but receipt with what date, before or after being banned?
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Just got my console (and I assume my account) banned from Live for playing Halo 4.
- Thread starter Skel1ingt0n
- Start date
The Culture Vulture
Member
The cashier pocketed the money. "I'll ring it up on the release date." Uh huh.
Ravensmash
Member
He can show a receipt.
The problem is that MS don't want to see it. Ban now, ask no questions later seems to be the motto.
I think the most important lesson here is that if Microsoft (or any other big company) thinks you did something wrong they can totally f*ck everything up and there is little to nothing you can do about it.
As in OPs case, he tried getting help and failed, the only option left for him is to go to court?
Imagine if your steam account gets closed, Valve states its been closed because of Illegal activity but they do not say what and since you agreed to their ToS you are not entitled to know either. And to top it off you didnt do anything wrong. Lets just for arguments sake say that there was a glitch in their automated systems that made the ban occur.
Considering youre not entitled to even a reason for this ban, its likely that you will just receive a prefab email telling you youre banned. Any attempt to contact a customer service regarding the case will be ignored (worst case) or swiftly dealt with once they see in their systems that your account is indeed closed.
It seems that there is very little to no will to resolve such cases when they happen. This isnt something that is unique to Valve or M$ but to every larger company.
You are at their mercy, or rather at the CSR's mercy.
Its a sick and twisted thing. I live in a country where we have pretty strong customer rights laws, but its still a risk. I mean, Apple almost got banned from selling their products here because of their shitty warrantly clause.
As in OPs case, he tried getting help and failed, the only option left for him is to go to court?
Imagine if your steam account gets closed, Valve states its been closed because of Illegal activity but they do not say what and since you agreed to their ToS you are not entitled to know either. And to top it off you didnt do anything wrong. Lets just for arguments sake say that there was a glitch in their automated systems that made the ban occur.
Considering youre not entitled to even a reason for this ban, its likely that you will just receive a prefab email telling you youre banned. Any attempt to contact a customer service regarding the case will be ignored (worst case) or swiftly dealt with once they see in their systems that your account is indeed closed.
It seems that there is very little to no will to resolve such cases when they happen. This isnt something that is unique to Valve or M$ but to every larger company.
You are at their mercy, or rather at the CSR's mercy.
Its a sick and twisted thing. I live in a country where we have pretty strong customer rights laws, but its still a risk. I mean, Apple almost got banned from selling their products here because of their shitty warrantly clause.
What does a receipt prove? He could have bought a new copy or used the receipt of a friend. The reseller didnt make a receipt at the moment, the receipt is nulled and void and this point.
Stinkles is fine. He's not responsible for MS's online policies, he was under no requirement to help, but he did try to help, and he specifically did not ask the OP to narc out his store. Stinkles' only crime is that he (as one of the people who helped make the game in question) overestimated his influence with Microsoft and got the OP's hopes up. And he might still be actively trying to get this cleared.
You're hilarious.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
I don't condone stealing whatsoever but it doesn't matter if he did or not, that's irrelevant. He played a legitimate Microsoft game on his xbox360, and Microsoft banned him straight away. That's disgusting.
Unless he provides evidence he tried to help why should we assume he did? That's the MS way it seems: guilty even if proven innocent.
paperspace
Member
Last edited:
I know this is probably gonna be belaboring "receipt-gate", but....who buys $60 worth of merchandise without getting a receipt? I mean, what if the game was fucked up and he took it back to the store and the person he bought it from wasn't there? He'd basically be using the same "you gotta believe me" argument to convince the new sales person.
Anyway, has he tried going back to the store to ask for a receipt? Or in this specific case, would a receipt even be relevant (based on how Microsoft bans consoles)?
Let's say he DID have a receipt. Would he still be banned right now?
EDIT: So...he does have a receipt? Anyone know which page that's on?
EDIT #2: N/M. I guess no receipt was produced.
Anyway, has he tried going back to the store to ask for a receipt? Or in this specific case, would a receipt even be relevant (based on how Microsoft bans consoles)?
Let's say he DID have a receipt. Would he still be banned right now?
EDIT: So...he does have a receipt? Anyone know which page that's on?
