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[GooseMan69]

I’m gonna have to replay it then. The last time I played it was on ps3 before the ps4 version even came out. There definitely was no gay make out scene in the game though.

There wasn’t. It was somewhat missable. Bill refers to Frank as his partner, and there’s a note you can find that indicates they were definitely lovers.

However, I think they went way overboard here, and fundamentally changed Bills character. In the game, Bill is portrayed as a radical version of Joel. He has all of Joel’s paranoia and emotional distance, but ratcheted up to 11. He represents the endgame of what Joel will become if he continues to close himself off from everyone and everything. The show changes that dynamic quite a bit.

 

[crazepharmacist]

I don't know how much you remember about the game. But the way Bill talks about Frank in the game, the way he reacts to find him dead and the letter Frank left him pretty much tells you Bill is gay. And if that's not enough, the gay porn magazine Ellie finds in the car should be everything you need to know, lol.

Yeah I don’t remember much apparently lol.

 

[Pidull]

I don't think episode 3 hit the same way the game did.

In the game it's the way Bill talks about Frank like he's a complete nuisance, a liability. Bill spends the entire time trying to convince himself he doesn't need Frank, basically in denial about a possible negative outcome for his partner.

That moment Bill finds out Frank is dead hits harder because you realize they weren't survival buddies, they were more. While this episode was bittersweet and overall solid, it didn't have nearly the same impact as the game for me (unlike the past couple episodes).

 

[crazepharmacist]

Having gay people in TV shows/games means you have gone "woke" in your opinion. You understand you are the one politicizing it? Ellie was gay in the first game and so was Bill. What political about that?

No, I didn’t mean it like that. Neil has said in interviews his political views have shaped his writing. Nothing woke about having a gay character in a show or game. But if Neil were to retcon a straight character into being gay, for seemingly no other purpose other than to have a past work more closely align with his personal views, than I would consider that to be woke, yeah. But clearly I was wrong, and Bill has always been gay so I take back my comments.

 

[kyliethicc]

 

[GooseMan69]

As much as I didn’t like episode 3, the next one looks like it’s gonna be fantastic. I can’t wait to see the hunters get more characterization, because they had none in the game. They were the most generic, cardboard cutout bad guys ever.

 

[deriks]

Nice episode. Definitely the weakest, but still nice

 

[Represent.]

So Druckman strikes again with his gay liberal woke bullshit. Bill was not gay in the game. Fuck this.

He is gay in the game. Plain as day. Ellie even finds a gay magazine with his jizz all over it.

 

[Slothbeing1209]

Spoiler: .

I wish Bill still alive like the game but damn this was great episode.
Little disappointed we don't have a fight between Ellie and Bill though.

 

[DForce]

So Druckman strikes again with his gay liberal woke bullshit. Bill was not gay in the game. Fuck this.

Bill mentioned Frank was his partner twice in the game. Bill was also emotional when he was counting the bite marks on his dead body.


Bill - "Once upon a time I had somebody that I cared about. It was a partner. Somebody I had to look after. And in this world that sort of shit is good for one thing. Gettin' ya killed."

Joel - "Do you know this guy or something?"
Bill - "Frank."
Joel - "Who the hell is Frank?"
Bill - "He was my partner."
Bill - "He's the only idiot that would wear a shirt like that."

 

[Alkemyst]

Phenomenal episode. If Nick Offerman doesn't win an Emmy, I'm rioting.

 

[Slothbeing1209]

But who played the 80s song on radio though?

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

But who played the 80s song on radio though?

It was timed to play 80s automatically if Bill didn’t contact for a few weeks

 

[DForce]

 

[BaneIsPain]

I was ok episode I guess, but I would say unneccessary scenes in there. oh well

 

[DForce]

What Ellie did to that infected in the basement was......... interesting (in a good way).

And the way she looked at Joel in episode one when he was beating the solider? They're obviously building to something.

 

[Strategize]

Well, regardless of whether people thought it was nesserary or not, I did what it wanted to well. Alot of Emmy buzz already.

 

[DenchDeckard]

I wish Bill still alive like the game but damn this was great episode.
Little disappointed we don't have a fight between Ellie and Bill though.

Ffs dude! Spoiler that shit. What the FUCK!

 

[Aaron Olive]

They did bill dirty...

1. TV Show made him soft
2. Added unnecessary exposition to spice things up cough....
3. Killing him going against the source material

seeing how they're trying to send a message who knows what else might change from the 2013 game script.

 

[Slothbeing1209]

Ffs dude! Spoiler that shit. What the FUCK!

People talked about this without spoiler for last 3 pages so I thought it's okay?
Okay I just put spoiler on just in case.

 

[ikbalCO]

Sometimes production value is comically low in this show.

