especially when the girls are drawn like they're children. It's fucking creepy. It is. Deal with it.

That said I still loved Persona 4 Golden, in spite of that cringeworthy shit.

No one watches Porkys on the bus.

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

I mean ultimately that's what this is about man. The two examples so far are first you're on a bus and someone glances over your shoulder and sees an anime chick in underwear with an outline of her labia right there, they're going to judge you. Maybe not in wherever you're from tacoland or whatever, but guess what in a majority of the world that's a fucking weird thing to sit on a bus in public looking at.

I don't remember what the second half of this post was going to be about.

Don't get me wrong, is fucking weird even here... but public transport here is weird to 10x degree.

Just saying that Danganronpa bath house is not exactly pronographic and I don't expect that people in public transport has the same sensibilities and judgement of character as me.

 

[A Sentient Keyboard]

The thing with Japanese games is that I feel like there's no real audience to be served with reviews anymore. If you're already someone who hates anime or whatever, why would you ever be interested in a game like this outside of reading a review that confirms their biases.

Sorry if I'm misunderstanding you, but you make it sound like there's no middle ground between being okay with fanservicey stuff and 'hating anime'.

I myself don't watch a lot of anime but have enjoyed some here and there, and I have no problem with the general aesthetic. 999 is one of my favorite games of all time. Still, I don't like it when games/shows show characters in skimpy clothing/titilating poses for very thinly-veiled reasons. It breaks the fourth wall and does a disservice to some characters. So, I appreciate it when a review points out what I can expect from a game.

 

[FStop7]

No one watches Porkys on the bus.

The mental image of some nervous, sweaty dude watching Porky's on one of those little "portable" black and white TVs on a city bus in 2014 made me burst out laughing in the middle of my office.

 

[firehawk12]

I mean ultimately that's what this is about man. The two examples so far are first you're on a bus and someone glances over your shoulder and sees an anime chick in underwear with an outline of her labia right there, they're going to judge you. Maybe not in wherever you're from tacoland or whatever, but guess what in a majority of the world that's a fucking weird thing to sit on a bus in public looking at.

I don't remember what the second half of this post was going to be about.

I think the secret is that most anime fans hate anime as much as everyone else. The difference is that we don't see all anime as the same thing, so when people paint with broad strokes about a genre, it gets annoying. I mean, we're a couple of weeks out from the North American release of Miyazaki's latest Ghibli film and unless I missed something when I watched it, I don't think there were any upskirts. lol

 

[Deleted member 22576]

I think the "someone sees you on a bus" argument is cheap from the outset. I consume and enjoy tons of media I wouldn't be comfortable showcasing context-free to a stranger. Even really really harmless stuff like someone posting a new selfie on twitter can edge into that feeling. I would feel slightly embarrassed in front of some company if they saw me playing Dark Souls. This next line is going to sound more contentious than I mean it, but its really all about your personal insecurities. I think a very common insecurity for most reasonable late twenties males involved in popular nerd culture is anime/cutesy/otaku sexuality. Its very offputting and predatory seeming. Even to the point where when I play Persona4 and try to be invested in the characters and relationships I come away feeling kind of dirty or weird about honestly trying to get myself to like chie or whatever. Theres a lot of very interesting parts to interactive media and the relationships it allows you to build with your characters.

As a general rule I am not comfortable letting anyone see what I do mobile device. Whether it be reading a text, playing something abstract like hexagon, or reading wikipedia. Thats something I am always 100% consciously aware of.. so my guard is already up when it comes to media consumption in public.

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

I think the secret is that most anime fans hate anime as much as everyone else. The difference is that we don't see all anime as the same thing, so when people paint with broad strokes about a genre, it gets annoying. I mean, we're a couple of weeks out from the North American release of Miyazaki's latest Ghibli film and unless I missed something when I watched it, I don't think there were any upskirts. lol

Oh god, this.