EDIT #2: N/M. I guess no receipt was produced.
OldJadedGamer
Banned
He has never produced a receipt showing the purchase from the date he was banned. He will never show it as he wants to hide where he bought it from.
I would go after the store who sold it early. It is their fault. The OP is hiding the store information to protect them.
I dont really get how they can just ban you for playing a game before a certain date.
I mean, shouldnt the boxes come with large warnings etc on them to prevent innocent bystanders from getting banned?
After all , they are only interested in banning pirates arent they?
On a personal note, this doesnt make me want to spend MORE money on my Xbox. Im glad i only bought 60-70 games for it before it started gathering dust.
I mean, shouldnt the boxes come with large warnings etc on them to prevent innocent bystanders from getting banned?
After all , they are only interested in banning pirates arent they?
On a personal note, this doesnt make me want to spend MORE money on my Xbox. Im glad i only bought 60-70 games for it before it started gathering dust.
I just checked the OP (complete with his edits) and you are correct. However, looking at his collection I'm inclined to assume he is a legitimate customer even without a receipt (protecting the store no doubt)
I think if the OP is protecting a store to save them from MS' wrath, he should be asking them for compensation equal to his lost digital content and neutered console.
However I strongly believe a banning is not a fair punishment for playing a game early, and MS should be dragged over the coals for this blatantly disgusting behaviour. Sadly, apathy rules the day and they will never be called on this bullshit. The only thing it proves is that if MS ban for breaking street dates for fear of piracy, it suggests they can't discern between pirate copies anymore (in some cases) and don't want to let that cat out of the bag.
Mackenzie 92
Member
Exactly, dude bought a copy that "fell of a truck" for a steep discount and doesn't want to implicate his friend would be my guess.
And some of you seem to be forgetting that when he went online with it to wag his dick, he was submitting to LIVE's TOS and waving a flag, saying "hey look at me MS, I'm playing your game early!" If he would have played his early game offline, he would have been fine and it would have been the smart thing to do if you're gonna acquire a game by shady means.
Some of you are acting like he went into a store on release day, bought the game, got his receipt and then came home and was immediately banned. That's not how it happened and that's why I don't have any sympathy for him and that's why I don't blame MS. OP has to take some responsibility for his own actions.
No-one is acting like that. We've read the thread.
That still doesn't account for the fact that banning and losing all digital content is unfair for playing a game early. Since when was that a crime?
Nobody says that he committed a crime, we have no proof of that. The TOS find suspicious that he found a early copy and banned him. Simple, and in line with the TOS. He can file a dispute if he want.
chaosblade
Unconfirmed Member
He did show them a receipt later. Should probably update the OP with that since people keep going by the first post which mentions he did not get a receipt at the time of purchase.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=44850209&postcount=1769
Zoe
Member
He showed them a receipt dated on release day.
Finding a copy early isnt exactly implausible though, is it?
As for filing a dispute, the email he got from MS initially indicated that the case was closed and no negotiation was available to him. His only recourse is small claims court it seems.
The TOS is blatantly unreasonable though, especially when paying customers are treated as guilty first, with no questions asked. Its unjustifiable.
If I were the OP and had paid for any content on credit card, I'd be talking to my bank and investigating the possibility of chargeback on account of microsoft acting fraudulently.
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Stinkles is not Microsoft. He tried to help, and ran into an official Microsoft roadblock. He can't pass that roadblock without a receipt that implicates a store and was dated before the OP was tagged online. Somebody else with connections tried the same thing, and hit the same roadblock. The OP is banned as a suspected pirate for being online early. That's just how it works.
But Stinkles knows a guy who knows a guy who has the power to override official Microsoft protocols. Stinkles is using his own personal influence to try and convince this other guy to use his own personal influence to get a powerful third somebody to make a special exception in the OP's case. That's not easy, and if you know how power at these upper levels works, just making that request (whether it works or not) may have burned up more favors than the monetary value of the OP's new Xbox. And Stinkles doesn't have to do any of this. Don't paint him with the same brush as Microsoft.
He was shown a receipt.
