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Hamas terrorists infiltrated Israel. 1400+ killed, 2400+ wounded, 240+ abducted. Israel declares war

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Happosai

Hold onto your panties
Can someone summarize or link to something with more detail on how and when Israel has attempted peace negotiations? I'm only just learning about a lot of the history with this, and I think that would be good info for me to brush up on.
This is not every peace negotiation or the like; but relatively close and well documented.

 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
It seems what people post about history, Palestinian gov doesnt want to take responsibility for the land when Israel offers it up. I think that's the jist of it???

Why would they say no? Hell, in any part of world history, it's always a land grab. So if one side says here you go, who wouldn't take it and run it yourself? Why wouldnt Gaza people want it?
 
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Happosai

Hold onto your panties
It seems what people post about history, Palestinian gov does want to take responsibility for the land when Israel offers it up. I think that's the jist of it???

Why would they say no? Hell, in any part of world history, it's always a land grab. So if one side says here you go, who wouldn't take it and run it yourself? Why wouldnt Gaza people want it?
That's part of it. Palestine would start accepting whichever power and rights Israel gave. However, nothing ever stuck. Ultimately, the occupants of Palestine would feel they weren't getting enough and kept pushing for election of a new power to eventually take all of Israel. That's always been the goal. Maybe not of every civilian in the territories on the West Bank or Gaza. They elected Hamas in 2006 if I recall and Hamas did nothing for Gaza's infrastructure. Israel supplied nearly everything and was negotiating with the U.N. on yet another 2-state solution just before this all went down on the 7th of October.

Once they elected Hamas, that's why the answer was always going to be a hard: no from Palestinian occupants. Hamas bides strictly by the 'river to sea' Qu'ran fueled homicidal ideologies. Civilians knew what was brewing at that point too and had options for contingency long before the attacks on the 7th to vacate elsewhere. I won't speak for why the majority stayed in Gaza (for instance). However, there was a time when Hamas would simply gun citizens down trying to flee Gaza too. Many feared leaving too. Now, anytime in human history when there was a way to escape such a situation; those who want freedom will find a way out and a way to survive. I think the whole brainwashing of the religion along with the fear of 'what may happen' too says a lot too as to why no one attempted to overthrow Hamas before the attacks.

Either way, it's too late now and Israel has the right to do whatever they must. However, their goal has always been to minimize collateral damage as we can clearly see.
 

LordOfChaos

Member
Oh shit, Qatar sentenced 8 Indian ex-navy officers to death for information gathering for Israel. Timing comes after the Indian prime minister announced support for Israel, and they may have been a softer target than going after Israel directly.

 

Wildebeest

Member
Oh shit, Qatar sentenced 8 Indian ex-navy officers to death for information gathering for Israel. Timing comes after the Indian prime minister announced support for Israel, and they may have been a softer target than going after Israel directly.

I'd comment, but Qatar have some extremely humanitarian bank accounts, and they value the lives of all banknotes equally. Really, they are above any academic criticism.
 

Artoris

Gold Member
Oh shit, Qatar sentenced 8 Indian ex-navy officers to death for information gathering for Israel. Timing comes after the Indian prime minister announced support for Israel, and they may have been a softer target than going after Israel directly.

This has a potential to spark an Indian Pakistan conflict
 

Woggleman

Member
I am speaking as a non Jewish person but I honestly don't understand why so many people have so much resentment against people of the Jewish faith. From what I see they don't bother anybody and in general never try to force their customs on anybody else. I have never heard of a Jewish person trying to pass a law to force a kosher diet on everybody else or being violent towards those who don't believe the same thing. No Jewish politician has every tried to ban ham and cheese sandwiches. That is more than can be said for some other groups. Where does all this hatred come from?
 
I am speaking as a non Jewish person but I honestly don't understand why so many people have so much resentment against people of the Jewish faith. From what I see they don't bother anybody and in general never try to force their customs on anybody else. I have never heard of a Jewish person trying to pass a law to force a kosher diet on everybody else or being violent towards those who don't believe the same thing. No Jewish politician has every tried to ban ham and cheese sandwiches. That is more than can be said for some other groups. Where does all this hatred come from?
"Jews are white, muslims are brown". That's all to it really.
 