 

[firehawk12]

Sorry if I'm misunderstanding you, but you make it sound like there's no middle ground between being okay with fanservicey stuff and 'hating anime'.

I myself don't watch a lot of anime but have enjoyed some here and there, and I have no problem with the general aesthetic. 999 is one of my favorite games of all time. Still, I don't like it when games/shows show characters in skimpy clothing/titilating poses for very thinly-veiled reasons. It breaks the fourth wall and does a disservice to some characters.

I find fanservice as tiring as the next person, but the implication seems to be that anime and fanservice is synonymous.

Meanwhile, people are having copious amounts of sex on Game of Thrones and no one bats an eye.

I could argue that Game of Thrones would be a much more interesting show if they didn't feel the need to show tits and ass all the time, couldn't I?

 

[PsychoSoldier]

I think it's less about the content being more adult and more about the way in which the specific content feels creepy and/or exploitative.

Nudity and sexual content can be done in a classy manner or in a way that makes it feel like some higher artistic purpose is being served, but when it seems to be played for titillation then it can make people uncomfortable.

 

[SummitAve]

Is the perviness what really turns people off, though? Here in America, it seems anime still gets that "cartoons are for kids" thing that turns adults off from watching anything animated ever. I mean, that recent Academy Awards drama about Frozen proves that that stigma is still in effect.

It feels like Japan is more "accepting" of this content because they take animation more seriously, while elsewhere, it's all for kids, so they wouldn't even be aware of all the pervy or "adult" content in them. And when it does become apparent that this stuff is in them, it's weird because they're cartoons.

If your only exposure to anime is through Giant Bomb, you're gonna think all anime is pervy anyway, lol. Giant Bomb Anime Coverage consists of stuff like GalGun, Otomedius Excellent, Deathsmiles, Hatsune Miku, Persona 4, and Dragon Ball. Even a game as innocent as Hatsune Miku gets dirtied up by the Giant Bomb crew, and it's hilarious.

I don't think it has anything to do with how accepting we are of animation. It's everywhere in our culture, and has been for almost 100 years. Anime gets the "cartoon for kids" because it essentially is. Some people may be able to overlook all the tropes of Anime, but for somebody who has not aquired the taste for it then it's quickly dismissed as immature for very good reasons.

 

[firehawk12]

I think it's less about the content being more adult and more about the way in which the specific content feels creepy and/or exploitative.

Nudity and sexual content can be done in a classy manner or in a way that makes it feel like some higher artistic purpose is being served, but when it seems to be played for titillation then it can make people uncomfortable.

Oh sure, but that goes for all genres and media though.

 

[Alfredo]

I think the secret is that most anime fans hate anime as much as everyone else. The difference is that we don't see all anime as the same thing, so when people paint with broad strokes about a genre, it gets annoying. I mean, we're a couple of weeks out from the North American release of Miyazaki's latest Ghibli film and unless I missed something when I watched it, I don't think there were any upskirts. lol

This is pretty much it.

I like to say I hate anime, but I genuinely enjoy Studio Ghibli and Satoshi Kon films.

The same goes for anime-style games. Blazblue? Guilty Gear? Go away! Persona 4? Ace Attorney? Awesome!

I think the world would be a better place without all the BS fanservice stuff out there, but I can easily just ignore it.

I don't think it has anything to do with how accepting we are of animation. It's everywhere in our culture, and has been for almost 100 years. Anime gets the "cartoon for kids" because it essentially is. Some people may be able to overlook all the tropes of Anime, but for somebody who has not aquired the taste for it then it's quickly dismissed as immature for very good reasons.

But when someone says "The Wind Rises" is for six year olds, that's pretty upsetting. But I guess all this is a different argument from the fanservice stuff.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

Patrick is going to have an interview up with the guy who did the first fan translation of DR and essentially introduced the game to the West. I followed that LP from the start so this will be interesting.

 

[LiK]

Patrick is going to have an interview up with the guy who did the first fan translation of DR and essentially introduced the game to the West. I followed that LP from the start so this will be interesting.

were they originally called "truth bullets"?