They warn you before you buy anything. "HEY, WE MIGHT BAN YOU AND REMOVE YOUR ACCESS TO YOUR STUFF. IF YOU ARE OKAY WITH THIS PRESS I ACCEPT". You decide if you want to buy there or not. If Mcdonald put a Burger with brains in it, and they put a warning under it, and you buy it, and are disgusted by it, you cant go back and ask for a refund. We warned you, so... yeah. Your fault.
Ignorance is bliss until it hit you in the face.
The cashier didnt want trouble. He picked up the cash money and simply cash it at the release day. So yeah, its a "fake" one. I do hope the store get in some sort of trouble for that.
Zoe
Member
Actually he said he paid with credit. They just weren't gonna run the card until release day.
OK, I'm done with the discussion. I understand people are arguing from the point of the TOS/EULA, but I find it completely reprehensible that nuking an account and console is fair play for the indiscretion of playing a game before an important marketing date.
Anything further I say on the issue will merely be going around in circles, so I wish you all a good night and hope that nothing like this ever happens to your accounts.
But if it does, I hope you come around to a more pro-consumer mindset and realise why this shit from MS should not be allowed to stand.
Anything further I say on the issue will merely be going around in circles, so I wish you all a good night and hope that nothing like this ever happens to your accounts.
But if it does, I hope you come around to a more pro-consumer mindset and realise why this shit from MS should not be allowed to stand.
OldJadedGamer
Banned
So I'm reading the thread and it's been asked a zillion times, and I think it should be asked one more time
Why did you go online? :-/
Because according to Microsoft, you won't get banned for playing legitimately acquired games early.
My brother worked at GameStop years ago and let a guy have his reserved copy of Madden early because he wasn't going to be around for the midnight release.
The dude went online with it and EA traced it back to my brother's GameStop and he got canned. I don't know if the customer got banned from Live, though.
The dude went online with it and EA traced it back to my brother's GameStop and he got canned. I don't know if the customer got banned from Live, though.
Getting out of the store with a game is stealing, unless its free or a promotion.
Also.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h4a3y7xetJY
It may be a typo, but I like it.
Vorg
Banned
wut.
Seriously, this shit is as anti-consumer as it gets. And the fact that even people who work for microsoft can't revoke the ban is just lol worthy. There's just no excuse for something like this to happen.
TheChewyWaffles
Member
How is that stealing if they let you walk away with it? Jesus, some of you are doing logical hopscotch to stretch this shit.
notsureifserious
It's not really stealing if it was given to him by a sales associate. Stealing suggests that he defrauded the store, which he didn't if such an exchange was made.
Unless you're joking....
The problem is that he was banned at all in the first place, when MS obviously had no idea if he was playing a legit copy or a pirated one.
If they were sure that he was playing a pirated copy (and this is the only scenario where a ban would be justified!), they would have never asked for his receipt.
Banning users based on a hunch and then making it their job to redeem themselves is a horrible way to treat your customers.
If my friend who worked at a game store give me a game and I go back home with it without paying or him paying, I did steal it or at least I am the complice of a theft. Except if he's the owner.
A Tim horton near my city was robbed. Turned out that 2 ex employee and two current employee planned all of this so they can share the money. So, since two employee gave the guys the money, are you saying its not stealing?
The only person who can authorize a free giveaway is the owner of the store. And I doubt any serious owner will give a free Halo 4 days before release, because it can put him in trouble. A lot of trouble with the second largest Game company out there.
Being pro-consumer do not mean being always on the side of the consumer. The consumer in this case went against the TOS, and did so without any warranty from the store by accepting of taking a game, without paying and without receipt.
In this case, Microsoft is pretty much perfect. the only thing I would hope is for him to get his Gametag back, but hey I like my achievements.
BibiMaghoo
Member
Thebryan was just pointing out what we all agreed too, and that MS are within rights to do so, and he / she is correct.
But this is neither now, nor has ever been about the right MS has to do it. It's about how morally repulsive such action is, and how it leaves a customer with little choice or solution to the matter unfairly.
It is a pre-emptive action by Microsoft to protect their interests at the cost of fairness to actual paying and loyal customers. This is something that has cropped up a lot this gen with other companies also.