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Happosai

Hold onto your panties
I wish I didn't have to click that to make sure it was satire.
I started reading the clip before looking at the publisher and got sweaty palms. Joke that nearly gave me a heart attack. I think that's because the sign in Istanbul from an above post isn't satire.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
I am speaking as a non Jewish person but I honestly don't understand why so many people have so much resentment against people of the Jewish faith. From what I see they don't bother anybody and in general never try to force their customs on anybody else. I have never heard of a Jewish person trying to pass a law to force a kosher diet on everybody else or being violent towards those who don't believe the same thing. No Jewish politician has every tried to ban ham and cheese sandwiches. That is more than can be said for some other groups. Where does all this hatred come from?
You answered your own question.

Jews get a lot of open aired hate because they dont whine and do violent shit like other groups of people. When was the last time you saw a Jewish protest group being so pissed off says kill all Muslims, or hijacking planes and stuff like that? Heck, even when they get mad and do military counter attacks they warn the general public where and when they are going to strike.

Another reason is envy. There's only 16 million Jews and a good portion of them are in Israel. No matter what happens to them, they always seem to strive for good education, jobs, science etc.... A good number of Nobel prize winners are Jewish.

It must be pretty embarrassing that a small plot of land in the mid east with 10 million people can do so well compared to the countries surrounding them.

 

Happosai

Hold onto your panties
You answered your own question.

Jews get a lot of open aired hate because they dont whine and do violent shit like other groups of people. When was the last time you saw a Jewish protest group being so pissed off says kill all Muslims, or hijacking planes and stuff like that? Heck, even when they get mad and do military counter attacks they warn the general public where and when they are going to strike.

Another reason is envy. There's only 16 million Jews and a good portion of them are in Israel. No matter what happens to them, they always seem to strive for good education, jobs, science etc.... A good number of Nobel prize winners are Jewish.

It must be pretty embarrassing that a small plot of land in the mid east with 10 million people can do so well compared to the countries surrounding them.

That's pretty much it. Not just Islam but people historically had envy at their successful heritage but never thought, "if I tried instead of pouting like a child, maybe I too could be successful." Envy and hatred.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
That's pretty much it. Not just Islam but people historically had envy at their successful heritage but never thought, "if I tried instead of pouting like a child, maybe I too could be successful." Envy and hatred.
Yup.

Envy is universal. Even in your typical western city, poor dudes want higher income people to be taxed as much as possible so the gov can give them back as much tax backed pay outs and services. Instead of just manning up and improving so the entire collectively population slowly improves over time (everyone on the ladder goes up a rung together) and respecting a person doing better is great on them for succeeding, they prefer the guy two rungs up get chopped down two rungs to balance things out as much as possible. A weird mentality.

It's just so much more pronounced in the mid east region where Israel in a plot of land you can barely see does so well vs other countries in the area probably 50x bigger with 10x the people.
 

ADiTAR

ידע זה כוח
Sometimes we just need to let these things sink in with silence and awe. A display larger than words, no pushing, no shouting, no anger, no hatred. You just lose your words sometimes...
Let's see how long this lasts, it's a very busy area in NYC, I'm surprised they got a permit for it.
 

ADiTAR

ידע זה כוח
I am speaking as a non Jewish person but I honestly don't understand why so many people have so much resentment against people of the Jewish faith. From what I see they don't bother anybody and in general never try to force their customs on anybody else. I have never heard of a Jewish person trying to pass a law to force a kosher diet on everybody else or being violent towards those who don't believe the same thing. No Jewish politician has every tried to ban ham and cheese sandwiches. That is more than can be said for some other groups. Where does all this hatred come from?
Jews are very prominent despite our very small numbers, and it pisses people of because they don't know why. And the irony is that it mostly happen because of exclusion.

Jews are very prominent in banking, because back in the old days Christianity and Islam looked down upon landing with interest, and because Jews couldn't own lands, they veered into the loan business.

