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[FunkMiller]

I'm not sure that Hamas miscalculated.
I actually think that Hamas wants an escalation of the conflict. They want more dead bodies, Israeli and Palestinian.
Hamas considers Palestinian dead civilians as a commodity in the blame game. They want to play the victim.
They knew this attack would have a retaliation. And they know that if they don't let the Palestinians evacuate before Israeli bombings, they get more dead bodies to pretend that they are the victim.
Yesterday, Hamas declared they wanted to negotiate a truce. This is because they know there is no way Israel can stop now. So once again, they pretend to play the victim game.

I think they were probably convinced by others that this incursion wouldn't result in their complete destruction. Which is the most likely outcome at this stage. Hamas are very much puppets in a much broader conflict.

 

[pesaddict]

How many BILLIONS has the U.S & UK sent to

 

[darrylgorn]

No, it's war.

I don't know what that means.

We don't excuse Russia because they started a war or the U.S. after 9/11.

It would have been one thing to secure their border but this siege will have some serious political blowback in the coming weeks, I think.

 

[ThisIsMyDog]

The Jewish people are only allowed to lay down and be massacred into extinction, not defend themselves, according to worldviews that remain popular everywhere you look. Well, the Jewish people reject that premise and have the power to make their own decisions, knowing full well, better than any other group on this planet, how the other approach plays out.

I may be playing devil's advocate here, but if you want to find the main reason why so many people in the West support Palestine instead of Israel, is the Jewish state's policy toward the West Bank. Over half a million illegal settlers, protected by the IDF, colonialism combined with apertheid.

 

[Topher]

I don't know what that means.

We don't excuse Russia because they started a war or the U.S. after 9/11.

Israel didn't start this war. Hamas did.

 

[darrylgorn]

Israel didn't start this war. Hamas did.

Who cares who started what?

It's 2023, we don't need more violence.

 

[Auto_aim1]

How many BILLIONS has the U.S & UK sent to

Israel is a critical ally for both in the middle east. If it starts with a 'B' it's a drop in the bucket for America. It is deals in Trillions my man.

 

[winjer]

I think they were probably convinced by others that this incursion wouldn't result in their complete destruction. Which is the most likely outcome at this stage. Hamas are very much puppets in a much broader conflict.

Hamas leaders are even in the region. So they don't care.
But among extremist Muslims, there is a strong sense of martyrdom, especially if they can take out some enemy.

 

[FunkMiller]

How many BILLIONS has the U.S & UK sent to

Israel receives no foreign aid from the UK. We do trade with them though.

 

[Topher]

Who cares who started what?

You do.

"We don't excuse Russia because they started a war or the U.S. after 9/11."

 

[darrylgorn]

No, it's war.

War is genocide.

 

[darrylgorn]

You do.

"We don't excuse Russia because they started a war or the U.S. after 9/11."

I'm not sure I follow. My point is that a greater power decided to infiltrate a lesser power.

 

[FullMetalx117]

I never understood the who was there first arguments.

My understanding is that many Palestinians were actually Jews who had converted to Islam. They share a lot of the same blood. So it just makes the situation even more sad. “Ethnic cleansing” on both sides is really just killing their own closest blood

 

[FunkMiller]

War is genocide.

Good lord. It really isn't. War sometimes comes with genocide. But war also prevents genocide.

 

[darrylgorn]

Good lord. It really isn't. War sometimes comes with genocide. But war also prevents genocide.

Okay. But that doesn't apply to this circumstance because there is no risk of genocide to Israel.

 

[Topher]

War is genocide.

"Genocide is an internationally recognized crime where acts are committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. "

A war isn't automatically waged with those intentions.

I'm not sure I follow. My point is that a greater power decided to infiltrate a lesser power.

So you are simply going to ignore the circumstances that have led up to that point? You cannot be serious.

 

[ADiTAR]

A man who had to barricade his family in his house in Israel for ten hours against the Hamas terrorists, puts a US senator in his place about the realties of both the Ukraine war and the Israel/Palestinian conflict:

The US can finish this way quicker, like Israel did in the 6 days war, strike first and get victory. They should rally their allies and go to war. That's the only way to achieve world peace.

 

[darrylgorn]

"Genocide is an internationally recognized crime where acts are committed with the intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group. "

A war isn't automatically waged with those intentions.



So you are simply going to ignore the circumstances that have lead up to that point? You cannot be serious.

I'm not ignoring anything. I condemn the actions of Hamas.

 

[Topher]

I'm not ignoring anything. I condemn the actions of Hamas.

And those actions have consequences. You can't have it both ways.

 

[EviLore]

It's 2023, we don't need more violence.

Agreed. And the way to prevent that is to obliterate the avowed terrorists.

 

[darrylgorn]

And those actions have consequences. You can't have it both ways.

Yeah, but not silly consequences like sieging and killing innocent people in an entire region.

I'm sure we can do better than that.

They're killing their own civilians by doing this too. Doesn’t make sense.

 

[Topher]

Yeah, but not silly consequences like sieging and killing innocent people in an entire region.

I'm sure we can do better than that.

They're killing their own civilians by doing this too. Doesn’t make sense.