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

I don't hate anime but I hate that people judge me because an Avatar with out even knowing my actual opinions.

 

[firehawk12]

This is pretty much it.

I think the world would be a better place without all the BS fanservice stuff out there, but I can easily just ignore it.

As much as I ignore the sex scenes on HBO shows. lol

Patrick is going to have an interview up with the guy who did the first fan translation of DR and essentially introduced the game to the West. I followed that LP from the start so this will be interesting.

I think the anime adaptation coming out so soon after helped as well. It was just a strange confluence of marketing, accidental or not.

 

[LiK]

I don't hate anime but I hate that people judge me because an Avatar with out even knowing my actual opinions.

i think we had a thread about this in OT where the OP asked if Gaffers judged people by avatars. it was kinda sad to see most do.

 

[SummitAve]

I don't hate anime but I hate that people judge me because an Avatar with out even knowing my actual opinions.

Don't create an identity based on anime then. Plenty of users don't have avatars.

 

[EmCeeGramr]

were they originally called "truth bullets"?

He translated them as Evidence Bullets; I can't recall if he said what they were originally in Japanese.

 

[TheBaronOfNA]

Don't create an identity based on anime then. Plenty of users don't have avatars.

Wha?

 

[LiK]

He translated them as Evidence Bullets; I can't recall what they were originally in Japanese.

hm, i kinda like truth bullets more then. more quotable.

 

[Zaph]

This game doesn't have any of that though. It's incredibly tame, I'd be much more embarrassed about reading FHM than playing this on the train.

There are two screenshots a page back with young looking characters in see-through towels and panties.

The thing with Japanese games is that I feel like there's no real audience to be served with reviews anymore. If you're already someone who hates anime or whatever, why would you ever be interested in a game like this outside of reading a review that confirms their biases.

I don't want to limit it to Japanese games though. I think the same goes for Sports games. The reason why the Jeff and Vinny QLs of the sports games are fun is because they don't like sports and sports games. They're not running Madden leagues with other game journalists and playing fantasy football, so they just try to break the game and shit on the rules/teams/players/etc. But a sports gamer would probably find their opinions infuriating.

Yeah, it's definately a very self-serving/niche genre and medium, but it's important for publications to keep up otherwise many people may miss otherwise great games like P4.

Eh, I was referring that I live in Mexico City (in a country with pretty fucked up sexual and gender views in both sides of the spectrum ) than my circle of friends.

I quoted your most recent post at the time. My post was in reference to your attitude that the issues contained in Patrick's review were non-issues or in some way irrelevant.

Oh god, this.

The irony is incredible. Instead of just "painting the genre with broad strokes", an outsider actually picked up the game, gave it a fair shake and spoke quite positively on it. Yet, because he dared to inform the reader that there are questionable aspects to the game that might make them uncomfortable if played around other people (very relevant to a portable review), you took issue.

 

[Chuck]

i think we had a thread about this in OT where the OP asked if Gaffers judged people by avatars. it was kinda sad to see most do.

I mostly agree, but when you see some with an avatar plastered with ms, sony, or nintendo stuff, specifically the only for/only on tag, it's very hard to not consider them a fanboy to some degree.

 

[RE_Player]

Whenever these types of debates pop up I take a step back and look at all the games in which murdering people takes place and is deemed acceptable. I'll take the occasional anime fan service scene over killing people mindlessly any day of the week.

 

[bionicpuppy]

Vinny: I know people hate menus...

Yeah some of us really do Vin-man. The South Park QL started the exact same way as the DS2 one, looking at menus, numbers and text.

By all means show the menus later on, but why not just start with the very basics? The premise of the story, and some gameplay? Now it feels like you are putting the cart before the horse.

I thought the menus and inventory changes are some of the most exciting differences in the game. YOU CAN USE MULTIPLE SOULS WITHOUT EXITING THE MENU! Get excited. Also, for the record, it's V-Man.