Whats up with the oh so obvious fake beards on bill and frank?

Spoiler

also YAY! Anna Torv is back.

 

[Roni]

So Druckman strikes again with his gay liberal woke bullshit. Bill was not gay in the game. Fuck this.

You're raging so hard at a gay couple it's actually blocking your memories of the game.




Joel's statement that the magazine is not meant for kids means it's pornographic. Ellie's comment about how the man would even walk around is in reference to how large his penis is and the stuck pages joke is a reference to how the previous owner (Bill) would have ejaculated on the magazine while enjoying it.

C'mon now...

The man owns a gay magazine and had a male partner. Doesn't take a scientist to figure this shit out.

If one doesn't remember something, either google it or don't say anything about it. Any device capable of posting on this board can be used to check that in 2 minutes. This is in the character's wiki page for crying out loud.

 

[Tripolygon]

They did bill dirty...

1. TV Show made him soft

You need to reassess why you feel Bill is soft. He was prepared for the apocalypse, he set traps around his town to protect himself, fought off raiders by himself. Died on his own terms with someone he loved.

2. Added unnecessary exposition to spice things up cough....

No, they fleshed out the character more than the game did and changed it up.

3. Killing him going against the source material

The source material is not untouchable, the very first episode of the show should tell you that. It is an adaptation not a recreation of the game one for one.

seeing how they're trying to send a message who knows what else might change from the 2013 game script.

What message are they trying to send?

 

[skneogaf]

I can't get over the casting, such a shame. The show is great otherwise!

The original game story is definitely much better than the TV show.

Bill wearing a gas mask was amazing and made me further wish they had spores.

 

[Aaron Olive]

You need to reassess why you feel Bill is soft. He was prepared for the apocalypse, he set traps around his town to protect himself, fought off raiders by himself. Died on his own terms with someone he loved.

No, they fleshed out the character more than the game did and changed it up.

The source material is not untouchable, the very first episode of the show should tell you that. It is an adaptation not a recreation of the game one for one.

What message are they trying to send?

Bruh …

1. Bill in the game was straight up no bullshit, had funny sense of humor and he was a little bit crazy.

2. On the show he doesn’t have any of that character to him, he’s soft spoken and singing Linda Ronstadt.

3. We know he was Gay in the game but he also was polite about the way he said it, wasn’t in your face and he went on about his day…. HBO though

I would feel the same way if they started episode 2 with Tess and Joel Fucking.

Come on don’t play dumb.

 

[ShadowNate]

What a great episode! I really liked it and the actors all around did excellent job. Offerman is the highlight probably, but Pascal also has some really good character reaction moments -- mostly shown by face expressions, but he's masterful at those times. Both are.

I would have wanted more Offerman in the series, but I can be happy with what we got since it was soooo good!

I bit of a rough editing in the episode's start, which felt weird. When Ellie is talking to Joel early on, they edited two takes where clearly Ellie is in different sitting positions.... Weird that small stuff like that stand out to me and annoy me.

 

[AnotherDayAnotherDollar]

This episode sucked ass.

 

[Tripolygon]

Bruh …

1. Bill in the game was straight up no bullshit, had funny sense of humor and he was a little bit crazy.

Bill in the show was also straight up no bullshit, was a little crazy, they also showed he was loving, caring. Don't particularly recall him having a sense of humor, he charged at Ellie for calling him fat.

2. On the show he doesn’t have any of that character to him, he’s soft spoken and singing Linda Ronstadt.

Being soft spoken and singing does not make one "soft". Again reassess why you think he is soft. He set traps and fought off raiders by himself and died on his own terms. That's a badass individual.

3. We know he was Gay in the game but he also was polite about the way he said it, wasn’t in your face and he went on about his day…. HBO though

1. HBO shows gratuitous sex scenes and naked body parts and by all measures what they portrayed of Bill and Frank was tastefully done and was not gratuitous.
2. Portraying gay people in relationships is as much in your face like portraying straight relationships.

I would feel the same way if they started episode 2 with Tess and Joel Fucking.

No you wouldn't. Also they did not start Episode 3 with Bill and Frank fucking. In fact they did not even show them fucking.

Come on don’t play dumb.

Don't play dumb, articulate the message that you feel they are trying to send. Let's see if it doesn't boil down to some variation of "gay agenda".

 

[The Fartist]

This episode sucked ass.

You mean literally, right?

 

[El Pistolero]

The anti-ultra woke sentiment that has permeated the internet is getting more toxic by the day. Extremists complaining about other extremists...

 

[Aaron Olive]

Bill in the show was also straight up no bullshit, was a little crazy, they also showed he was loving, caring. Don't particularly recall him having a sense of humor, he charged at Ellie for calling him fat.