Enlighten us then. What should Israel do?

 

[FullMetalx117]

Yeah, but not silly consequences like sieging and killing innocent people in an entire region.

I'm sure we can do better than that.

Not actually sure about that. Israeli world class intelligence systems has proven to be Russian grade. So maybe they don’t actually have the precision we all think and just need to be guns blazing the entire time

 

[darrylgorn]

Agreed. And the way to prevent that is to obliterate the avowed terrorists.

Of course. Do that without killing innocent people.

 

[Z O N E]

Yeah, but not silly consequences like sieging and killing innocent people in an entire region.

I'm sure we can do better than that.

They're killing their own civilians by doing this too. Doesn’t make sense.

So, what appropriate action would you recommend when a terrorist group invades your country, rapes your children and women, kills your children, women and men and kidnaps your children, women and men?

Do you invite them to sit at the round table and have a chat?

Hamas is responsible for all the deaths happening right now on Israels side AND Palestines side.

 

[pesaddict]

Or bombing universitys, schools & hospitals residential areas

 

[darrylgorn]

Enlighten us then. What should Israel do?

As far as I understand, it's an apartheid, so start with fixing that.

They can also have a covert group to infiltrate individual, Hamas compounds.

 

[pesaddict]

So, what appropriate action would you recommend when a terrorist group invades your country, rapes your children and women, kills your children, women and men and kidnaps your children, women and men?

Do you invite them to sit at the round table and have a chat?

Hamas is responsible for all the deaths happening right now on Israels side AND Palestines side.

What like IDF has been doing for the 50+ years

 

[Topher]

Or bombing universitys, schools & hospitals residential areas

You mean the places Hamas operates from in order to use civilians as human shields?

 

[ADiTAR]

Of course. Do that without killing innocent people.

Kinda hard when those terrorist have their cache of weapons in schools and hospitals and mosques. They put their own people in harms way because they want the world opinions to change.

The question is why are we not seeing a huge amount of people in the Egypt crossing, ask yourself why don't they flee.

 

[Z O N E]

What like IDF has been doing for the 50+ years

You mean what Hamas started? You bomb a country and they will bomb back.

Hamas will be the downfall of Palestine, not Israel.

 

[Embearded]

Unlike Hamas, Israel is not targeting civilians.
Israel warns the Palestinian population to evacuate before striking Hamas targets.
And let's not forget that it's Hamas that is using civilians as a meat shield.
Hamas not only is hurting the Israelian population, but it's also the Palestinian population.

This is why i cannot accept that all Palestinians are in line with what happened 3 days ago and Hamas in general.
I cannot accept the absence of people who place their children's and their own life above everything else in this world, No matter the education level and the living conditions.
Then again, we see people who got out, have a life in NY, Canada and other places of the world and they gather to celebrate death.
Personally i am really conflicted on how i would handle this situation if i was a high ranking officer.

If Israel is indeed giving out directions to civilians to get out, good for them.

 

[FunkMiller]

Agreed. And the way to prevent that is to obliterate the avowed terrorists.

Quite how we've reached the point of arguing over whether we should obliterate people who rape and murder innocent women and children is beyond me. How can anyone think anything other than that every effort should be made to destroy them?

 

[FullMetalx117]

Kinda hard when those terrorist have their cache of weapons in schools and hospitals and mosques. They put their own people in harms way because they want the world opinions to change.

The question is why are we not seeing a huge amount of people in the Egypt crossing, ask yourself why don't they flee.

Simple answer. Most would rather not leave their homes. And some actually see their homes as worth dying for. Knowing that, Israel still going to fully level the place?

 

[darrylgorn]

Kinda hard when those terrorist have their cache of weapons in schools and hospitals and mosques.

I agree, this is an extraordinarily difficult task.

But the next few weeks are not going to be kind to Israel for this move. It's a big mistake, politically.

 

[EviLore]

 

[IDKFA]

As far as I understand, it's an apartheid, so start with fixing that.

It's not.

I'm interested to know why you think this is anything like what happened in South Africa.

 

[BlueAlpaca]

Want to make sure people understand:

Hamas doesn't represent Palestinian people. Yes you can dig up voting results, support videos, but understand this is all with a backdrop of execution if those people don't do what Hamas say (sharia law system). It's a silent majority situation. Defectors cannot make their opinions heard freely, and anyone that does will be executed. Examine the Afghanistan situation. Voting would make you think that Taliban had vast public support. But I can guarantee plenty of women who had to give up college degrees and wear full coverings the next day didn't support them, they just couldn't say anything otherwise there would be executions. The amount of people trying to flee the country at the congested airport still sticks in my mind.

Always remember, the vast majority of people don't really care about politics, nationalism, etc. They just want to live their day to day lives. It's always the vocal very loud minority that ruins it for everyone.

No.