Same thing why Jews are prominent in Hollywood. They couldn't get work in regular industries the US because they're Jewish, so they started their own industry that will accept them.

Not sure why so many of us are doctors, I guess we think people will be ok with us if we heal them.

Also, Hitchens explained in another angle which I found interesting. Jews rejected Jesus and Muhammad, they saw them as just regular men. So both religions can't comprehend how we saw these two deities and said, "no thanks."
 

MrA

Member
You answered your own question.

Jews get a lot of open aired hate because they dont whine and do violent shit like other groups of people. When was the last time you saw a Jewish protest group being so pissed off says kill all Muslims, or hijacking planes and stuff like that? Heck, even when they get mad and do military counter attacks they warn the general public where and when they are going to strike.

Another reason is envy. There's only 16 million Jews and a good portion of them are in Israel. No matter what happens to them, they always seem to strive for good education, jobs, science etc.... A good number of Nobel prize winners are Jewish.

It must be pretty embarrassing that a small plot of land in the mid east with 10 million people can do so well compared to the countries surrounding them.

I think there is an important lesson here, if you understand economics, you can give your family access to any other learning, Jews are disproportionately good with money (which should be lauded and emulated, not despised),
plus jews seem to generally have that all-important quality of taking responsibility for their own failures and not blaming others, which makes people that scapegoat supremely jealous
 

Dr.D00p

Member
Sometimes lately it seems the only way to restore any sanity to the world right now and put the crazies in the ground for another 50+ years...is to have a good, old fashioned, World War.

Maybe it's just nature's way for humanity to flush out the shit, from its system.
 

tommib

Member
Can someone summarize or link to something with more detail on how and when Israel has attempted peace negotiations? I'm only just learning about a lot of the history with this, and I think that would be good info for me to brush up on.
This is a good event recap for the 1st hour:
 

Tomeru

Member


I'm israeli, and honestly? Shouldve let that "peace keeper" burn our flag. Couldve been a wakeup call for america to realise they're also starting to look like the middle east.

And throw that mf ass in jail.

Edit:
"Of course its a toyota" lmao
 
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Guilty_AI

Member
I am speaking as a non Jewish person but I honestly don't understand why so many people have so much resentment against people of the Jewish faith. From what I see they don't bother anybody and in general never try to force their customs on anybody else. I have never heard of a Jewish person trying to pass a law to force a kosher diet on everybody else or being violent towards those who don't believe the same thing. No Jewish politician has every tried to ban ham and cheese sandwiches. That is more than can be said for some other groups. Where does all this hatred come from?
There is no specific cause leading to everything, its rather a historical process that build up to the current state. In Europe, they would usually refuse to convert to christianity, which limited the roles they could take in society, and would end up taking professions that were looked down upon by the church and population, things like trade or money lending. Even after the protestant reformation in the 16th century they'd still refuse to convert, or be associated with absolutist movements from that period.

The common theory in late 19th century is that anti-semitism had its roots in the fact jewish had no land of their own and instead settled in others lands while maintaning their own traditions and values instead of assimilating. Its no secret people throughout history tended to be very xenophobic and had some inherent hatred towards outsiders, so in their eyes it was like having outsiders within their own land. This line of thought is one of the things that led to the foundation of Israel, that perhaps with a proper jewish nation anti-semitism would subside.

Naturally that didn't happen, but personally i still think this theory is correct. Its simply that erasing centuries of hatred cannot come immediatly even after stabilishing a solution to the problem. Not to mention the creation of Israel itself also came with its own share of issues that were bound to generate conflict.
 
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FunkMiller

Gold Member
The common theory in late 19th century is that anti-semitism had its roots in the fact jewish had no land of their own and instead settled in others lands while maintaning their own traditions and values instead of assimilating. Its no secret people throughout history tended to be very xenophobic and had some inherent hatred towards outsiders, so in their eyes it was like having outsiders within their own land. This line of thought is one of the things that led to the foundation of Israel, that perhaps with a proper jewish nation anti-semitism would subside.

The grand irony of all this being of course that the people who originally settled the land in question?