Being soft spoken and singing does not make one "soft". Again reassess why you think he is soft. He set traps and fought off raiders by himself and died on his own terms. That's a badass individual.

1. HBO shows gratuitous sex scenes and naked body parts and by all measures what they portrayed of Bill and Frank was tastefully done and was not gratuitous.
2. Portraying gay people in relationships is as much in your face like portraying straight relationships.

No you wouldn't. Also they did not start Episode 3 with Bill and Frank fucking. In fact they did not even show them fucking.

Don't play dumb, articulate the message that you feel they are trying to send. Let's see if it doesn't boil down to some variation of "gay agenda".

My message is they are starting to branch away from the source material quite a bit, stuff that didn’t exist suddenly existing. I said I would feel the same if episode 2 started with shit that didn’t happen just to spice things up. it can go either way i wasn’t thrilled about that awful sex scene with Abby on part 2 either it’s all just unnecessary cringe.

No Agenda…

 

[Roni]

My message is they are starting to branch away from the source material quite a bit, stuff that didn’t exist suddenly existing. I said I would feel the same if episode 2 started with shit that didn’t happen just to spice things up. it can go either way i wasn’t thrilled about that awful sex scene with Abby on part 2 either it’s all just unnecessary cringe.

Except episode 2 DID start with shit that didn't happen. Not only Indonesia was never in the original game, Indonesia wasn't even the origin of the infection in the game, it was South America.

 

[Aaron Olive]

Except episode 2 DID start with shit that didn't happen. Not only Indonesia was never in the original game, Indonesia wasn't even the origin of the infection in the game, it was South America.

Yes that’s true, I agree.

 

[Tripolygon]

My message is they are starting to branch away from the source material quite a bit, stuff that didn’t exist suddenly existing.

Episode 1 starts off with an entirely fictitious talk show that does not exist in the game, they fleshed out Joel and Ellie neighbors with stories that did not exist in the game. A kid that was euthanized that did not exist in the game. Episode 2 starts with Indonesia that did not exist in the game etc.

I said I would feel the same if episode 2 started with shit that didn’t happen just to spice things up.

Did you watch Episode 1 and 2?

it can go either way i wasn’t thrilled about that awful sex scene with Abby on part 2 either it’s all just unnecessary cringe.

I guess it is just convenient that you also forgot about Ellie and Dina sex scene even though it happens before Abby and Owen. The only reason i have seen people being uncomfortable with Abby is people don't see her as very feminine and she also killed Joel.

 

[Roni]

Yes that’s true, I agree.

In that case, why is the outrage a week late?

 

[Aaron Olive]

Episode 1 starts off with an entirely fictitious talk show that does not exist in the game, they fleshed out Joel and Ellie neighbors with stories that did not exist in the game. A kid that was euthanized that did not exist in the game. Episode 2 starts with Indonesia that did not exist in the game etc.

Did you watch Episode 1 and 2?

I guess it is just convenient that you also forgot about Ellie and Dina sex scene even though it happens before Abby and Owen. The only reason i have seen people being uncomfortable with Abby is people don't see her as very feminine and she also killed Joel.

Yeah and I didn’t speak on them but I do acknowledge that it wasn’t source, Ellie and Dina playing thumb war and smoking weed was dumb as fuck too instead of out for Joel in a weak ass snow storm. Druckman at his finest

im still enjoying the show as the weeks go by though still upset they offed my guy Bill so no part 3.

 

[kyliethicc]

always funny watching people out themselves with such dumb takes

 

[Warablo]

EP 3: I am kinda sick of flashbacks in TV and games. Seemed like kind of a pointless episode, but thought they were trying to introduce those characters. If both of them are dead. Then all that episode was to show them having a running vehicle and weapons.

 

[Aaron Olive]

EP 3: I am kinda sick of flashbacks in TV and games. Seemed like kind of a pointless episode, but thought they were trying to introduce those characters. If both of them are dead. Then all that episode was to show them having a running vehicle and weapons.

Yup.

 

[Yoboman]

Bruh …

1. Bill in the game was straight up no bullshit, had funny sense of humor and he was a little bit crazy.

2. On the show he doesn’t have any of that character to him, he’s soft spoken and singing Linda Ronstadt.

3. We know he was Gay in the game but he also was polite about the way he said it, wasn’t in your face and he went on about his day…. HBO though

I would feel the same way if they started episode 2 with Tess and Joel Fucking.

Come on don’t play dumb.