Marking a notable shift in Palestinian public opinion, 60 percent of the population surveyed in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip (55% and 68%, respectively) said that the five-year goal “should be to work toward reclaiming all of historic Palestine, from the river to the sea,”

Worldwide (and U.S.-wide) celebrations of Hamas’s slaughter and kidnapping

This post (and probably the next one) will be devoted to the war in Israel and Palestine, an event that has got me deeply depressed for many reasons: murder, hostages taken with no good way to get the

whyevolutionistrue.com

 

[ADiTAR]

Simple answer. Most would rather not leave their homes. And some actually see their homes as worth dying for. Knowing that, Israel still going to fully level the place?

Yes.

Gaza cannot stand. Terror cannot stand.

But again, that's me. I'm a grandson of Holocaust survivors who's families have been murdered. When we vowed never again, it means at all costs. And my leaders are giving them the chance to flee, telling them to go. If Israel put down our weapons they'll kill us in an instant, we have to strike first. Not to mention we have 2-3 million arabs within who can also rise up. We are in a very serious situation here.

 

[FullMetalx117]

No.

Worldwide (and U.S.-wide) celebrations of Hamas’s slaughter and kidnapping

This post (and probably the next one) will be devoted to the war in Israel and Palestine, an event that has got me deeply depressed for many reasons: murder, hostages taken with no good way to get the

whyevolutionistrue.com

Don’t forget the backdrop of execution. I kind of laid it all out for you in that post

 

[DaleinCalgary]

We need that sweet summer child picture added soon for somebody.

 

[ADiTAR]

It's not.

I'm interested to know why you think this is anything like what happened in South Africa.

Because he read a word on TikTok.

 

[ADiTAR]

I agree, this is an extraordinarily difficult task.

But the next few weeks are not going to be kind to Israel for this move. It's a big mistake, politically.

We shouldn't give a fuck. The world who hates us, hates us, there are protests and comments that are vile. We won't be able to change that, so we can be the villain they already think we are as long as we restore security to our citizens.

I always said that Hilary should have acted the bitch, because that would have gotten her elected.

 

[Havoc2049]

I have no idea whether this would be a workable plan but I would:

- Try to evacuate all women, children, and old people from Gaza, or try to make a deal with Egypt to temporarily take them.
- Once that's done, make loudspeaker announcements to the effect that any men of fighting age still inside Gaza after some cut-off point/deadline will be treated as enemy combatants.
- Make clear that anyone who does surrender will be screened and checked to see if they might be a combatant and finger printed
- Then... conduct the ground invasion

All of that in addition to bolstering the border with the Gaza strip to prevent a repeat of what just happened.

No way Hamas would agree to any of that and the whole time they would be raining rockets down on Israel.

 

[FunkMiller]

No.

Worldwide (and U.S.-wide) celebrations of Hamas’s slaughter and kidnapping

This post (and probably the next one) will be devoted to the war in Israel and Palestine, an event that has got me deeply depressed for many reasons: murder, hostages taken with no good way to get the

whyevolutionistrue.com

Yes. While Israel are absolutely guilty of some appalling behaviour towards the Palestinians, let's not pretend that the majority of Palestinians wan't anything other than the destruction of Israel.

 

[EviLore]

 

[FullMetalx117]

Life In Gaza: A Syrian Woman’s Experiences With Hamas And Her Work To Improve Israeli/Palestinian Relations

Manar Al-Sharif moved to Gaza to attend college. But instead, she ended up an activist, working to improve life for Palestinians in Gaza and bridge the gap between Israelis and Palestinians.

www.forbes.com

“It's shocking because most of the news and media only talk about the conflict between Hamas and Israel, but not about the culture of the people there and how they think and live," Al-Sharif explained. "I was shocked by the reality there, by the people. The people told me they don't want war; they are looking for peace and solutions, but they cannot talk about this.”

 

[Kittehkraken]

Okay. But that doesn't apply to this circumstance because there is no risk of genocide to Israel.

 

[BlackTron]

Of course. Do that without killing innocent people.

Up until now, Hamas has intentionally used human shields strategically, so that IDF must either tolerate their presence and allow them to keep operating, or engage and become "the bad guy" by getting civilians caught in the crossfire. By launching this attack and killing hundreds of civilians, Hamas has basically pissed off IDF enough to say "fuck you and your strategy, we're coming to get you".

By not reacting, they are basically saying "well that was bad, but we could never hurt a fly, so we'll just sit here on our moral high ground while you feel empowered to make another attack we won't respond to, and for our civilians to get their asses reamed again".

For some people it's like they live in a fantasy movie or video game world where morality is black, white and easy. All we need is one Solid Snake to do it The Right Way™ and make sure all the hostages get rescued.

 

[Topher]

Life In Gaza: A Syrian Woman’s Experiences With Hamas And Her Work To Improve Israeli/Palestinian Relations

Manar Al-Sharif moved to Gaza to attend college. But instead, she ended up an activist, working to improve life for Palestinians in Gaza and bridge the gap between Israelis and Palestinians.

www.forbes.com

“It's shocking because most of the news and media only talk about the conflict between Hamas and Israel, but not about the culture of the people there and how they think and live," Al-Sharif explained. "I was shocked by the reality there, by the people. The people told me they don't want war; they are looking for peace and solutions, but they cannot talk about this.”

Interesting article. Gaza is referred to as the "open air prison" and yet Hamas makes it a prison within a prison for many.