Canaanites.

Who were the Canaanites? Forefathers of both Jews and Arabs.

Neither faction has a solid claim to the land. It should be shared fairly.

Or, you know, cordoned off from every religious fucker out there. One of the two :pie_eyeroll:
 
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ADiTAR

ידע זה כוח
The grand irony of all this being of course that the people who originally settled the land in question?

Canaanites.

Who were the Canaanites? Forefathers of both Jews and Arabs.

Neither faction has a solid claim to the land. It should be shared fairly.

Or, you know, cordoned off from every religious fucker out there. One of the two :pie_eyeroll:
In theory Cnaan (Canaan) is all of Jordan, Israel, Lebanon and Syria, so theoratically Arabs got their dues. And Jews did get Judeah (even though it also includes parts of Jordan).
 

EviLore

Expansive Ellipses
Staff Member
The grand irony of all this being of course that the people who originally settled the land in question?

Canaanites.

Who were the Canaanites? Forefathers of both Jews and Arabs.

Neither faction has a solid claim to the land. It should be shared fairly.

Or, you know, cordoned off from every religious fucker out there. One of the two :pie_eyeroll:
qahG7Ju.jpg
 

jason10mm

Gold Member
If we (the US) did as the Romans did the world would be a veeerrryy different place. Other places like to cast us as roman-like brutal conquerors, but the reality was quite different for how they treated opposition. That said, sometimes the half measures the US employs lead to more problems than if it just stayed out of domestic issues or went full in on a touchdown.

I think we are gonna see Israel go for a touchdown in Gaza.

I'm just waiting for a series of "accidents" to start befalling Hamas leaders worldwide. Mossad certainly has the aura of being able to do this, curious if it is truth.
 

ADiTAR

ידע זה כוח
If we (the US) did as the Romans did the world would be a veeerrryy different place. Other places like to cast us as roman-like brutal conquerors, but the reality was quite different for how they treated opposition. That said, sometimes the half measures the US employs lead to more problems than if it just stayed out of domestic issues or went full in on a touchdown.

I think we are gonna see Israel go for a touchdown in Gaza.

I'm just waiting for a series of "accidents" to start befalling Hamas leaders worldwide. Mossad certainly has the aura of being able to do this, curious if it is truth.
They did it in Munich, world has advanced since then, I do hope to see some creative way. Make it unexpected.

Israel right now is doing skirmishes inside Gaza, go in and out in a very cooperative maneuvers. It makes me feel confident.
 

RJMacready73

Simps for Amouranth
Wow, BBC, how dare you!


I've watched a few interviews with Hamas and Palestinian spokesmen/women and I have to reach for the off switch after 5mins, it's all the same shit... They live in a fucking bubble of misery and denial and when asked a simple question about Oct7th it's just complete whataboutisms.. honestly the more I see and hear the more I think fuck it, you've made your bed of thorns, you where offered a fucking mattress and you burned it so I could care less now
 

Sub_Level

wants to fuck an Asian grill.
I'm just waiting for a series of "accidents" to start befalling Hamas leaders worldwide. Mossad certainly has the aura of being able to do this, curious if it is truth.

They are more than capable. But we just saw the biggest ever intelligence failure in Israeli history this month so I’m past the point of viewing them as some sort of untouchable super-elite agency. This has hopefully woken them up.
 

ADiTAR

ידע זה כוח
I've watched a few interviews with Hamas and Palestinian spokesmen/women and I have to reach for the off switch after 5mins, it's all the same shit... They live in a fucking bubble of misery and denial and when asked a simple question about Oct7th it's just complete whataboutisms.. honestly the more I see and hear the more I think fuck it, you've made your bed of thorns, you where offered a fucking mattress and you burned it so I could care less now
That's also the reason you see these protests. I don't think they ever thought their massacre will be so ISIS like, video broadcasted and live streamed. So the protests are here to try and cry about the Palestinians/Hamas, but the world has seen what they've done, the world now know what they are (keep in mind lots of civilians joined the massacre), so they try to obfuscate and shift blame. We can't let them.
 
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