Ah good old keep your guys in the closet is good writing

 

[Yoboman]

I watched 2 amazing episodes and then the longest Davato commercial ever. Lol

We got a super fan over here

 

[Fools idol]

the homophobes are out again I see lmfao

'hurr durr woke woke hurr durrrrr'

If you didn't put two and two together in the game that you hold so dearly, or just chose to ignore it, Frank was Bill's big ol' gay lover bear.

This episode was alright, agree kind of weak after last weeks amazing episode.. but still really good overall.

 

[Danjin44]

It was very clear from the beginning that they were not going follow exactly same as the game.

this was even true with NieR Automata anime, they made some very interesting changes that I was not expecting.

In all honestly isn’t exactly the point? I already played games, what’s point watching EXACT story that I already experienced?

 

[Yoboman]

There wasn’t. It was somewhat missable. Bill refers to Frank as his partner, and there’s a note you can find that indicates they were definitely lovers.

However, I think they went way overboard here, and fundamentally changed Bills character. In the game, Bill is portrayed as a radical version of Joel. He has all of Joel’s paranoia and emotional distance, but ratcheted up to 11. He represents the endgame of what Joel will become if he continues to close himself off from everyone and everything. The show changes that dynamic quite a bit.

I never really felt there were any parallels to Joel and Bill but I can see that dynamic

In terms of the show vs game here I think both have their strengths. The banter and traps about town could have made for a great episode.

But the way they really fleshed out the two characters is a vastly deeper portrayal than the game gave. Bill was ultimately a pretty 2 dimensional character in the game with hints that there is more to him under the surface

The reality of TV shows is you also want some settler episodes in the mix. The rest of the season is likely to be intense moments one after another. This was a bit of a calm before the storm episode

 

[Aaron Olive]

Ah good old keep your guys in the closet is good writing

I don’t have a problem with the sexual orientation of his character just wish it was done better, Bill in game was more Badass and came off more unhinged humor, I enjoyed the episode. I think I could’ve wrote my post better than I did.

 

[Lasha]

Would critics be doting on the episode if Bill and Frank were a heterosexual couple? The achievement of the episode is the way that Bill and Frank's relationship is presented in the same way as any other long term relationship. The relationship tread down the same well-worn path of most romances right up to its predicable "twist" at the end. I think more critics would be pissed about spending an hour developing a throw-away straight couple.

I enjoyed the episode. I did feel like I was watching a pilot for a spinoff.

 

[Yoboman]

I don’t have a problem with the sexual orientation of his character just wish it was done better, Bill in game was more Badass and came off more unhinged humor, I enjoyed the episode. I think I could’ve wrote my post better than I did.

It was done amazingly well

It's different but if they can't even play with the dynamics of secondary characters that dont return then what's the point? It's pretty clear it is faithful with some liberties. Same as they fleshed out Sarah, gave more moments to Tess and gave some background with the Fireflies and Ellie

 

[ShadowNate]

Clearly Bill's letter was written with Tess in mind, but its message applies to Joel and Ellie too. The essence of it anyway.

I don't see the episode as filler. The world building part of the series needs to be more about how other people (preferrably ones who were at some point part of Ellie's or Joel's lives and are pertinent to their current journey goals) handled the devastating events of the past decade.

We'll have plenty of time with Joel and Ellie of course.

Interesting though that they chose this ending for B&F, where they go out on their own terms, in a proud manner, yet also in a cozy house full of all kinds of comfort that they made for themselves. It's certainly a constrast to how most anyone else dies in that world.

 

[kyliethicc]

Would critics be doting on the episode if Bill and Frank were a heterosexual couple? The achievement of the episode is the way that Bill and Frank's relationship is presented in the same way as any other long term relationship. The relationship tread down the same well-worn path of most romances right up to its predicable "twist" at the end. I think more critics would be pissed about spending an hour developing a throw-away straight couple.

I enjoyed the episode. I did feel like I was watching a pilot for a spinoff.

you seem to have completely missed the point of the episode.

Bill & Frank's story... besides just being really good worldbuilding, besides introducing some good levity in a dark show, and besides just explaining the practical shit like how Joel gets a car and supplies ... is a masterclass in thematic writing and character development, all while forshadowing the climax of the story that will drive the plot of the entire next season.

 

[Lasha]

you seem to have completely missed the point of the episode.

Bill & Frank's story... besides just being really good worldbuilding, besides introducing some good levity in a dark show, and besides just explaining the practical shit like how Joel gets a car and supplies ... is a masterclass in thematic writing and character development, all while forshadowing the climax of the story that will drive the plot of the entire next season.

How did the episode flesh out the world? The bulk of the episode takes place within Bill and Frank's yard. The game somehow got to its emotional climax without Frank at all. An hour spent showing Frank and Bill living for a few decades is an hour less that we have developing a reason to care about Joel's decision. The hour was enjoyable if kind of irrelevant.